Post/Author/DateTime	Post
bjorntfh 01-14-05, 05:05 PM	Horrific Summoning [General] You summoning spells call forth gibbering horrors that break the minds of lesser beings. Requirements: The ability to summon pseudonatural or fiendish creatures. Effect: Whenever you summon a creature with the pseudonatural or fiendish template everyone viewing the summoning must make a Will save (DC 10+spell level+Primary casting modifier) or become shaken for a number of rounds equal to 1+spell level. Any creature that succedes at the save is immune to this power for 24 hours. The caster is unaffected by this feat. Sickening Summoning [General] Your summoning spells burst onto the material plane in a spray of ichor and gore, corveing and sickening anything nearby. Requirements: Horrific Summoning Effect: As Horrific Summoning except that it only affects creatures within 30' of the summoned creature. All affected creatures must make a fortitude save (DC 10+spell level+Primary casting modifier) or be nauseated for 1d4 rounds. After the nausea wears off they are subject to the shaken (or worse) effects from Horrific Summoning as normal. The caster is unaffected by this feat. Comments anyone?
Merlion 01-14-05, 06:16 PM	Seems fine to me. I just wish something along these lines were actually included in the pseudonatural template.
bjorntfh 01-14-05, 06:29 PM	Myself as well, although I forgot to include this line from both feats: The caster of the spell is unaffected by this feat. I felt they cpatured the nature of summoning that-which-was-not-meant-to-be rather nicely. I specified that it only applies to fiendish or pseudonatural creatures because that way you don't get a nauseating summoning of a celestial (makes less sense...) Of course the image of this thing breaching into reality in a shower of gore and bits of shredded flesh while screaming probably would be enough to send the less stout of any group running for the hills. I just never liked the idea that the only difference between pseudonatural and normal creatures was a few points of resistance, one true strike and the ability to give a -1 morale penalty to attack rolls. It's just too weak, especially compared to fiendish and celestial creatures. This way your Alienist can REALLY scare people with unnatural horrors (remember: multiple fear effects stack!)
Kyaran 01-14-05, 06:34 PM	I'd put these at the end of the Augment Summoning feat chain if you want a DC of 10+SL+stat mod. That's likely to be at least an 18, so should be hard to get even though it's only saving against 'shaken'. If you want these to be bottom level feats (as written), I'd reduce the save DC to 10 + ½ caster level. The fear/nausea powers seem good. I think the only change I'd make is to put a range on the Horrific Summoning; maybe 60'.
bjorntfh 01-14-05, 07:01 PM	It's range of sight, so obstructions would apply. If you summon a pseudonatural solar (CR24!) in the air above a battle field... then everyone who sees it should be subject. Since most of the time the range of sight will be short (encounters at long distance are less common than close ones) I'd say leaveit to the DM to decide who's close enough to get an unobstructed view of the show. As for Augment Summoning, it's a requirement of Alienist (I believe) so anyone taking these feats would probably already have it. Personally, it makes no difference to me which way it goes, so making them dependent on Augment Summoning would be fine. The problem with making them DC 10+ 1/2 CL is that the effect is supposed to be added to the spell, so the DC is exactly the same as if the summoning spell allowed a save. That's what I was aiming for with the original DC calculation.
Merlion 01-14-05, 07:22 PM	Although I think for me the other thing really missing from Alienist is some unique Lovecraftian monsters that you can summon, as oposed to, say, a pseudonatural badger. Well, that and some other class features that are actually worth having. Still, very nice feats. I find them fine as is...if the DC is to low, its never gonna actually do anything...making saves is pretty easy usualy.
bjorntfh 01-14-05, 07:29 PM	I just like the idea behind Alienist, although it does have that whopping drawback of -10 to Diplomacy, bluff and sense motive (OUCH!) Personally, I like the concept of going mad with power... provided you are willing to have the party get annoyed at summoning things-that-should-not-be. (Yes, my Illumin Alienist uses those terms to describe them. His "flaw" for level 10 is going to be his words spell out surface thoughts. Not his, reandom people's surface thoughts. And random phrases. And strange symbols. Just plain distrubing things all around.) Personally, I love setting up triggered summons though Planar Binding. Offer a pseudonatural creature this as a trade: "serve me once when I call on you, and I will release you into this world. You cannot attempt to harm myself or my companions, but otherwise you are free after your service is done." I use it as a free blocker/combat trick. When I'm attacked, free action say the word to call it, it appears instantly (since the magic was already set up with Planar Binding) freaks everyone out and starts protecting me. After the battle, it goes off on it's way to do whatever it decides to do. Sometimes I offer them the right to take one of our enemies back to the Far Realms to play with in exchange for servitude for a couple of minutes. Tehy seem to like that one as well.
Merlion 01-14-05, 07:40 PM	I'm a big fan of H.P. Lovecraft, from who's work the concept of the Alienist and the Far Realm comes...but unfortunitly applying the pseudonatural template to regular DnD animals and magical beasts and stuff doesnt really fit with the beings from those stories, for me. I wish they had created a few unique monsters for Alienists to summon...that, and like I said some more useful class abilities than gaining extra hitpoints that dont do you you any good cause you still die if you get hit more than once or twice. Granting them the abilities of your feats as part of the class would have been a good place to start.
Nom 01-14-05, 07:46 PM	I'd put these at the end of the Augment Summoning feat chain if you want a DC of 10+SL+stat mod. That's likely to be at least an 18, so should be hard to get even though it's only saving against 'shaken'. If you want these to be bottom level feats (as written), I'd reduce the save DC to 10 + ½ caster level.You are aware that 10 + SL is effectively 10 + 1/2 CL, but only for max level spells? 10 + SL + score is standard for spells, and IMO is the appropriate modifier. Though I'd apply the shaken effect for rounds equal to spell level (rather than 1 + spell level, just a minor tweak). 10 + 1/2 caster level could actually be higher than 10 + SL + score at high levels. Consider: level 20 wizard, +6 Int, level 1 summon monster: 10 + SL + score = 16 10 + 1/2 caster level = 20 Level 1 spells should not have the same DC as level 9 spells. If the DC is not fixed (and thus low), it should scale on spell level. The first effect should probably state that it is 'fear, mind-affecting' so that immunities are correctly recognised. You also need to consider whether SR applies to either effect. I'd say 'no' to the second (it's a conjuration of something real), the first I'd probably say 'yes'.