Post/Author/DateTime	Post
d4rkarch0n 11-09-04, 07:35 AM	Hi all :D Well, I've got a situation that I found hard to deal with, and I came to ask some guidance. In my campaign, we have the following scene (where we stopped last session, just in time!): I'm a Wizard almost out of spells, flying 50ft away from one box. Inside the box (that is already opened, and it opens like a closet) there is a scepter. I want to get this scepter. The problem is that the one who opened the box is a huge giant - that is touching the box already. He cannot get the scepter before me. The only spell I have left is - guess what - Limited Wish. I also have some itens, but the most usefull one I think is my Dimensional Travel Staff (Teleport, Dimensional Door and Blink). But as I ain't hasted, I can't just get inside the giant's area and get the AoO (I got 50hp left), otherwise I could just travel in and travel out (oh, yeah, it's 3.0 =D). I placed this post here for I'm almost sure my salvation lies on my Limited Wish. The main question is: how can I avoid death and have the scepter with one round? I thought of many things, like Wall of Force, but he is touching the box, can't separate them. Place a Wall of Force replace the now-opened doors of the box - but as WoF is imovable, he could just move the box. I'm goin crazy! Thanx for any help :D P.S.: right now I'm thinking about Tasha's Hideous Laughter. Simple but... who knows? I'm 17th (and Archmage 4, got spell power +6, might work huh).
hovnarr 11-09-04, 07:59 AM	If you're playing 3.0 you will notice that Geas/Quest (lvl 6, can be cast as Lim Wish) does not have a saving throw, a casting time of but 1 action and enables you to tell a creature to do pretty much what you feel like. It's really broken in 3.0. So just tell the giant to bring you the scepter, like a good little giant. :) If you don't like that you have a number of save or die spells at your disposal. Polymorph him to a shrubbery or magic jar him if you want to avoid a fort save. You might also use telekinesis as a violent burst to send the scepter flying straight to you, but this requires a range touch attack. If the scepter weighs less than 5 pounds you might even be able to move it up into the air where the giant can't reach it with a simple Mage Hand spell. Then you can grab it at your leisure (you may still move while maintaining the concentration) and Dim Door out of there when you have it in your grasp. Hope this gave you some inspiration :)
d4rkarch0n 11-09-04, 08:20 AM	I will read this Geas/Quest. Last time I read it i thought that if the victim refused to do what u demanded, she'd only take 3d6 damage/day and that's it. But I'll read again. For the Telekinesis/Mage Hand, I didnt use it back then cuz it moved only 20ft/round, but i just realized that 20ft closer to me will put the scepter out of the giant's 15ft reach, then i can catch it on the fly and move away. Thanx!
[GSV] Kirstar 11-09-04, 08:33 AM	isnt there a spell called mislead. it creates an illusion of you and makes you invisible. ?
carnivore 11-09-04, 09:03 AM	wish that the giant was etherial that way he couldnt touch you or the box or wand. he wouldnt understand why he couldnt touch the box or you. but you should cast invisibliity on yourself ,then ghost sound to disract him, grab the wand and run. or just teleport the object(wand) to you, leaving him holding the box :D
Cardinal Teplin 11-09-04, 09:20 AM	Illusion? Of the wand soaring away into your hands? The giant will probably go after you rather than double check the box... Or acid fog. Stops the giant being able to see, and should destroy the box. The giant might be able to catch the faling staff he can't see, but I wouldn't think so. Save or die spell on the giant. Polymorph the box into a gelatenous cube? Giant would have to kill the cube to get at the staff, which buys you time. But yes, just teleport the staff to your hand. seems reasonable for a limited wish effect.
RaspK FOG 11-09-04, 09:32 AM	or just teleport the object(wand) to you, leaving him holding the box :D Drawmij's Instant Summons is a 7th-level spell, and can bring something specially prepared for the occasion to you from just about anywhere on the same plane as you. Now, I think that bringing target object within close range to your hand is not such a hastle; maybe allow a Reflex save (in this case with a DC for a 7th-level spell for casting it with Limited Wish) to negate the effect altogether. ;)
Huan 11-09-04, 09:41 AM	Move a little closer in range, then Wish for a 5th lvl Fleshshiver spell, the Giant will be stunned for the next round (hopefully buying you time to get in and out with the scepter), then the next round, maybe the Giant will die of the damage while you high-tail it out. Or maybe a Hold Monster if you think it can't Will save out of your DC. Yeah, Mislead makes you improved invisible and creates a fake double. The problem with Instant Summons is that you have to have you Arcane Mark on whatever it is you are summoning. But wow, a lot of good ideas here. I think simple teleportation is the best answer though.
RaspK FOG 11-09-04, 09:49 AM	The problem with Instant Summons is that you have to have you Arcane Mark on whatever it is you are summoning. My idea is based on the fact it can replicate other effects, most typically other spells; now, consider a variation on Instant Summons that works only within Close range (25ft. + 5ft./2 levels; a 14th-level caster has a maximum reach of 60ft. at Close range), does not need the object have your Arcane Mark on it, allows a Reflex save to negate the effect for magical or attented items, and is lower than 7th-level. :D
carnivore 11-09-04, 09:54 AM	or emulate Telekinesis :D and snatch that scepter
Purkake 11-09-04, 10:14 AM	Just wish for telekinesis and get it out without endangering yourself.
carnivore 11-09-04, 10:18 AM	hmmm yeah i like Purkakes idea better ;)
Father Dale 11-09-04, 10:43 AM	Just "wish" the sceptre into your hands. That seems like a perfectly reasonable use of the limited wish spell and 300 exp.
