Abjurer [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Abjurer [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Razefire
02-28-07, 01:58 AM Recently, I have joined a game, and I havent played in yrs. So, I decided to play a wizard, i like the class, and it might be nice to play after havent have played in so long. Anyway, I wanted to specialize in a school. I chose abjuration, as I think magical protection/defense is overlooked alot by players, but I like the role. Anyway, I wanted advice on how to build an Abjurer. Oh, another thing is im joining a group as level 6. Advice will be appreciated, thanks.
Seeker95
02-28-07, 09:24 AM Since you're just getting back into it, I recommend:
1. Do not specialize. The benefits are not really worth it.
2. Build you PC one level at a time, rather than "everything you can have at level 6." When you finish your 1st level build, level it up to 2nd. Then to 3rd. Etc.
3. Again, do not specialize. You can still choose lots of abjuration spells, but why close off two schools that you don't fully grasp to get a +1 CL benefit in a school you also do not fully grasp.
tarkin
02-28-07, 12:11 PM I disagree about not specializing. There are LOTS of ways to build a strong specialist character.

The only problem is taking schools to not use. It is not that hard to find a school that you are willing to give up.

Usually I am willing to give up at least two of Enchantment/Charm, Conjuration, Necromancy.

The question is, why did you pick Abjurer?

The benefit from specializing is that you get a free spell of each level. So you need to pick a school that has good spells to memorize ALL the time of EVERY level, not one that skips a few, or has lots of 'sometime spells'.

From PHB:

1: Protection from evil and Shield
*2: maybe Resist Energy
3: Dispell Magic and Magic Circle and Protection from Energy
4: Stone Skin, but barely
*5: ???
6: Dispell Magic, Greater and maybe Repulsion
*7: Maybe Spell Turning (good spell, but rarely usefull)
8: Dimensional Lock, Prismatic Wall
9: Prismatic Sphere.

OK, you got some heavy problem areas, 2,5, and 7

Let's go looking for non-core spells to fill in those problem areas:
2: no help
5: Refusal (Complete Arcane) and IronGuard, Lesser (Forgotten Realms)
7: Anti-Magic Aura (Magic of Faerun) and Energy Immunity (Compelte Arcane).

Net result, an Abjurer does pretty well, as long as 2nd level spells are not very important to you. That would be 1-2nd level and > 7th level
runestar
02-28-07, 12:15 PM I feel that specialization is well worth it at lower lvs. When you get so few slots, every slot you get helps, and specialization helps a lot here.:)
Melpomene
02-28-07, 12:21 PM Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil from CA makes a super-neat abjurer, provided you don't mind waiting a few levels or burning through a few feats and skills.
Bard of DorAr
02-28-07, 12:40 PM I strongly advise you get ahold of Complete Arcane and Complete Mage.

Classes you WANT to take.

Complete Arcane: Initiate of the Seven Fold Veil: Control of Prismatics, good defensive ability, prereqs bleed into Archmage well.

Also Consider the Feat: Precocious Apprentice (Pg 181, for a class in Complete Mage)

Complete Mage: Master Specialist is solid Filler instead of standard Wizard, if you took the Precocious Apprentice Feat you enter this at level 3. It's not the mandatory class but it helps towards prereqs.

Abjurant Champion: Gives a BAB boost, all your Abjuration Spells are Extended, all your third level down Abjuration Spells are Quickened, what's not to like?

Focused Specialist Class Alternate: Give up a third barred school, have spells on par with the Sorcerer.

So for a roughed out build for a focused Abjurer I would suggest.
+4
Elf: Abjurere 2/ Master Specialist 7/ Initiate of the SevenFold Veil 7/ Abjurant Champion 4 (Or Iot7 6/ Abjurant Champion depending on your reliance of Dispel Magic).

So you end up with BAB +11 or +12, Full Caster, Spells per day equal to a Sorc, though three of them per level HAVE to be Abjurations, Large Defensive Capabilities, all Abjuration Spells Extended, all 2nd or all 3rd level Abjurations quickened.

Other Suggestions to take into account is the Complete Mage Feat Somatic Weaponry, so you can cast with weapons. At that point the 2nd level Abjuration Daggerspell Stance becomes a beauty, not because you want to dual wield Daggers, but because you Can stand back and gain some DR and SR when you need it. You want the Shield Spell, you also want to upfront talk to the DM about houseruling Mage Armor, it was clearly aimed at Abjurant Champion even though by RAW it doesn't work.
Seeker95
02-28-07, 03:53 PM I disagree about not specializing. There are LOTS of ways to build a strong specialist characterYou are absolutely right. There are LOTS of ways. And all of them require a solid understanding of the intricacies and inter-relationships of a myriad of edition-specific rules and mechanics.

