Caster Level 17? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Caster Level 17? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
smileybob1
10-22-04, 05:46 PM does anyone think that it is reasonable that you must be of caster level 17 to make a pearl of power (1st). not to mention every other spell level. this seems a little over the top
Doomhawk
10-22-04, 05:57 PM No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it.
Egres
10-22-04, 06:14 PM No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it.
From the SRD:

For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell and not higher than her own caster level. For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a higher minimum on the creator’s level).
MythDragon
10-22-04, 06:14 PM No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it.

I think the minimum would be as low as 1st level (for the first pearl, that recalls 1 first level spell)

From SRDNote that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item’s creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed).

While item creation costs are handled in detail below, note that normally the two primary factors are the caster level of the creator and the level of the spell or spells put into the item. A creator can create an item at a lower caster level than her own, but never lower than the minimum level needed to cast the needed spell. Using metamagic feats, a caster can place spells in items at a higher level than normal.

so i think the minimum would be the spell need to make teh item in the pearl of powers case... Strong transmutation; CL 17th; Craft Wondrous Item, creator must be able to cast spells of the spell level to be recalled; Price 1,000 gp (1st), 4,000 gp (2nd), 9,000 gp (3rd), 16,000 gp (4th), 25,000 gp (5th), 36,000 gp (6th), 49,000 gp (7th), 64,000 gp (8th), 81,000 gp (9th), or 70,000 gp (two spells).

good question though. I think I am reading it right :)
smileybob1
10-22-04, 06:14 PM No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it.

um not so sure about that

from the SRD:

• Caster Level: The next item in a notational entry gives the caster level of the item, indicating its relative power. The caster level determines the item’s saving throw bonus, as well as range or other level-dependent aspects of the powers of the item (if variable). It also determines the level that must be contended with should the item come under the effect of a dispel magic spell or similar situation. This information is given in the form “CL x,” where “CL” is an abbreviation for caster level and “x” is an ordinal number representing the caster level itself.
For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell and not higher than her own caster level. For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a higher minimum on the creator’s level).
Egres
10-22-04, 06:16 PM um not so sure about that

from the SRD:
Ehmmm...

Didn't you read my post?
smileybob1
10-22-04, 06:18 PM ehmmm...

if you check our post times i think you will realize that it is not my fault, thank you very much
MythDragon
10-22-04, 06:20 PM lol yeah realy three post at the same time :)

but where in the srd is that part you guys posted? I am looking in the "Create magic items" part....and i dont see that little tid bit you posted....probably just over looked it.
cwslyclgh
10-22-04, 06:47 PM from the errata to the DMG

Caster Level
Dungeon Master’s Guide, page 215
Problem: The last two sentences in the section on Caster
Level are ambiguous and potentially misleading.
Solution: Replace with this text: For other magic items, the
caster level is determined by the creator. The minimum caster
level is that which is needed to meet the prerequisites given.

so NO it is not a requirement.
Egres
10-22-04, 09:58 PM ehmmm...

if you check our post times i think you will realize that it is not my fault, thank you very much
Sorry.

:)
smrtgmp
10-22-04, 10:19 PM I was going to quote the errata, but cwslyclgh beat me to it. :tiphat:
That being the case, I'll just agree with him. :)
Doomhawk
10-23-04, 12:34 AM So... wait... is it a requirement, or isn't it? And do I have to apologize for misleading people? [Not that I'm trying to protect my ego or anything, no sir...]
smrtgmp
10-23-04, 12:37 AM No, its not a requirement
smileybob1
10-23-04, 03:52 AM from the errata to the DMG

so NO it is not a requirement.

well i dont mean to be a pain but it would appear to me that the errata is ruling in favor of my arguement. all it says is that if the creator's caster level is greater than the minimum then the caster level is equal to the creators caster level. for example a 14th level wizard crafts a head band of intellect, his head band of intellect will be much more resiliant and more difficult to dispel than the 7th level wizard who made the same item.

