Concentrate on Multiple Spells? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Concentrate on Multiple Spells? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ManinBlaq
10-16-06, 01:42 PM I thought I saw an ability (most likely from a prestige class), perhaps it was a feat (though I doubt it), but an ability that allows a caster to maintain concentration on 2 different spells. I seem recall something called 'Split Mind'.

Don't know .. I've reviewed the most obvious sources that I have on hand but don't come up with anything.

Does anyone in the community know it, or something similiar (besides the obvious -- Extraordinary Concentration from Complete Adventurer)?
PolasKasDorion
10-17-06, 09:53 AM I remember running across a spell that did this for you... don't remember where, probably the Spell Compendium. Basically... you cast it and it concentrates on the first spell for you, then you can continue to cast other spells.
Iver Gearsham
10-17-06, 03:15 PM Spc 196 Sonorous Hum it maintains concentration for the next spell you cast for minutes per lvl.
texanhick20
10-17-06, 04:28 PM just transfer control over to your familiar..

I do this all the time, have your Familiar be in control, he's got the intelligence enough to atleast follow your commands with what to do with the spell..
MarkB
10-17-06, 05:16 PM just transfer control over to your familiar..
And how exactly do you do that? Your familiar is not the caster of the spell.
IMarvinTPA
10-17-06, 05:42 PM Complete Adventurer has Extraordinary Concentration (http://www.imarvintpa.com/dndLive/feats.php?ID=499) which lets you concentrate on a spell as a move or a swift action.

IMarv
ManinBlaq
10-18-06, 12:28 AM just transfer control over to your familiar..

I do this all the time, have your Familiar be in control, he's got the intelligence enough to atleast follow your commands with what to do with the spell..

Yea.. I've never heard of this particular technique. Could you please enlighten us?

Is this a feat or prestige ability?
texanhick20
10-18-06, 01:16 AM Neither, it's in the main srd..

If the spell or effect has a duration other than instantaneous, it stops affecting the familiar if it moves farther than 5 feet away and will not affect the familiar again even if it returns to the master before the duration expires. Additionally, the master may cast a spell with a target of "You" on his familiar (as a touch range spell) instead of on himself.

My gaming group has interpreted this to mean spells that you have to concentrate on, can be transfered to the familiar.

atleast spells like detect magic could be transfered to the familiar who can then speak with you :)
ManinBlaq
10-18-06, 01:18 AM Well, then that's a personal interpretation.

Clever .. and I can see your logic, but I don't quite agree with it.

Thanks though.
MarkB
10-18-06, 04:14 AM Neither, it's in the main srd..

If the spell or effect has a duration other than instantaneous, it stops affecting the familiar if it moves farther than 5 feet away and will not affect the familiar again even if it returns to the master before the duration expires. Additionally, the master may cast a spell with a target of "You" on his familiar (as a touch range spell) instead of on himself.

My gaming group has interpreted this to mean spells that you have to concentrate on, can be transfered to the familiar.

atleast spells like detect magic could be transfered to the familiar who can then speak with you :)
Well, that's a massively novel interpretation. That ability allows you to do two things - let a familiar share the benefits of a spell you cast on yourself, or cast a personal-range spell on the familiar.

Neither of these makes the familiar the spell's caster, nor can either option be applied to spells that you're casting to affect anything aside from yourself and your familiar. The ability does not in any way allow you to palm off Concentration checks onto your familiar.
texanhick20
10-18-06, 04:31 AM it makes the famiiar a little more useful though for anything other than ohh, it takes a fireball and you lose a level worth of XP,,
Esponer
10-18-06, 05:59 AM Familiars cannot naturally concentrate on a spell for you. Psicrystals, with the aid of a 3rd level psionic power, can. Sonorous hum is a spell, and is generally better than using solicit psicrystal to have your psicrystal concentrate on something for you (much better duration, and requires no psicrystal).
Jherid
10-18-06, 07:47 AM Familiars can concentrate on spells...if you take the Familiar Concentration (LEoF) feat.
Just another user
10-18-06, 07:48 AM Well, then that's a personal interpretation.

Clever .. and I can see your logic, but I don't quite agree with it.

Thanks though.

It is a good idea for a feat, tho.
risner
10-18-06, 10:32 AM Spirit Shaman base class has that ability. Complete Divine I think.

just transfer control over to your familiar..

I do this all the time

That isn't how familiars work. At least not without a class ability or specific feat to allow the familiar to have the ability to take over concentration because they (the familiar) are not the casters and only the caster can concentrate. Using your logic, then anyone that has the spell (including a Fighter) could continue to concentrate to retain the spell.
texanhick20
10-18-06, 10:05 PM Spirit Shaman base class has that ability. Complete Divine I think.

That isn't how familiars work. At least not without a class ability or specific feat to allow the familiar to have the ability to take over concentration because they (the familiar) are not the casters and only the caster can concentrate. Using your logic, then anyone that has the spell (including a Fighter) could continue to concentrate to retain the spell.

if that fighter makes the use magic device DC to activate that scroll or wand to cast the spell then yes, he can concentrate to retain the spell.
risner
10-19-06, 06:06 PM if that fighter makes the use magic device DC to activate that scroll or wand to cast the spell then yes, he can concentrate to retain the spell.

