A Lawful Theft [Archive] - Wizards Community

A Lawful Theft [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
The Vorpal Tribble
05-10-07, 10:37 AM This domain may be taken by any cleric of a Lawful Neutral or Lawful Evil deity.

Eminent Domain
Granted Power: You add Bluff, Intimidate and Sleight of Hand to your list of cleric class skills.

You may also cast spells with the Chaos descriptor reguardless of your actual alignment without consequence.

Eminent Domain Spells
1 Protection from Law
2 Locate Object
3 Glibness
4 Secure Shelter
5 Dominate Person
6 Mislead
7 Mage’s Magnificent Mansion
8 Trap the Soul
9 Soul Bind
Novacat
05-10-07, 10:39 AM Tee hee.
Witch
05-10-07, 10:41 AM It makes no sense to have Lawful deities supply you with Chaotic spells.
The Vorpal Tribble
05-10-07, 10:45 AM It makes no sense to have Lawful deities supply you with Chaotic spells.
Well, riddle me this. If a law is made to allow chaos, what does it become? ;)
Shadowfax7
05-10-07, 10:47 AM Well, riddle me this. If a law is made to allow chaos, what does it become? ;)

Uhmmm . . . from a neutral deity, king, etc.
The Vorpal Tribble
05-10-07, 11:08 AM Uhmmm . . . from a neutral deity, king, etc.
That'd be missing the whole concept of this though :rolleyes:
Muktar
05-10-07, 12:42 PM If law was to be made to allow chaos, it would be chaos.
Witch
05-10-07, 12:49 PM Well, riddle me this. If a law is made to allow chaos, what does it become? ;)
Chaos. Not law.
Someone
05-10-07, 01:05 PM Wouldn't it simply be called taxes?

Aka: the lawful redistribution of wealth, for good or evil.

Hence Robin Hood was chaotic.
Pandaemoni
05-10-07, 03:06 PM Eminent Domain is not theft. It's a forced sale. The "gummint" doesn't simply take your land, they buy it from you for fair value; you are just required to sell it at a fair price.

There are some (mostly non-western) countries that do expropriate property without compensation, but that's not really "eminent domain" in the sense that term is typically used.
The Vorpal Tribble
05-10-07, 03:17 PM Well, I can't really answer these questions as it starts treading upon ground Wizards don't care for.
Seeker95
05-10-07, 04:26 PM For the first level domain spell, I would suggest the cleric can cast "protection from law/chaos" regardless of which was prepared.

I would also consider having the cleric with such a domain substitute different spells for the normal spontaneous cure option. Perhaps sanctuary, call weapon/armor/item/object spells, etc.

I really like what you have done here, with no changes needed. The above is more "typing out loud" than anything else.
Novacat
05-10-07, 07:59 PM Eminent Domain is not theft. It's a forced sale. The "gummint" doesn't simply take your land, they buy it from you for fair value; you are just required to sell it at a fair price.

There are some (mostly non-western) countries that do expropriate property without compensation, but that's not really "eminent domain" in the sense that term is typically used.

Not theft, no, but it is a violation of the right to own property. If the government can take it, compensation or no, then you do not truly own it, and all other rights become moot.
Seeker95
05-10-07, 08:04 PM Please keep comments to the Cleric Domain, and not real world definitions and examples. :tiphat:
SephDragoon
05-10-07, 09:15 PM This is what I like to call, the Dark Horse concept. Use something from your enemy's ability against them, though you are the opposite of what they are. Aka, good using evil abilities, or in this case law using chaotic abilities.

And this does work... but only in one special case... a theif sent by the government... or more aproapriately... a spy. Besides the exception of 007, I think most 00 agents would have been considered lawful, but they snuck around, stole things, killed like a sneaky bastard... etc. They did in the name of queen and country. They were lawful, but using techniques normally employed by the forces of chaos. Hence... dark horse concept.

So good job. I might have picked better spells, but whatever.
The Vorpal Tribble
05-10-07, 10:08 PM So good job. I might have picked better spells, but whatever.
I'm quite open to suggestions. What might fit better do you think? I kinda chose them to appear as if they were 'buffing up' for the job.

