Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Mango_stuff 06-09-04, 05:35 AM	Im rather horrible at graphic arts, plus my scanner is broken. But I was wondering if anyone could possibly make me a character sheet with specific changes. I need it for a 10th lvl druid, 10th lvl Sentienl of Bharrai (Exalted Deed) and My race is a Half Celestial, Elf, Natural WereBear. The changes are as follows: I would suggest to use a Druid sheet for your basis... Version 3.0 plz - look on the back and get rid of the spell list. - Extend the list for special abilities and feats. make it fit the rest of the space from the removed spell list. - around the end of the extended list leave some space so I can write some Immunities. - leave every skill box blank Thats it, If you can I will be much abligged, and the only must have on the sheet is that it is 3.0 compadible. Thanks, MANGO
Seeker95 06-09-04, 07:59 AM	There are many 3.0 character sheets available online. www.mad-irishman.com is one great resource for character sheets.
smrtgmp 06-09-04, 09:35 AM	Originally posted by Mango_stuff ...My race is a Half Celestial, Elf, Natural WereBear. Thats going to be a huge level adjustment. Given a druids shapechanging ability, you may want to concider dropping the werebear.
Seeker95 06-09-04, 10:21 AM	Can an elf be a natural werebear? I thought the natural versions of the lycanthropes simply WERE the lycanthrope. Then again, maybe there are different humanoid forms the various natural lycanthropes. Sub-races of lycanthropes?
smrtgmp 06-09-04, 10:37 AM	Good point. Maybe his parents were both elves that became afflicted werebears prior to his conception?
Mango_stuff 06-09-04, 01:11 PM	Originally posted by smrtgmp Thats going to be a huge level adjustment. All the natural werebear template adds is a +2 lvl adjustment, and the half celestial adds +1, The Natural part of it means I can just morph into the thing whenever I choose, and am not subject to involuntary change. Its not really insane, It is just and ECL of +3, and the fact that I worship a bear God (bharrai) lets the race make a bit more sense. Besides, In the new camp I'm joining, on of the PC's gets to be a half Demon, Half Celestial, not that I'm complaining about it, but who else hear thinks that is just flat out rediculous. Not to mention IMPOSSIBLE.
smrtgmp 06-09-04, 01:30 PM	Actually a natural lyncanthrope adds a +3 LA, afflicted lyncanthropes adds a +2. Also, you have to add the hit dice you get from the bear, which gives a natural werebear an ECL of 9 before you start adding class levels. Furthermore, the half-celestial template has a level adjustment of +4, not +1. That means your looking at an ECL of 13 before you even get started with class levels. I'm not quite sure where you got the +1. Maybe you're thinking of an assimar? Large level adjustments dont mesh well with spell casting classes. Not only will you have delayed access to higher level spells, but your caster level will be signifigantly lower. That can really hurt when trying to overcome SR or dispell an enemies spell. Besides, In the new camp I'm joining, on of the PC's gets to be a half Demon, Half Celestial, not that I'm complaining about it, but who else hear thinks that is just flat out rediculous. Not to mention IMPOSSIBLE. I'm not sure about impossibe, but it certainly is improbable (and yes, ridiculous as well). I guess an angel and a devil could sire an offspring, but still...
Mango_stuff 06-09-04, 03:47 PM	Ya, im using the version 3.0 MM, The half celestial template is +1, and the wearbear just says +2, It mentions nothing of the added on bear HD.... God, if only i could trade in my 3.0 for 3.5... WoTC needs to get there act together via the book remaking... Esspecialy the new Psi-handbook... wtf
smrtgmp 06-09-04, 05:20 PM	Sorry, I missed the 3.0. Even so, those bonuses are to challenge rating, not level adjustment. The two arent a 1:1 ratio. Even if your DM uses them as such, a werebear still has 6 HD. I just checked my 3.0 MM. Soooo, asumimg he lets you use a +3 total LA, you still have to deal with the 6 racial HD, which would put you at an ECL of 9.
