Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bill Bisco: Average Adventurer 09-10-06, 01:27 PM	There are some great creatures out there; there are also some that fill too small of a niche or are just waaaay to similar to other monsters. Share your thoughts, (and please # every post :D ) 1. Shakarim (RoD) - Humans that became Orcs through a curse, just too specific and too weird. Kinda mess up the flavor too. 2. Skulk (RoD) - I'd really use either Changelings, or Dopplegangers. This race fills a niche that other races do already 3. Underfolk (RoD) - Once again, this is a really small niche. We already have a similar race in Forgotten Realms. However, this one is better since it actually has Darkvision. Really though, adventuring in the underdark, my players would see Grimlocks, Quaggoths, Duergar, Deep gnomes and Drow. Not more humans. 4. Derro (MM1) We already have Duergar; these guys aren't that different
Priest_of_Shaundakul 10-02-06, 09:53 AM	bump
Return of the Flumph 10-02-06, 04:04 PM	5. Nightmare Beast. Seriously, its just a big random furry thing with some nonsensical SLAs that has nothing to do with nightmares. 6. Lilitu. A tentacled succubus with no ability to change its form that is somehow able to go unnoticed in good aligned temples. Nice job, a$$holes. 7. Myconids. I'm not even going to talk about it.
Richmud 10-02-06, 05:46 PM	6. Lilitu. A tentacled succubus with no ability to change its form that is somehow able to go unnoticed in good aligned temples. Nice job, a$$holes. They have disguise self with a limitless duration as a spell-like ability. I have no monsters to add here as I'm never certain I won't be able to use a monster
MrAdam 10-02-06, 05:55 PM	7. Myconids. I'm not even going to talk about it. Hey, I love Myconids...they're really tasty sauteed in salad with a glass of wine... Seriously tho, I use myconids alot in my games what's wrong with them?
James_Nostack 10-02-06, 09:33 PM	Honestly, I only use about 30-40 monsters in my campaign, and they're all from the SRD. In this case, they're a bunch of monsters related to medieval European folklore. I find that a radically small monster list makes the fantasy elements of the game feel a bit more realistic, and when done well establishes a strong sense of time and place. (Like, you could also use a bunch of monsters taken from Greek mythology for a completely different feel.) Also, fewer monsters means greater familiarity with the rules on my part as a DM. Hags, for example, are really cool, and I might have otherwise completely overlooked them. So, for me, almost all of the iconic monsters are not used at all: no beholders, no mind flayers, no yuan-ti... I miss 'em occasionally, but not as much as I'd thought.
Piggyfreak6 10-02-06, 09:39 PM	8. Arcane Ooze- I still dont' know what it is! 9. Crawling Head- How'd a head get to be the huge size anyway!
CryoSilver 10-02-06, 09:41 PM	10: Dragons. There are no dragons in my homebrew campaign setting
spncrbrrtt 10-02-06, 09:41 PM	Don't dis the mycanois foo' i love em. i have a colony living in my basement as i post. (there are actually some in the bottom floor of my little bro's char's castle.) 11. Skum. there is no point to them 12. grey slaad. When there are death, blue and red slaad to be had, what's the point? 13. Spider eaters. I've only seen them used once, and as a mount for an even more pathetic creature at that. 13. Nixie. They are a one good arrow shot and they die monster. and uncommon for that.
PhaedrusXY 10-02-06, 09:47 PM	15?) The digester. It looks like half a monster. Where the hell is the front? Did a real monster eat half of it? It's basically a pair of back legs with an esophagus sticking out the front, squirting acid everywhere. Stupidest monster ever.
Watchdog_of_Hades 10-02-06, 10:04 PM	You're saying that there's a creature called a lilitu? I thought that I had made up an original name for a character, and then you come along and tell me that there's a monster... Darn it. 16(no ?): Grick. 17: Sea cat. I almost never flip to the pages those are on.
Insane Pixie 10-02-06, 10:14 PM	18. Shrieker. Invented so commoners could level up.
Shroomy 10-02-06, 11:28 PM	I don't think there are any monsters I would never consider using. I've seen more than half the monsters on this list used to great effect in various modules.
Terraneaux 10-02-06, 11:51 PM	A lot of the MM III creatures seem like a bit of a stretch.
DungeonMaster 10-03-06, 12:11 AM	Anything from the MM3 or MM4. Templated monster samples.
