Blood Magus + Magic Missile? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Blood Magus + Magic Missile? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
green_yawgmoth
03-25-04, 09:36 PM Let's say I have a Sorcerer 9/Blood Magus 8, and I use his Gore ability to add 1d6 damage. I'm pretty sure if I target 5 different things, each missile deals 1d6+1d4+1 to each target. But if I target just one creature, would it do 5d4+1d6+5, or 5d4+5d6+5? My reasoning for the latter being that I'm targeting one thing 5 times, and thus each missile would be a separate entity of the spell.
Rhys23
03-25-04, 09:49 PM The description in Tome & Blood really doesn't mention anything about targets, just that the ability adds a 1d6 to the damage. IMO, if you target 5 different opponents with magic missile then only one of the targets receives the extra 1d6 damage.

You could house rule the ability. Let the Blood Magus deal 5 damage to himself to add the 1d6 to each missile. IMO, however, this is WAY to powerful.
green_yawgmoth
03-26-04, 10:02 AM Anyone else want to interpret this? Perhaps take the side of massive damage? ;)
kreynolds
03-26-04, 10:08 AM The gore ability says a spell would deal an extra 1d6 points of damage. If each missile dealt an extra 1d6 points of damage, then the spell wouldn't be dealing an extra 1d6 points of damage. It would be dealing an extra 5d6 points of damage, and the gore ability does not allow that.
Zherog
03-26-04, 10:20 AM I agree with Rhys23 and K.R. You get an extra 1d6. If you are going to fire your Magic Missle spell at multiple targets, you get to decide which of those targets receives the extra damage. But only one target gets to be so lucky. ;)
Lord Psynister
03-26-04, 10:24 AM I'm with Zherog here.
green_yawgmoth
03-26-04, 12:02 PM Okay, but what about an area of effect spell, like Fireball? Do you think that just one creature in the area gets that extra 1d6, or would it be all of them?
kreynolds
03-26-04, 12:09 PM All of them, and I think I see where you're headed with this...interesting. I'm going to revise my answer then. A magic missile spell would deal an extra 1d6 points of damage to each target.

This is different from each missile dealing an extra 1d6 points of damage. If that were the case, then you could target one creature with all five missiles and deal +5d6 points of damage, but Gore does not allow that.

What it does allow, however, is your spell to deal an extra 1d6 points of damage, and if your spell hits multiple people, they're all going to take an extra 1d6 points of damage.

Just remember that a magic missile spell affected by Gore isn't 1d4+1+1d6 per missile. It's a very important distinction.
Zherog
03-26-04, 12:19 PM green_yawgmoth - I don't have my books with me (I'm at work). Would you (or somebody else) mind quoting the ability so I can refresh myself with it?
Rhys23
03-26-04, 03:56 PM I don't think the splatbooks are part of the OGL, so I don't feel comfortable quoting it here.

Comparing magic missile to fireball is a lot like comparing apples and oranges, IMO. One is an auto-target/auto-hit/1st level spell. The other is an area effect/reflex save/3rd level spell.

Adding a 1d6 to each missile effectively breaks magic missile. I'm sure most will agree that it is a high powered spell for 1st level. This DOUBLES the effectiveness (damage) of the spell.

Now look at fireball. An additional 1d6 is EXACTLY the same as casting the spell as a mage one level higher. YES, the damage can affect multiple targets, but its a higher level spell, with the addition of a Reflex save for half damage. Also, the fireball effectively becomes 11d6 damage instead of 10d6. Thats like a 9% increase in damage.
CrimsonRyoko
03-26-04, 04:00 PM I think i agree with the +1d6 to each creature affected by any spell. It is limited thou to only 1d6 per creature.

Magic missile to one creature would deal all of its missiles damaga and then 1d6, MM to 5 creatures would deal 5 missiles damage and then 1d6 to each of those creatures in turn.
It isnt exactly "reasonable" in the sense that its easily explanable mechanic wise in game, but it is mechanically sound none the less.

