A Magic System Without Spellcasting Classes? [Archive] - Wizards Community

A Magic System Without Spellcasting Classes? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Fed Up With Fantasy
12-08-07, 05:18 PM Does anybody know of a D20 System magic system that doesn't use spellcasting classes? Something that would allow players to add specific spells to their current class without multi-classing? Perhaps a list of Feats that would allow casting from specific levels or schools? Anything at all. Thanks.
LordDewtain
12-08-07, 05:34 PM chthulu does something like this. maybe that would be adapted.

I would just give it to them. if you choose what to give them, then its all in your hands. sure it is a little out of place rules wise, but it doesn't matter.

make them rituals that require everyone to cast, and make them powerful. then it is a big quest to go out and find the "Tome of _____"
Fed Up With Fantasy
12-08-07, 05:56 PM Thanks for the help. I've never looked at Cthulu but it sounds lik a good place to start.
Tempest Stormwind
12-08-07, 06:14 PM Does anybody know of a D20 System magic system that doesn't use spellcasting classes? Something that would allow players to add specific spells to their current class without multi-classing? Perhaps a list of Feats that would allow casting from specific levels or schools? Anything at all. Thanks.

Two come to mind.

Green Ronin produced a variant on psionics back in 3e that works off of skills and feats.

WotC's own Star Wars: Saga Edition has a rules system for the Force (essentially magic) that is *entirely* skills-and-feats-based. It shouldn't be too hard to port over, either.
Ash2Dust
12-08-07, 08:45 PM There's also incantations from, I believe, Unearthed Arcana and the Urban Arcana supplement for D20 Modern.

OGL info on them are here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/incantations.htm).
Fed Up With Fantasy
12-09-07, 07:59 AM I've never considered Green Ronin before but I've heard they have some pretty good stuff. I've looked through their Mystic Vistas line and found Monsters of the Mind, but which product introduces Psionic rules? While looking at the Green Ronin products, I also found quite a few other publishers. Any suggestions on which ones to take a look at or avoid?

Star Wars Saga Edition has been suggested to me before, and I have a friend with a copy of it who is supposed to be letting me borrow it.

The Incantations link is very helpful. I will definately be taking another look at those rules as I tweak what I need.

Thanks for the great suggestions!
Yokomohoyo
12-09-07, 02:20 PM Their is also the system of the "Slayers" game. It's a D20 system and even the fighter can cast spells. You could also try B.E.S.E.M which with a feat you can grant any player spell casting abilities of a sorcerer (not a wizard).
Tempest Stormwind
12-09-07, 03:00 PM I've never considered Green Ronin before but I've heard they have some pretty good stuff. I've looked through their Mystic Vistas line and found Monsters of the Mind, but which product introduces Psionic rules? While looking at the Green Ronin products, I also found quite a few other publishers. Any suggestions on which ones to take a look at or avoid?

Psychic's Handbook.

As for other publishers, it depends entirely what you're looking for and what your tolerance for slacking is. (For instance, avoid Mongoose Publishing; they have the worst development team I've ever seen, to the point where things they produce are either poorly mechanically balanced (either to the point of uselessness or OMGBROKEN) or incredibly overcomplex to implement (nine feats for something that could be an alternate use for a skill, for instance)).

They make BESM look well-designed, which should send shivers down your spine. (If it didn't, know that BESM has point-based character creation, and you can literally get the same amount of bonus points for being "somewhat awkward" or from going from "wanted across the nation" to "wanted everywhere in the world". Those same points can be spent to make you go from average to above-average (but not spectacular) appearance, or to turn your .45 pistol into the Death Star laser. And they have the gall to excuse it all as being balanced because the GM can change the rules. An entire game based on Oberoni!)

My own experience with 3rd party publishers is mostly based off of expanding what the game can currently do rather than adding in alternate systems.

Star Wars Saga Edition has been suggested to me before, and I have a friend with a copy of it who is supposed to be letting me borrow it.