Melpomene 10-03-06, 12:23 AM	19. Rust Monster. I won't put my players through that. I just won't.
scienceman47 10-03-06, 12:55 AM	20.incarnum ooze - Its an ooze specifically designed to harm incarnum players. It should be called the defining zero creativity new mechanics splat book monster.
Roivas 10-03-06, 02:08 AM	Shedu: Possibly the lamest monster in history, it might be based off of myths but stat wise this creature is the dumbest thing on 5 legs. I'd rather fight the tarrsque six hundred times in a row at 9th level than have a noncombat encounter with these Burger King crown wearing morons. If I do use them in my game I reduce their Int, Wis, and Cha to 1 each and take away all their spell like abilities just so I can see my players slay one. Mudmaw: A strange crocodile with tendrils in it's mouth? No thanks, I'd rather not know what idea spawned this ridiculous beast. Vermin Lord: A master of insects who is an insect? Something tells me they aren't even trying to make creatures when something like this makes it into the MM3. Am I bitter? Probably. But I do have a point, some monsters should never have existed to raise the ire of player and GM alike. Though for every monster that I deam unusable a hundred fun creatures come onto the stage.
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 10-03-06, 05:42 AM	24. Elves. Stupid elves.
spncrbrrtt 10-03-06, 07:54 AM	What's wrong with elves? I'll sick my squadron of them on you. :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf: :elf:
Shaggy_Shaggs 10-03-06, 08:16 AM	18. Shrieker. Invented so commoners could level up.Are you kidding? Shriekers are plenty useful as organic alarm systems, solid waste disposal units, and possibly even food, for a subterranean fortress setting. Admittedly they probably should've been a terrain feature rather than a creature, but they're still nifty. Anyway... 25. Werewolves. Far too cliché as lycanthropes go, and not even very effective compared to other lycanthrope possibilities. 26. Cursts. Love the idea, hate the execution, can't be arsed to fix the stupid things. 27. Any creature with the Deathless type. Sad, pathetic, unoriginal, fallacious stereotype-reinforcing, undead wannabes. :nonono:
Raptorial 10-03-06, 11:25 AM	28. Dire glyptodons. Dire mammoths are so much cooler :cool: .
Fabius Maximus 10-03-06, 11:34 AM	Everything incarnum. Loxo and any other anthropomorphic race except gnolls maybe. They are just dumb. Wereanimals other than werewolves.
Return of the Flumph 10-03-06, 01:54 PM	Don't dis the mycanois foo' i love em. i have a colony living in my basement as i post. (there are actually some in the bottom floor of my little bro's char's castle.) 11. Skum. there is no point to them Mycanoids are walking, talking MUSHROOMS!!! What the hell is this, Mario d20? Classic monster or not, they will never be used at my gaming table. Skum do seem a little redundant (we already have kuo-toa and sahaugin, after all), but they can be worthwhile if you do it right. Really stress the connection between them and the aboleth (if you have Lords of Madness, there is a gruesome little tidbit about where skum come from). Describing them as bloated, pink humanoids with giant, tooth-filled maws on the ends of their necks where the head should be also helps, but that's just how I describe them (their bite damage is way too high for something that looks like the picture in the MM). I guess I must have misread the lilitu's statblock. I looked for that SLA, I'm not sure how I managed to not notice it.
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 10-03-06, 02:31 PM	What's wrong with elves? I'll sick my squadron of them on you. Everything.
Raptorial 10-03-06, 02:53 PM	Regular elves are boring. Drow or aquatic elves on the other hand...