The OP said I haven't played in years.
HxHunter
02-28-07, 06:17 PM Usually I am willing to give up at least two of Enchantment/Charm, Conjuration, Necromancy.

I think you meant Evocation.

@Razefire: Check out
- Archmage (DMG)
- Abjurant Champion (CM)
- Inititate of the Sevenfold Veil (CA)
- Master Specialist (CM)
- Spellguard of Silverymoon (PGtF, it has some RP requirements)

Abjuration is nice. If you want to specialize drop Necro, Evocation, or Enchantment. You can use Shadow Evocation to make up for Evo. Then it is between Necro (RoEnfeeblement, RoExhaustion, Enervation) and Enchantment (Charms, Power Words, Feeblemind)
Melpomene
02-28-07, 06:23 PM You can do well or poorly with either specializing or not specializing. If the opee wants to be an abjurer, more power.

Generally, Enchantment and Illusion require that you, you know, care about them enough to invest a feat or whatever into them. Necromancy has a narrow enough focus where you can do without if you want.

The others... well, you usually want to snag a spell or two from.

For the record, though, you can live happily without conjuration. It just changes the way you play a little. And that little is less than you'de think.
DM_V2
02-28-07, 06:28 PM Darn two people already beat me too it.

Initiate of the seven fold veil is the best wizard Prc EVER!!!!!!!!
RellenMarn
02-28-07, 10:28 PM Currently playing an abjurer/ initiate of the sevenfold veil and loving it! A beautiful PRC, and personally I have never had a spell level that I could not fill.

1st: Protection from Evil, or Shield usually.
2nd: Protection from arrows, Obscure Object (situational, but has served me very well)
3rd: Dispel Magic - nuff said.
4th: Remove Curse, Globe of Invulnerability.
5th: Mordenkainen's Private Sanctum - very useful in my campaign, Break Enchantment
6th: Greater Dispel Magic
7th: Spell Turning
8th: Prismatic Wall, Mindblank
9th: Prismatic Sphere, Imprisonment, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Freedom - very nice all.

Not to mention meta magics, etc.

Seriously though, do not drop Conjuration, you could, but it is probably the most essential school with teleport, summons, and attack spells. I recommend dropping Necromancy and Enchantment - especially if playing a good character.
Elf-Killer
03-01-07, 12:20 AM I disagree about not specializing. There are LOTS of ways to build a strong specialist character

You are absolutely right. There are LOTS of ways. And all of them require a solid understanding of the intricacies and inter-relationships of a myriad of edition-specific rules and mechanics.

The OP said I haven't played in years.
I'll second that.

Also Consider the Feat: Precocious Apprentice (Pg 181, for a class in Complete Mage)

Complete Mage: Master Specialist is solid Filler instead of standard Wizard, if you took the Precocious Apprentice Feat you enter this at level 3. It's not the mandatory class but it helps towards prereqs.
I wouldn't take this feat, you can enter the PrC at lvl 4 normally, and it will become useless to you...

Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil is a excelent choice for a PrC, you won't be able to qualify for it before lvl 10, but it's quite feat-intensive... it is located in the Complete Arcane.

And you really shouldn't drop Conjuration... teleport is very important as are many attack spells from this school (Orbs anyone?)
Razefire
03-01-07, 01:16 PM Wowm thank you all so much for the positive and informed feedback. I just bought Complete Arcane, and Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil is awesome. Now, I am hoping to see Abjurant Champion and Master Specialist, can't wait.

I figured I really love magic alot, and I wanted to play a chracter who protected his comrades/allies, so I rather enjoy a defensive support role in general. Its just, I wanted to be a specialist Abjurer because I wanted to be really good at spell control/protection. I didnt want to totally eliminate offensive capabilities, so I selected to eliminate enchantment and necromancy. Conjuration is just too cool to give up, and Evocation has Contingency, which I am not eager to give up, lol. Thanks for the help, it was appeciated alot.
Dunamin
03-02-07, 07:12 AM Good call! I applaud making such decisions based on what style you like, rather than considerations to effectivity (unless those choices are really drastically bad).

