Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Robmansz 12-18-03, 11:56 AM	Hi there, in a while my sorcerer turns level 8... We all know what that means... :confused: My first level 4 spell..! ;) Currently im intrigued by the Sonic Orb spell, partly because of my Energy Substitution (Electricity) and Spell Focus (Evocation) feats... Well on my way becoming an Elemental (Air) Savant... :angel: Since i am not set on this i want to ask you, the community, for alternate choices... Eg. what was your first 4th level arcane spell? thanks for replying... :D Rob 3.0 ed.
dantedarkstar 12-18-03, 12:02 PM	Sorcerer I guess ? 4th level is kinda hard to choose, because there are lots of good spells, but no "obvious" choices. Sonic Orb may be fine, but personally I would prefer something more general. Polymorph can be really useful, as well as Dimension Door, Greater Invisibility or Wall of Ice. But all these may fit badly your concept. Maybe some hints ? Battle sorcerer ? Utility sorcerer ? Something else ? Do you have enough combat or utility spells ?
Robmansz 12-18-03, 12:29 PM	I have been loading up on the combat spells mainly... My party requires that i do so, however i feel that i do want to be more than a moving artillery platform... Thus my skillpoints are mostly spent on gather info, intimidation, bluff etc... This is the balance for now, combat spells vs social skills... I'm needin a summoning spell before i can take levels in Elemental (Air) Savant but i want to take that 1 level before going prestige, that would be at 12th level (summon monster 6)... You could say i need some of those general utility spells... But for now my Character is mainly bent towards battle Sorcerer Rob 3rd ed
tarkin 12-18-03, 12:43 PM	4th level has a lot of good spells, but for a sorceror that only gets one, in my mind it comes down to 3 superb spells. I personally prefer Greater Invisibility. Alone or combined with Non-detection (essential at higher levels) it is one of the best defensive spells around. If you have enough lower level offensive spells, this is a great thing. Cast attack spell then move. Cast then move. But for sorceror Resilient Sphere is very appealing. It can be used both offensively (trap person) or defensively (protect self). The only other spell I would consider for my first 4th level spell would be enervation. It rips through enemey wizards. Once a sorceror has one or more of these top three, consider the following: 1) Shadow Conjuration if you are low on conjuration spells. 2) Dimensional Anchor if you face a lot of wizards that teleport away 3) Stoneskin and/or Fire Shield if you get into melee combat often 4) Black Tentacles if you need a good guarding spell (look at duration). 5) Ice Storm if you face a lot of evaders (Monks/Thieves) P.S. Summoning spells tend to suck for combat. They shine in solving wierd problems where you need someone that can fly or swim or dig or hold very hot things etc. etc. As such I need to learn a summoning spell I would prefer it be a weaker level not a 6th level.
polsemager 12-18-03, 03:45 PM	When talking about a spell that can solve many problems, you must include Dimension Door. Although you'll get acces to teleport in a few levels until then DD is really, REALLY nice
Golem1972 12-18-03, 04:34 PM	These may not be optimal, but my group seems to have a lot of fun with them. Invisibility, Greater - really good defensive spell for you; really, really good offensive spell for your rogue (lots of sneak attacks, just watch out for creatures with blindfight/sense) Polymorph - just an all around great spell, besides all of the non-combat uses this spell has, the party tank will love having reach and a really big strength bonus. Charm Monster - lasts one day per level, great against big melee monsters with low will saves (you can collect a small army of temporary monster cohorts this way). One last point, if your about to hit 9th level, shouldn't you be picking up your SECOND 4th level spell? Having already picked up a 4th level spell upon reaching 8th level?
