A Familiar for a Wizard [Archive] - Wizards Community

A Familiar for a Wizard [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Rishawn
07-16-04, 11:15 AM I am currently a second level wizard/ first level fighter and am thinking about a familiar. However the familiars in the Player's Handbook v 3.5 seem to be really basic animals. I also realize that if my familiar dies I could lose 200 XP per wizard level and at this time I need all of my XP. Any advice?
Phrennzy
07-16-04, 12:23 PM Does your PC have a style or personality?

I mean, if he's a necromancer, you might try a small undead rat or something cool like that.

If you are a desert warrior, or specialize with poison, try a scorpion.

More of a woodsy kind of guy? Try a hawk.

I would only take the familiar if you think it fits with your character, not just because of bonuses it gives you.

The loss of experience for the death of the familiar should not factor into the choice. Think of it as getting a loving, trusting pet - one that you can communicate with and form a close bond with. Not just another accessory, like a sword or something.
Dartanion
07-16-04, 05:28 PM You could also hold off on summoning a familiar until you can pick up the improved familiar feat. In the 3.5 dmg, it gives stats on some pretty cool familiars that you can't get without that feat. However, you must be at a point where you are able to summon a new familiar, so I'd hold off for a much better friend.
ninjarabbit
07-16-04, 05:31 PM If you're worried about your familar dying, don't send it into combat. Keep it at home to watch your stuff (though instruct it not to engage any intruders, just follow).
Seeker95
07-16-04, 06:22 PM You don't have to keep it at home. Keeping it in your pocket/backpack/robe keeps it as safe as any of your possessions.

Attended objects are almost never affected by attacks or spells.
Edward
07-17-04, 01:53 AM I like the raven. It can fill the role of aerial scout, it can talk to you even if you take a PRC early and it can deliver verbal messages. I often try to cast telepathic bond to it so I can get full communication with it at any range (rather than empathic bond only to 1 mile)

Of cause if it doesn’t suite your character take something else. Just remember that XP loss easy something in RP terms as well.

Your familiar is a part of you. I play my wizards as considering the lives of there immediate family alone over there familiar (evil characters may consider the familiar hire) cutting off your right arm is often preferable to the death of your familiar as an arm is only flesh the familiar is part of your sole.

Edward
Seoman Moonstar
07-17-04, 08:27 AM Just a question... i am a wizard 5/ member of the guild of waterdeep 1

My Familiar??? does the prestige class stacks for the purpose to determine the AC,natural armor.. ?
Thermanshs
07-17-04, 08:36 AM Manyx has never betrayed me....(check sig)
as for a familiar's survivability I totally agree with seeker
Derren S.
07-17-04, 08:40 AM Originally posted by Seoman Moonstar
Just a question... i am a wizard 5/ member of the guild of waterdeep 1

My Familiar??? does the prestige class stacks for the purpose to determine the AC,natural armor.. ?

No only wizard level count, not PRC level.
Seeker95
07-17-04, 11:57 AM Originally posted by Derren S.
No only wizard level count, not PRC level. Somethimes.

Many prestige classes grant a spellcasting level in an existing class. If your PrC does this, then as your PrC level goes up, your caster level will also rise (although sometimes at only half the rate). And as your caster level goes up, your familiar improves as normal.
Derren S.
07-17-04, 11:59 AM Really? I must have missed that rule. Or is it a sage ruling?
Seeker95
07-17-04, 12:10 PM Originally posted by Derren S.
Really? I must have missed that rule. Or is it a sage ruling? It is not a Sage ruling. It is a level ruling. If you gain a level in an existing class, your level has gone up.

However, after reading through the PrCs in the DMG, I can see how someone might make the counter argument.
grazzt_the_dark
07-17-04, 12:19 PM From the SRD:
When a new arcane trickster level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in a spellcasting class he belonged to before adding the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained, except for an increased effective level of spellcasting. If a character had more than one spellcasting class before becoming an arcane trickster, he must decide to which class he adds the new level for purposes of determining spells per day.
Emphasis mine.

This is basically what it says for every PrC which increases effective caster level. The familiar falls under the other benefit category of spellcasting, and as such does not increase in power.

The only exception to this is any PrC that has a familiar in which case:
Levels of different classes that are entitled to familiars stack for the purpose of determining any familiar abilities that depend on the master’s level.
Patrick_H
12-13-04, 09:55 PM Greetings all. This is my first post here, so I'm hoping I've found the right place for my query.

