a secret power of Lich ... is it a fault [Archive] - Wizards Community

a secret power of Lich ... is it a fault [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
BaalZebul
06-30-03, 08:26 AM I'm not an experienced player and I'm not sure if this can be true
but I don't know ?

Now everyone knows something about lich touch.
There are 2 opportunities. One of them is the famous paralysing touch and the second one is his normal touch attack that deals 1d8+5 negative energy to any living creature.

So when I read through the Cure or any of the cleric's healing spells I saw that it channels positive energy that heals any living creatures and inflict spell that channels negative energy that heals undeads.

If negative energy can heal undeads, a lich might touch himself and channel this energy that heals him 1d8+5 damage.

Am I wrong ?
DakezDarkenblood
06-30-03, 10:13 AM I allow it in my games... realistically, it's the only way liches and death knights have to heal.

However, the key word may be interpretted as 'living' in that description. The lich is not alive, and therefore cannot be a target of the touch attack.
lukelightning
06-30-03, 10:18 AM Great. Now you made me imagine liches touching themselves. Like that Divinyl's song... "I don't want anybody else/when I take some damage I touch myself...."
DakezDarkenblood
06-30-03, 10:23 AM It all makes sense if you dress the lich up in a tattered red leather jacket, a sequined glove, and have a dozen or two advanced zombies following him around with the leadership feat.
Adrez Nesnsid
06-30-03, 11:13 AM Originally posted by lukelightning
Great. Now you made me imagine liches touching themselves. Like that Divinyl's song... "I don't want anybody else/when I take some damage I touch myself...."

HA HA HA Ha-Ha-HA-HA

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Lord Arijani of Sri Raji
06-30-03, 11:17 AM But I think there is a difference here: while the cleric is channeling positive energy through a prepared spell, the lich is channeling negative energy from his own "negative energy dweomer", if I can call it this way. I mean, he would be channeling negative energy from his own "undead source" to heal his own body.

I believe one thing is the undead touch a living being and the damage be a consequence of the contact with raw negative energy flowing through the undead body. Another thing is to try to "short circuit" this same negative energy from the source, through the body and back to it.
Vegeta8472
06-30-03, 01:41 PM That's kind of like putting a wire to each end of a batterie. But, doing that runs it out of a charge.
Brian.C
06-30-03, 02:49 PM I'd say the lich could do it, but there should be a limit to the number of times it can.

- Brian
Willie the Duck
06-30-03, 04:05 PM By the rules, no.

Negative energy does not always cure undead, just as positive energy doesn't always cure mortals. There are some positive energy effects which cause things to glow, not be healed. Curative Spells (and curative spells only), work in the fashion described (i.e. CLW cures the living/ hurts undead, CaLW cures undead/hurts living). That's why it has to stipulate in the paladin description that it acts the same way, because it isn't obvious.

Also note, this is NOT the only way that a lich or death knight can heal themselves. undead with an INT score heal at the same rate that mortals do.
DakezDarkenblood
06-30-03, 04:29 PM Undead are more powerful in my campaign than in the core, which is why I allow it. By the rule Willie definitely has the right interpretation.

Healing 16 hit points a day when the party you forced to retreat just blew a mass heal and got everyone 150 hit points back isn't a challenge for long.
Adrez Nesnsid
06-30-03, 06:09 PM Originally posted by Willie the Duck

Also note, this is NOT the only way that a lich or death knight can heal themselves. undead with an INT score heal at the same rate that mortals do.

Don't forget that a lich can also heal itself by destroying its own body, thus causing itself to reconstitute itself at full HP.
Joe Gold
07-01-03, 01:25 AM If it wants to wait 1d10 days.
Vegeta8472
07-01-03, 02:31 AM A demilich can cast Harm on itself at will. So, when I finally make myself a lich, I'll definately spend the time, money, and XP to become a good demilich. Sure, I'll be down to only a skull/hand/foot/whatever I choose to be down to, but I'll still have Alter Self at will as well.
Boondoggle
07-01-03, 09:43 PM Originally posted by DakezDarkenblood
It all makes sense if you dress the lich up in a tattered red leather jacket, a sequined glove, and have a dozen or two advanced zombies following him around with the leadership feat.

