A Vampire and his Coffin: Can He Obtain a New One? [Archive] - Wizards Community

A Vampire and his Coffin: Can He Obtain a New One? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ksbsnowowl
06-01-07, 01:56 PM Popular myth insinuates that a Vampire's coffin is special, that it has a connection to the unholy earth he was buried in. This would indicate that the coffin is unique, and cannot be replaced by just any coffin.

However, the vampire description doesn’t even state that a newly-made vampire must be buried. It mentions that a Vampire Spawn rises 1d4 days after burial, but makes no mention of how long it takes a new true vampire to arise after he has been blood-drained.

As for the coffin, it merely states that when reduced to 0 HP’s, the vampire must reach his “coffin home” within 2 hours.

So, can a vampire obtain a new, safe coffin if his first is lost or destroyed? Can he have multiple coffins?
Return of the Flumph
06-01-07, 01:58 PM Whether the rules permit it or not, my first DM certainly thought so. One of the first miniadventures I played in involved preventing a newborn vampire from making a coffin for himself until dawn.
Thiez
06-01-07, 02:37 PM Whether the rules permit it or not, my first DM certainly thought so. One of the first miniadventures I played in involved preventing a newborn vampire from making a coffin for himself until dawn.

That's quite a good idea for an adventure. Cool DM! :)
ksbsnowowl
06-07-07, 07:01 AM Any actual thoughts on what the rules actually allow?

(Not to dis the story time; that is a very cool adventure idea)
Radijs
06-07-07, 08:56 AM The rules are completely silent on this whole coffin deal.

So its completely up to the DM.
phoen777
06-07-07, 08:56 PM Agreed, the rules say nothing, so it's up to the DM. As a DM, however, I can't help but give my thoughts, whether they're wanted or not. :)

I would say that the vampire can get a new coffin if his is destroyed, but not if it is lost, as he's still tied to it then. But creating a new coffin shouldn't be as easy for a vamp as just making a wood box full of dirt. I think that he should have to get a coffin, then go back to the grave he was originally buried in and get new dirt. If that's not possible (the original grave may have been compromised; perhaps the Tarrasque ate the town, graveyard and all, or maybe the earth of the cemetary was hallowed, sanctified, consecrated, and soaked in holy water) then the vampire has to make a new grave for himself. To do this, he climbs into the coffin and has his minions bury it in traditional funeral fashion (i.e. six feet down, with some sort of grave marker) then wait 24 hours for his unholy taint to affect the soil, at which time the minions dig him back up and he can finish the process by putting some of the dirt from his new grave in the coffin.

Obviously these are not official rules, just something I came up with that makes sense to me. Whether that's because it's actually a good idea, or because I'm using some kind of warped logic, I don't know. Personally I hope it's both. ;)
ksbsnowowl
06-07-07, 10:05 PM Those are excellent suggestions, phoen. Thank you.

The reason I ask is because in one of the published modules, it is suggested that a vamp BBEG can just use any coffin if he is reduced to 0 HP's (and thus in gaseous form and under a 2 hour limit to return to "his coffin home."
kalstrand
06-07-07, 10:17 PM I would agree with phoen777 because of Dracula. If you read it you will see Dracula prepares many coffins by filling them with dirt from his castle so he can disperse them to multiple properties around the world.

I would allow the vampire to make as many coffins as he chooses and if for some reason his grave is destroyed I would allow him to make a new grave in a fashion similar to pheon777's idea.
Millennium
06-08-07, 09:21 AM I'd rule that a vampire who currently has no coffin (because he never had one in the first place, or because he had one but it was destroyed) can establish a new one, but he may only have one active coffin at a time. The process requires 24 hours and dirt from the vampire's grave. Some vampires prepare coffins in advance by filling them with grave dirt; aside from saving time (which may be in short supply), it also guards against the grave being destroyed by removing the dirt before that can happen.

If a vampire's grave is destroyed he can prepare a new one, but this is a major inconvenience and risk. I require funereal rites similar to phoen777's, but the vampire must then rest in the grave for a year and a day, during which time it is helpless.

There are several schools of thought among vampires concerning how to deal with this weakness. Many of the oldest vampires go to great lengths to keep their graves from being destroyed, setting up permanent guards and fortifications and often building their homes around their own graves. Some vampires prefer to focus their resources elsewhere, however; they obscure the location of their graves, but don't set up a guard, and then if they do need to set up a new grave then they only keep it guarded while they're resting. A few vampires, mostly relatively modern ones, don't even bother establishing new graves; they merely keep a supply of coffins under heavy guard or well hidden and trust their own abilities to keep from needing to exhaust that supply.
HuManBing
06-08-07, 09:24 AM This would have to be a house rule, though, right? From what I've read on this board and elsewhere, popular opinion seems to be that if it's not in the RAW, then it's not canon (even if it makes sense for it to be).
420
06-08-07, 02:03 PM Actually, the vampire myth regarding coffins is that the coffin contains a bit of earth from the vampire's burial site (or simply from the vampire's homeland). The idea of using the coffin is probably just convenience or, considering a vampire's obsessive compulsive streak, some kind of twisted nostalgia.