Laak 12-19-03, 04:24 AM	All though I'm playing a wizard, I have also had some trouble chosing my first 4th level spells. As Dantedarkstar said there are several good 4th level spells, but none of them really seem to stick out. In the end I opted for Otiluke’s resilient Sphere (for offensive and defense use :mage: ) and improved invisibility (again both offensive and defensive). An alternative is Tirumael’s energy spheres (MoF), a spell that gets beter while you're progressing. laak
Robmansz 12-19-03, 01:26 PM	Golem1972, you're right :D Pressed the wong one i guess... My Sorcerer turns level 8 soon... I'll edit my original message... :eek:
Redeemer of Ogar 12-19-03, 02:42 PM	I went with Fire Orb and Dimension Door as my first two Lvl4 spells for my wizard. However, I had a specialist wizard who had sworn off Enchantment, Illusion, and Necromancy, otherwise I'd have definitely considered Improved Invisibility. I had forgotten that invisibility was illusion when creating my specialist. :embarrass +--Redeemer of Ogar--
RLWilde 12-19-03, 11:26 PM	Otiluke's Resilient Sphere... takes an enemy combatant out of the fight 'til you've dealt with his friends and are ready to deal with him... the old "divide and conquer" tactic. A lot really depends on your group and campaign. Fighter-heavy? Mass Enlarge Person Fight a lot of spellcasters? Lesser Globe of Invulnerability
Jon Hightower 12-20-03, 12:26 AM	Definitely greater Invis. It is a wonder to stay invisible after attacking with a spell and it will help others in your party as well. Rogues stay invisible after a sneak attack, monks and fighters fight invisibly, An invisible raging Barbarian is a wonder to behold, and the list goes on..........
Bopple 12-20-03, 12:53 AM	Another vote for Greater Invisibility. The next candidate would be Enervation.
Zar Niln 12-20-03, 01:43 AM	Phantasmal Killer my friend! Great spell! Skreebo the Kobold Wizard heard great things about it, said eh, what the heck. Prepared it one day on a whim. Cast it on a Drider Cleric. BAM! No one else touched it. I would like to put votes for Dimension Door, Polymorph Other, Improved Invisibility, and if you are medium-size, Polymorph Self. Great trick: Polymorph into a hill giant before battle. That'll make the dwarves think twice.
green_yawgmoth 12-20-03, 02:14 AM	I went with fire orb followed by ennervation at lv 9. Ennervate for 1-4 neg. levels, then fire orb them. If you have a high enough DC (which for a lv 8 sorc with SF-evoc should be about 21ish), that -4 levels (if you roll a 4) should make it hard to save. Now that you have your target dazed for a round, hit 'em again; ennervation will be nice for dropping their saves/attacks more, or another fire orb could daze them for another round. Fire orb is also nice for when you get a mini-horde coming at you, as you can cut it into up to 8 spheres; 1/level. Dazing an entire attack force (or most of it) will be most helpful to the party, as now they can attack freely.
Robmansz 12-20-03, 10:03 AM	i cannot seem to find the spell description of "Greater Invisibility" in any of my books... :eek: Is this the unofficial name for the spell "Improved Invisibility"? Or is it 3.5? Thanks for all of your replies btw If i cast Otiluke's Resilient Sphere on another spellcaster, he is probably allowed to cast a dispel magic. But still, this can be a usefull spell indeed... :smirk: Enervation is also powerfull in that there is no save... :b: Problem is i like the other suggestions too, but these two i will surely discuss with some friends... What about Stoneskin? Is it any good if you already have Mirror Image and Shield? Rob 3rd ed. :dice: :dice: :dice: (now there's a roll heheh)
Bopple 12-20-03, 10:09 AM	It's 3.5 name of Improved Invisibility. And stone skin seems not so good, imo.
tarkin 12-20-03, 12:28 PM	Stoneskin was improved in 3.5, but I still prefer Resilient sphere or Greater Invisibility, as I mentioned above.
Robmansz 01-11-04, 09:49 PM	Welp my character is 8th level now... Now i have two weeks to decide... I am seriously considering improved invisibility and enervation... Still open for suggestions..! Robmansz..;)
green_yawgmoth 01-12-04, 01:23 AM	Ennervation is a very, very nice spell, and so are all of the various orb spells. Originally posted by tarkin 4) Black Tentacles Only if he takes Polymorph other as his 9th level spell. ;)