I've been going through all my D&D books and stuff looking for more detailed information about the relationship between Sorcerer (or Wizard) and his/her familiar. I'm hoping someone can direct me to a more in-depth treatise than that provided by the Player's Handbook.

I don't care if the description is in 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 3.5 edition materials, I've probably got it. I have every edition of Dungeon Magazine and Dragon Magazine since issue #1, and I have a massive collection of D&D materials in terms of handbooks, game accessories, etc.

I've recently gotten back into gaming after a long hiatus, and I'm trying to remember and re-acquaint myself with stuff I've lost touch with. (Even though I stopped playing for over a decade, I kept buying and collecting the books and magazines out of habbit. I always figured I'd get back into it again someday, and that day has come!)
Terratek
12-13-04, 11:02 PM If you're that concerned about your familiar, you might want to look in Complete Arcane. It has several new spells that make familiars a lot more surviveable. Also, I second the recommendation for waiting a couple levels and taking inproved familiar.
[GSV] Kirstar
12-14-04, 03:36 AM I would only go for a familiar if you think it will improve your play, not as a power option.

Long ago in a dragon magazine there was this set of spells called Enhance Familiar or words to that effect. Now they were fun & useful.

Alot of people choose a familiar as a power option, anyone who does that soon learns what happens when the DM always remembers that a familiar is on their shoulder.... :)

anyway. This thread reminds me of a game my group had where the wizard snuffed it, and in a moment of weakness the DM let the character play his familiar, and let it gain character levels. Also for a laugh He let the now EX familiar get himself a human as his familiar.
Patrick_H
12-15-04, 07:56 AM Terratek: I'm not concerned about the familiar, I'm concerned about role playing. I'm concerned about accurately portraying the association between the familiar and wizard/sorcerer. Information about specific spells I have, and plenty of it. That tells me nothing about what kinds of routine interractions between the faimiliar and his wizard/sorcerer are taking place when spells are not used.
Seeker95
12-15-04, 08:16 AM Information about specific spells I have, and plenty of it. That tells me nothing about what kinds of routine interractions between the faimiliar and his wizard/sorcerer are taking place when spells are not used.Interactions between a wizard and his familiar outside of spell use is called roleplaying. It won't be in an instruction manual.

Treat your familiar however you want. Suggest to the DM that you want to play up the wizard-familiar interactions. Then just do it. There isn't much difference between RP with your familiar and RP with any other friendly NPC.
Patrick_H
12-15-04, 09:57 AM Interactions between a wizard and his familiar outside of spell use is called roleplaying. It won't be in an instruction manual. ... There isn't much difference between RP with your familiar and RP with any other friendly NPC.

I'm sure there's considerable difference between roleplaying with the familiar versus any other friendly NPC. For one thing, the DM plays the NPC and determines what the NPC does and how he reacts to the PCs. I don't think the DM is going to roleplay my character's familiar.

The kinds of things I'm trying to find out include questions like whether they are linked telepathically? How independent is the familiar from the wizard? What kinds of special feats and abilities can be exhibitted without invoking specific spells?

I'm sure there are differences between a familiar and the animal companion of the druid, for example. There seems to be a lot more information about the druid's animal companion than there is about a wizard's familiar.
Seeker95
12-15-04, 11:32 AM I don't think the DM is going to roleplay my character's familiar.Then get a new DM. Roleplaying anything but the PC is the role of the DM.whether they are linked telepathically?
How independent is the familiar from the wizard?
What kinds of special feats and abilities can be exhibitted without invoking specific spells?1. Not telepathically. Only empathically.
2. As independent from the wizard as the wizard is from him. No rules. Just roleplay.
3. No feats other than those ascribed to the creature in its normal form, and those granted to all familiars.There seems to be a lot more information about the druid's animal companion than there is about a wizard's familiar.I don't see a big difference in the amount of information on the two. Both are fairly empty of non-advancement information.

I understand what you are asking, but the answers are ephemeral at best. If your DM is not interested in roleplaying your familiar, then you're on your own to hold the two-way conversations, reactions, and quirks however you want.
heinzk23111
12-15-04, 01:28 PM I like the raven. It can fill the role of aerial scout, it can talk to you even if you take a PRC early and it can deliver verbal messages. I often try to cast telepathic bond to it so I can get full communication with it at any range (rather than empathic bond only to 1 mile)

Of cause if it doesn’t suite your character take something else. Just remember that XP loss easy something in RP terms as well.

Your familiar is a part of you. I play my wizards as considering the lives of there immediate family alone over there familiar (evil characters may consider the familiar hire) cutting off your right arm is often preferable to the death of your familiar as an arm is only flesh the familiar is part of your sole.