spncrbrrtt 10-03-06, 05:47 PM	true... I thought you were talking about all elves, drow included. I have a lot of Drow characters. Incarnum rules! It is one of the main things in my campaign! There should be a board for it. But there isn't. :(
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-03-06, 06:32 PM	Mycanoids are walking, talking MUSHROOMS!!! What the hell is this, Mario d20? Classic monster or not, they will never be used at my gaming table. Skum do seem a little redundant (we already have kuo-toa and sahaugin, after all), but they can be worthwhile if you do it right. Really stress the connection between them and the aboleth (if you have Lords of Madness, there is a gruesome little tidbit about where skum come from). Describing them as bloated, pink humanoids with giant, tooth-filled maws on the ends of their necks where the head should be also helps, but that's just how I describe them (their bite damage is way too high for something that looks like the picture in the MM). I cannot use myconids seriously. That having been said, they're great for introducing comic relief characters into my otherwise serious stories. I mean, you said it: they're walking, talking 'shrooms. Add in the fact that they have hallucinogenic spores and spend eight hours of the day "melding into a transcendental, hallucinogenic, group-mind state" and the logical conclusion becomes clear: these creatures are medieval fantasy stoners. Obviously, if you wanted to keep a serious mood, you'd steer clear of this kind of thing. Everything you said about skum: seconded (although I always thought they were green). Skum suffer from one of the worst illustrations in the MM, although I think the cover illustration of Underdark is showing skum pretty well. I pretty much describe them that way, stressing the mouth full of deep-sea-fish fangs. I don't think there's a monster I would completely rule out using, but I was very disappointed to see the majority of the MM4 and a significant portion of the MM3 used up on so many stupid variants of common monsters. I don't buy these books to get stats for gnolls with character levels; I can do those myself! :mad:
Watchdog_of_Hades 10-03-06, 06:40 PM	Anything from the MM3 or MM4. Templated monster samples.The MM3 actually doesn't have any templated creatures, aside from samples for templates (which the MM's 1 and 2 have too, and I assume that you're going to use those sometime).
Balseraph 10-03-06, 06:49 PM	A large portion of the MM2 really. I'm on a personal mission to try to make as many of the MM1 least-used list threatening and interesting if used appropriately. I don't tell my players what they're facing by name and I use slightly altered descriptions to 'beef up' the cosmetic value :)
Insane Pixie 10-03-06, 08:53 PM	Are you kidding? Shriekers are plenty useful as organic alarm systems, solid waste disposal units, and possibly even food, for a subterranean fortress setting. Admittedly they probably should've been a terrain feature rather than a creature, but they're still nifty. Anyway... They have their uses, but they're not worth CR1. They have no means of damaging something. A cat is more frightening.
MrAdam 10-03-06, 09:26 PM	I don't want to HEAR any more Myconid bashing. Not only are they great in salads, but they are also usefull for non-combat (being neat-o sources of wildnerness lore and potions and wotnot) and combat (nobody expects the little mushroom man to bust ot the poison darts) encounters...now as for a truly hatefull monster NOTHING reeks of "I suck" like the drow... the single most hakneyed, overdone, lame race (ooh scary, black elves that live underground and worship spiders) in D+D's long and illustrious history. IF ANYONE can name another race more overdone (with Dozens of "Wizards" books and Dozens more Third party books (each one more repulsive than the last) devoted to them) I'll eat my laptop. However the drow DO have one (ONE!!!) saving grace...Driz'zt:The Batman of D+D
spncrbrrtt 10-03-06, 09:33 PM	NOTHING reeks of "I suck" like the drow... the single most hakneyed, overdone, lame race (ooh scary, black elves that live underground and worship spiders) in D+D's long and illustrious history. IF ANYONE can name another race more overdone (with Dozens of "Wizards" books and Dozens more Third party books (each one more repulsive than the last) devoted to them) I'll eat my laptop. However the drow DO have one (ONE!!!) saving grace...Driz'zt:The Batman of D+D Nice. But don't forget jarlaxe. he rulez.
Watchdog_of_Hades 10-03-06, 09:34 PM	ooh scary, black elves that live underground and worship spidersOoh, scary! Giant mushrooms that live underground and pollute with spores! Ooh, scary! Big cold things with pikes that live in Hell! Ooh, scary! A six-armed half-snake with a lot of weapons! I can summarize any monster like that. The only reason Drow are overdone is because of their "saving grace." Drizz't caused a wave of fanboyism that "made all dark elves chaotic good rebels yearning to throw off the reputation of their evil kin." And I'm fairly sure that the only reason you dislike them is that they're overused. You shouldn't praise Drizz't; you should burn him in effigy.
Bill Bisco: Average Adventurer 10-03-06, 09:42 PM	hey could we stay on topic please? THanks :cool:
spncrbrrtt 10-03-06, 10:04 PM	it is on topic just a bit away. this is topic We're over here.
