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| khyron114403-08-07, 09:15 PM | Most of my rulebooks are 3.0, so I might not be up to date on what exactly is legal, but I've been playing around with the template system and found a way to apply five templates to one creature that changes a CR 4 monster into a CR 12 monster by the end. And it's all legal by the rules as written as far as I know. We start with a Dire Horse from the Monster Manual 2, a CR 4 monster. Its size is Large and its type is Animal. We then apply the Warbeast Template also from the Monster Manual 2. What you get is this: Dire Horse of War Large Animal Hit Dice: 9d8 +63 Initiative: +1 Speed: 70 ft. AC: 16 (-1 Size, +1 Dex, +6 Natural) Attacks: 2 hooves +12 Melee and Bite +7 Melee Damage: Hoof 1d6+7, Bite 1d4+3 Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 10 ft./ 5 ft. Special Attacks: - Special Qualities: Low-light Vision, Scent, Combative Mount Saves: Fort +13, Ref +7, Will +9 Abilities: Str 25, Dex 13, Con 25, Int 2, Wis 17, Cha 11 Skills: Listen +10 Spot +10 Climate/Terrain: Any Land Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 5 Treasure: None Alignment: Always Neutral Next apply the Anarchic Template from Manual of the Planes. You could also go with the Axiomatic Template, Celestial Template, or Fiendish Template, if you prefer. You end up with this: Anarchic Dire Horse of War Large Magical Beast Hit Dice: 9d8 +63 Initiative: +1 Speed: 70 ft. AC: 16 (-1 Size, +1 Dex, +6 Natural) Attacks: 2 hooves +12 Melee and Bite +7 Melee Damage: Hoof 1d6+7, Bite 1d4+3 Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 10 ft./ 5 ft. Special Attacks: Smite Law Special Qualities: Low-light Vision, Scent, Combative Mount, Darkvison 60 ft., Fast Healing 3, Immune to Polymorph and Petrification, Acid, Cold, Electricty, Fire, and Sonic Resistance 5 Saves: Fort +13, Ref +7, Will +9 Abilities: Str 25, Dex 13, Con 25, Int 3, Wis 17, Cha 11 Skills: Listen +10 Spot +10 Climate/Terrain: Any Land and underground Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 7 Treasure: None Alignment: Always Chaotic Neutral Next add the Phrenic template from Expanded Psionics Handbook. You Get: Phrenic Anarchic Dire Horse of War Large Magical Beast (Psionic) Hit Dice: 9d8 +63 Initiative: +1 Speed: 70 ft. AC: 16 (-1 Size, +1 Dex, +6 Natural) Attacks: 2 hooves +12 Melee and Bite +7 Melee Damage: Hoof 1d6+7, Bite 1d4+3 Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 10 ft./ 5 ft. Special Attacks: Smite Law, Psi-Like Abilities Special Qualities: Low-light Vision, Scent, Combative Mount, Darkvison 60 ft., Fast Healing 3, Immune to Polymorph and Petrification, Acid, Cold, Electricty, Fire, and Sonic Resistance 5, Power Resistance 19, Naturally Psionic Saves: Fort +13, Ref +7, Will +10 Abilities: Str 25, Dex 13, Con 25, Int 5, Wis 19, Cha 13 Skills: Listen +11 Spot +11 Climate/Terrain: Any Land and underground Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 9 Treasure: None Alignment: Always Chaotic Neutral Psi-Like Abilities: 3/ day Defensive Precognition, 1/ day Force Screen, 3/ day Empty Mind, 3/ day Mind Thrust, 1/ day Body Adjustment, 1/ day Brain Lock, 1/ day Aversion, 1/ day Blast, 3/ day Intellect Fortress, 1/ day Psychic Crush Next add the Monster of Legend Template from Monster Manual 2. You get: Phrenic Anarchic Dire Horse of War of Legend Large Outsider (Psionic) Hit Dice: 9d8 +108 Initiative: +8 Speed: 70 ft. AC: 24 (-1 Size, +4 Dex, +11 Natural) Attacks: 2 hooves +17 Melee and Bite +15 Melee Damage: Hoof 1d6+12, Bite 1d8+6 Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 10 ft./ 5 ft. Special Attacks: Smite Law, Psi-Like Abilities, Frightful Presence Special Qualities: Low-light Vision, Scent, Combative Mount, Darkvison 60 ft., Fast Healing 3, Immune to Polymorph and Petrification, Acid, Cold, Electricty, Fire, and Sonic Resistance 5, Power Resistance 19, Naturally Psionic, Damage Reduction 10/+1, Regrow Limbs Saves: Fort +21, Ref +13, Will +14 Abilities: Str 35, Dex 19, Con 35, Int 7, Wis 21, Cha 17 Skills: Listen +12 Spot +12 Climate/Terrain: Any Land and underground Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 11 Treasure: None Alignment: Always Chaotic Neutral Psi-Like Abilities: 3/ day Defensive Precognition, 1/ day Force Screen, 3/ day Empty Mind, 3/ day Mind