is says

The minimum caster level is that which is needed to meet the prerequisites given.

i think this statement clearlt suggests that you must be at least equal to the caster level to meet the prerequisites
smrtgmp
10-23-04, 03:56 AM i think this statement clearlt suggests that you must be at least equal to the caster level to meet the prerequisites
This is true. except that you seem a little confused about what the requirements are. The requirements are the feats and spells needed to make an item. The CL given at the begining of the item description is not a requirement. Only items that specifically mention a CL requirement, such as pearls of power and the golem bane scarab, have a CL requirement greater than needed to cast the prerequisite spells.
cwslyclgh
10-23-04, 04:15 AM Caster level is not a prerequisite, the prerequistes are are located aftre the semi-colon ; folowing caster level.

what the errata is saying is that the caster level must be at least the minimum required to fullfil what is listed after that semi-colon

for an item with a caster level requirement in the prerequisites check out cloak of resistance.

Cloak of Resistance: These garments offer magic protection in the form of a +1 to +5 resistance bonus on all saving throws (Fortitude, Reflex, and Will).
Faint abjuration; CL 5th; Craft Wondrous Item, resistance, creator’s caster level must be at least three times the cloak’s bonus; Price 1,000 gp (+1), 4,000 gp (+2), 9,000 gp (+3), 16,000 gp (+4), 25,000 gp (+5);Weight 1 lb.
Emir
10-23-04, 06:45 AM The metamagic rods have the same problems:

