Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Avihs 09-08-05, 02:25 AM	I am currently gearing up to start a campaign and have been concidering using the spell point system for sorcerers. My question is if anyone else has tried this, and did you have any balance issues with combining the two systems?
Draco Strang 09-08-05, 03:01 AM	If you look at it, Psionics is pretty much a spell-point system. Maybe check that out before trying something from UA or building one? I've never seen a vancian system and a spell-point system combined. If I were you, I'd turn it into a flavor issue and let one group of casters (say, the divine) use vancian, whilst all arcane classes use spell-points, or something like that.
Tyler Do'Urden 09-08-05, 04:03 AM	How exactly would you mix Vance and Points? Would you prepare list and cast from it based on your point total or something?
Avihs 09-08-05, 02:02 PM	How exactly would you mix Vance and Points? Would you prepare list and cast from it based on your point total or something?Well, I would be using the Spell Point system from UA for Sorcerers. Other classes would remain the same, as they appear. I have always found the sorcerer somewhat lacking and have been condidering using the UA Spell Point system to give them more versatility without getting into the whole rigamarole of turning them into Wiard clones by modifying their spell progression tables or granting bonus feats. If you look at it, Psionics is pretty much a spell-point system. Maybe check that out before trying something from UA or building one? Aye, I am familiar with the point system from XPH. Although the point totals involved with that rule-set are higher than what is given in the UA, I believe that is where they should remain, in the XPH. Psionic characters, basically, have earned those higher point totals because they are limited to a single school/disipline (Psion) or know a far more limited amount of disciplines (Wilder).
Nephlite 09-08-05, 02:11 PM	Well, I would be using the Spell Point system from UA for Sorcerers. Other classes would remain the same, as they appear. I have always found the sorcerer somewhat lacking and have been condidering using the UA Spell Point system to give them more versatility without getting into the whole rigamarole of turning them into Wiard clones by modifying their spell progression tables or granting bonus feats. Aye, I am familiar with the point system from XPH. Although the point totals involved with that rule-set are higher than what is given in the UA, I believe that is where they should remain, in the XPH. Psionic characters, basically, have earned those higher point totals because they are limited to a single school/disipline (Psion) or know a far more limited amount of disciplines (Wilder). Um, no, they need the extra points becsuse you have to augment ever power. An arcane example, Fireball free scales 1d6/level. No additional cost. a Psionic fireball would cost 1 PP each extra 1d6 beyond Base cost (probably 5d6 damage as a 3rd level power I'm assuming). So to cast a 10d6 psionic fireball would use up 10 PP, not 5 like the Spellcaster. Disciplines should be looked at as Domains. The General list as well as your domain list are usable. Example: I'm a shapre I can choose from knowns (I think you are limited to 3 at level 1): Shaper domain powers like Astral Construct or any general list power like Inertial armor, Decelerate, Crystal shard, Float, catfall, etc etc. Wilder can only use general list unless he researches wasting Xp.
Avihs 09-08-05, 03:21 PM	Um, no, they need the extra points becsuse you have to augment ever power. An arcane example, Fireball free scales 1d6/level. No additional cost. a Psionic fireball would cost 1 PP each extra 1d6 beyond Base cost (probably 5d6 damage as a 3rd level power I'm assuming). So to cast a 10d6 psionic fireball would use up 10 PP, not 5 like the Spellcaster. Disciplines should be looked at as Domains. The General list as well as your domain list are usable. Example: I'm a shapre I can choose from knowns (I think you are limited to 3 at level 1): Shaper domain powers like Astral Construct or any general list power like Inertial armor, Decelerate, Crystal shard, Float, catfall, etc etc. Wilder can only use general list unless he researches wasting Xp.(sigh ... :rolleye2: ) Here we go... 1) The UA Spell Point system is a scaling system... The above 10th level Sorc would spend 5 points for his basic (6d6) fireball and an aditional point for each die, up to 10d6, for a total of 9 spell points. Which is one point less than your psionic fireball. 2) Which psionic system are your refering to? The 3.0 Psionic Handbook or 3.5 Expanded Psionic Handbook? My references are from the 3.5 XPH, which does not make use of the general powers list and discipline/domain bonus powers. Now back to my original question... Has anyone tried to combine a spell point (sorcerer) and vancian (wizard) sytem into their campaign? If so, have there been any ballance issues?
Avihs 09-09-05, 01:58 AM	2) Which psionic system are your refering to? The 3.0 Psionic Handbook or 3.5 Expanded Psionic Handbook? My references are from the 3.5 XPH, which does not make use of the general powers list and discipline/domain bonus powers.Scratch the above question... I had me a Dizzy Blond Gnome moment... :gah: I saw a reference to the "domain" word and had a bad flash back to the 3.0 psionic book. :D Any-Who....
Vanigo 09-09-05, 04:48 PM	How exactly would you mix Vance and Points? Would you prepare list and cast from it based on your point total or something? I once had a scheme where you memorized and expended spells normally, but you could rememorize spells whenever you had spare time. The catch was, you also spent spell points for every spell you cast, and those could only be regained through rest.
NexusX 09-09-05, 06:41 PM	Re: Spell points I'm not sure if this is quite the proper place for this, but because it has to do with Spell points, I thought I would post it here. I've been using a spell point system I made up for my long-running Stargate: Cosmothea campaign (No, it has nothing to do with the Stargate shows,etc. my Stargate campaign has been running since 1979) for at least the past 10 years. During this time, I've never heard a single complaint from my players about an imbalance. This is not to say that it isn't imbalanced, just that no one has complained. The monsters and NPC's use the same system, of course, and we've had a thriving gaming group for most of those 26+ years. I'm bringing this up because I've read so many posts over the months in which gamers bash spell points or seem very concerned that things will go awry or be terribly unbalanced. I have a detailed spell point and magic system, and haven't had any trouble with it, despite my many deviations from the D&D core rules. In Stargate: Cosmothea there is no spell memorization (I've always hated that concept). Wizards must spend time studying the complex spells during their free time, but when they go to cast a spell, they can pick and choose as they see fit, as long as they have the spell, have enough spell points to pay for it, and haven't cast up to their maximum number of spells of their highest spell level (i.e. if a D&D spellcaster can cast 3 3rd level spells, a Stargate character also is limited to 3 3rd level spells, but his lower limits - 1st and 2nd are now fluid. The spellcaster can, for example, cast 3 1st level spells instead of casting 1 3rd level. It's all handled using spell points, of course. I thought I would include this post in case there are any DM's out there who are leary of making the jump to spell points or who were wondering how it went in other campaigns. While D&D isn't broke (and thus in need of spell points), my players really enjoy the system - and no, the fighter types aren't complaining about an imbalance. Sorry for the long post ... Nexus
Avihs 09-10-05, 01:29 AM	NP for the long post NexusX... Thanks for the reply and your insight. ANyone else have any thoughts?
smrtgmp 09-10-05, 02:02 AM	I have a homebrew class that is basically a combination of vancian spellcasting and a spellpoint system. It's worked well thus far, though thus far I've only used it for NPCs, and I dont even think my PCs have any idea they faced something different. I suppose the fact that it was integrated somewhat seamlessly is a good sign.