You missunderstood me.
A spellcaster casts a multiple target spell on himself and a fighter.
The spellcaster then quits concentrating on the spell and the fighter takes over concentration to retain the spell on himself and the spellcaster.

By your logic that is perfectly allowed. It isn't allow and that is but one of the flaws in allowing some other entity to take over concentration of a spell.
It doesn't have anything to do with the Fighter using UMD because the fighter (in my previous post) was not the caster of the spell, he was simply a target of the spell in the same way a familiar was the target of a spell.
User5127
10-20-06, 12:51 AM actually his logic meant that because of the bond you share with your familiar its not far out of the question for the familiar to take control of the spell for you. and they can. with the feat. that was mention by an above poster.

if you want the familiar to concentrate on the spell then get IT to cast the spell for you and then do the concentrating. there no transfer. no problem.
MarkB
10-20-06, 07:38 AM if you want the familiar to concentrate on the spell then get IT to cast the spell for you and then do the concentrating. there no transfer. no problem.
most familiars are not spellcasters, and while you can share some spells with them, you can't get them to cast on your behalf.
Fruscht
10-20-06, 09:28 AM If you want you familiar to cast a spell (and thus concentrate on it) for you, you can cast Imbue Familiar with Spell Ability on him. It's a 6th level spell from Spell Compendium.
One of my favorite combinations is Imbue Familiar with Spell Ability + Manyjaws.

Other option (already mentioned by Iver Gearsham) is Sonorous Hum spell.
texanhick20
10-20-06, 05:12 PM i didn't know about the feat and all, luckily so far the only spells I've had my familiar's use was Cloud of Knives, it's a Target You spell, so you can make it into a touch spell and just have your familiar fireing the knife while you cast a second casting of the spell. :)

(since I have four familiars, that gets fun after five castings of the spell!)
creepy drifter
10-22-06, 05:14 PM To put to rest any issues with the familiar "assuming control" of a concentration spell, read the game mechanics of the LEoF feat called Familiar Concentration.