Protect themselves from the Law and then locate the property (object). Spew a bunch of gobbledy gook (glibness) and secure your hold on the land. Dominate and mislead them, and whadya know, you got the mansion!

The last two was a bit of a jest that they won't just stop at your home.
SephDragoon
05-10-07, 10:22 PM The only thing I really have a problem with, is the lack of a sneaking spell. Invisibility or something should be in there, imo, to help you get TO the item in question. Sleep also seems like a much better 1st level spell, not for abilities, but for thematic reasons. I mean, how many times have you seen thefts become much easier once you put the guard to sleep?

Looking back on it... is this just a joke domain?
Lina_Inverse
05-10-07, 10:29 PM Not theft, no, but it is a violation of the right to own property. If the government can take it, compensation or no, then you do not truly own it, and all other rights become moot.

The right to own property which is in itself a law and can therefore be defined by the local ruler how exactly it's defined.
Novacat
05-11-07, 12:51 AM Looking back on it... is this just a joke domain?

Yes.
ArcTan
05-11-07, 05:21 PM Dude, this domain is a joke, people. *Joke*. It's a pun on the term "eminent domain" and the fact that a lot of critics of the government's eminent domain powers regard eminent domain as "legalized theft". (Ignoring, of course, that the government does have to pay you a fair price for your land when it buys it, and that compelling you to sell *is* different from forcibly taking it, and that people who still complain about it should move to China and see how much worse this kind of thing can be.)
SephDragoon
05-11-07, 05:39 PM It was a good domain idea... but seriously... I don't think this kind of joke belongs on here. Heck, I got caught up in the first few replies which seemed to take the idea seriously... I didn't even look at the domain name for a long time.

Now seriously, if this is a joke, then don't ask for suggestions... if you are taking it seriously, then that is another story. But when you say:
I'm quite open to suggestions. What might fit better do you think? I kinda chose them to appear as if they were 'buffing up' for the job.

I start thinking this is a serious domain, so don't do that again -_-.
The Vorpal Tribble
05-12-07, 11:45 AM It was a joke, but I take my jokes seriously ;)

