Clothes of Fortification? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Clothes of Fortification? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
tiggrhoo
07-25-04, 01:49 AM Can you enchant normal clothes to have: An armor bonus?
An enhancement bonus to armor? (+5 pants)
Enchantments from the Armor Special Abilities list? (t-shirt of heavy fortification)

Some of these things may be relevant, but I'm not sure:
Magic Vestment spell
Robe of the Archmagi
Bracers of Armor
Elgonn
07-25-04, 03:00 AM *An armor bonus?

Only as in that you can enchant anything to grant an armor bonus like bracers of armor.

*An enhancement bonus to armor?

No

*Enchantments from the Armor Special Abilities list?

No
BlackSmith
07-25-04, 03:15 AM Originally posted by tiggrhoo
An armor bonus?
yes, use the same pricing method than Bracers of Armor but multiply the cost with 1,5 as the body slot of shirt that has Physical improvement in its slot.

Originally posted by tiggrhoo
An enhancement bonus to armor? (+5 pants)

no, there is no base armor bonus that you could enhance.

Originally posted by tiggrhoo
Enchantments from the Armor Special Abilities list? (t-shirt of heavy fortification)
yes, reduce the armor bonus of the barcers give by the amount of the ability.
compleat warrior clears this better than me.

check my Robe of Protection in sig for fun.
xrp3_robot
07-25-04, 03:20 AM I don't see why not. I have players that have +3 shadow robes, or +5 glamered, invulnerability and light fortification explorer's outfit. It doesn't stack with normal armor and voids the magic of magic armor.
tiggrhoo
07-25-04, 03:35 AM Originally posted by BlackSmith [about adding enhancement bonus to clothes] -
no, there is no base armor bonus that you could enhance. But that reason doesn't stop Magic Vestment from doing it. :confused:

Originally posted by BlackSmith
check my Robe of Protection in sig for fun. I did, it was cool. I don't know if it's legal, though, that's why I have this thread.

Originally posted by BlackSmith
reduce the armor bonus of the barcers give by the amount of the ability.
compleat warrior clears this better than me. I couldn't find it. Could you give a page number please?
flyingmoose
07-25-04, 03:36 AM Pants of invulernability is very funny to me.
Elgonn
07-25-04, 03:45 AM Funny would be glammered clothes
tiggrhoo
07-25-04, 04:00 AM Yes, but with true seeing you could tell it was actual clothes. :D
bitnine
07-25-04, 04:09 AM Originally posted by tiggrhoo
But that reason doesn't stop Magic Vestment from doing it. :confused:Heh. This is at least the 4th time I've seen this very topic. If I were more energetic I'd do a search a post a link, but that sounds like it would consume effort that I do not currently possess. That and the search function is timing out for me.

In any event, you might want to read over the magic vestment spell:An outfit of regular clothing counts as armor that grants no AC bonus for the purpose of this spell.You can, however, as mentioned have an item that acts as a reslotted bracers of armor, providing a magical armor bonus. A robe shouldn't incur the 1.5 counter-affinity cost multiplier, as the robe has the most versitile affinity of "multiple effects." Heck, you could have a gold tooth of magical armor, it'd just have the cost modifier of being slotless.
Seeker95
07-25-04, 12:39 PM The answer to this set of questions will vary from DM to DM.

I allow it, with one caveat. If you do so, your clothes are treated as armor. The ASF chance for clothing is 0%. But since it counts as armor (once enhanced with an armor bonus), it occupies the armor slot *and* would trigger the same restrictions as any other armor for those classes that have armor restrictions.
bitnine
07-25-04, 01:11 PM Originally posted by Seeker95
I allow it, with one caveat. If you do so, your clothes are treated as armor. The ASF chance for clothing is 0%. But since it counts as armor (once enhanced with an armor bonus), it occupies the armor slot *and* would trigger the same restrictions as any other armor for those classes that have armor restrictions. Yeah, that's a fairly common ruling. Would you also allow someone to go with reslotting bracers of armor into a shirt/robe as a different option?
Seeker95
07-25-04, 01:24 PM Originally posted by bitnine
Would you also allow someone to go with reslotting bracers of armor into a shirt/robe? Probably. To be honest, I would decide based on the player. If it was one of my munchkin players (I have them) I would say no. If it was one of my concept players (I have them too), I am more inclined to say yes.
Edymnion
07-25-04, 03:35 PM Originally posted by Seeker95
Probably. To be honest, I would decide based on the player. If it was one of my munchkin players (I have them) I would say no. If it was one of my concept players (I have them too), I am more inclined to say yes. I think thats the key thing here.
As a rule, I say that you cannot enchant clothing with armor bonuses. Its not armor, and you can't 'chant them any more than you could enchant your sword with Fortification. Something is either armor all the way, complete with all of the restrictions as well as the bonuses, or it is not armor. If clothes were armor, then monks and duelists go around naked. As for Magic Vestment, I think the very idea that they went and made an entire spell expressly for the purpose of allowing you to do it in the first place should tell you something. If it were like Magic Weapon, it would have just said it enchants armor or clothing. It didn't, it specifically said clothing, and it specifically said "for the purposes of this spell". So no dice at all on enchanted clothing.