As long as the vampire is touching this soil it doesn't matter where it rests.

However, the coffin has two special advantages over, say, a bed for instance. First, it has a lid, in case some sunlight sneaks into the room somehow. Second, unlike most beds, a coffin is container-like (less likely to lose precious soil) and has handles so it can be quickly moved.

Also, it is quite common to send coffins on long trips (even today) so it's an extremely convenient way for a vampire to travel incognito.

-420
ksbsnowowl
06-08-07, 06:26 PM Actually, the vampire myth regarding coffins is that the coffin contains a bit of earth from the vampire's burial site (or simply from the vampire's homeland).Now this idea I like, as the vampire in question was never buried at a burial site (he was turned into a vampire while alone in the bowels of a large city; no friends around to bury him before his reappearance 2 days later), and it allows him to follow the "prescribed" escape plan. He will always carry a 5-pound sack of his homeland, wherever he goes.
MCage
06-09-07, 05:18 PM I posted a very similar question a while back on what if a vampire wanted multiple coffins, the thing i ended up useing is a vampire can have a total ammount of coffins equal to his Cha mod (minimum of 1)
turalisj
06-09-07, 10:06 PM Lol. Dracula having 20+ coffins in everycountry :P
MCage
07-07-07, 06:37 PM yeah just good luck getting to the one over the mountain pass in the 2 hour limit
KillerVole
07-08-07, 01:18 AM As has been stated, Dracula had many coffins, each containing dirt from his homeland. It was also strongly implied that he could shelter in the coffins of his spawn. If you let your vampires do either of those things, they will become more survivable.
RobbyPants
07-12-07, 03:21 PM I would agree with phoen777 because of Dracula. If you read it you will see Dracula prepares many coffins by filling them with dirt from his castle so he can disperse them to multiple properties around the world.