all of them require CS 17 !!
Someone
10-23-04, 12:45 PM The metamagic rods have the same problems: all of them require CL 17 !!Yeah, the "CL 17" is the defualt run-home-to-mama requirement for when the writers couldn't come up with a better mechanic. Basicly, they said "the only way they could pull it off is to wish or miracle for it". And as wish/ miracle are 9th lvl spells, and only 17th lvl (or higher) wizards/ clerics can cast those spells, its a CL 17.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
smileybob1 10-22-04, 05:46 PM	does anyone think that it is reasonable that you must be of caster level 17 to make a pearl of power (1st). not to mention every other spell level. this seems a little over the top
Doomhawk 10-22-04, 05:57 PM	No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it.
Egres 10-22-04, 06:14 PM	No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it. From the SRD: For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell and not higher than her own caster level. For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a higher minimum on the creator’s level).
MythDragon 10-22-04, 06:14 PM	No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it. I think the minimum would be as low as 1st level (for the first pearl, that recalls 1 first level spell) From SRDNote that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item’s creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). While item creation costs are handled in detail below, note that normally the two primary factors are the caster level of the creator and the level of the spell or spells put into the item. A creator can create an item at a lower caster level than her own, but never lower than the minimum level needed to cast the needed spell. Using metamagic feats, a caster can place spells in items at a higher level than normal. so i think the minimum would be the spell need to make teh item in the pearl of powers case... Strong transmutation; CL 17th; Craft Wondrous Item, creator must be able to cast spells of the spell level to be recalled; Price 1,000 gp (1st), 4,000 gp (2nd), 9,000 gp (3rd), 16,000 gp (4th), 25,000 gp (5th), 36,000 gp (6th), 49,000 gp (7th), 64,000 gp (8th), 81,000 gp (9th), or 70,000 gp (two spells). good question though. I think I am reading it right :)
smileybob1 10-22-04, 06:14 PM	No, it's not reasonable. Thankfully, it's also not a requirement. The Caster Level line in an item's description is not a prerequisite; rather, it is an indication of what caster level the item will function at if found at random. I'm not sure if the value will be different when a person of a different caster level makes it. um not so sure about that from the SRD: • Caster Level: The next item in a notational entry gives the caster level of the item, indicating its relative power. The caster level determines the item’s saving throw bonus, as well as range or other level-dependent aspects of the powers of the item (if variable). It also determines the level that must be contended with should the item come under the effect of a dispel magic spell or similar situation. This information is given in the form “CL x,” where “CL” is an abbreviation for caster level and “x” is an ordinal number representing the caster level itself. For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell and not higher than her own caster level. For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a higher minimum on the creator’s level).
Egres 10-22-04, 06:16 PM	um not so sure about that from the SRD: Ehmmm... Didn't you read my post?
smileybob1 10-22-04, 06:18 PM	ehmmm... if you check our post times i think you will realize that it is not my fault, thank you very much
MythDragon 10-22-04, 06:20 PM	lol yeah realy three post at the same time :) but where in the srd is that part you guys posted? I am looking in the "Create magic items" part....and i dont see that little tid bit you posted....probably just over looked it.
cwslyclgh 10-22-04, 06:47 PM	from the errata to the DMG Caster Level Dungeon Master’s Guide, page 215 Problem: The last two sentences in the section on Caster Level are ambiguous and potentially misleading. Solution: Replace with this text: For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the creator. The minimum caster level is that which is needed to meet the prerequisites given. so NO it is not a requirement.
Egres 10-22-04, 09:58 PM	ehmmm... if you check our post times i think you will realize that it is not my fault, thank you very much Sorry. :)
smrtgmp 10-22-04, 10:19 PM	I was going to quote the errata, but cwslyclgh beat me to it. :tiphat: That being the case, I'll just agree with him. :)
Doomhawk 10-23-04, 12:34 AM	So... wait... is it a requirement, or isn't it? And do I have to apologize for misleading people? [Not that I'm trying to protect my ego or anything, no sir...]
smrtgmp 10-23-04, 12:37 AM	No, its not a requirement
smileybob1 10-23-04, 03:52 AM	from the errata to the DMG so NO it is not a requirement. well i dont mean to be a pain but it would appear to me that the errata is ruling in favor of my arguement. all it says is that if the creator's caster level is greater than the minimum then the caster level is equal to the creators caster level. for example a 14th level wizard crafts a head band of intellect, his head band of intellect will be much more resiliant and more difficult to dispel than the 7th level wizard who made the same item. is says The minimum caster level is that which is needed to meet the prerequisites given. i think this statement clearlt suggests that you must be at least equal to the caster level to meet the prerequisites
smrtgmp 10-23-04, 03:56 AM	i think this statement clearlt suggests that you must be at least equal to the caster level to meet the prerequisites This is true. except that you seem a little confused about what the requirements are. The requirements are the feats and spells needed to make an item. The CL given at the begining of the item description is not a requirement. Only items that specifically mention a CL requirement, such as pearls of power and the golem bane scarab, have a CL requirement greater than needed to cast the prerequisite spells.
cwslyclgh 10-23-04, 04:15 AM	Caster level is not a prerequisite, the prerequistes are are located aftre the semi-colon ; folowing caster level. what the errata is saying is that the caster level must be at least the minimum required to fullfil what is listed after that semi-colon for an item with a caster level requirement in the prerequisites check out cloak of resistance. Cloak of Resistance: These garments offer magic protection in the form of a +1 to +5 resistance bonus on all saving throws (Fortitude, Reflex, and Will). Faint abjuration; CL 5th; Craft Wondrous Item, resistance, creator’s caster level must be at least three times the cloak’s bonus; Price 1,000 gp (+1), 4,000 gp (+2), 9,000 gp (+3), 16,000 gp (+4), 25,000 gp (+5);Weight 1 lb.
Emir 10-23-04, 06:45 AM	The metamagic rods have the same problems: all of them require CS 17 !!
Someone 10-23-04, 12:45 PM	The metamagic rods have the same problems: all of them require CL 17 !!Yeah, the "CL 17" is the defualt run-home-to-mama requirement for when the writers couldn't come up with a better mechanic. Basicly, they said "the only way they could pull it off is to wish or miracle for it". And as wish/ miracle are 9th lvl spells, and only 17th lvl (or higher) wizards/ clerics can cast those spells, its a CL 17.