Post/Author/DateTime	Post
lanilifar 01-15-04, 01:11 AM	Boing, Boing, Ahh, Ahh, Ahhhh Conjuration (Healing) Level: Sor/Wiz 4 Components: V, S, M Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Medium Target: One living creature Duration: 5 rounds Saving Throw: Will partial, see text Spell Resistance: Yes This spell overwhelms the subject's aura and spirit. It channels positive energy over the creature to disrupt it's ability act. During the first 2 rounds of the spell, the target takes 20 points of non-lethal damage each round, successful will saves halve this damage. On rounds 2 and 3 the target glows so brightly, he recieves concealment providing a 30% miss chance. On rounds 3 and 4 the taget heals 10 points of damage (lethal and nonl-lethal). On round 5 any non-lethal damage remaing from this spell is healed. Arcane Material Component: 50 gp of diamond dust tossed into the air
FireSpark 01-15-04, 02:53 AM	What...in...the hell?:uh-huh:
Seeker95 01-15-04, 09:12 AM	Basically, it demonstrates the wizards inability to effectively control positive energy. Round 1 - 20 points nonlethal damage Round 2 - 20 points nonlethal damage; 30% concealment Round 3 - heal 10 points nonlethal damage; 30% concealment Round 4 - heal 10 points non-lethal damage Round 5 - heal 20 points nonlethal damage Net effect: 2 rounds of 30% concealment. Net conclusion: Wizards can't heal.
dantedarkstar 01-15-04, 09:35 AM	:rofl:
kreynolds 01-15-04, 09:42 AM	Originally posted by lanilifar Level: Sor/Wiz 4 This should probably be available to bards as well. Originally posted by lanilifar Range: Medium You're missing the rest of the range. Originally posted by lanilifar Saving Throw: Will Half The "h" in "Half" should be lowercase (i.e. "half"). Originally posted by lanilifar Arcane Material Component: 50 gp of diamond dust tossed into the air I think the costly material component is too costly. Probably shouldn't require a costly material component at all. ;) :D
kreynolds 01-15-04, 09:45 AM	Originally posted by Seeker95 Net conclusion: Wizards can't heal. Shroud of Undeath + (any spell that deals negative energy damage) = Wizards can heal. :D
Seeker95 01-15-04, 09:55 AM	Originally posted by kreynolds Shroud of Undeath + (any spell that deals negative energy damage) = Wizards can heal. :D They are not healing. They are making effective use of the qualities of undeath and negative energy. Although the smile at the end of your post also indicates that this was bait that I took. Reel me in! :P
Sproik 01-15-04, 10:20 AM	Originally posted by Seeker95 Net conclusion: Wizards can't heal. *ahem* Polymorph *ahem* Sorry, something caught in my throat... :D
Seeker95 01-15-04, 11:04 AM	Originally posted by Sproik *ahem* Polymorph *ahem* Sorry, something caught in my throat... :D It must be some of the paper shreds from the folks tearing apart the core rules trying to find a justification for a wizard casting heal spells! :P Polymorph restrores hit points as if the polymorphing character had rested for a day. It is a residual effect of becoming a normal specimen of the type of creature being changed into. If you took no damage before changing, you don't get those rested points. But if your Con changes, your hit points will change! :D
spasheridan 01-15-04, 12:52 PM	wizards can't have healing!
kreynolds 01-15-04, 01:29 PM	yes they can! *sorry, had to stoop*
Frank the Vandal 01-15-04, 01:42 PM	Originally posted by Seeker95 Basically, it demonstrates the wizards inability to effectively control positive energy. Round 1 - 20 points nonlethal damage Round 2 - 20 points nonlethal damage; 30% concealment Round 3 - heal 10 points nonlethal damage; 30% concealment Round 4 - heal 10 points non-lethal damage Round 5 - heal 20 points nonlethal damage Net effect: 2 rounds of 30% concealment. Net conclusion: Wizards can't heal. In my reading, it's: Round 1 - 20 points nonlethal damage Round 2 - 20 points nonlethal damage; 30% concealment Round 3 - heal 10 points nonlethal and 10 points of lethal damage; 30% concealment Round 4 - heal 10 points non-lethal and 10 points of lethal damage Round 5 - heal 20 points nonlethal damage Total gain: 20 hitpoints. So if they had this spell, Wizards could heal, but since they can't, they won't get the spell (according to the majority on these boards, including me, I think). ;)
Seeker95 01-15-04, 02:53 PM	Originally posted by Frank the Vandal In my reading, it's: Round 3 - heal 10 points nonlethal and 10 points of lethal damage; 30% concealment Round 4 - heal 10 points non-lethal and 10 points of lethal damage Total gain: 20 hitpoints. Not disagreeing with your final conclusion (that they couldn't heal), but the "lethal and non-lethal" is in parentheses, following the claim of healing 10 points. The total is 10 points in each round. The "lethal and non-lethal" is an unnecessary clause, since the non-lethal damage already exceeds the amount healed in a round. original text: On rounds 3 and 4 the taget heals 10 points of damage (lethal and non-lethal).