The Force powers themselves are available for free (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=starwars/article/forcepowercards) (with current errata); the Force system itself isn't, but it's discussed (almost entirely!) in Saga Preview 3 (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=starwars/article/SagaPreview3). You can put together roughly 85% of the system from those (but it makes more sense in the book).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Fed Up With Fantasy 12-08-07, 05:18 PM	Does anybody know of a D20 System magic system that doesn't use spellcasting classes? Something that would allow players to add specific spells to their current class without multi-classing? Perhaps a list of Feats that would allow casting from specific levels or schools? Anything at all. Thanks.
LordDewtain 12-08-07, 05:34 PM	chthulu does something like this. maybe that would be adapted. I would just give it to them. if you choose what to give them, then its all in your hands. sure it is a little out of place rules wise, but it doesn't matter. make them rituals that require everyone to cast, and make them powerful. then it is a big quest to go out and find the "Tome of _____"
Fed Up With Fantasy 12-08-07, 05:56 PM	Thanks for the help. I've never looked at Cthulu but it sounds lik a good place to start.
Tempest Stormwind 12-08-07, 06:14 PM	Does anybody know of a D20 System magic system that doesn't use spellcasting classes? Something that would allow players to add specific spells to their current class without multi-classing? Perhaps a list of Feats that would allow casting from specific levels or schools? Anything at all. Thanks. Two come to mind. Green Ronin produced a variant on psionics back in 3e that works off of skills and feats. WotC's own Star Wars: Saga Edition has a rules system for the Force (essentially magic) that is entirely skills-and-feats-based. It shouldn't be too hard to port over, either.
Ash2Dust 12-08-07, 08:45 PM	There's also incantations from, I believe, Unearthed Arcana and the Urban Arcana supplement for D20 Modern. OGL info on them are here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/incantations.htm).
Fed Up With Fantasy 12-09-07, 07:59 AM	I've never considered Green Ronin before but I've heard they have some pretty good stuff. I've looked through their Mystic Vistas line and found Monsters of the Mind, but which product introduces Psionic rules? While looking at the Green Ronin products, I also found quite a few other publishers. Any suggestions on which ones to take a look at or avoid? Star Wars Saga Edition has been suggested to me before, and I have a friend with a copy of it who is supposed to be letting me borrow it. The Incantations link is very helpful. I will definately be taking another look at those rules as I tweak what I need. Thanks for the great suggestions!
Yokomohoyo 12-09-07, 02:20 PM	Their is also the system of the "Slayers" game. It's a D20 system and even the fighter can cast spells. You could also try B.E.S.E.M which with a feat you can grant any player spell casting abilities of a sorcerer (not a wizard).
Tempest Stormwind 12-09-07, 03:00 PM	I've never considered Green Ronin before but I've heard they have some pretty good stuff. I've looked through their Mystic Vistas line and found Monsters of the Mind, but which product introduces Psionic rules? While looking at the Green Ronin products, I also found quite a few other publishers. Any suggestions on which ones to take a look at or avoid? Psychic's Handbook. As for other publishers, it depends entirely what you're looking for and what your tolerance for slacking is. (For instance, avoid Mongoose Publishing; they have the worst development team I've ever seen, to the point where things they produce are either poorly mechanically balanced (either to the point of uselessness or OMGBROKEN) or incredibly overcomplex to implement (nine feats for something that could be an alternate use for a skill, for instance)). They make BESM look well-designed, which should send shivers down your spine. (If it didn't, know that BESM has point-based character creation, and you can literally get the same amount of bonus points for being "somewhat awkward" or from going from "wanted across the nation" to "wanted everywhere in the world". Those same points can be spent to make you go from average to above-average (but not spectacular) appearance, or to turn your .45 pistol into the Death Star laser. And they have the gall to excuse it all as being balanced because the GM can change the rules. An entire game based on Oberoni!) My own experience with 3rd party publishers is mostly based off of expanding what the game can currently do rather than adding in alternate systems. Star Wars Saga Edition has been suggested to me before, and I have a friend with a copy of it who is supposed to be letting me borrow it. The Force powers themselves are available for free (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=starwars/article/forcepowercards) (with current errata); the Force system itself isn't, but it's discussed (almost entirely!) in Saga Preview 3 (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=starwars/article/SagaPreview3). You can put together roughly 85% of the system from those (but it makes more sense in the book).