Necropolitan 10-03-06, 10:17 PM	Dire Maggot. ... Seriously, in what situation would my PCs encounter the Dire Maggot, and in said situation, how the **** did the get there? If they are in a place where there even MIGHT be a Dire Maggot; they've done something *wrong*.
Razieliffied 10-03-06, 10:20 PM	I am confident in my ability to throw any monster at my friends. I've currently used the monster manual and the fiend folio, working my way through MM2 and three. I have MM4 around here somewhere but like to take things one step at a time.
SageBahamut 10-03-06, 11:04 PM	I will never use Brown Mold in any game. Ever. Not because it's useless or lame, but because I know too many players who would think it was funny as hell to bottle the stuff and then fling it into a volcano, and I think my campaign setting as a whole deserves better than that. Anything in the MMIV (also known as the Big Book of Dragonspawn). They must have been running out of ideas by then. Seriously.
Roivas 10-03-06, 11:14 PM	Shadow squirrels, the MM4. Wanted to throw wizards down a flight of stairs for making this one. Ravid, a big dragonish outsider that is more threatening against undead than anything 5th level. I guess it could animate random objects, but that makes the objects the encounter not the Ravid. And also that weird bird that can take two actions at one time from MM2 [I'm not going to bother to look]. Just a weird hard to use thingy that wouldn't make an interesting high level fight.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-03-06, 11:29 PM	... Seriously, in what situation would my PCs encounter the Dire Maggot, and in said situation, how the **** did the get there? If they are in a place where there even MIGHT be a Dire Maggot; they've done something *wrong*. I know that was a rhetorical question, but there is an answer! Dire/giant maggots are the larvae of giant insects. Unless your party is playing exterminator, the entire team is not likely to run into one. However, if a single PC is subdued and disabled (but not killed) by giant ants or wasps, then they may take that character back to the nest, to be fed to the next generation of growing, hungry mouths. Yeah,that ought to unnerve somebody at the table. Either that, or I need professional help for thinking about these things.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-03-06, 11:36 PM	Ignore this second post: computer error
Raptorial 10-03-06, 11:44 PM	Uh............You posted twice. Anywho, I think "typical" dire animals are overused. A dire wolf-come on! There really was such a creature, so why defile its good name with that piece of crud you call a monster? Now a winged dire diprotodon-That's original.
Richmud 10-04-06, 04:11 AM	And also that weird bird that can take two actions at one time from MM2 [I'm not going to bother to look]. Just a weird hard to use thingy that wouldn't make an interesting high level fight. On the off chance someone cares its called a chronotyrn
Watchdog_of_Hades 10-04-06, 10:50 AM	My MM2 goes from "Chaos Roc" to "Cloaked Ape." No "Chronotyrn."
Richmud 10-04-06, 10:55 AM	My MM2 goes from "Chaos Roc" to "Cloaked Ape." No "Chronotyrn." Looked it up myself, its in the fiend folio not the MM2 and I misspelt its name. Its a Chronotyryn
rastlin_of_the_tomes 10-04-06, 11:24 AM	magic golem from 2nd edit. this thing is the most annoying thing ever because of one ability: nothing based on magic can herm it and anything magical instead heals it, plus the monk counts a magic weapon. that plus its ring of magic fire is the most annoying thing ever, and just to screw with you more, its an epic level monster with 30d10 health and 2d20 attack damage with a +30 attack bonus.
Foxhengeyokai 10-04-06, 12:07 PM	Lemme see here, I normally end up using just about everything from the monster manuals, but I can't say that I've ever used the Moon Rat. I mean sure, it seems like a cool concept and all, but it's still just a bunch of rats. Then again, I have thrown paragon bunnies at the PC's and Vorpal bunnies too.
SiouLubb 10-04-06, 12:15 PM	The Delver. The Ethereal Filcher
bhu 10-04-06, 12:27 PM	Much of MM2, it reeks of TPK since the CR's are way skewed. Abyssal Maw for example...... The Nilbog from 2E.
Salla 10-04-06, 03:40 PM	Summoning Ooze. I am *NOT* juggling that many statblocks.