Edward

I lake the Raven as well. alternately you could (depending on the flavor of your character) go with a parrot and use the same stats as a Raven.

Instead of a cat try a small fox
Work wit your DM and the possibilities are endless. Just don't get carried away and try to get something that will confer something extra special or a special ability. That is reserved for the Enhanced Familiars.
lukelightning
12-15-04, 01:32 PM One of the advantages of the lowly toad familiar is that of all the PHB familiars, the toad is the one that would probably be most content sitting in a jar in your backpack, out of danger.
Kyy'Dakh
12-15-04, 01:37 PM One familiar concept that I recently thought about is a hummingbird, for some strange reason. Any suggestions as to what skill boosts/abilities it would confer? ...And suggestions for hummingbird stats?

It might be difficult to care for a hummingbird, though, since they burn their energy very quickly, right?
Seeker95
12-15-04, 03:51 PM Perhaps a hummingbird could grant the master a +1 Reflex save? The downside is that the master must consume 50% more food each day, and suffers 50% greater penalties from hunger and thirst.
incubus
12-15-04, 09:02 PM Perhaps a hummingbird could grant the master a +1 Reflex save? The downside is that the master must consume 50% more food each day, and suffers 50% greater penalties from hunger and thirst.
So it's half as good as a regular familiar (which grant +2 to a save) AND has a downside.

Yay.

There's rules for a hummingbird familiar somewhere already. IIRC it gives a bonus to initiative. I've a vague feeling they're in one of the forgotten realms books.
PhaedrusXY
12-15-04, 09:19 PM Here are some threads you might find useful:

Clever Uses of Share Spells (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=334251)
How to get the most out of your familiar (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=193357)
3.5 Forms for Alter Self (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=176246) (there is a section dedicated to forms for familiars)

From the standard familiars, I prefer bats and ravens. If you get an Improved Familiar, I'd get one that is an Outsider, so they can get the most benefit from the Polymorph spell. (Which may or may not work, depending on how the DM rules the familiar's type changing when it becomes a familiar.)
Kyy'Dakh
12-16-04, 09:07 AM Thanks, Incubus. I'll take a look at my FR books... or the ones at the local Waldenbooks. Bonus to Initiative sounds good. Might end up being able to make some ranged touch attacks against flat-footed opponents. :D