:rofl: :bow: :rofl:

Best joke I've seen on these boards in a while. Just be sure to keep those perform ranks maxed :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
BaalZebul 06-30-03, 08:26 AM	I'm not an experienced player and I'm not sure if this can be true but I don't know ? Now everyone knows something about lich touch. There are 2 opportunities. One of them is the famous paralysing touch and the second one is his normal touch attack that deals 1d8+5 negative energy to any living creature. So when I read through the Cure or any of the cleric's healing spells I saw that it channels positive energy that heals any living creatures and inflict spell that channels negative energy that heals undeads. If negative energy can heal undeads, a lich might touch himself and channel this energy that heals him 1d8+5 damage. Am I wrong ?
DakezDarkenblood 06-30-03, 10:13 AM	I allow it in my games... realistically, it's the only way liches and death knights have to heal. However, the key word may be interpretted as 'living' in that description. The lich is not alive, and therefore cannot be a target of the touch attack.
lukelightning 06-30-03, 10:18 AM	Great. Now you made me imagine liches touching themselves. Like that Divinyl's song... "I don't want anybody else/when I take some damage I touch myself...."
DakezDarkenblood 06-30-03, 10:23 AM	It all makes sense if you dress the lich up in a tattered red leather jacket, a sequined glove, and have a dozen or two advanced zombies following him around with the leadership feat.
Adrez Nesnsid 06-30-03, 11:13 AM	Originally posted by lukelightning Great. Now you made me imagine liches touching themselves. Like that Divinyl's song... "I don't want anybody else/when I take some damage I touch myself...." HA HA HA Ha-Ha-HA-HA :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Lord Arijani of Sri Raji 06-30-03, 11:17 AM	But I think there is a difference here: while the cleric is channeling positive energy through a prepared spell, the lich is channeling negative energy from his own "negative energy dweomer", if I can call it this way. I mean, he would be channeling negative energy from his own "undead source" to heal his own body. I believe one thing is the undead touch a living being and the damage be a consequence of the contact with raw negative energy flowing through the undead body. Another thing is to try to "short circuit" this same negative energy from the source, through the body and back to it.
Vegeta8472 06-30-03, 01:41 PM	That's kind of like putting a wire to each end of a batterie. But, doing that runs it out of a charge.
Brian.C 06-30-03, 02:49 PM	I'd say the lich could do it, but there should be a limit to the number of times it can. - Brian
Willie the Duck 06-30-03, 04:05 PM	By the rules, no. Negative energy does not always cure undead, just as positive energy doesn't always cure mortals. There are some positive energy effects which cause things to glow, not be healed. Curative Spells (and curative spells only), work in the fashion described (i.e. CLW cures the living/ hurts undead, CaLW cures undead/hurts living). That's why it has to stipulate in the paladin description that it acts the same way, because it isn't obvious. Also note, this is NOT the only way that a lich or death knight can heal themselves. undead with an INT score heal at the same rate that mortals do.
DakezDarkenblood 06-30-03, 04:29 PM	Undead are more powerful in my campaign than in the core, which is why I allow it. By the rule Willie definitely has the right interpretation. Healing 16 hit points a day when the party you forced to retreat just blew a mass heal and got everyone 150 hit points back isn't a challenge for long.
Adrez Nesnsid 06-30-03, 06:09 PM	Originally posted by Willie the Duck Also note, this is NOT the only way that a lich or death knight can heal themselves. undead with an INT score heal at the same rate that mortals do. Don't forget that a lich can also heal itself by destroying its own body, thus causing itself to reconstitute itself at full HP.
Joe Gold 07-01-03, 01:25 AM	If it wants to wait 1d10 days.
Vegeta8472 07-01-03, 02:31 AM	A demilich can cast Harm on itself at will. So, when I finally make myself a lich, I'll definately spend the time, money, and XP to become a good demilich. Sure, I'll be down to only a skull/hand/foot/whatever I choose to be down to, but I'll still have Alter Self at will as well.
Boondoggle 07-01-03, 09:43 PM	Originally posted by DakezDarkenblood It all makes sense if you dress the lich up in a tattered red leather jacket, a sequined glove, and have a dozen or two advanced zombies following him around with the leadership feat. :rofl: :bow: :rofl: Best joke I've seen on these boards in a while. Just be sure to keep those perform ranks maxed :)