But, for a good player, I'd be willing to bend the rules a bit.
Of course, where do you get Masterwork Clothes, and how much do they cost? Noble's Outfit do the trick?
BlackSmith
07-25-04, 04:54 PM Originally posted by tiggrhoo
But that reason doesn't stop Magic Vestment from doing it. :confused:

Magic Vestment is a spell that enhances your armors ability to block attacks, not a item.
thats the purpose of the spell, altrough it is merciful for characters that dont wear armor. It boost their normal clothing but as you cant wear normal clothes under armor (short of smallclothes) there is no worry about abjuse thus the spell makes have added a line that says it also affects normal clothing.

point me one item that gives enhancement armor bonus alone.
there is none.
Why?
because it would be abjusable to boot.
think about bracers of armor +8 and your whatever-item-of-enhacement-armor-bonus +10.
sudenly you got +18 AC without any draw backs.
not going to happen.

if the item gives already a armor bonus in non-magical form, you can enhance it (hence the name "Armor bonus (enhancement)" ).
if it does not give armor bonus in non-magical form, the price is the same but the bonus is armor bonus (like Bracers of Armor +X).

thus you want a t-shirt that gives +8 armor bonus to AC and has heavy fortification, it costs you 253 500 gp.
price comes from +13 (+8 armor and +5 fortification) MPM (Market Price Modifier) squared * 1000 = 169 000 gp.
BUT as your shirt should give Physical improvement, it suffers from +50% price increase thus 169kgp * 1,5 = 253,5kgp