Necropolitan 10-04-06, 05:22 PM	I know that was a rhetorical question, but there is an answer! Dire/giant maggots are the larvae of giant insects. Unless your party is playing exterminator, the entire team is not likely to run into one. However, if a single PC is subdued and disabled (but not killed) by giant ants or wasps, then they may take that character back to the nest, to be fed to the next generation of growing, hungry mouths. Yeah,that ought to unnerve somebody at the table. Either that, or I need professional help for thinking about these things. I hate you, you filthy, dirty punk. You just gave me an In-Game reason to use the bloody Dire Maggot. I love my Leaf-Cutter Ants. I just took the Monsterous Ant template, made a few tweaks to the various stats and gave it Improved Sunder. They'll climb onto someone, and start carving them out of their armor like a can-opener. And now I have a place to use the Dire Maggot. I hate you, and I curse your name, you magnificent bastard.
DeSkyggeKriger 10-04-06, 09:32 PM	Dire Maggot. ... Seriously, in what situation would my PCs encounter the Dire Maggot, and in said situation, how the **** did the get there? If they are in a place where there even MIGHT be a Dire Maggot; they've done something *wrong*. I threw some dire maggots in the basement of a necromancer's tower. They were acting as a garbage disposal. If the party weren't so low level, I would've had the mommy (giant mosquito maybe?) be there, too.
Echoes of Deception 10-04-06, 10:19 PM	Instead of arguing with people over what I really will use, allow me to state things I will not, in no particular order: Intellect Devourer, Owlbear, Tarrasque, Athach, Goblin, Kobold, Bugbear, Orc, Guardinals, Githyanki, Mercane, Abeil, Automatons, Bladeling, Blood Ape, Bogun, Braxat, that giant walking graveyard thing, Deathbringer, Desmodu, Dinosaurs, Fire Bats, Flesh Jelly, Any kind of Giant, Halflings, Grimalkin, Greenvise, Hook Horrors, Jermlaine, Wizards' version of the leviathan, Marrashi, Meenlock, Moon Rats, Moonbeasts, Mooncalves, Mudmaws, Needleman, Nethersight Mastiff, Raggamoffyns, Rampagers, Sirine, Son of Kyuss, Aspect of any god, Spirit of the Land, Twilight Guardian, Spriggan, Wind Ghost, Achaierai, Animated Objects, Aranea, Belker, Chimera, Destrachan, Digester, Drider, Normal elves, Grimlocks, Hags, Harpies, Hell Hounds, Hobgoblins, Hippogriff, Wizards' version of the kraken, Mimicks in the shapes of treasure chests, Bearhounds, Phasms, Phantom Fungi, Rasts, Ropers, Sahuagin, Sea Cats, Shambling Mounds, Sphinxes, Spider Eaters, Xill, Xorn, Xaren, Yeth Hounds... There are more, but I got bored of listing them. Myconids rock. Especially fiendish ones.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-08-06, 03:57 PM	While I can't say I'll never use it: the Stone Spike (Monster Manual II). As far as I can tell, the only differences between it and a medium earth elemental are that the stone spike gets one more attack per round and has one less hit die than a standard earth elemental.
Starman IX 10-09-06, 08:39 AM	IF ANYONE can name another race more overdone (with Dozens of "Wizards" books and Dozens more Third party books (each one more repulsive than the last) devoted to them) I'll eat my laptop.Dragons. You want ketchup with that? ;)
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-09-06, 09:36 AM	Dragons. You want ketchup with that? ;) :rofl: Dragons are still cool though.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-09-06, 09:50 PM	Felt like it was time to put this thread up beside its companion "301 monsters you want to use" :bump:
dySWN 10-10-06, 01:00 PM	The Bearhound. Why would any just god take two animals who are good enough on their own and slap them together like that? Storm elementals seem awful useless to me, too.
Insane Pixie 10-10-06, 01:45 PM	Hey... I like both of those... oh, well. Unlike some other posters, I'm not going to argue for their usefullness. That's not the point of the thread. I'll never use Merfolk. Simply will never fit into any of my campaigns.
GhostMSL 10-15-06, 05:01 AM	I made the horrid mistake of useing a Banelar on my players when they were level 5. In my defense it should be said that it was 3.0 where it was CR: 5 - which did seem a tad low when i looked at it, but I thought Wizards knew what they are doing when they made it. They died - horribly and messily. But they kinda agreed that it wasn't really my fault - sorta.
Lina_Inverse 10-15-06, 07:03 AM	Dragons. You want ketchup with that? ;) Hmmm, dragons are done alot and indeed more. But are dragons "more overdone" or even overdone. Perhaps the later, but not the former. Afterall dragons arent another damn elven subrace.(Please do not go looking for the variety of dragon that IS an elven subrace, as im sure it exists i just dont want confirmation.
