Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Loren Pechtel 06-05-05, 11:40 PM	A bunch of skeletons are attacking. The head of one in the back is actually the demilich.
Ogre4Hire 06-06-05, 09:46 PM	I'd say that your ruse would be detected rather quickly, as any party strong enough to even entertain delusions of taking on a Demilich is going to tear through a pack of skeletons without even noticing them.
runestar 06-06-05, 10:16 PM	What's the ruse? A party powerful enough to take on a demilich will plow through even the most advanced of skeletons with ease. If the skeletons prove a moderate challenge, then what the heck is the lich doing there? The demilich cant use its powers without giving up the gig, and its skeleton body will do negligible damage.
Drindin 06-07-05, 12:20 AM	Skeletons provide a minor distraction (much like a mosquito might), nothing more I'd imagine... possibly the bigger baddies would be hiding in the back with the demilich?
Loren Pechtel 06-07-05, 12:47 AM	It's not that the skeletons provide a challenge. They certainly wouldn't. It's that they make it hard to find the demilich, and if he's careful about what he does it makes it hard for them to even realize what they are up against. A demilich doesn't want to be shattered--and it seems to me the best defense is to not let your opponents realize you're shatterable.
runestar 06-07-05, 11:00 PM	Mosquitoes can be darn annoying, during my first outfield exercise, I found it nigh impossible to sleep with what must be dozens of them buzzing around my head. (yeah, call me a wuss) My take is that the lich would not be able to conceal his existance very well. The skeletons wouldn't last a round, what would he do after that? Lay on the ground and play deader than dead?
kinem 06-07-05, 11:20 PM	I'm going to have to say that this could be a viable tactic. Sure, the skeletons wouldn't last a round. They don't have to: What is the one thing that is supposed to determine high level combat? Initiative. So, let's assume that the dl's goal with this tactic is to be able to cast his Spell of Unstoppable Doom before the party takes him out with one round of their actions. He could try invisibility or illusion, but the party is likely to have detection spells up. So a mundane disguise isn't a bad idea. Lets assume our friend encounters a party of 4 characters: a rogue, a cleric, a wizards, and a fighter. What will happen: Rogue (acts first): "Skeletons? Ha!" He takes some out. Fighter: "Ho hum." He takes more out. Wizard (who took Improved Initiative, a good feat): "Yep dese are normeral skelees, I see youz take dem out easy. I'll do notin'." Cleric: "Let's get this over with. Turn!" (All remaining skeletons vanish; DL remains.) DL: "Ha Ha!" Casts Spell of Unstoppable Doom. All PCs die.
speeblefreak 06-08-05, 11:21 AM	Here's a similar idea: fill a dungeon with screaming skulls and skulletons (demilich look-alikes all) just until the point where the party will have caught on. Then inject a real demilich. Fighter: Another "demilich?" Take it out, cleric, I'm not going to waste my +5 arrows on it. Rogue: That goes for me, too. Wizard: I use prestidigitation to amuse myself while the cleric turns the thing. Cleric: Yawn. (turns, nothing happens)--WHA?! Demilich: :evillaugh (destroys party)
Gurthoron 06-08-05, 11:30 AM	One of the main problems is concealing the skull. A nice skull with the soulstones on it and reaking of evil and magic will be a big beacon, even in a pack of skeletons. And if the demilich just needs a round to kill the party, hes gonna get it off anyway because smart demilich's are freaking hard to kill. "Excellent, I have a spell that will kill all my enemies. Now, I could confront the adventurers in a passageway and pretend to be one of the skeleton's heads to fool them, or I could just float back and hide and zap them without them knowing I'm there. Hmmmm, what to choose." This tactic is just silly for the demilich. He is better off trying to stay out of sight and doing hit-and-runs while his undead minions wear down the enemy.
Ogre4Hire 06-08-05, 04:01 PM	Considering the size of a Demilich, his best tactic would be to construct a lair that has numerous tiny alcoves and tunnels that are far too small for even a Halfling to fit through. He could then simply float around and snipe the fools to death (until they got the idea to simply collapse the building).
