| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
|---|---|
| Xerxes04-15-05, 03:42 PM | I am currently playing an aging human Psion/Cleric in a game that has an epic scope. I asked the GM if there might be a way for my character to extend his life, possibly even becoming an immortal. My character is uncertain if he will be able to complete the quest before his life-span is up, and cannot trust the other two characters to complete the quest. The most obvious way is to become a Lich, but my character would like to maintain his True Neutral alignment. There are "good" Liches out there, such as the brief description in the Libris Mortis, I don't want to be overpowering. There is also the Deathless in the Book of Exalted Deeds and in the Eberron book, which while not has overpowered (lacks the phylactery and the ability to return if "killed"), I'm unsure if the whole "undeath" thing is something my character would want. I've debated with myself on whether or not it might be possible to have the process the Elan's go through done to my character, but keep the levels my character has already obtained. That would give my character 1000-something years, but I like the idea of an immortal character. The GM is pretty flexible, but I don't think he wants me to be overpowered. While as a player I think some of the options would be high on the cool factor, I don't to unbalance the game. Any suggestions would be helpful, even custom ideas not in the books. Thanks in advance. Xerxes |
| lordmolay04-15-05, 04:20 PM | get someone to cast wish or mirical on you... however me being a DM i would have some messed up cosiqueses with the wish |
| bomaz04-15-05, 04:27 PM | there is an epic feat to live longer. design an epic spell to immortality(possibly another epic spell to make the spellcraft check) become an elf, or outsider. start gathering followers become a demigod (not suitable for a cleric perhaps) |
| Xerxes04-15-05, 04:33 PM | I probably should clarify. The game's story has an epic scope, but the characters are not epic. The GM and I want this to be a developing concern and a researched subject, and probably will not happen for several levels. |
| 75RD Drum Clip04-15-05, 04:56 PM | Longevity potions and or Elixers of Youth could solve the issue. |
| Nuntius12804-15-05, 05:03 PM | I don't think I'd have a problem with using Wish for Immortality. Just so long as you mean immortality as a means of immunity to death by aging, of course. |
| Heptameron04-15-05, 05:06 PM | It might be difficult to convince the elans to turn you into one, let alone keep your level/class/skills/etc. But the maximum age was errata-ed so that elans can live forever, I believe. So that's a prospective course, as long as your DM is willing to bend the rules. Otherwise you could probably develop a power that adds a year to your life, or something (probably 9th-level). |
| shultz04-15-05, 05:07 PM | Look into the Green Star Adept class from complete arcane. It's a prestige class that slowly transforms you into a construct at 10th level but with your own mind. The construct basically has an infinite life span and will never succumb to the affects of age. The class can have any alignment. |
| Elurindel04-15-05, 05:35 PM | The only problem with asking for immortality with a wish is that it might stick you in a nondimension where no time passes,or cast Eternity of Pain upon you. You could always risk the Reincarnation spell, if you get a druid to do it for you. You come back in a new body, with most of your stats and all your class levels, and the age of a new adventurer. |
| Xerxes04-15-05, 05:47 PM | I think another clarification is in order. I'm helping the GM get some new gamers off the ground (great players, and can be very fun to RP). That is the reason I'm playing a cleric/psion. I deal damage from a distance and heal them...a support character. Normally I don't like playing clerics, and psion is helping me to enjoy the character. In order to facilitate this, we've designed a Mystic Theurge/Cerebremancer type class for Psionics and Divine. I just use everything from the Cerebremancer and just add "divine" where it says "arcane", and replace "Knowledge: Arcana" with "Knowledge: Religion". I've started this class and am unwilling to change it from it just yet. The Green Star Adept is indeed quite tempting, but I would change from being an effective part of the party, to focusing on an arcane aspect that my character does not have. While I believe the GM will be willing to alter the class to fit either the psionic or divine aspects of my character, it will move away from the versatility and necessity of supporting two characters who are essentially fighters. But maybe a middle ground could be obtained? Lichdom is obtained through a powerful magical ritual, and according to the Monster Manual, it can be done at lower levels (sample Lich is a Level 7 Sorcerer). Therefore, maybe a one-shot ritual using some specialized material/substance such as the Green Star Gem in order to obtain the immortality/longer life my character desires, but none of the other benifits? Possibly. The major thing for me is that my character obtains this through his own study and actions, not because of some arbitrary casting of a Wish spell or finding a magical elixer. Maybe it's just me, but I enjoy the idea of my character going through an extensive ritual and coming out changed. It makes it mysterious and, in my mind, cool. |