Foxhengeyokai 10-15-06, 12:10 PM	I REFUSE to use those absurd Climbdogs and thudhunters.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-15-06, 01:33 PM	I REFUSE to use those absurd Climbdogs and thudhunters. What the heck are those?
Foxhengeyokai 10-15-06, 01:35 PM	They are in the arms and equipment guide. A climbdog is basically a dog with a climb speed and bird feet. I never really looked at the thudhunter, just cause it sonded dumber that forest gump.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-15-06, 01:48 PM	A climbdog is basically a dog with a climb speed and bird feet. Designers must have been scraping the bottom of the barrel right there. Designer 1: "We still need one more creature. You got anything?" Designer 2: "Well, nothing new...what if we combined two old monsters into one bad!@# new one?" Designer 1: "Brilliant! What do you want to combine?" Designer 2: "Well, owl and bear are taken, and so are squid and panther...what about combining a bird and a dog?" Designer 1: "Brilliant! It's so original; no one will ever see it coming! We could call it a birddog!" Designer 2: "Genius! Oh, wait, that name already exists in the real world, for dogs that hunt birds." Designer 1: "Well, what if we gave it a climb speed and emphasized that instead of flight? What would we call that?" Designer 2: "A dog that climbs...we could call it...a climbdog! Designer 1: "Brilliant!" Designer 2: "Brilliant!"
Foxhengeyokai 10-15-06, 01:50 PM	Pretty much.
Doom_Linnorm 10-15-06, 03:48 PM	There's also plenty of rubbish in the Fiend Folio. Drow: I dunno, its just to cliche, I've seen more players using then Drow then I've seen people play other (though admitedly worse) kinds of elves. (Thus I created my own new subrace that kicks arse.) Humans: THEY ARE FRIKKIN EVERYWHERE, GET RID OF EM PLEASE!!! (In some campaigns you actualy encounter more humans then drow :eek: ) ;) I've got plenty to add from the MM2 and FF but I dunno any from the top of my head right now... and I left my books back home (I'm right now in a boarding school in england)
Respen 10-16-06, 12:30 AM	7. Myconids. I'm not even going to talk about it. I just used Myconids in my home campaign. They were fiendish worshippers of Zuggtmoy that were defending an artifact created by a follower of Grazzt. A different (and still living) follower of Grazzt hired my players and then turned on them when they refused to hand over the artifact. I used The Book of Vile Darkness and Fiendish Codex I to rationalize my monster choices. It is my opinion that almost all of the monsters on this thread can be used in almost any situation through the use of templates and class levels. Besides all monsters are part of some kind of ecology, except for undead, but they can be used to fuel the plots to many adventures.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-16-06, 12:47 AM	It is my opinion that almost all of the monsters on this thread can be used in almost any situation through the use of templates and class levels. Besides all monsters are part of some kind of ecology, except for undead, but they can be used to fuel the plots to many adventures. I agree. I think the main thing we're all doing here is rating monsters on their coolness factor (always good for a laugh) :rofl:
RobbyPants 10-16-06, 08:51 AM	sarrukh (the creature that makes Pun Pun what he is)!
elondir 10-16-06, 09:00 AM	5. Nightmare Beast. Seriously, its just a big random furry thing with some nonsensical SLAs that has nothing to do with nightmares. Dude that one was a Dark Sun monster. It's not a quori, it's supposed to be a creature that is a nightmare even consider fighting, in the same way that the tarrasque is a nightmare to fight.
Selgard 10-16-06, 09:08 AM	Climbdogs are from Darksun too, if I remember correctly.. the cliff-dwelling halflings. they fit there.. just not so much in other worlds.