Purkake 06-08-05, 04:55 PM	Considering the size of a Demilich, his best tactic would be to construct a lair that has numerous tiny alcoves and tunnels that are far too small for even a Halfling to fit through . He could then simply float around and snipe the fools to death (until they got the idea to simply collapse the building). An epic rogue could easily crawl up your a** so you need something better for the lich ;)
runestar 06-08-05, 10:29 PM	I think any optimsed cleric worth his salt should have little problem turning a demilich of his cr. Plus won't your party feel weird that their cr29 party is being onset by skeletons. They are sure to smell foul play. I guess it would be good for a few diversions, if the demilich is not amongst the skeletons in the first few skirmishes.
Loren Pechtel 06-08-05, 11:28 PM	Mosquitoes can be darn annoying, during my first outfield exercise, I found it nigh impossible to sleep with what must be dozens of them buzzing around my head. (yeah, call me a wuss) No reason to call you a wuss. There's something about their whine that I absolutely hate. To make it worse when I was in a situation of having them whining around at night it was in malaria territory and I wasn't on the best preventative drug. (The only drug allergy I've ever had.) My take is that the lich would not be able to conceal his existance very well. The skeletons wouldn't last a round, what would he do after that? Lay on the ground and play deader than dead? That depends on how many skeletons there are. Also, have them come at the party on a fairly narrow front. They'll last a few rounds. When the last one drops he should play dead and only use magic that won't give away his position. They'll be looking for the bad guy while he's right there hammering them.
Loren Pechtel 06-08-05, 11:31 PM	One of the main problems is concealing the skull. A nice skull with the soulstones on it and reaking of evil and magic will be a big beacon, even in a pack of skeletons. And if the demilich just needs a round to kill the party, hes gonna get it off anyway because smart demilich's are freaking hard to kill. "Excellent, I have a spell that will kill all my enemies. Now, I could confront the adventurers in a passageway and pretend to be one of the skeleton's heads to fool them, or I could just float back and hide and zap them without them knowing I'm there. Hmmmm, what to choose." This tactic is just silly for the demilich. He is better off trying to stay out of sight and doing hit-and-runs while his undead minions wear down the enemy. Paint the stones white. He'll be found if they have detect evil up *and are concentrating* on it. Yes, he could hide and snipe from a distance. That's exactly what the PC's would think when they are taking hits from no apparent source. They're going to be looking down corridors, not at their feet. If he's found he bugs out with a quickened dimension door.
Loren Pechtel 06-08-05, 11:33 PM	I think any optimsed cleric worth his salt should have little problem turning a demilich of his cr. Plus won't your party feel weird that their cr29 party is being onset by skeletons. They are sure to smell foul play. I guess it would be good for a few diversions, if the demilich is not amongst the skeletons in the first few skirmishes. Yeah, there should be other challenges of low CR. After all, a demilich isn't going to know what sort of attackers to expect, he will probably have things ready for low-level fools who blunder in so he doesn't have to waste his powerful stuff against them.
runestar 06-09-05, 09:26 AM	YEah, which is why I advocate sending out a few advance skeleton parties to trick them into thinking the opposition is composed of nothing of "lowly" undead. When they let their guard down, its time for the demilich to strike. Though it can work either way, since the players much (correctly) assume that the villian is merely testing their mettle by sending progressively more powerful foes at them, thus they will not allow their guard to lower. Its not that bad of a ploy, played correctly, but anything unexpected can crop up in a campaign, so its best to prepare contingencies in case the players somehow discover your ruse.
Loren Pechtel 06-11-05, 12:35 AM	YEah, which is why I advocate sending out a few advance skeleton parties to trick them into thinking the opposition is composed of nothing of "lowly" undead. When they let their guard down, its time for the demilich to strike. Though it can work either way, since the players much (correctly) assume that the villian is merely testing their mettle by sending progressively more powerful foes at them, thus they will not allow their guard to lower. Its not that bad of a ploy, played correctly, but anything unexpected can crop up in a campaign, so its best to prepare contingencies in case the players somehow discover your ruse. I wasn't thinking of sending only lowly undead but rather sending a variety of things at different levels. This would look like just another group of wimps but it would let the demilich get in some free licks. As soon as he thinks he's discovered he bugs out with a quickened dimension door.