| primemover00304-15-05, 05:50 PM | There is an Epic spell in Lost Empires of Faerun that can do what you ask but it requires the deaths of many, many sentient creatures. Ioulaum's Longevity IIRC... |
| Psychoray04-15-05, 06:09 PM | Becoming an outsider: Take 10 levels of elemental savant from complete arcane. |
| Moon-Lancer04-15-05, 06:20 PM | in races of the wild there is a fey race for players that are immortal to age. +1 level adjustment. |
| MaverickWolf04-15-05, 06:50 PM | Here's another idea for you: In Savage Species, there are various rituals to transform yourself into a different race. Perhaps you could go through one of those rituals to transform yourself into an elan, instead of trying to do things their way. Just an idea for you to look at. |
| NeueRegel04-15-05, 09:50 PM | I read a book called "The Misenchanted Sword" that kinda made a quite clear difference in terms between "immortality" and "eternal youth". The first implies "impossible to kill, impossible to die". But the character still aged... becoming more and more elderly, crippled, alzheimered, sightless, etc... The second granted perfect youth, but no other powers; he'd still bleed just fine. Now, the two together, or even the first, alone, I'd really twist with a wish. But the second, by itself? In game terms? What'd it really hurt? Just my two coppers. NeueRegel |
| runestar04-15-05, 10:52 PM | In order to facilitate this, we've designed a Mystic Theurge/Cerebremancer type class for Psionics and Divine. I just use everything from the Cerebremancer and just add "divine" where it says "arcane", and replace "Knowledge: Arcana" with "Knowledge: Religion". Yet another reason why I think the psychic theurge prc in the mind's eye was another utter waste of space, where an original prc could actually be posted. |
| mikevw204-15-05, 11:31 PM | Could go to something that would let you bring on the half-celestial template. There are many that players have created. The only one I know of specifically is a Celestial Heir, created by someone I know. |
| Tobias Talco'un04-15-05, 11:52 PM | I read a book called "The Misenchanted Sword" that kinda made a quite clear difference in terms between "immortality" and "eternal youth". The first implies "impossible to kill, impossible to die". But the character still aged... becoming more and more elderly, crippled, alzheimered, sightless, etc... The second granted perfect youth, but no other powers; he'd still bleed just fine. Now, the two together, or even the first, alone, I'd really twist with a wish. But the second, by itself? In game terms? What'd it really hurt? Just my two coppers. NeueRegel First of all, great book. Next, in one issue or Dungeon, the Mordion(sp?) castle issue(Ithink it was #330), there was a minor artifact in the form of a potion that made it so that you coundn't die by ageing. You keep on gaining/losing ability scores as normal with aging, but you couldn't go below one, and a wish to stop lossing ability scores from aging would fix it. Just have your DM say you drunk this a long time ago, and you didn't know it, or have him make a adventure around it(My choice). |
| Sylvaroth04-16-05, 09:37 AM | Would you care to specify what quest your character fears he cannot complete? |
| DarkWarriorKarg04-16-05, 10:15 AM | I am currently playing an aging human Psion/Cleric in a game that has an epic scope. I asked the GM if there might be a way for my character to extend his life, possibly even becoming an immortal. My character is uncertain if he will be able to complete the quest before his life-span is up, and cannot trust the other two characters to complete the quest. The most obvious way is to become a Lich, but my character would like to maintain his True Neutral alignment. There are "good" Liches out there, such as the brief description in the Libris Mortis, I don't want to be overpowering. There is also the Deathless in the Book of Exalted Deeds and in the Eberron book, which while not has overpowered (lacks the phylactery and the ability to return if "killed"), I'm unsure if the whole "undeath" thing is something my character would want. I've debated with myself on whether or not it might be possible to have the process the Elan's go through done to my character, but keep