elondir 10-16-06, 09:09 AM	magic golem from 2nd edit. this thing is the most annoying thing ever because of one ability: nothing based on magic can herm it and anything magical instead heals it, plus the monk counts a magic weapon. that plus its ring of magic fire is the most annoying thing ever, and just to screw with you more, its an epic level monster with 30d10 health and 2d20 attack damage with a +30 attack bonus. Sounds awesome to me. I think I remember have a pain with those in Baldur's Gate Throne of Bhaal. Godo monster if you ask me. I would never use most monsters from the Kara-Tur or Al-Qadim Monstrous Compendiums, although I would use a handful from those sources. EDIT: Yeah Climbdogs were in Windriders of the Jagged Cliffs. The life-shaper halflings genetically engineered them because the Jagged Cliffs are like ten miles high. They had some other weird stuff that eventually evolved into Daelkyr grafts. Check out Psionic Artifacts of Athas for some really, really weird lifeshaped items. The life-shapers probably could give the Daelkyr a run for their money on the whole aberration crafting thing. After reading Pun-Pun, even I, who scavenge the CO boards for the ultimate broken build, decided that I would not have Sarrukhs in any campaign I would ever make.
pita 10-16-06, 02:34 PM	The Bearhound. Why would any just god take two animals who are good enough on their own and slap them together like that? Storm elementals seem awful useless to me, too. Same reason we include the owl bear. To show that even an owl can love a bear, and live with the pain of child bearing to a bear.
kazgoroth 10-16-06, 04:09 PM	Another useless monster is the Kraken.... HOW IN THE NINE HELLS are a group of PC's suposed to fight them anyway. I'll liked to see a fighter in full plate mail, jump in the ocean to attack the Kraken, before he runs out of air. (even with the water breathing ability it would be almost imposible, since a full plate mail is pretty heavy) And if the PC's are traveling on the ocean, on a ship or similiar, they wouldn't have a chance. The cant hit it, it just stays out of reach, and crush the ship.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-16-06, 04:30 PM	Another useless monster is the Kraken.... HOW IN THE NINE HELLS are a group of PC's suposed to fight them anyway. I'll liked to see a fighter in full plate mail, jump in the ocean to attack the Kraken, before he runs out of air. (even with the water breathing ability it would be almost imposible, since a full plate mail is pretty heavy) And if the PC's are traveling on the ocean, on a ship or similiar, they wouldn't have a chance. The cant hit it, it just stays out of reach, and crush the ship. Continuing with my habit of posting answers to rhetorical questions: True, a fighter in plate mail would sink like a rock, but for the kraken to crush a ship, it would have to wrap its tentacles around the hull, leaving them vulnerable to sunder attempts by the PC's (see Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest). If the beast instead chose to attack the characters while they were on the ship, I always assumed it would send its tentacles slithering aboard and sort of haul its body up half-out of the water to use its jaws (read Peter Benchley's novel Beast for a description of a fight like this). So, even though the kraken is still in the water, it can be treated as being right next to the characters (although they obviously can't circle around behind it). Feel free to ignore this post, as I understand this thread is really just for our opinions.
Count Arioch the 28th 10-16-06, 04:43 PM	I dunno about the first poster, Derro can be freaking scary if played correctly.
elondir 10-16-06, 05:20 PM	I prefer derro to duergar. Why? Derro are insane and have a closer connection to the elemental plane of earth.
Return of the Flumph 10-16-06, 11:31 PM	Continuing with my habit of posting answers to rhetorical questions: True, a fighter in plate mail would sink like a rock, but for the kraken to crush a ship, it would have to wrap its tentacles around the hull, leaving them vulnerable to sunder attempts by the PC's (see Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest). If the beast instead chose to attack the characters while they were on the ship, I always assumed it would send its tentacles slithering aboard and sort of haul its body up half-out of the water to use its jaws (read Peter Benchley's novel Beast for a description of a fight like this). So, even though the kraken is still in the water, it can be treated as being right next to the characters (although they obviously can't circle around behind it). Feel free to ignore this post, as I understand this thread is really just for our opinions. Freedom of movement in conjunction with the aforementioned water breathing allows the fighter to wade in after the beast. Not to mention you can just use arrows without having to get close.
