Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Atar 12-07-05, 05:48 PM	Hi, I have two questions concidering sorcerers... 1) Lets say I'm a level 9 or 10 sorcerer, and I cast Eagle's Splendor right before I go to sleep. I sleep and wake up, prerpare my magic (meditate, sing, focus, whatever :P). Do I get bonus spells acording to the higher charisma bonus? 2) Is it possible to take a level 2 spell with a level 3 'slot' at your level up? A player wants to choose more lower level spells, would this be okay? I don't see why not but lets hear the expert opinions :) Regards, Atar
spaceadet 12-07-05, 05:53 PM	with regards to question 2. you can cast a lvl 2 spell with a lvl 3 slot, so I don't see any reason that you can't learn an extra lvl 2 spell instead of a lvl 3 spell. Or you could make it a heightened lvl 2 spell, no other benefit except the harder DC.
spaceadet 12-07-05, 05:56 PM	question 1. If the eagles splendor lasts long enough (8 hours), then you get the bonus spell.
Elbethamore 12-07-05, 06:28 PM	1) Lets say I'm a level 9 or 10 sorcerer, and I cast Eagle's Splendor right before I go to sleep. I sleep and wake up, prerpare my magic (meditate, sing, focus, whatever :P). Do I get bonus spells acording to the higher charisma bonus? The spell description specifically says you do not. Sorcerers and bards (and other spellcasters who rely on Charisma) affected by this spell do not gain any additional bonus spells for the increased Charisma, but the save DCs for spells they cast while under this spell’s effect do increase.
Auorix 12-07-05, 06:32 PM	I believe the 24 hour rule is in effect on #1. If you do not have that bonus for OVER 24 hours then it will not increase your spells per day. Need some smart people back up for proof though.
farfairer 12-07-05, 07:06 PM	I believe the 24 hour rule is in effect on #1. If you do not have that bonus for OVER 24 hours then it will not increase your spells per day. Need some smart people back up for proof though. What 24 hour rule? A mage can put on a headband of Int 2 minutes befor preping for the day and gain the extra spells for a higher int. The problem comes only if he takes the headband off becasue any spell he gained from the INT increas is automaticly lost. Eagle's Splendor is differnt and as Elbethamore said, the spell specificly states that you don't get extra spell slots from it. Atar: question 2: Technically RAW no. The spell must be of the apropriate level (PHB page 54, second column paragraph 1). In order to learn more spells of a given level than normally allowed you need to take the extra spell feat from Complete Arcane.
Auorix 12-07-05, 07:17 PM	I have read here before that with the headband of Int, you must have worn it more than 24 hours to receive the benifit to you bonus spells. I am sure some others will remember it too.
Seeker of Undeath 12-07-05, 07:19 PM	Farfairer has it right. However I will point out that it's a good idea to learn metamagic-ed versions of spells you know so that you don't need to worry about full-round casting time. My DM hates it when he looks at my spells known and sees quickened fireball as a 7th-level spell. Of course empowered magic missile hurts for a short time too. Those aren't grand examples, but I'm sure your imagination can do more. I'm partial to modified Dimension Door spells for beating grapples and doing the Nightcrawler thing. BTW I did have one DM cringe at Empowered Dissintegrate. *shrug* Seemed okay to me.
farfairer 12-07-05, 07:23 PM	Auorix: I think that is only a rule for specific items, most of which are printed in the Miniature's Handbook. Or you might be thinking of something 3.0 instead of 3.5 Seeker of Undeath: Thank you. How do you learn a "metamagiced spell"? I didn't think you could learn Empowered Fireball as a seperate spell from Fireball.
Seeker of Undeath 12-07-05, 07:50 PM	Seeker of Undeath: Thank you. How do you learn a "metamagiced spell"? I didn't think you could learn Empowered Fireball as a seperate spell from Fireball.I seem to recall an article, one of the "Playing <character class> with Class", mentioning it. My fuzzy memory makes me want to say it was mentioned as an aside during the article on Clerics (obviously a Cleric wouldn't be able to take advantage of this but I think a parallel was drawn with a spontaneous caster IIRC). I wish I could remember for a certainty which one it was or that I had a link. Until I can scrounge it up feel free to just think of it as one of my goofy houserules. It works quite well for my players and has for myself as well. The primary reason it's not troubled any DM is that it requires you actually possess the metamagic feat (there's one feat slot at least) and that you spend one of your very limited spells known slots. Is it worthwhile to let a Sorcerer/Bard/whatever burn up what's normally a very limited list of options in exchange for speedier use? It could be; it's not come to create problems so far. The question of how often they actually need that particular spell also comes to mind. Would one always learn Empowered Fireball instead of other 5th-level spells? That little quandry of character building alone makes me enjoy the option. Twin Scorching Ray or Dissintegrate? That may or may not be a bad example since the former has no save, but does require six touch attacks and has a set energy type. Meanwhile the latter allows a save but works on objects and would continue to scale in damage with caster level beyond the fixed [(number of successful touch attacks ranging from 0 to 6)(4d6)] of its competitor. One reason I also think it alright to do this would be the recent creation of spells like Swift Fly and so forth (see Complete Adventurer). It's distinct from the base spell, Fly, by casting time and duration. Similarly there's Overland Flight. It seemed reasonable to do likewise with other spells following the preset guidelines for level adjustment set forth in metamagic feats. It may or may not be an accepted method in official games like Living Greyhawk (though I'd be surprised if it's not), but it should work for home games at the least.
farfairer 12-08-05, 02:22 AM	Seeker of Undeath: I may be alone here, but I have to ask why? Why would you take up a 7th level spell slot perminantly with maximized fireball, when you have the maximize feat and 3rd level fireball? I realize that it means you can only move 5 feet for the round, but still I don't see the point of taking perminantly metamagic altered spells as standard spells, when you have the metamagic feat anyway. Especially since strict RAW a metamagic altered spell doesn't count as being a higher level spell for DC purposes.
MindWandererB 12-08-05, 02:59 AM	Why would you take up a 7th level spell slot perminantly with maximized fireball, when you have the maximize feat and 3rd level fireball? You wouldn't do that at all. You probably wouldn't even take Maximized Fireball as a 6th level spell (which is what it would be). You might take Quickened Fireball as a 7th level spell so you can actually use it. Or you could take Arcane Preparation.