I would allow the vampire to make as many coffins as he chooses and if for some reason his grave is destroyed I would allow him to make a new grave in a fashion similar to pheon777's idea.
This is similar to what I do and for the same reasons. One of the things I hate about the MM version is that they're silent on so many things (coffins, rest, feeding, etc...). Hence, my remake.
dknight100
07-12-07, 09:47 PM On a side note:
If you want to make a real Dracula like vampire, remove the death by sunlight - by daylight iirc (its been a while since I read Dracula) he just doesn't have his powers, rather than incendiary saiyan mode.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ksbsnowowl 06-01-07, 01:56 PM	Popular myth insinuates that a Vampire's coffin is special, that it has a connection to the unholy earth he was buried in. This would indicate that the coffin is unique, and cannot be replaced by just any coffin. However, the vampire description doesn’t even state that a newly-made vampire must be buried. It mentions that a Vampire Spawn rises 1d4 days after burial, but makes no mention of how long it takes a new true vampire to arise after he has been blood-drained. As for the coffin, it merely states that when reduced to 0 HP’s, the vampire must reach his “coffin home” within 2 hours. So, can a vampire obtain a new, safe coffin if his first is lost or destroyed? Can he have multiple coffins?
Return of the Flumph 06-01-07, 01:58 PM	Whether the rules permit it or not, my first DM certainly thought so. One of the first miniadventures I played in involved preventing a newborn vampire from making a coffin for himself until dawn.
Thiez 06-01-07, 02:37 PM	Whether the rules permit it or not, my first DM certainly thought so. One of the first miniadventures I played in involved preventing a newborn vampire from making a coffin for himself until dawn. That's quite a good idea for an adventure. Cool DM! :)
ksbsnowowl 06-07-07, 07:01 AM	Any actual thoughts on what the rules actually allow? (Not to dis the story time; that is a very cool adventure idea)
Radijs 06-07-07, 08:56 AM	The rules are completely silent on this whole coffin deal. So its completely up to the DM.
phoen777 06-07-07, 08:56 PM	Agreed, the rules say nothing, so it's up to the DM. As a DM, however, I can't help but give my thoughts, whether they're wanted or not. :) I would say that the vampire can get a new coffin if his is destroyed, but not if it is lost, as he's still tied to it then. But creating a new coffin shouldn't be as easy for a vamp as just making a wood box full of dirt. I think that he should have to get a coffin, then go back to the grave he was originally buried in and get new dirt. If that's not possible (the original grave may have been compromised; perhaps the Tarrasque ate the town, graveyard and all, or maybe the earth of the cemetary was hallowed, sanctified, consecrated, and soaked in holy water) then the vampire has to make a new grave for himself. To do this, he climbs into the coffin and has his minions bury it in traditional funeral fashion (i.e. six feet down, with some sort of grave marker) then wait 24 hours for his unholy taint to affect the soil, at which time the minions dig him back up and he can finish the process by putting some of the dirt from his new grave in the coffin. Obviously these are not official rules, just something I came up with that makes sense to me. Whether that's because it's actually a good idea, or because I'm using some kind of warped logic, I don't know. Personally I hope it's both. ;)
ksbsnowowl 06-07-07, 10:05 PM	Those are excellent suggestions, phoen. Thank you. The reason I ask is because in one of the published modules, it is suggested that a vamp BBEG can just use any coffin if he is reduced to 0 HP's (and thus in gaseous form and under a 2 hour limit to return to "his coffin home."
kalstrand 06-07-07, 10:17 PM	I would agree with phoen777 because of Dracula. If you read it you will see Dracula prepares many coffins by filling them with dirt from his castle so he can disperse them to multiple properties around the world. I would allow the vampire to make as many coffins as he chooses and if for some reason his grave is destroyed I would allow him to make a new grave in a fashion similar to pheon777's idea.
Millennium 06-08-07, 09:21 AM	I'd rule that a vampire who currently has no coffin (because he never had one in the first place, or because he had one but it was destroyed) can establish a new one, but he may only have one active coffin at a time. The process requires 24 hours and dirt from the vampire's grave. Some vampires prepare coffins in advance by filling them with grave dirt; aside from saving time (which may be in short supply), it also guards against the grave being destroyed by removing the dirt before that can happen. If a vampire's grave is destroyed he can prepare a new one, but this is a major inconvenience and risk. I require funereal rites similar to phoen777's, but the vampire must then rest in the grave for a year and a day, during which time it is helpless. There are several schools of thought among vampires concerning how to deal with this weakness. Many of the oldest vampires go to great lengths to keep their graves from being destroyed, setting up permanent guards and fortifications and often building their homes around their own graves. Some vampires prefer to focus their resources elsewhere, however; they obscure the location of their graves, but don't set up a guard, and then if they do need to set up a new grave then they only keep it guarded while they're resting. A few vampires, mostly relatively modern ones, don't even bother establishing new graves; they merely keep a supply of coffins under heavy guard or well hidden and trust their own abilities to keep from needing to exhaust that supply.
HuManBing 06-08-07, 09:24 AM	This would have to be a house rule, though, right? From what I've read on this board and elsewhere, popular opinion seems to be that if it's not in the RAW, then it's not canon (even if it makes sense for it to be).
420 06-08-07, 02:03 PM	Actually, the vampire myth regarding coffins is that the coffin contains a bit of earth from the vampire's burial site (or simply from the vampire's homeland). The idea of using the coffin is probably just convenience or, considering a vampire's obsessive compulsive streak, some kind of twisted nostalgia. As long as the vampire is touching this soil it doesn't matter where it rests. However, the coffin has two special advantages over, say, a bed for instance. First, it has a lid, in case some sunlight sneaks into the room somehow. Second, unlike most beds, a coffin is container-like (less likely to lose precious soil) and has handles so it can be quickly moved. Also, it is quite common to send coffins on long trips (even today) so it's an extremely convenient way for a vampire to travel incognito. -420
ksbsnowowl 06-08-07, 06:26 PM	Actually, the vampire myth regarding coffins is that the coffin contains a bit of earth from the vampire's burial site (or simply from the vampire's homeland).Now this idea I like, as the vampire in question was never buried at a burial site (he was turned into a vampire while alone in the bowels of a large city; no friends around to bury him before his reappearance 2 days later), and it allows him to follow the "prescribed" escape plan. He will always carry a 5-pound sack of his homeland, wherever he goes.
MCage 06-09-07, 05:18 PM	I posted a very similar question a while back on what if a vampire wanted multiple coffins, the thing i ended up useing is a vampire can have a total ammount of coffins equal to his Cha mod (minimum of 1)
turalisj 06-09-07, 10:06 PM	Lol. Dracula having 20+ coffins in everycountry :P
MCage 07-07-07, 06:37 PM	yeah just good luck getting to the one over the mountain pass in the 2 hour limit
KillerVole 07-08-07, 01:18 AM	As has been stated, Dracula had many coffins, each containing dirt from his homeland. It was also strongly implied that he could shelter in the coffins of his spawn. If you let your vampires do either of those things, they will become more survivable.
RobbyPants 07-12-07, 03:21 PM	I would agree with phoen777 because of Dracula. If you read it you will see Dracula prepares many coffins by filling them with dirt from his castle so he can disperse them to multiple properties around the world. I would allow the vampire to make as many coffins as he chooses and if for some reason his grave is destroyed I would allow him to make a new grave in a fashion similar to pheon777's idea. This is similar to what I do and for the same reasons. One of the things I hate about the MM version is that they're silent on so many things (coffins, rest, feeding, etc...). Hence, my remake.
dknight100 07-12-07, 09:47 PM	On a side note: If you want to make a real Dracula like vampire, remove the death by sunlight - by daylight iirc (its been a while since I read Dracula) he just doesn't have his powers, rather than incendiary saiyan mode.