LordHawkeye 10-17-06, 01:11 AM	Manes (Book of vile darkness): Wha? Demons already got their fodder creature. What's that make this? Fodder's fodder? Pointless... Rust monster: My players like me as a DM and I'd very much like it to remain that way thank you very much. Tarrasque: By these levels, my PC's are up against world conquest scheming villains. Animal intelligence monsters just don't give me anything creative to work with. Unicorn: Unless you got an all female party, I'm running low on ways to use this. Interesting fact: I have never used orcs before. Why? No reason, just never turned out that way. I don't want to HEAR any more Myconid bashing. Not only are they great in salads, but they are also usefull for non-combat (being neat-o sources of wildnerness lore and potions and wotnot) and combat (nobody expects the little mushroom man to bust ot the poison darts) encounters...now as for a truly hatefull monster NOTHING reeks of "I suck" like the drow... the single most hakneyed, overdone, lame race (ooh scary, black elves that live underground and worship spiders) in D+D's long and illustrious history. IF ANYONE can name another race more overdone (with Dozens of "Wizards" books and Dozens more Third party books (each one more repulsive than the last) devoted to them) I'll eat my laptop. However the drow DO have one (ONE!!!) saving grace...Driz'zt:The Batman of D+D The drow: Society if feminazis had their way. Need I say more? Why Driz'zt was the only drow male with enough sense to split is beyond me.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-17-06, 02:03 AM	Manes (Book of vile darkness): Wha? Demons already got their fodder creature. What's that make this? Fodder's fodder? Pointless... To make things even crazier, consider the wrackspawn (Monster Manual IV). If dretches are the fodder, and manes are the fodder's fodder, then wrackspawn are the fodder's fodder's fodder! One wonders if there is not a still lower creature that the wrackspawn take their anger out on.
Foxhengeyokai 10-17-06, 03:04 PM	One wonders if there is not a still lower creature that the wrackspawn take their anger out on. Obviously, they take their anger out on prinnies.
dengarbountyhunter 10-17-06, 07:16 PM	I don't know who said manes, but I have to disagree; they are not utterly useless, for the demon armies in my campaign use them as catapult ammo (they explode in an acid cloud when they die)!
Tevish Szat 10-23-06, 05:59 PM	Manes exist as the CE petitoners. as for somethgin i;ll probalby never use... anyuthign from the ELH, no matter how much i want to get there. i will also agree with Crawling head, and add Bone and Flesh Oozes to it.
Lina_Inverse 10-23-06, 06:17 PM	Obviously, they take their anger out on prinnies. d00d, thats just not cool. Dont hurt the prinnys d00d. As to answer the question if theres something for the fodder's fodder's fodder to torment. ITS THE ABYSS, BY DEFINITION YES.
Gandrel 10-23-06, 06:19 PM	I cannot use myconids seriously. That having been said, they're great for introducing comic relief characters into my otherwise serious stories. I mean, you said it: they're walking, talking 'shrooms. Add in the fact that they have hallucinogenic spores and spend eight hours of the day "melding into a transcendental, hallucinogenic, group-mind state" and the logical conclusion becomes clear: these creatures are medieval fantasy stoners. Obviously, if you wanted to keep a serious mood, you'd steer clear of this kind of thing. I don't think there's a monster I would completely rule out using, but I was very disappointed to see the majority of the MM4 and a significant portion of the MM3 used up on so many stupid variants of common monsters. I don't buy these books to get stats for gnolls with character levels; I can do those myself! :mad: Hahahaha...myconid as medieval fantasy stoners....thats fun because its true...and yes I also disapointed with the MM4. The only cool tiamat spawns are the bluespawn godslayer,the red firebelcher, the arcanix, and the white hordeling. The icerskider is too ridiculous to be true. And the variants of the comon monsters races are destined for lazy or newbies dms. But you gotta admit that the new tables for the knowledge checks for knowig the creatures traits are useful, and the maps too.
Jefepato 10-23-06, 08:06 PM	The firbolg. They used to be cool, but I can't in good conscience accept that a Large "giant-kin" has a Strength of 36.
TheMeanOne 10-23-06, 09:24 PM	The only thing I feel confident I won't ever use is the Tarrasque. It's a huge epic battle that I wouldn't ever build a campaign around, just not my sort of game. I'm sure it works for some people - but the Tarrasque will never be in a campaign I run.
TheCrawlingSpleen 10-24-06, 12:29 AM	The icerskider is too ridiculous to be true. And the variants of the comon monsters races are destined for lazy or newbies dms. But you gotta admit that the new tables for the knowledge checks for knowig the creatures traits are useful, and the maps too. The knowledge check answers are indeed cool, and although I had never thought about the maps, those probably will prove useful sometime in the future.
Insane Pixie 10-24-06, 12:31 AM	I've yet to use guardinals. Maybe because when you say it too fast, it sounds like "Garden Gnolls".