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rishawn 07-16-04, 11:15 AM	I am currently a second level wizard/ first level fighter and am thinking about a familiar. However the familiars in the Player's Handbook v 3.5 seem to be really basic animals. I also realize that if my familiar dies I could lose 200 XP per wizard level and at this time I need all of my XP. Any advice?
Phrennzy 07-16-04, 12:23 PM	Does your PC have a style or personality? I mean, if he's a necromancer, you might try a small undead rat or something cool like that. If you are a desert warrior, or specialize with poison, try a scorpion. More of a woodsy kind of guy? Try a hawk. I would only take the familiar if you think it fits with your character, not just because of bonuses it gives you. The loss of experience for the death of the familiar should not factor into the choice. Think of it as getting a loving, trusting pet - one that you can communicate with and form a close bond with. Not just another accessory, like a sword or something.
Dartanion 07-16-04, 05:28 PM	You could also hold off on summoning a familiar until you can pick up the improved familiar feat. In the 3.5 dmg, it gives stats on some pretty cool familiars that you can't get without that feat. However, you must be at a point where you are able to summon a new familiar, so I'd hold off for a much better friend.
ninjarabbit 07-16-04, 05:31 PM	If you're worried about your familar dying, don't send it into combat. Keep it at home to watch your stuff (though instruct it not to engage any intruders, just follow).
Seeker95 07-16-04, 06:22 PM	You don't have to keep it at home. Keeping it in your pocket/backpack/robe keeps it as safe as any of your possessions. Attended objects are almost never affected by attacks or spells.
Edward 07-17-04, 01:53 AM	I like the raven. It can fill the role of aerial scout, it can talk to you even if you take a PRC early and it can deliver verbal messages. I often try to cast telepathic bond to it so I can get full communication with it at any range (rather than empathic bond only to 1 mile) Of cause if it doesn’t suite your character take something else. Just remember that XP loss easy something in RP terms as well. Your familiar is a part of you. I play my wizards as considering the lives of there immediate family alone over there familiar (evil characters may consider the familiar hire) cutting off your right arm is often preferable to the death of your familiar as an arm is only flesh the familiar is part of your sole. Edward
Seoman Moonstar 07-17-04, 08:27 AM	Just a question... i am a wizard 5/ member of the guild of waterdeep 1 My Familiar??? does the prestige class stacks for the purpose to determine the AC,natural armor.. ?
Thermanshs 07-17-04, 08:36 AM	Manyx has never betrayed me....(check sig) as for a familiar's survivability I totally agree with seeker
Derren S. 07-17-04, 08:40 AM	Originally posted by Seoman Moonstar Just a question... i am a wizard 5/ member of the guild of waterdeep 1 My Familiar??? does the prestige class stacks for the purpose to determine the AC,natural armor.. ? No only wizard level count, not PRC level.
Seeker95 07-17-04, 11:57 AM	Originally posted by Derren S. No only wizard level count, not PRC level. Somethimes. Many prestige classes grant a spellcasting level in an existing class. If your PrC does this, then as your PrC level goes up, your caster level will also rise (although sometimes at only half the rate). And as your caster level goes up, your familiar improves as normal.
Derren S. 07-17-04, 11:59 AM	Really? I must have missed that rule. Or is it a sage ruling?
Seeker95 07-17-04, 12:10 PM	Originally posted by Derren S. Really? I must have missed that rule. Or is it a sage ruling? It is not a Sage ruling. It is a level ruling. If you gain a level in an existing class, your level has gone up. However, after reading through the PrCs in the DMG, I can see how someone might make the counter argument.
grazzt_the_dark 07-17-04, 12:19 PM	From the SRD: When a new arcane trickster level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in a spellcasting class he belonged to before adding the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained, except for an increased effective level of spellcasting. If a character had more than one spellcasting class before becoming an arcane trickster, he must decide to which class he adds the new level for purposes of determining spells per day. Emphasis mine. This is basically what it says for every PrC which increases effective caster level. The familiar falls under the other benefit category of spellcasting, and as such does not increase in power. The only exception to this is any PrC that has a familiar in which case: Levels of different classes that are entitled to familiars stack for the purpose of determining any familiar abilities that depend on the master’s level.
Patrick_H 12-13-04, 09:55 PM	Greetings all. This is my first post here, so I'm hoping I've found the right place for my query. I've been going through all my D&D books and stuff looking for more detailed information about the relationship between Sorcerer (or Wizard) and his/her familiar. I'm hoping someone can direct me to a more in-depth treatise than that provided by the Player's Handbook. I don't care if the description is in 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 3.5 edition materials, I've probably got it. I have every edition of Dungeon Magazine and Dragon Magazine since issue #1, and I have a massive collection of D&D materials in terms of handbooks, game accessories, etc. I've recently gotten back into gaming after a long hiatus, and I'm trying to remember and re-acquaint myself with stuff I've lost touch with. (Even though I stopped playing for over a decade, I kept buying and collecting the books and magazines out of habbit. I always figured I'd get back into it again someday, and that day has come!)
Terratek 12-13-04, 11:02 PM	If you're that concerned about your familiar, you might want to look in Complete Arcane. It has several new spells that make familiars a lot more surviveable. Also, I second the recommendation for waiting a couple levels and taking inproved familiar.
[GSV] Kirstar 12-14-04, 03:36 AM	I would only go for a familiar if you think it will improve your play, not as a power option. Long ago in a dragon magazine there was this set of spells called Enhance Familiar or words to that effect. Now they were fun & useful. Alot of people choose a familiar as a power option, anyone who does that soon learns what happens when the DM always remembers that a familiar is on their shoulder.... :) anyway. This thread reminds me of a game my group had where the wizard snuffed it, and in a moment of weakness the DM let the character play his familiar, and let it gain character levels. Also for a laugh He let the now EX familiar get himself a human as his familiar.