just my .02
green_yawgmoth
03-26-04, 10:24 PM Originally posted by Rhys23
Adding a 1d6 to each missile effectively breaks magic missile. Which is why I'm asking. Derf derf. But really, even maximized, that's 11 damage to five targets. Is it really that broken at level 17? I'm going to go ahead and say that when I asked the question, I was already thinking 1 target = 5d4+1d6+5, and 5 targets = 5(1d4+1d6+1). I just wanted to see if there was justification for the latter, because I am a massive powergamer. :cool:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
green_yawgmoth 03-25-04, 09:36 PM	Let's say I have a Sorcerer 9/Blood Magus 8, and I use his Gore ability to add 1d6 damage. I'm pretty sure if I target 5 different things, each missile deals 1d6+1d4+1 to each target. But if I target just one creature, would it do 5d4+1d6+5, or 5d4+5d6+5? My reasoning for the latter being that I'm targeting one thing 5 times, and thus each missile would be a separate entity of the spell.
Rhys23 03-25-04, 09:49 PM	The description in Tome & Blood really doesn't mention anything about targets, just that the ability adds a 1d6 to the damage. IMO, if you target 5 different opponents with magic missile then only one of the targets receives the extra 1d6 damage. You could house rule the ability. Let the Blood Magus deal 5 damage to himself to add the 1d6 to each missile. IMO, however, this is WAY to powerful.
green_yawgmoth 03-26-04, 10:02 AM	Anyone else want to interpret this? Perhaps take the side of massive damage? ;)
kreynolds 03-26-04, 10:08 AM	The gore ability says a spell would deal an extra 1d6 points of damage. If each missile dealt an extra 1d6 points of damage, then the spell wouldn't be dealing an extra 1d6 points of damage. It would be dealing an extra 5d6 points of damage, and the gore ability does not allow that.
Zherog 03-26-04, 10:20 AM	I agree with Rhys23 and K.R. You get an extra 1d6. If you are going to fire your Magic Missle spell at multiple targets, you get to decide which of those targets receives the extra damage. But only one target gets to be so lucky. ;)
Lord Psynister 03-26-04, 10:24 AM	I'm with Zherog here.
green_yawgmoth 03-26-04, 12:02 PM	Okay, but what about an area of effect spell, like Fireball? Do you think that just one creature in the area gets that extra 1d6, or would it be all of them?
kreynolds 03-26-04, 12:09 PM	All of them, and I think I see where you're headed with this...interesting. I'm going to revise my answer then. A magic missile spell would deal an extra 1d6 points of damage to each target. This is different from each missile dealing an extra 1d6 points of damage. If that were the case, then you could target one creature with all five missiles and deal +5d6 points of damage, but Gore does not allow that. What it does allow, however, is your spell to deal an extra 1d6 points of damage, and if your spell hits multiple people, they're all going to take an extra 1d6 points of damage. Just remember that a magic missile spell affected by Gore isn't 1d4+1+1d6 per missile. It's a very important distinction.
Zherog 03-26-04, 12:19 PM	green_yawgmoth - I don't have my books with me (I'm at work). Would you (or somebody else) mind quoting the ability so I can refresh myself with it?
Rhys23 03-26-04, 03:56 PM	I don't think the splatbooks are part of the OGL, so I don't feel comfortable quoting it here. Comparing magic missile to fireball is a lot like comparing apples and oranges, IMO. One is an auto-target/auto-hit/1st level spell. The other is an area effect/reflex save/3rd level spell. Adding a 1d6 to each missile effectively breaks magic missile. I'm sure most will agree that it is a high powered spell for 1st level. This DOUBLES the effectiveness (damage) of the spell. Now look at fireball. An additional 1d6 is EXACTLY the same as casting the spell as a mage one level higher. YES, the damage can affect multiple targets, but its a higher level spell, with the addition of a Reflex save for half damage. Also, the fireball effectively becomes 11d6 damage instead of 10d6. Thats like a 9% increase in damage.
CrimsonRyoko 03-26-04, 04:00 PM	I think i agree with the +1d6 to each creature affected by any spell. It is limited thou to only 1d6 per creature. Magic missile to one creature would deal all of its missiles damaga and then 1d6, MM to 5 creatures would deal 5 missiles damage and then 1d6 to each of those creatures in turn. It isnt exactly "reasonable" in the sense that its easily explanable mechanic wise in game, but it is mechanically sound none the less. just my .02
green_yawgmoth 03-26-04, 10:24 PM	Originally posted by Rhys23 Adding a 1d6 to each missile effectively breaks magic missile. Which is why I'm asking. Derf derf. But really, even maximized, that's 11 damage to five targets. Is it really that broken at level 17? I'm going to go ahead and say that when I asked the question, I was already thinking 1 target = 5d4+1d6+5, and 5 targets = 5(1d4+1d6+1). I just wanted to see if there was justification for the latter, because I am a massive powergamer. :cool: