Post/Author/DateTime	Post
EvilVegan 04-19-04, 05:31 PM	just got a 3.5 dmg. Looking over magic armor and it seems that it would be possible to have +5 Full Plate of Spell Resistance (19) with greater Acid, Cold, Elec, Fire, and Sonic resistance, Undead Controlling, Greater Shadow, Greater Silent Moves, Greater Slick, Etherealness, and Glamered? It would be expensive. . . but is that possible? Did I miss a gp limit or something? Granted it costs 633600 gp, but still. Weapons seem to be the same as they were in 3.0, with the bonuses instead of gp additions. Maa?
Nick Soapdish 04-19-04, 05:41 PM	There's a gp limit. I thought it was 100,000 gp, but I can't find anything under the SRD and I'm not sure. It might be as high as 200,000 gp which is the limit on non-epic magic items IIRC.
Seeker95 04-19-04, 07:15 PM	Couple of comments. 1. Any single item with a gold piece value over 200,000 gp is considered "epic". 2. No single weapon or armor can have more than +5 on the armor enhancements, nor greater than +10 on the total of armor and ability enhancements. 3. Your item breaks both these rules.
Donnavin Snowolf 04-19-04, 07:20 PM	I don't think it breaks number 2. I can't find anywhere in the SRD that says "Acid, Cold, Elec, Fire, and Sonic resistance, Undead Controlling, Greater Shadow, Greater Silent Moves, Greater Slick, Etherealness, and Glamered" are a + enchantment, just +to cost. I admit this had me confused as well. Number 1 it definately breaks though.
Seeker95 04-19-04, 07:30 PM	Each of them has "equivalent enhancement bonuses" as defined by the tables 7-5, 7-6, 7-14, and 7-15. This is made explicit in the text on page 217 (for armor): A suit of armor cannot have an effective bonus (enhancement plus special ability bonus equivalents) higher than a +10. (first full paragraph on the page) This is repeated on the same page for shields, and for weapons on page 221.
Mith 04-19-04, 07:55 PM	Seeker, he's specifically talking about the enhancements that DON'T list an equivilant bonus. There are a number, and on that table they say things like "+66,000 gp" instead of "+2" or something.
Edymnion 04-19-04, 08:17 PM	Yup, 3.5 added a whole bunch of junk about enchantments that aren't enchantments. Like all of the energy resistances, shadow, slick, etc, are now just a straight gold cost to add to a suit. They no longer take up plusses. So yes, if you've got the money, you can put as many of the non-plus additions on armor that you want. Anything over 200,000 gold is still an Epic level item though. And yes, I preferred to have these things as +X equivolents instead of "freebies".
Seeker95 04-19-04, 09:46 PM	Mith, thanks for the clarification. I now see the distinction. I agree with Edymnion, but at the same time, the price limit pretty much covers it anyway.
Sancus 04-19-04, 11:32 PM	+X bonuses are supposed to be for 'add-on' things that don't make a weapon specifically good at being a weapon(attack/damage) or armor specifically better at being armor. It's a good idea, except it's applied poorly, with many books not following that guideline very well.
Asmodeous 04-20-04, 02:36 AM	I had thought that those attributes counted as a "+" depending on where they appeared on that table. (sorry, dont have a 3.5 dmg with me). so, if the attribute was listed lower than +2, but higher than +3 in the table, it counted as a +2 as far as the total + of the armor goes, but yeah, as Edymnion pointed out, its probably academic anyway, as the 200,000gp limit will kick in and stop you getting too carried away.
bitnine 04-20-04, 03:00 AM	Well, most of the things that have been converted over to gp increases instead of + equivelents seem to be supplementary abilities. The list is: Skill bonuses (slick/shadow/silent) Energy resistance Etherealness Undead ControllingWhat strikes me as similar among them is that they don't seem to be key 'armorish' abilities so much as additional abilities that are folded into armor, much as a slotless item added as a side bonus. Anyways, given the price limitation, I don't really see things going all nuts.
Asmodeous 04-20-04, 03:13 AM	I just had a thought about this. If A character had epic craft weapons and armor, could that character create the suit of armor that Evilvegan suggested? The item would be classified as epic, so only epic characters could wear, but 633,600 gp is chicken feed when you are talking epic crafting.
Seeker95 04-20-04, 10:15 AM	Originally posted by Asmodeous If A character had epic craft weapons and armor, could that character create the suit of armor that Evilvegan suggested? Yes. Epic re-writes all the rules. (Some would argue that there is little difference between "re-write" and "break" and that Epic is a different game altogether.)
Kyuketsukiouji 04-20-04, 10:30 AM	Actually, non-Epic characters could wear it, but you need Epic Craft Arms to make it.
Seeker95 04-20-04, 10:52 AM	Kyuke, Non-epic characters could wear it, but a DM should not allow it into a non-epic campaign simply because it outstrips* the wealth by character level table on page 135 of the 3.5 DMG. Not only can you not craft it without epic feats. But you can't afford it at pre-epic levels! :P * Assuming the DM does not permit a character to have more than 50% of maximum character wealth tied to a single item.
Kyuketsukiouji 04-20-04, 10:57 AM	Seeker: That's entirely up to your DM. After all, finding any artifact breaks that table too, and sometime, PCs do get their hands on an artifact (if only because they have to destroy it). Of course, I always said that if your party wealth starts getting too high for their levels by the guidelines, it's time to up CRs....
Seeker95 04-20-04, 11:02 AM	Originally posted by Kyuketsukiouji Of course, I always said that if your party wealth starts getting too high for their levels by the guidelines, it's time to up CRs.... :devil: A balancing tool available to any DM! :devil: Especially when combined with sunder and disarm.
Kyuketsukiouji 04-20-04, 11:21 AM	Yup.