As a DM, I sometimes provide opportunities for specialist wizards to shine in their fields in more subtle ways - mostly by more flavourful and thorough descriptions upon encountering magic of their speciality school, but sometimes even through minor mechanical benefits (besides those given in RAW). For instance, I might let an abjurer gain a +2 bonus on his Spellcraft check to recognize a Wall of Stone as such.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Razefire 02-28-07, 01:58 AM	Recently, I have joined a game, and I havent played in yrs. So, I decided to play a wizard, i like the class, and it might be nice to play after havent have played in so long. Anyway, I wanted to specialize in a school. I chose abjuration, as I think magical protection/defense is overlooked alot by players, but I like the role. Anyway, I wanted advice on how to build an Abjurer. Oh, another thing is im joining a group as level 6. Advice will be appreciated, thanks.
Seeker95 02-28-07, 09:24 AM	Since you're just getting back into it, I recommend: 1. Do not specialize. The benefits are not really worth it. 2. Build you PC one level at a time, rather than "everything you can have at level 6." When you finish your 1st level build, level it up to 2nd. Then to 3rd. Etc. 3. Again, do not specialize. You can still choose lots of abjuration spells, but why close off two schools that you don't fully grasp to get a +1 CL benefit in a school you also do not fully grasp.
tarkin 02-28-07, 12:11 PM	I disagree about not specializing. There are LOTS of ways to build a strong specialist character. The only problem is taking schools to not use. It is not that hard to find a school that you are willing to give up. Usually I am willing to give up at least two of Enchantment/Charm, Conjuration, Necromancy. The question is, why did you pick Abjurer? The benefit from specializing is that you get a free spell of each level. So you need to pick a school that has good spells to memorize ALL the time of EVERY level, not one that skips a few, or has lots of 'sometime spells'. From PHB: 1: Protection from evil and Shield 2: maybe Resist Energy 3: Dispell Magic and Magic Circle and Protection from Energy 4: Stone Skin, but barely 5: ??? 6: Dispell Magic, Greater and maybe Repulsion *7: Maybe Spell Turning (good spell, but rarely usefull) 8: Dimensional Lock, Prismatic Wall 9: Prismatic Sphere. OK, you got some heavy problem areas, 2,5, and 7 Let's go looking for non-core spells to fill in those problem areas: 2: no help 5: Refusal (Complete Arcane) and IronGuard, Lesser (Forgotten Realms) 7: Anti-Magic Aura (Magic of Faerun) and Energy Immunity (Compelte Arcane). Net result, an Abjurer does pretty well, as long as 2nd level spells are not very important to you. That would be 1-2nd level and > 7th level
runestar 02-28-07, 12:15 PM	I feel that specialization is well worth it at lower lvs. When you get so few slots, every slot you get helps, and specialization helps a lot here.:)
Melpomene 02-28-07, 12:21 PM	Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil from CA makes a super-neat abjurer, provided you don't mind waiting a few levels or burning through a few feats and skills.
Bard of DorAr 02-28-07, 12:40 PM	I strongly advise you get ahold of Complete Arcane and Complete Mage. Classes you WANT to take. Complete Arcane: Initiate of the Seven Fold Veil: Control of Prismatics, good defensive ability, prereqs bleed into Archmage well. Also Consider the Feat: Precocious Apprentice (Pg 181, for a class in Complete Mage) Complete Mage: Master Specialist is solid Filler instead of standard Wizard, if you took the Precocious Apprentice Feat you enter this at level 3. It's not the mandatory class but it helps towards prereqs. Abjurant Champion: Gives a BAB boost, all your Abjuration Spells are Extended, all your third level down Abjuration Spells are Quickened, what's not to like? Focused Specialist Class Alternate: Give up a third barred school, have spells on par with the Sorcerer. So for a roughed out build for a focused Abjurer I would suggest. +4 Elf: Abjurere 2/ Master Specialist 7/ Initiate of the SevenFold Veil 7/ Abjurant Champion 4 (Or Iot7 6/ Abjurant Champion depending on your reliance of Dispel Magic). So you end up with BAB +11 or +12, Full Caster, Spells per day equal to a Sorc, though three of them per level HAVE to be Abjurations, Large Defensive Capabilities, all Abjuration Spells Extended, all 2nd or all 3rd level Abjurations quickened. Other Suggestions to take into account is the Complete Mage Feat Somatic Weaponry, so you can cast with weapons. At that point the 2nd level Abjuration Daggerspell Stance becomes a beauty, not because you want to dual wield Daggers, but because you Can stand back and gain some DR and SR when you need it. You want the Shield Spell, you also want to upfront talk to the DM about houseruling Mage Armor, it was clearly aimed at Abjurant Champion even though by RAW it doesn't work.