GRAOUH !!! 11-09-04, 10:51 AM	I'm a Wizard almost out of spells, flying 50ft away from one box. Inside the box (that is already opened, and it opens like a closet) there is a scepter. I want to get this scepter. The problem is that the one who opened the box is a huge giant - that is touching the box already. He cannot get the scepter before me. The only spell I have left is - guess what - Limited Wish. I also have some itens, but the most usefull one I think is my Dimensional Travel Staff (Teleport, Dimensional Door and Blink). But as I ain't hasted, I can't just get inside the giant's area and get the AoO (I got 50hp left), otherwise I could just travel in and travel out (oh, yeah, it's 3.0 =D). I placed this post here for I'm almost sure my salvation lies on my Limited Wish. You don't provoke AoO by entering in a threatened area in 3.5, it's not the same in 3.0 ?
d4rkarch0n 11-09-04, 10:52 AM	Yeah, lots of good ideas, but I'd like to remind everyone I only have one action. If I can use something in one action to gain time, this is cool. But, since you guys understood well, I'll introduce the second problem into this problem. Like 100ft away from the box, is another wizard. My action is after his, so he moved closer to a crystal that controls the room - which I dont know how to use yet, so forget the crystal. He wants the scepter as well. If I buy some time, he'd probably get it in the next round (he is a sorcerer giant with fly active). What I consider possible so far is: 1. Emulate Telekineses to bring it 20ft closer (Telekinesis moves objects 20ft/round) and with my move action, grab the scepeter in the air and fly; 2. Emulate Tasha's Hideous Laughter, or Geas/Quest as suggested by hovnarr; 3. Ask my DM for a effect of teleportation, as suggested by Father Dale. It's though, really. And I wonder if when I touch the "Giant's Scepter" I'll lose levels, for the giants are evil, and so is my DM, lol :D
d4rkarch0n 11-09-04, 10:55 AM	You don't provoke AoO by entering in a threatened area in 3.5, it's not the same in 3.0 ? See, I play since the 1st level this DnD3 campaing, but so far, I don't know much about these bararians' things. The only AoO things I'm sure is about drinkin' potions and castin' spells in front of the enemy - and, for the last one, grappled or something alike. Not sure about the going in/out the reach of foes. At first I thought "no", but my DM said "yes". I hope he is just mistaken :D
Saiph 11-09-04, 12:20 PM	actually, I don't think you provoke an AoO when you teleport into a square. AoO by movement is caused by leaving a threatened square, not entering. Teleport has you enter the square, without leaving any of the other squares threatened by a giant. Its about the only way to end up next to him without provoking an AoO by moving. Grabbing the item though, might do it. I can't remember if picking up an item from the ground provokes an AoO. It might, it would make sense, but not everything makes sense when it comes to AoO's. As a DM, I'd just allow you to limited wish it into your hands. For the level and XP cost, that's perfectly acceptable and very similar to other spells that can be mimiced.
GRAOUH !!! 11-09-04, 12:27 PM	Pick up the item between your feet and then teleport back ;)
tarkin 11-09-04, 01:42 PM	Here is something you might consider. Use Limited Wish to fill the area with 10,000 valueless but otherwise exact duplicate copies of teh Scepter. You don't get the scepter yet, but it buys you a ton of time
RaspK FOG 11-09-04, 01:51 PM	:doh: I was confused about the level of Telekinesis; otherwise that's what I had in mind (so I used it in another way). Very good form, indeed! :clap:
RaistlinBN 11-09-04, 02:48 PM	The only reason the Instant Summons spell is balanced is due to the fact that your arcane mark must be present on the object before teleportation. Otherwise, you could teleport objects from anywhere out of any situation (much like this one). That sounds very broken. I think your best bet is to limited wish a 3.0 haste effect. This way, you'd have your move action to move into the threatened area (no AoO) and touch the sceptre PLUS an extra partial action to activate your staff to teleport/dimension door out of harm's way. I don't have any books in front of me at this moment...but I believe activating a staff is the equivalent of a "spell trigger, command word, use activated" effect meaning that it does not require concentration and does not provoke attacks of opportunity. Raist
smrtgmp 11-09-04, 06:49 PM	I've seen a spell somewhere that teleports an unatended object into your hands, and I believe its 6th level or lower. That being the case, I would think Limited Wish could accomplish such a task.
[GSV] Kirstar 11-10-04, 03:24 AM	smrtgmp, it was on the boards. and it was a will save for attended objects as well i think anyway, i still think mislead or what ever it is called is the thing to go for. you go invisible, an illusion of yourself appears thats under your control. or you could dominate the other wizard ?
RaspK FOG 11-10-04, 04:38 AM	I worked on a similar basis: Close range, no arcane mark, Reflex save (I suppose Will fits in better), no arcane mark... What level should this be, 4th maybe?
GRAOUH !!! 11-10-04, 06:24 AM	Here is a psionic power Retrieve Psychoportation (Teleportation) Level: Psion/wilder 6 Display: Visual Manifesting Time: 1 standard action Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./ level) Target: One object you can hold or carry in one hand, weighing up to 10 lb./level Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: Will negates; see text Power Resistance: No Power Points: 11 You automatically teleport an item you can see within range directly to your hand. If the object is in the possession of an opponent, it comes to your hand if your opponent fails a Will save. Augment: For every additional power point you spend, the weight limit of the target increases by 10 pounds. Schism
d4rkarch0n 11-10-04, 10:15 AM	It is nice, and seems to fit well to Limited Wish. Thanks all for the help! ;)