Unfortunately, you need to have an Improved Familiar to get the feat.
Tempest Stormwind
10-22-06, 06:07 PM Check this thread out. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=409126) We've managed to get five or six concentration spells going at any given time, without using novel interpretations of Share Spells. (MarkB is right on that, of course.) Yes, Familiar Concentration factors in there. There's also Wu Jen spells (Finding the Center / Aiming at the Target) and the Extraordinary Concentration feat.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ManinBlaq 10-16-06, 01:42 PM	I thought I saw an ability (most likely from a prestige class), perhaps it was a feat (though I doubt it), but an ability that allows a caster to maintain concentration on 2 different spells. I seem recall something called 'Split Mind'. Don't know .. I've reviewed the most obvious sources that I have on hand but don't come up with anything. Does anyone in the community know it, or something similiar (besides the obvious -- Extraordinary Concentration from Complete Adventurer)?
PolasKasDorion 10-17-06, 09:53 AM	I remember running across a spell that did this for you... don't remember where, probably the Spell Compendium. Basically... you cast it and it concentrates on the first spell for you, then you can continue to cast other spells.
Iver Gearsham 10-17-06, 03:15 PM	Spc 196 Sonorous Hum it maintains concentration for the next spell you cast for minutes per lvl.
texanhick20 10-17-06, 04:28 PM	just transfer control over to your familiar.. I do this all the time, have your Familiar be in control, he's got the intelligence enough to atleast follow your commands with what to do with the spell..
MarkB 10-17-06, 05:16 PM	just transfer control over to your familiar.. And how exactly do you do that? Your familiar is not the caster of the spell.
IMarvinTPA 10-17-06, 05:42 PM	Complete Adventurer has Extraordinary Concentration (http://www.imarvintpa.com/dndLive/feats.php?ID=499) which lets you concentrate on a spell as a move or a swift action. IMarv
ManinBlaq 10-18-06, 12:28 AM	just transfer control over to your familiar.. I do this all the time, have your Familiar be in control, he's got the intelligence enough to atleast follow your commands with what to do with the spell.. Yea.. I've never heard of this particular technique. Could you please enlighten us? Is this a feat or prestige ability?
texanhick20 10-18-06, 01:16 AM	Neither, it's in the main srd.. If the spell or effect has a duration other than instantaneous, it stops affecting the familiar if it moves farther than 5 feet away and will not affect the familiar again even if it returns to the master before the duration expires. Additionally, the master may cast a spell with a target of "You" on his familiar (as a touch range spell) instead of on himself. My gaming group has interpreted this to mean spells that you have to concentrate on, can be transfered to the familiar. atleast spells like detect magic could be transfered to the familiar who can then speak with you :)
ManinBlaq 10-18-06, 01:18 AM	Well, then that's a personal interpretation. Clever .. and I can see your logic, but I don't quite agree with it. Thanks though.
MarkB 10-18-06, 04:14 AM	Neither, it's in the main srd.. If the spell or effect has a duration other than instantaneous, it stops affecting the familiar if it moves farther than 5 feet away and will not affect the familiar again even if it returns to the master before the duration expires. Additionally, the master may cast a spell with a target of "You" on his familiar (as a touch range spell) instead of on himself. My gaming group has interpreted this to mean spells that you have to concentrate on, can be transfered to the familiar. atleast spells like detect magic could be transfered to the familiar who can then speak with you :) Well, that's a massively novel interpretation. That ability allows you to do two things - let a familiar share the benefits of a spell you cast on yourself, or cast a personal-range spell on the familiar. Neither of these makes the familiar the spell's caster, nor can either option be applied to spells that you're casting to affect anything aside from yourself and your familiar. The ability does not in any way allow you to palm off Concentration checks onto your familiar.
texanhick20 10-18-06, 04:31 AM	it makes the famiiar a little more useful though for anything other than ohh, it takes a fireball and you lose a level worth of XP,,
Esponer 10-18-06, 05:59 AM	Familiars cannot naturally concentrate on a spell for you. Psicrystals, with the aid of a 3rd level psionic power, can. Sonorous hum is a spell, and is generally better than using solicit psicrystal to have your psicrystal concentrate on something for you (much better duration, and requires no psicrystal).
Jherid 10-18-06, 07:47 AM	Familiars can concentrate on spells...if you take the Familiar Concentration (LEoF) feat.
Just another user 10-18-06, 07:48 AM	Well, then that's a personal interpretation. Clever .. and I can see your logic, but I don't quite agree with it. Thanks though. It is a good idea for a feat, tho.
risner 10-18-06, 10:32 AM	Spirit Shaman base class has that ability. Complete Divine I think. just transfer control over to your familiar.. I do this all the time That isn't how familiars work. At least not without a class ability or specific feat to allow the familiar to have the ability to take over concentration because they (the familiar) are not the casters and only the caster can concentrate. Using your logic, then anyone that has the spell (including a Fighter) could continue to concentrate to retain the spell.
texanhick20 10-18-06, 10:05 PM	Spirit Shaman base class has that ability. Complete Divine I think. That isn't how familiars work. At least not without a class ability or specific feat to allow the familiar to have the ability to take over concentration because they (the familiar) are not the casters and only the caster can concentrate. Using your logic, then anyone that has the spell (including a Fighter) could continue to concentrate to retain the spell. if that fighter makes the use magic device DC to activate that scroll or wand to cast the spell then yes, he can concentrate to retain the spell.
risner 10-19-06, 06:06 PM	if that fighter makes the use magic device DC to activate that scroll or wand to cast the spell then yes, he can concentrate to retain the spell. You missunderstood me. A spellcaster casts a multiple target spell on himself and a fighter. The spellcaster then quits concentrating on the spell and the fighter takes over concentration to retain the spell on himself and the spellcaster. By your logic that is perfectly allowed. It isn't allow and that is but one of the flaws in allowing some other entity to take over concentration of a spell. It doesn't have anything to do with the Fighter using UMD because the fighter (in my previous post) was not the caster of the spell, he was simply a target of the spell in the same way a familiar was the target of a spell.
User5127 10-20-06, 12:51 AM	actually his logic meant that because of the bond you share with your familiar its not far out of the question for the familiar to take control of the spell for you. and they can. with the feat. that was mention by an above poster. if you want the familiar to concentrate on the spell then get IT to cast the spell for you and then do the concentrating. there no transfer. no problem.
MarkB 10-20-06, 07:38 AM	if you want the familiar to concentrate on the spell then get IT to cast the spell for you and then do the concentrating. there no transfer. no problem. most familiars are not spellcasters, and while you can share some spells with them, you can't get them to cast on your behalf.
Fruscht 10-20-06, 09:28 AM	If you want you familiar to cast a spell (and thus concentrate on it) for you, you can cast Imbue Familiar with Spell Ability on him. It's a 6th level spell from Spell Compendium. One of my favorite combinations is Imbue Familiar with Spell Ability + Manyjaws. Other option (already mentioned by Iver Gearsham) is Sonorous Hum spell.
texanhick20 10-20-06, 05:12 PM	i didn't know about the feat and all, luckily so far the only spells I've had my familiar's use was Cloud of Knives, it's a Target You spell, so you can make it into a touch spell and just have your familiar fireing the knife while you cast a second casting of the spell. :) (since I have four familiars, that gets fun after five castings of the spell!)
creepy drifter 10-22-06, 05:14 PM	To put to rest any issues with the familiar "assuming control" of a concentration spell, read the game mechanics of the LEoF feat called Familiar Concentration. Unfortunately, you need to have an Improved Familiar to get the feat.
Tempest Stormwind 10-22-06, 06:07 PM	Check this thread out. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=409126) We've managed to get five or six concentration spells going at any given time, without using novel interpretations of Share Spells. (MarkB is right on that, of course.) Yes, Familiar Concentration factors in there. There's also Wu Jen spells (Finding the Center / Aiming at the Target) and the Extraordinary Concentration feat.