Prgrmr@wrk 01-15-04, 06:43 PM	This might be a bit off topic (since everyone's 'arguing' about arcane healing), but I think this spell is too powerful for 2nd level. Used offensively, this becomes a save or die for any low level character. Even if they save, they could still be screwed. How so, you ask? That 40pts of subdual damage is a big problem. Very few 3rd level characters would have enough HP even at max to keep from falling unconcious<sp> due to subdual damage. A 3rd level barbarian, who rolled max, and had a 18 con would only have 48 HP. The average 3rd level fighter type character is more likely to have around 20-30 HP. So what if they heal it back quickly, by then, they've already been coup-de-graced by a the wizard or his companions. Against another wizard, this is just a low level Power Word Kill, since even if the wizard makes his save, virtually no 3rd level d4 class will have enough HP to stay in fighting form after takein 20pts of subdual (or non lethal as you newfangled kids call it). Used to heal, it heals more damage (outside of battle) than a 2nd level cure moderate wounds (2d8+3 at 3rd level, which is a max of 19pts). And this spell always heals 20pts overall, without a chance for rolling low. Raise it to 4th level or so, maybe higher. And that's just to make it balanced, since wizards still sholdn't be able to heal directly. (Since all the 'downsides' of the spell go away by the end of it, they don't really count as much. Might as well just say it can't be cast in combat).
lanilifar 01-15-04, 07:35 PM	but I think this spell is too powerful for 2nd level. I do too. That is why I made it 4th. My target was 3rd level, but I couldn't make a version that made me happy at 3rd. Used to heal, it heals more damage (outside of battle) than a 2nd level cure moderate wounds (2d8+3 at 3rd level, which is a max of 19pts). And this spell always heals 20pts overall, without a chance for rolling low. I put it up against the 4th level, Cure Critical, which does a min of 4d8+7 for an average of 25 pts. That is why I made this spell heal 20 pts. At 20th level this spell will heal 20 pts, Cure Critical will heal a minimum of 24, and an average of 38. It is less effective at healing than a cleric spell of the same level. The "lethal and non-lethal" is an unnecessary clause I agree it is unneccesary, as the default rule is that any spell which heals hit point damage, also heals a like amount of non-lethal damage. I included to avoid confusion. Net conclusion: Wizards can't heal. I know many feel that way. I do not have a problem with those who want wizards to heal, personally. I do however play that they generally can't, as I prefer the flavor of healing being divine. This spell, to me, has an arcane flavor. I felt it needed "real" healing at the end to balance out the big wollop in the beginning. Try to seperate the whole arcane healing issue, either pretend it doesn't bother you, or pretend this is a cleric spell. I would like comments on the spell itself, not those issues. My big issue is it is more complicated than I generally like to make a spell. However, it doesn't seem to me any worse than Conufsion. I feel I could play with this spell and not be overburdened by its effects (as far as remembering all the spell does over its five rounds of existence).
Prgrmr@wrk 01-16-04, 02:21 PM	Originally posted by lanilifar I do too. That is why I made it 4th. My target was 3rd level, but I couldn't make a version that made me happy at 3rd. Why did I read it as 2nd level? Sorry about that, my wis score seems to be very low lately. Oh well, at least that means you have unbiased agreement that 4th level is good for this spell.
Vanigo 01-16-04, 11:56 PM	The save line shouldn't be Will half. [Save type] half is exclusively reserved for spells that only deal damage, and deal half normal damage on a succesful save. If a spell deals damage and has a secondary effect, and deals half damage on a succesful save, you use [Save type] partial. What you've got here has several effects, only one of which is affected by a save. You need to have the save type be Will partial.
chemadam2 01-17-04, 12:09 AM	I suggest we all get together at the local fast-food outlet and discuss it for hours on end over a bucket of McNuggets. Or maybe I can have the McNuggets, and you can discuss this for hours on end. Either way, I get my McNuggets, and no one gets hurt. Oh, for the sake of relevancy, you do have a cleric in the party, right? Wouldn't he or she get offended if you start doing his job with a worse spell?