the levels my character has already obtained. That would give my character 1000-something years, but I like the idea of an immortal character. The GM is pretty flexible, but I don't think he wants me to be overpowered. While as a player I think some of the options would be high on the cool factor, I don't to unbalance the game. Any suggestions would be helpful, even custom ideas not in the books. Thanks in advance. Xerxes How can being unaging unbalance anything? You're just talking about being unaging. Just come up with a side quest for your character. At the end, he gains longevity/immortality. Dieties can grant that on a whim. Your character returns as a ghost (more powerful than you wanted, though...) A Bone undead could be amusing... (Look, it's skeletor!) If you're in FR, you could becoma a "Chosen of [insert diety here]" There's also psion uncarnate... |
| Alienfreak04-16-05, 10:49 AM | 1. Use Evil spells (one in BoVD and one in the Lost Empires of Fearun) 2. Change your type: You can become an Outsider due to a ritual (savage species) or by using a wish spell (savage species) 3. Taking an Prestige Class that lets you become an Outsider (for example Elemental Savant) or other thing (Green Star Adept) 4. Become an Undead (Lich, Bodak ... Cryptspawn [dont remember its exact source but +0 LA undead template]) 5. Become an Chosen of any Deity 6. Ascend to Godhood 7. Undeath after Death Spell Everything i can imagine at the moment. |
| ronyon04-16-05, 06:55 PM | I have been reexamining an old spell,Binding. Most versions restrain the character, and/or prevent the use of his powers. Some versions remove aging and the need for sustanance. Minimus Containment makes you small, sticks you in a jar, keeps you alive forever, and-it doesnt limit your powers in any way. Now, Im the necromancer type, so I was thinking of a skeleton PaO'ed into a powerful undead, with me in a jar in its head. Your character might want to use an item of unseen servant or something. I would make sure to give yourself a decent collection of books and a simulacrum sucubbi, but then I love my comforts... |
| EvilVegan04-16-05, 07:16 PM | Polymorph any object yourself into an elan. |
| Grayequus04-16-05, 11:50 PM | There's a spell for agelesness in there called, appropriately 'Immortality' There's also a pdf download with just the spells. Personally, I think ninth plus XP is too high for whats essentially a handwave and is admirably suited to the fantasy trope, but thats me. Here's a link to a 'free Sample' pdf that Atlas Games put out. While Wellspring of Youth is only cosmetic, IMO, you could use its stats and create a spell which extended your lifespan instead of making you look and feel young again. http://www.atlas-games.com/pdf_storage/pen_time_domain.pdf Hope some of this helps! |
| Xerxes04-17-05, 03:53 PM | The quest my character is worried about is a recollection of destinies. My character is a guardian of destiny. His whole life he guarded a temple that housed an access of power for shaping destiny. A dark lord appeared and consumed this power and destroyed the city around the temple. Banished by his dark power into the splintered destinies created by disrupting his final ritual before he was able to completely consume the power, we are now jumping from world to world (kind of like Sliders, where it's the same world, just different events have occurred). So our quest is to right certain wrongs in each world in order to realign each world back to a singular destiny. Which, logistically, could take centuries. My character, who understands the quest the most, would not be able to determine how many worlds were created, not without access to spells that he cannot cast yet (such as commune). And the reason I mentioned not being over balanced, is that certain options to become immortal (Lich, for one) will add an ECL that will keep me from gaining powers and spells. While it will be "balanced" in a game sense, I won't want be able to gain levels on a regular basis. |
| Sylvaroth04-18-05, 03:20 AM | Off of the top of my head: If you hop from one world to another, you could perchance arrive in a world that is ruled by a group of beings who are worshiped by the peoples because they are immortal. You then discover, that a certain item grants them like eternal youth, so you decide to take the item from them and to show the people who their deities really are (keeping the item for yourselfes of course). This item and the ex-gods could lead to some interesting plots e.g. Though you need the item to complete the quest you and your companions have seen the power it grants and the evil that was done with its help. Is it a wonder then that your fellows grows suspicious of you following the path of the ex-gods and manipulating events to create a world under your dominion? The ex-gods close in the party, conquering one adjusted destiny after another, building up a parralel-dimensional-empire, in the course sending their armies to find the PCs. The item could have an effect on your PC, similar to that of the one ring on Frodo. The ex-gods could team-up with the dark lord. The spirit of the item could, unnoticed by your fellows or yourself, possess you, to use your quest to further its own evil goals (you would then be the party's shining protagonist and dark antagonist in one person). |
| Ssussunriyh04-18-05, 03:36 AM | I read a book called "The Misenchanted Sword" that kinda made a quite clear difference in terms between "immortality" and "eternal youth". The first implies "impossible to kill, impossible to die". But the character still aged... becoming more and more elderly, crippled, alzheimered, sightless, etc... Sounds like the ancient Greek myth about Eos, goddess of the dawn, who fell in love with a mortal prince. She petitioned Zeus to grant him eternal life, and they spent many happy years together. But then she realized that she forgot to ask that he be granted eternal youth, as well... The prince aged and withered and wasted away, until he was nothing but a cricket, chirping for all eternity. Her sister Selune, goddess of the moon, fell in love with a mortal shepherd whom she observed sleeping in a meadow. Learning from her sister's mistake, she asked instead that he be granted eternal sleep. (I guess she loved him only for his body, and wasn't much for stimulating conversation...) |
| ninja104-19-05, 08:20 PM | I've read several references to "outsiders". What book describes an Outsider's lifespan? For the Half-Celestial suggestion, do Native Outsiders follow the same lifespan as Outsiders? Thanks all. |
| Realms of Chaos04-19-05, 08:45 PM | There are several means of accomplishing this feat. For instance, on the Astral Plane, aging does not occur. Also, There is a template from Necromantic lore called Eternal Confessor that was meant for clerics that wanted to continue the holy work it started while it is still alive. There are always spells like wish and miracle although they may be messed up. You can change your very type through classes, rituals, or spells. Try taking those into account. |
| bomaz04-20-05, 06:49 AM | miracle. let your god aid you with your life is a good idea |
| RASVIMofIO04-20-05, 10:56 AM | From the past and both bt TSR/ Wizards. Set 5: Immortal Rules and the Primal Order. Both deal with making a player into a god. Please feel free to contact me about either of these sources. write me here (necrosous2000@yahoo.com) |
| Necron9904-20-05, 03:18 PM | The description of the 'Worm that Walks" critter in the ELH alludes to the fact that you can choose to become one as a form of undeath, without being undead (IIRC, it's been a while). |
| Alienfreak04-20-05, 04:04 PM | But it has an freaking Level Adjustment ... |
| klode_me04-20-05, 04:10 PM | in races of the wild there is a fey race for players that are immortal to age. +1 level adjustment. yes there are, but they donīt have a LA. :D |
| Xerxes04-21-05, 03:43 PM | I'd like to thank you all for your help. After discussion with my DM about all of the ideas presented here, we've come to the conclusion that the one option that fits the best with the storyline is becoming a Chosen of my deity. While this includes a Level Adjustment I'd rather have avoided, I guess I'll just have to accept it for having the immortality I've wanted...and the other very cool abilities that come with being a Chosen. |
| Alienfreak04-21-05, 04:09 PM | Not being your own god (or wanna be god) suxx all the way ;) |
| ninja104-21-05, 04:45 PM | anybody know where outsider = immortal comes from? (native outsider too?) |
| Grayequus04-21-05, 05:45 PM | Its in the outsider qualities. You lose your maximum age and no longer 'die when your time is up' as I recall. I'm a little fuzzy on official rulings since I kept that part from 3.0, to maintain the 'Big Deal' factor of spells/class features that grant one Outsider status. I give the dragon, elemental and shapechanger types the same benifit as its basically flavor text anyway. |
| ninja104-22-05, 04:16 PM | I couldn't find that in the 3.0 or 3.5 description of Outsider. The reason I ask, is that I have an NPC that I made Half Celestial because of age concerns and my story line, but now I'm unsure of what the age max should be by the RAW. I know I can simply house rule it, but I'd prefer to stick to the rules whenever possible. Does anyone else know where I can find the age restrictions for ousiders and native outsiders? |
| -Defiler of Souls-04-22-05, 10:46 PM | i can think of two ways: 1). live in the astral plane, time doesn't pass there 2). have a wizard use an astral projection spell on you, you don't age which under its effect(and of course hide your real body in an obscure tomb somewhere) |