A crazy question on HD affected by a spell [Archive] - Wizards Community

A crazy question on HD affected by a spell [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Loren Pechtel
04-18-08, 11:50 AM Having trouble falling asleep last night I got to thinking: Can a Wiz 10 knock themselves out with a sleep spell? They're above the HD limit but can they voluntarily forego that and let it affect them anyway?
Damned slayer
04-18-08, 11:54 AM Having trouble falling asleep last night I got to thinking: Can a Wiz 10 knock themselves out with a sleep spell? They're above the HD limit but can they voluntarily forego that and let it affect them anyway?

check deep slumber in SC

but as per the sleep spell it wouldn't work your above max HD
jaelis
04-18-08, 12:06 PM No. You can voluntarily fail a save, but you can't voluntarily lower your HD.

But a case like this is debatable, since there are no rules for trying to fall asleep. If a DM made some up, he could perfectly well say that you can voluntarily let any sleep effect put you to sleep, even if it wouldn't normally do so.
Loren Pechtel
04-19-08, 01:25 PM No. You can voluntarily fail a save, but you can't voluntarily lower your HD.

But a case like this is debatable, since there are no rules for trying to fall asleep. If a DM made some up, he could perfectly well say that you can voluntarily let any sleep effect put you to sleep, even if it wouldn't normally do so.

It depends on how you interpret the HD limit.

I've always seen HD limits as auto-save.
Damned slayer
04-19-08, 02:27 PM It depends on how you interpret the HD limit.

I've always seen HD limits as auto-save.

and how do you see up to large??
if he's huge he can decide to be smaller for the spell?
Prince_of_Parkness
04-21-08, 02:01 AM and how do you see up to large??
if he's huge he can decide to be smaller for the spell?

Yes. His theory is interesting. If the spell cant affect you because you have 2 many HD, your the wrong type or the wrong size the spell is still cast on you, you just automatically succeed your save, so a voluntary target could be affected by a spell that normally wouldn't work on it. Not sure if thsi house interpretation would cause any problems thought
Wih
04-21-08, 02:45 AM Succeeding your save is different from being immune. A spellcaster always knows if the target of their spell has succeeded or failed their save, and being immune is different to that, so it also lets them define if they are immune to it.

Besides, Sleep only lasts minutes/level. Not going to help you get your beauty spell without some major metamagic trickery.
Loren Pechtel
04-21-08, 12:54 PM Yes. His theory is interesting. If the spell cant affect you because you have 2 many HD, your the wrong type or the wrong size the spell is still cast on you, you just automatically succeed your save, so a voluntary target could be affected by a spell that normally wouldn't work on it. Not sure if thsi house interpretation would cause any problems thought

I'm only talking about HD. Size doesn't apply as the spell can't cover the whole area, you couldn't choose to fail the save because it couldn't get you anyway. Likewise, the wrong type simply can't be affected.

Besides, Sleep only lasts minutes/level. Not going to help you get your beauty spell without some major metamagic trickery.

But if you get to sleep you probably aren't going to wake up when the spell wears off.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Loren Pechtel 04-18-08, 11:50 AM	Having trouble falling asleep last night I got to thinking: Can a Wiz 10 knock themselves out with a sleep spell? They're above the HD limit but can they voluntarily forego that and let it affect them anyway?
Damned slayer 04-18-08, 11:54 AM	Having trouble falling asleep last night I got to thinking: Can a Wiz 10 knock themselves out with a sleep spell? They're above the HD limit but can they voluntarily forego that and let it affect them anyway? check deep slumber in SC but as per the sleep spell it wouldn't work your above max HD
jaelis 04-18-08, 12:06 PM	No. You can voluntarily fail a save, but you can't voluntarily lower your HD. But a case like this is debatable, since there are no rules for trying to fall asleep. If a DM made some up, he could perfectly well say that you can voluntarily let any sleep effect put you to sleep, even if it wouldn't normally do so.
Loren Pechtel 04-19-08, 01:25 PM	No. You can voluntarily fail a save, but you can't voluntarily lower your HD. But a case like this is debatable, since there are no rules for trying to fall asleep. If a DM made some up, he could perfectly well say that you can voluntarily let any sleep effect put you to sleep, even if it wouldn't normally do so. It depends on how you interpret the HD limit. I've always seen HD limits as auto-save.
Damned slayer 04-19-08, 02:27 PM	It depends on how you interpret the HD limit. I've always seen HD limits as auto-save. and how do you see up to large?? if he's huge he can decide to be smaller for the spell?
Prince_of_Parkness 04-21-08, 02:01 AM	and how do you see up to large?? if he's huge he can decide to be smaller for the spell? Yes. His theory is interesting. If the spell cant affect you because you have 2 many HD, your the wrong type or the wrong size the spell is still cast on you, you just automatically succeed your save, so a voluntary target could be affected by a spell that normally wouldn't work on it. Not sure if thsi house interpretation would cause any problems thought
Wih 04-21-08, 02:45 AM	Succeeding your save is different from being immune. A spellcaster always knows if the target of their spell has succeeded or failed their save, and being immune is different to that, so it also lets them define if they are immune to it. Besides, Sleep only lasts minutes/level. Not going to help you get your beauty spell without some major metamagic trickery.
Loren Pechtel 04-21-08, 12:54 PM	Yes. His theory is interesting. If the spell cant affect you because you have 2 many HD, your the wrong type or the wrong size the spell is still cast on you, you just automatically succeed your save, so a voluntary target could be affected by a spell that normally wouldn't work on it. Not sure if thsi house interpretation would cause any problems thought I'm only talking about HD. Size doesn't apply as the spell can't cover the whole area, you couldn't choose to fail the save because it couldn't get you anyway. Likewise, the wrong type simply can't be affected. Besides, Sleep only lasts minutes/level. Not going to help you get your beauty spell without some major metamagic trickery. But if you get to sleep you probably aren't going to wake up when the spell wears off.