Seeker95 02-28-07, 03:53 PM	I disagree about not specializing. There are LOTS of ways to build a strong specialist characterYou are absolutely right. There are LOTS of ways. And all of them require a solid understanding of the intricacies and inter-relationships of a myriad of edition-specific rules and mechanics. The OP said I haven't played in years.
HxHunter 02-28-07, 06:17 PM	Usually I am willing to give up at least two of Enchantment/Charm, Conjuration, Necromancy. I think you meant Evocation. @Razefire: Check out - Archmage (DMG) - Abjurant Champion (CM) - Inititate of the Sevenfold Veil (CA) - Master Specialist (CM) - Spellguard of Silverymoon (PGtF, it has some RP requirements) Abjuration is nice. If you want to specialize drop Necro, Evocation, or Enchantment. You can use Shadow Evocation to make up for Evo. Then it is between Necro (RoEnfeeblement, RoExhaustion, Enervation) and Enchantment (Charms, Power Words, Feeblemind)
Melpomene 02-28-07, 06:23 PM	You can do well or poorly with either specializing or not specializing. If the opee wants to be an abjurer, more power. Generally, Enchantment and Illusion require that you, you know, care about them enough to invest a feat or whatever into them. Necromancy has a narrow enough focus where you can do without if you want. The others... well, you usually want to snag a spell or two from. For the record, though, you can live happily without conjuration. It just changes the way you play a little. And that little is less than you'de think.
DM_V2 02-28-07, 06:28 PM	Darn two people already beat me too it. Initiate of the seven fold veil is the best wizard Prc EVER!!!!!!!!
RellenMarn 02-28-07, 10:28 PM	Currently playing an abjurer/ initiate of the sevenfold veil and loving it! A beautiful PRC, and personally I have never had a spell level that I could not fill. 1st: Protection from Evil, or Shield usually. 2nd: Protection from arrows, Obscure Object (situational, but has served me very well) 3rd: Dispel Magic - nuff said. 4th: Remove Curse, Globe of Invulnerability. 5th: Mordenkainen's Private Sanctum - very useful in my campaign, Break Enchantment 6th: Greater Dispel Magic 7th: Spell Turning 8th: Prismatic Wall, Mindblank 9th: Prismatic Sphere, Imprisonment, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Freedom - very nice all. Not to mention meta magics, etc. Seriously though, do not drop Conjuration, you could, but it is probably the most essential school with teleport, summons, and attack spells. I recommend dropping Necromancy and Enchantment - especially if playing a good character.
Elf-Killer 03-01-07, 12:20 AM	I disagree about not specializing. There are LOTS of ways to build a strong specialist character You are absolutely right. There are LOTS of ways. And all of them require a solid understanding of the intricacies and inter-relationships of a myriad of edition-specific rules and mechanics. The OP said I haven't played in years. I'll second that. Also Consider the Feat: Precocious Apprentice (Pg 181, for a class in Complete Mage) Complete Mage: Master Specialist is solid Filler instead of standard Wizard, if you took the Precocious Apprentice Feat you enter this at level 3. It's not the mandatory class but it helps towards prereqs. I wouldn't take this feat, you can enter the PrC at lvl 4 normally, and it will become useless to you... Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil is a excelent choice for a PrC, you won't be able to qualify for it before lvl 10, but it's quite feat-intensive... it is located in the Complete Arcane. And you really shouldn't drop Conjuration... teleport is very important as are many attack spells from this school (Orbs anyone?)
Razefire 03-01-07, 01:16 PM	Wowm thank you all so much for the positive and informed feedback. I just bought Complete Arcane, and Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil is awesome. Now, I am hoping to see Abjurant Champion and Master Specialist, can't wait. I figured I really love magic alot, and I wanted to play a chracter who protected his comrades/allies, so I rather enjoy a defensive support role in general. Its just, I wanted to be a specialist Abjurer because I wanted to be really good at spell control/protection. I didnt want to totally eliminate offensive capabilities, so I selected to eliminate enchantment and necromancy. Conjuration is just too cool to give up, and Evocation has Contingency, which I am not eager to give up, lol. Thanks for the help, it was appeciated alot.
Dunamin 03-02-07, 07:12 AM	Good call! I applaud making such decisions based on what style you like, rather than considerations to effectivity (unless those choices are really drastically bad). As a DM, I sometimes provide opportunities for specialist wizards to shine in their fields in more subtle ways - mostly by more flavourful and thorough descriptions upon encountering magic of their speciality school, but sometimes even through minor mechanical benefits (besides those given in RAW). For instance, I might let an abjurer gain a +2 bonus on his Spellcraft check to recognize a Wall of Stone as such.