(And ArcTan, we can't get political here but let me just say I wasn't making fun of those who have a problem with it. I'm one of them.)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The Vorpal Tribble 05-10-07, 10:37 AM	This domain may be taken by any cleric of a Lawful Neutral or Lawful Evil deity. Eminent Domain Granted Power: You add Bluff, Intimidate and Sleight of Hand to your list of cleric class skills. You may also cast spells with the Chaos descriptor reguardless of your actual alignment without consequence. Eminent Domain Spells 1 Protection from Law 2 Locate Object 3 Glibness 4 Secure Shelter 5 Dominate Person 6 Mislead 7 Mage’s Magnificent Mansion 8 Trap the Soul 9 Soul Bind
Novacat 05-10-07, 10:39 AM	Tee hee.
Witch 05-10-07, 10:41 AM	It makes no sense to have Lawful deities supply you with Chaotic spells.
The Vorpal Tribble 05-10-07, 10:45 AM	It makes no sense to have Lawful deities supply you with Chaotic spells. Well, riddle me this. If a law is made to allow chaos, what does it become? ;)
Shadowfax7 05-10-07, 10:47 AM	Well, riddle me this. If a law is made to allow chaos, what does it become? ;) Uhmmm . . . from a neutral deity, king, etc.
The Vorpal Tribble 05-10-07, 11:08 AM	Uhmmm . . . from a neutral deity, king, etc. That'd be missing the whole concept of this though :rolleyes:
Muktar 05-10-07, 12:42 PM	If law was to be made to allow chaos, it would be chaos.
Witch 05-10-07, 12:49 PM	Well, riddle me this. If a law is made to allow chaos, what does it become? ;) Chaos. Not law.
Someone 05-10-07, 01:05 PM	Wouldn't it simply be called taxes? Aka: the lawful redistribution of wealth, for good or evil. Hence Robin Hood was chaotic.
Pandaemoni 05-10-07, 03:06 PM	Eminent Domain is not theft. It's a forced sale. The "gummint" doesn't simply take your land, they buy it from you for fair value; you are just required to sell it at a fair price. There are some (mostly non-western) countries that do expropriate property without compensation, but that's not really "eminent domain" in the sense that term is typically used.
The Vorpal Tribble 05-10-07, 03:17 PM	Well, I can't really answer these questions as it starts treading upon ground Wizards don't care for.
Seeker95 05-10-07, 04:26 PM	For the first level domain spell, I would suggest the cleric can cast "protection from law/chaos" regardless of which was prepared. I would also consider having the cleric with such a domain substitute different spells for the normal spontaneous cure option. Perhaps sanctuary, call weapon/armor/item/object spells, etc. I really like what you have done here, with no changes needed. The above is more "typing out loud" than anything else.
Novacat 05-10-07, 07:59 PM	Eminent Domain is not theft. It's a forced sale. The "gummint" doesn't simply take your land, they buy it from you for fair value; you are just required to sell it at a fair price. There are some (mostly non-western) countries that do expropriate property without compensation, but that's not really "eminent domain" in the sense that term is typically used. Not theft, no, but it is a violation of the right to own property. If the government can take it, compensation or no, then you do not truly own it, and all other rights become moot.
Seeker95 05-10-07, 08:04 PM	Please keep comments to the Cleric Domain, and not real world definitions and examples. :tiphat:
SephDragoon 05-10-07, 09:15 PM	This is what I like to call, the Dark Horse concept. Use something from your enemy's ability against them, though you are the opposite of what they are. Aka, good using evil abilities, or in this case law using chaotic abilities. And this does work... but only in one special case... a theif sent by the government... or more aproapriately... a spy. Besides the exception of 007, I think most 00 agents would have been considered lawful, but they snuck around, stole things, killed like a sneaky bastard... etc. They did in the name of queen and country. They were lawful, but using techniques normally employed by the forces of chaos. Hence... dark horse concept. So good job. I might have picked better spells, but whatever.
The Vorpal Tribble 05-10-07, 10:08 PM	So good job. I might have picked better spells, but whatever. I'm quite open to suggestions. What might fit better do you think? I kinda chose them to appear as if they were 'buffing up' for the job. Protect themselves from the Law and then locate the property (object). Spew a bunch of gobbledy gook (glibness) and secure your hold on the land. Dominate and mislead them, and whadya know, you got the mansion! The last two was a bit of a jest that they won't just stop at your home.
SephDragoon 05-10-07, 10:22 PM	The only thing I really have a problem with, is the lack of a sneaking spell. Invisibility or something should be in there, imo, to help you get TO the item in question. Sleep also seems like a much better 1st level spell, not for abilities, but for thematic reasons. I mean, how many times have you seen thefts become much easier once you put the guard to sleep? Looking back on it... is this just a joke domain?
Lina_Inverse 05-10-07, 10:29 PM	Not theft, no, but it is a violation of the right to own property. If the government can take it, compensation or no, then you do not truly own it, and all other rights become moot. The right to own property which is in itself a law and can therefore be defined by the local ruler how exactly it's defined.
Novacat 05-11-07, 12:51 AM	Looking back on it... is this just a joke domain? Yes.
ArcTan 05-11-07, 05:21 PM	Dude, this domain is a joke, people. Joke. It's a pun on the term "eminent domain" and the fact that a lot of critics of the government's eminent domain powers regard eminent domain as "legalized theft". (Ignoring, of course, that the government does have to pay you a fair price for your land when it buys it, and that compelling you to sell is different from forcibly taking it, and that people who still complain about it should move to China and see how much worse this kind of thing can be.)
SephDragoon 05-11-07, 05:39 PM	It was a good domain idea... but seriously... I don't think this kind of joke belongs on here. Heck, I got caught up in the first few replies which seemed to take the idea seriously... I didn't even look at the domain name for a long time. Now seriously, if this is a joke, then don't ask for suggestions... if you are taking it seriously, then that is another story. But when you say: I'm quite open to suggestions. What might fit better do you think? I kinda chose them to appear as if they were 'buffing up' for the job. I start thinking this is a serious domain, so don't do that again -_-.
The Vorpal Tribble 05-12-07, 11:45 AM	It was a joke, but I take my jokes seriously ;) (And ArcTan, we can't get political here but let me just say I wasn't making fun of those who have a problem with it. I'm one of them.)