Post/Author/DateTime	Post
metamind 02-12-06, 04:13 PM	Ive been Dming for a while no, and there is something I never quite understood: when casting a spell, must you make an attack roll, or is is just a save?
Wind of Darkness 02-12-06, 04:20 PM	Depends on the spell. If it requires an attack roll, you roll an attack. If it allows a save, your opponent rolls a save. Some require both, some require neither. I direct you to the SRD section on magic (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/magicOverview.htm). EDIT: Spelling error.
Viper3220 02-12-06, 04:24 PM	if you have to use an attack roll, it will say so. IMO all magic should be touch attacks, but that would cripple the wizard. (or so alot of people would say) I personally think its cheap to always hit.
Wind of Darkness 02-12-06, 04:32 PM	if you have to use an attack roll, it will say so. IMO all magic should be touch attacks, but that would cripple the wizard. (or so alot of people would say) I personally think its cheap to always hit. It would make no sense mechanically for a lot of spells to work that way. What, are you bitter that you have bad luck with saves or something? ;)
Viper3220 02-12-06, 04:41 PM	I think that alot of spells like Dominate person (mental spells) but for fireball... they should atleast have to roll to hit the area. (something simple like ac 10 but if there's people in the way (cover) then add a little bonus. or are they _that_ precise? actually Magic Missile and True Strike and save or die spells are what made me bitter. ;)
metamind 02-12-06, 04:43 PM	Oh, so it is just a save, SR, and ranged touch...Thanks a lot!
Wind of Darkness 02-12-06, 04:47 PM	They are indeed that precise. Jeez, direct damage spells aren't that great as is. Is there really a need to nerf them even more!? Wizards, in case you haven't noticed, aren't all that great at making attack rolls. Requiring them to do so for damage spells athat already allow saves is just plain mean.
Nom 02-12-06, 05:30 PM	Spells can take a little getting used to at first. When performing a physical attack, you make an attack roll (variable) against a fixed AC, and if successful roll damage. This leads a lot of people to expect that when you cast a spell you make a roll as well. But think about it, when you roll an attack roll you are not rolling to see if you can attack, but whether your attack hits the target. In the same way, the attempt to cast the spell is (usually) automatically successful. However, it may or may not affect the target, depending on the type of spell. There are roughly three different situations: (1) The spell works. If a spell doesn't directly affect an unwilling target, it just works. Cure spells, protections and summons fall into this category, as do many miscellaneous spells. Spells that affect the environment (eg obscuring mist) usually work this way as well. (2) The spell works, but the target might resist or reduce the effect. Many attack spells allow a saving throw. The trick about such spells is that the target makes a saving throw against the effect, which has a fixed DC. This is exactly the opposite to how attack rolls work, so it can feel a little odd until you get used to it. It will help if you declare the DC with the spell - "I cast sleep, DC 13". This way, it is obvious that the target needs to save, rather than just "I cast sleep" and everybody pauses wondering who needs to roll the dice. (3) The spell needs to hit the target. This is needed for rays or touch ranged spells. These spells often don't allow the target a saving throw - if you're hit then you're affected. In this case, the attacker rolls a normal attack roll, though the target can't use armour to protect himself ("touch AC").