Patrick_H 12-15-04, 07:56 AM	Terratek: I'm not concerned about the familiar, I'm concerned about role playing. I'm concerned about accurately portraying the association between the familiar and wizard/sorcerer. Information about specific spells I have, and plenty of it. That tells me nothing about what kinds of routine interractions between the faimiliar and his wizard/sorcerer are taking place when spells are not used.
Seeker95 12-15-04, 08:16 AM	Information about specific spells I have, and plenty of it. That tells me nothing about what kinds of routine interractions between the faimiliar and his wizard/sorcerer are taking place when spells are not used.Interactions between a wizard and his familiar outside of spell use is called roleplaying. It won't be in an instruction manual. Treat your familiar however you want. Suggest to the DM that you want to play up the wizard-familiar interactions. Then just do it. There isn't much difference between RP with your familiar and RP with any other friendly NPC.
Patrick_H 12-15-04, 09:57 AM	Interactions between a wizard and his familiar outside of spell use is called roleplaying. It won't be in an instruction manual. ... There isn't much difference between RP with your familiar and RP with any other friendly NPC. I'm sure there's considerable difference between roleplaying with the familiar versus any other friendly NPC. For one thing, the DM plays the NPC and determines what the NPC does and how he reacts to the PCs. I don't think the DM is going to roleplay my character's familiar. The kinds of things I'm trying to find out include questions like whether they are linked telepathically? How independent is the familiar from the wizard? What kinds of special feats and abilities can be exhibitted without invoking specific spells? I'm sure there are differences between a familiar and the animal companion of the druid, for example. There seems to be a lot more information about the druid's animal companion than there is about a wizard's familiar.
Seeker95 12-15-04, 11:32 AM	I don't think the DM is going to roleplay my character's familiar.Then get a new DM. Roleplaying anything but the PC is the role of the DM.whether they are linked telepathically? How independent is the familiar from the wizard? What kinds of special feats and abilities can be exhibitted without invoking specific spells?1. Not telepathically. Only empathically. 2. As independent from the wizard as the wizard is from him. No rules. Just roleplay. 3. No feats other than those ascribed to the creature in its normal form, and those granted to all familiars.There seems to be a lot more information about the druid's animal companion than there is about a wizard's familiar.I don't see a big difference in the amount of information on the two. Both are fairly empty of non-advancement information. I understand what you are asking, but the answers are ephemeral at best. If your DM is not interested in roleplaying your familiar, then you're on your own to hold the two-way conversations, reactions, and quirks however you want.
heinzk23111 12-15-04, 01:28 PM	I like the raven. It can fill the role of aerial scout, it can talk to you even if you take a PRC early and it can deliver verbal messages. I often try to cast telepathic bond to it so I can get full communication with it at any range (rather than empathic bond only to 1 mile) Of cause if it doesn’t suite your character take something else. Just remember that XP loss easy something in RP terms as well. Your familiar is a part of you. I play my wizards as considering the lives of there immediate family alone over there familiar (evil characters may consider the familiar hire) cutting off your right arm is often preferable to the death of your familiar as an arm is only flesh the familiar is part of your sole. Edward I lake the Raven as well. alternately you could (depending on the flavor of your character) go with a parrot and use the same stats as a Raven. Instead of a cat try a small fox Work wit your DM and the possibilities are endless. Just don't get carried away and try to get something that will confer something extra special or a special ability. That is reserved for the Enhanced Familiars.
lukelightning 12-15-04, 01:32 PM	One of the advantages of the lowly toad familiar is that of all the PHB familiars, the toad is the one that would probably be most content sitting in a jar in your backpack, out of danger.
Kyy'Dakh 12-15-04, 01:37 PM	One familiar concept that I recently thought about is a hummingbird, for some strange reason. Any suggestions as to what skill boosts/abilities it would confer? ...And suggestions for hummingbird stats? It might be difficult to care for a hummingbird, though, since they burn their energy very quickly, right?
Seeker95 12-15-04, 03:51 PM	Perhaps a hummingbird could grant the master a +1 Reflex save? The downside is that the master must consume 50% more food each day, and suffers 50% greater penalties from hunger and thirst.
incubus 12-15-04, 09:02 PM	Perhaps a hummingbird could grant the master a +1 Reflex save? The downside is that the master must consume 50% more food each day, and suffers 50% greater penalties from hunger and thirst. So it's half as good as a regular familiar (which grant +2 to a save) AND has a downside. Yay. There's rules for a hummingbird familiar somewhere already. IIRC it gives a bonus to initiative. I've a vague feeling they're in one of the forgotten realms books.
PhaedrusXY 12-15-04, 09:19 PM	Here are some threads you might find useful: Clever Uses of Share Spells (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=334251) How to get the most out of your familiar (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=193357) 3.5 Forms for Alter Self (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=176246) (there is a section dedicated to forms for familiars) From the standard familiars, I prefer bats and ravens. If you get an Improved Familiar, I'd get one that is an Outsider, so they can get the most benefit from the Polymorph spell. (Which may or may not work, depending on how the DM rules the familiar's type changing when it becomes a familiar.)
Kyy'Dakh 12-16-04, 09:07 AM	Thanks, Incubus. I'll take a look at my FR books... or the ones at the local Waldenbooks. Bonus to Initiative sounds good. Might end up being able to make some ranged touch attacks against flat-footed opponents. :D