Mango_stuff 06-09-04, 05:53 PM	Why would you add the 6 HD of the bear to your total, wouldn't you get the bear HD added on to yours when in bear form?
smrtgmp 06-09-04, 06:00 PM	No, check you MM again. Werebears have 6 HD. Wich, if you think about it, makes sense. Otherwise there would be the same level adjustment for a wererat as there is a werebear, and a werebear is clearly more powerful. They have a +16 to str, +2 to Des, and +8 to con, not to mention the DR. If your DM will give you all that for a +2 LA, then go for it. Its not how the designers intended it, however.
Mango_stuff 06-09-04, 10:26 PM	Thats only when in hybrid form though, Im pretty sure. I dont have the MM with me but I remeber there was somthing about 3 different types of things I could transform into, my normal form, my hybrid form, which gives all the stat bonus, and the actual animal bear form. I don't know how my dm will run it, but i think he will treat them as 3 seperate creatures, different hp, stats, saves, skill checks... not ranks, and of course spells, for each different form of me.
smrtgmp 06-09-04, 11:50 PM	You still get 6 extra hitdice any way you look at it. Why would a werebear and a wererat have the same ECL? They wouldnt. If thats the way your DM is playing it, than thats the way it works in his campaign. However, you are confusing the challenge rating adjustment (which is "same as the animal +2") for a level adjustment. Thats one reason I like the 3.5 MM better. It provides level adjustments for lots of different monsters, so its easier to add class levels to them. Also, the 3.0 werebear doesnt have a hybrid form. It only has a human (or in your case elf) form and a bear form. The 3.5 werebear has a hybrid form, however. It seems that you are right regarding Hit Dice, at least in a way. For 3.0 lyncanthropes it says to use the HD of the character or the animal, which ever is higher. I suppose that means that at low levels you would start off with 6 HD, and would remain there until that total was surpassed due to class levels. At least, that is my interpretation fo the text on pg 217 of the 3.0 MM. Even if this is the case, it still means that a character with only one class level will have 6 racial hitdice from being a werebear. I realize I was a bit of an ass to you on the cometfall thread (what can I say, I was raised a sarcastic SOB), but I'm only trying to help you here. Here, lets compile a list of all the stuff you get(not counting elven traits) from combining the werebear with the half-celestial template. Werebear: 6 hitdice to start the game +2 natural armor bonus to AC +16 to str, +2 to dex, +8 to con while in bear form the feats blind-fight, multiattack, and power attack while in bear form lycanthropic empathy curse of lycanthropy (although this isnt of much use to players, who have a tendency to kill their enemies) DR 15/silver while in bear form (although this isnt very useful in 3.0 since magic weapons will over ride this) +2 bonus on fort and will saves +4 bonus to search, spot, and listen in elf form (not counting elf bonuses), +8 in bear Half-celestial: 75% chance of having wings. Gives you a fly speed of 2x base speed, good maneuverability another +1 natural armor bonus to AC ability to use light at will as a supernatural ability the following spells at the following levels (usable 1/day unless otherwise noted): level 1-2: protection from evil 3/day, bless 3-4: Aid, detect evil 5-6: cure serious wounds, neutralize poison 7-8: holy smite, remove disease 9-10: dispel evil 11-12: holy word 13-14: holy aura 3/day, hallow 15-16: Symbol 17-18: Summon monster IX (celestials only) 19+ :Ressurection Immunity to acid, cold, disease, and electricity +4 to Str, +2 to Dex, +4 to Con, +2 to Int, +4 to Wis, +4 to Cha I think we can both agree that this is way to much stuff to be getting for a simple +3 level adjustment. If you're not sure you believe me, do the following. Make a character with 1 class level with the above bonuses, and give him a +3 LA for an ECL of 4. Then, make yourself a 4th level character and compare the two. Is there any way you would choose the character with four class levels over the one with the above abilities? If your answer is no, than it's clear that the above is worth more than a +3 LA.
Seeker95 06-10-04, 02:55 PM	Any concept that takes this much time to clear of confusion and misunderstanding should probably be scrapped for a new idea.
smrtgmp 06-10-04, 06:32 PM	I agree.