so 253,5kgp for t-shirt of armor +8 that has heavy fortification.
Originally posted by tiggrhoo
I did, it was cool. I don't know if it's legal, though, that's why I have this thread.
define legal.
if are thinking if it is done by the guidelines or if it is balanced, it cointains a link for its discussion thread about its balance and it has its price outcome.
if you worry it is a broken item, dont. i dont such crap.
i do good things that live for their value.
Originally posted by tiggrhoo
I couldn't find it. Could you give a page number please? wrong book, my bad.
Arms and Equipment Guide, p 130.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
tiggrhoo 07-25-04, 01:49 AM	Can you enchant normal clothes to have: An armor bonus? An enhancement bonus to armor? (+5 pants) Enchantments from the Armor Special Abilities list? (t-shirt of heavy fortification) Some of these things may be relevant, but I'm not sure: Magic Vestment spell Robe of the Archmagi Bracers of Armor
Elgonn 07-25-04, 03:00 AM	An armor bonus? Only as in that you can enchant anything to grant an armor bonus like bracers of armor. An enhancement bonus to armor? No *Enchantments from the Armor Special Abilities list? No
BlackSmith 07-25-04, 03:15 AM	Originally posted by tiggrhoo An armor bonus? yes, use the same pricing method than Bracers of Armor but multiply the cost with 1,5 as the body slot of shirt that has Physical improvement in its slot. Originally posted by tiggrhoo An enhancement bonus to armor? (+5 pants) no, there is no base armor bonus that you could enhance. Originally posted by tiggrhoo Enchantments from the Armor Special Abilities list? (t-shirt of heavy fortification) yes, reduce the armor bonus of the barcers give by the amount of the ability. compleat warrior clears this better than me. check my Robe of Protection in sig for fun.
xrp3_robot 07-25-04, 03:20 AM	I don't see why not. I have players that have +3 shadow robes, or +5 glamered, invulnerability and light fortification explorer's outfit. It doesn't stack with normal armor and voids the magic of magic armor.
tiggrhoo 07-25-04, 03:35 AM	Originally posted by BlackSmith [about adding enhancement bonus to clothes] - no, there is no base armor bonus that you could enhance. But that reason doesn't stop Magic Vestment from doing it. :confused: Originally posted by BlackSmith check my Robe of Protection in sig for fun. I did, it was cool. I don't know if it's legal, though, that's why I have this thread. Originally posted by BlackSmith reduce the armor bonus of the barcers give by the amount of the ability. compleat warrior clears this better than me. I couldn't find it. Could you give a page number please?
flyingmoose 07-25-04, 03:36 AM	Pants of invulernability is very funny to me.
Elgonn 07-25-04, 03:45 AM	Funny would be glammered clothes
tiggrhoo 07-25-04, 04:00 AM	Yes, but with true seeing you could tell it was actual clothes. :D
bitnine 07-25-04, 04:09 AM	Originally posted by tiggrhoo But that reason doesn't stop Magic Vestment from doing it. :confused:Heh. This is at least the 4th time I've seen this very topic. If I were more energetic I'd do a search a post a link, but that sounds like it would consume effort that I do not currently possess. That and the search function is timing out for me. In any event, you might want to read over the magic vestment spell:An outfit of regular clothing counts as armor that grants no AC bonus for the purpose of this spell.You can, however, as mentioned have an item that acts as a reslotted bracers of armor, providing a magical armor bonus. A robe shouldn't incur the 1.5 counter-affinity cost multiplier, as the robe has the most versitile affinity of "multiple effects." Heck, you could have a gold tooth of magical armor, it'd just have the cost modifier of being slotless.
Seeker95 07-25-04, 12:39 PM	The answer to this set of questions will vary from DM to DM. I allow it, with one caveat. If you do so, your clothes are treated as armor. The ASF chance for clothing is 0%. But since it counts as armor (once enhanced with an armor bonus), it occupies the armor slot and would trigger the same restrictions as any other armor for those classes that have armor restrictions.
bitnine 07-25-04, 01:11 PM	Originally posted by Seeker95 I allow it, with one caveat. If you do so, your clothes are treated as armor. The ASF chance for clothing is 0%. But since it counts as armor (once enhanced with an armor bonus), it occupies the armor slot and would trigger the same restrictions as any other armor for those classes that have armor restrictions. Yeah, that's a fairly common ruling. Would you also allow someone to go with reslotting bracers of armor into a shirt/robe as a different option?
Seeker95 07-25-04, 01:24 PM	Originally posted by bitnine Would you also allow someone to go with reslotting bracers of armor into a shirt/robe? Probably. To be honest, I would decide based on the player. If it was one of my munchkin players (I have them) I would say no. If it was one of my concept players (I have them too), I am more inclined to say yes.
Edymnion 07-25-04, 03:35 PM	Originally posted by Seeker95 Probably. To be honest, I would decide based on the player. If it was one of my munchkin players (I have them) I would say no. If it was one of my concept players (I have them too), I am more inclined to say yes. I think thats the key thing here. As a rule, I say that you cannot enchant clothing with armor bonuses. Its not armor, and you can't 'chant them any more than you could enchant your sword with Fortification. Something is either armor all the way, complete with all of the restrictions as well as the bonuses, or it is not armor. If clothes were armor, then monks and duelists go around naked. As for Magic Vestment, I think the very idea that they went and made an entire spell expressly for the purpose of allowing you to do it in the first place should tell you something. If it were like Magic Weapon, it would have just said it enchants armor or clothing. It didn't, it specifically said clothing, and it specifically said "for the purposes of this spell". So no dice at all on enchanted clothing. But, for a good player, I'd be willing to bend the rules a bit. Of course, where do you get Masterwork Clothes, and how much do they cost? Noble's Outfit do the trick?
BlackSmith 07-25-04, 04:54 PM	Originally posted by tiggrhoo But that reason doesn't stop Magic Vestment from doing it. :confused: Magic Vestment is a spell that enhances your armors ability to block attacks, not a item. thats the purpose of the spell, altrough it is merciful for characters that dont wear armor. It boost their normal clothing but as you cant wear normal clothes under armor (short of smallclothes) there is no worry about abjuse thus the spell makes have added a line that says it also affects normal clothing. point me one item that gives enhancement armor bonus alone. there is none. Why? because it would be abjusable to boot. think about bracers of armor +8 and your whatever-item-of-enhacement-armor-bonus +10. sudenly you got +18 AC without any draw backs. not going to happen. if the item gives already a armor bonus in non-magical form, you can enhance it (hence the name "Armor bonus (enhancement)" ). if it does not give armor bonus in non-magical form, the price is the same but the bonus is armor bonus (like Bracers of Armor +X). thus you want a t-shirt that gives +8 armor bonus to AC and has heavy fortification, it costs you 253 500 gp. price comes from +13 (+8 armor and +5 fortification) MPM (Market Price Modifier) squared * 1000 = 169 000 gp. BUT as your shirt should give Physical improvement, it suffers from +50% price increase thus 169kgp * 1,5 = 253,5kgp so 253,5kgp for t-shirt of armor +8 that has heavy fortification. Originally posted by tiggrhoo I did, it was cool. I don't know if it's legal, though, that's why I have this thread. define legal. if are thinking if it is done by the guidelines or if it is balanced, it cointains a link for its discussion thread about its balance and it has its price outcome. if you worry it is a broken item, dont. i dont such crap. i do good things that live for their value. Originally posted by tiggrhoo I couldn't find it. Could you give a page number please? wrong book, my bad. Arms and Equipment Guide, p 130.