Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rixarn 05-24-05, 02:35 PM	Well there are in fact two points i want to discuss, the second one being probably discussed in the past but im not sure about the first. 1)Shapechange and Forms: Inmunities, resistances, etc... To explain my idea with examples: a. My character casts shapechange , he is hitten by an enemy Energy Drain Gaining 5 negative levels. In his round he then shapechanges to any form of undead you like. Since undead are inmune to energy drain or loss level, do you recover lost levels? If so, only as long as you´re in undead form or the effect is "Dissolved" in the undead form. b. My character is struck by a deadly poison and he fails his saving thrown... in his round he changes to a balor (a creature inmune to poison)... The character is still poisoned? Pretty much that´s the idea and there can be a lot of examples... 2) Shapechange and advanced forms: I belive the general rule is you take the form of the average creature of the species, but there are some creatures (like dragons) that are the same creature but just advanced. Its nonesense you cant take the form of -for example- an advanced Fire giant or Titan but you can take the form of any dragon as long as you reach his HD... Well those are my ideas :D
tarkin 05-24-05, 02:44 PM	1A) Not sure, but this is what I would rule (basically taking the offical rule for poison and applying it here as well): The damage is already done, you have taken it, it is NOT an effect hanging on you, so does not go away if you become undead. 1B) Here what is happen is known, official. If you get hit by poison while in a form suspectible to poison you take damage immediately. Changing form does NOT help against the damage already taken. However all poisons have an immediate effect and a secondary effect. If you are in a form immune to the secondary effect when it activates, then you do not take any damage. 2) The Dragon forms are explicitedly listed as seperate versions. The same thing happens with elementals (different sizes instead of ages). As such they are sufficiently different to NOT count as "advancements", and are an exception that proves the rule.
Dalthbar 05-24-05, 03:15 PM	I'm going to agree with tarkin. Your form can prevent future damage, but not past damage. Spells like Shroud of Undeath can prevent lots of stuff as if you were undead, but wouldn't remove pre-existing effects (such as negative levels).
Rixarn 05-25-05, 05:12 PM	What about the negative level stuff? Do you think then its the same case?
MrkGrismer 05-26-05, 09:14 AM	I would say that goes for negative levels as well. If you are not immune when you get hit then you take the damage/effect. If you later change to something that is immune it is irrelevant. If you later change to something that regenerates/fast heals then that regeneratin fast healing applies.
Rixarn 05-26-05, 09:56 AM	Lets think in some kind of lingering effect such as any domination spell. If the caster is dominated and he happens to shift to undead, he cant remain dominated as undead are inmune to mind-influencing effect... at that very moment the "lingering effect" is cut, isnt it? As i see it, Poison is a different case I belive, since its an "instantaneous effect" (the first roll) with lingering consequenses (the effect of the poison) of course the poison is still there and the secondary effect is another instantaneous effect. Energy drain is a lingering effect with(in some cases) instantaneous consequenses(real level loss if you fail the saves at the end of the duration for energy drain, for example). Dunno :(