Thrust, 1/ day Body Adjustment, 1/ day Brain Lock, 1/ day Aversion, 1/ day Blast, 3/ day Intellect Fortress, 1/ day Psychic Crush Finally add the half-X template of your choice from the Monster Manual. I went with Half-Celestial because it adds to all attributes, including Wis. Doing that, you get: Half-Celestial Phrenic Anarchic Dire Horse of War of Legend Large Outsider (Psionic) Hit Dice: 9d8 +126 Initiative: +8 Speed: 70 ft. AC: 26 (-1 Size, +5 Dex, +12 Natural) Attacks: 2 hooves +19 Melee and Bite +17 Melee Damage: Hoof 1d6+14, Bite 1d8+7 Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 10 ft./ 5 ft. Special Attacks: Smite Law, Psi-Like Abilities, Frightful Presence, Spell-Like Abilities Special Qualities: Low-light Vision, Scent, Combative Mount, Darkvison 60 ft., Fast Healing 3, Immune to Polymorph and Petrification, Fire, and Sonic Resistance 5, Power Resistance 19, Naturally Psionic, Damage Reduction 10/+1, Regrow Limbs, Immune to Acid, Cold, Disease, adn Electricity, +4 racial bonus to Fort saves vs. Poison Saves: Fort +23, Ref +14, Will +16 Abilities: Str 39, Dex 21, Con 39, Int 9, Wis 25, Cha 21 Skills: Listen +14 Spot +14 Climate/Terrain: Any Land and underground Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 12 Treasure: None Alignment: Always Chaotic Good Psi-Like Abilities: 3/ day Defensive Precognition, 1/ day Force Screen, 3/ day Empty Mind, 3/ day Mind Thrust, 1/ day Body Adjustment, 1/ day Brain Lock, 1/ day Aversion, 1/ day Blast, 3/ day Intellect Fortress, 1/ day Psychic Crush Spell-Like Abilities: 3/ day Protection from Evil, 1/ day Bless, 1/ day Aid, 1/ day Detect Evil, 1/ day Cure Serious Wounds, 1/ day Neutralize Poison, 1/ day Holy Smite, 1/ day Remove Disease, 1/ day Dispel Evil |
| Angelflesh03-08-07, 10:32 PM | I totally love templates, but the problem with applying many of them is that you usually end up with a high CR monster with little Hp. |
| epifreak03-08-07, 10:37 PM | Which is exactly why you abuse them for stuff like polymorph ;) The outlined horse monstrosity is still 9HD, thus making it disproportionately more useful than its HD would indicate for polymorph. For more fun, hit the epic level handbook and pick out something where the CR > HD. Add as many templates as you can think of legally. Watch the others cry. Disclaimer: not responsible for hammer-gun wounds coming as a direct result of taking my (admittedly) bad advice. |
| khyron114403-09-07, 01:50 PM | I totally love templates, but the problem with applying many of them is that you usually end up with a high CR monster with little Hp. True, but I don't think that 126 Hp from Con plus 9d8 from HD is too bad for a CR 13 monster. |
| khyron114403-10-07, 10:51 PM | True, but I don't think that 126 Hp from Con plus 9d8 from HD is too bad for a CR 13 monster. I was looking through my Monster Manual after I posted that last night and found out the Beholder has CR of 13 and quite noticably fewer HP on average than the final Half-Celestail Phrenic Anarchic Dire Horse of War of Legend. Although the Beholder's got better offensive spell-like abilities, my horse probably has more spell-like abilities total. |
| hreslingozer03-11-07, 04:19 AM | Yes, but the beholder has AntiMagic Cone and natural flight. It also has the ability to fire off multiple save or die spells -- in a single round, then activate its cone! Good luck matching that. Honestly, our party of 12th level adveturers would clean this thing's clock (although it would use up some firepower). Our fighter alone would dish out almost enough damage in the first round (against that average AC) to possibly take it down. And our sorcerer would have a field day once it figured out its relatively low REF save, and fire resist 5! (Max fireball, fireball, etc.) and how about empowered scorching ray against that low touch AC, or an empowered Ray of Enfeeblement). With its low hit dice, the Knowledge checks to figure out its weaknesses would be relatively easy. All those special abilities are great, but it can only use 1 a round. And the DC's are low, most of our party would easily make saves against it. Psychic Crush would be the one worry the fighter would have, but would still make his save over 50% of the time. Compare your templated creature with an Ice Devil (from the SRD): ICE DEVIL (GELUGON) Large Outsider (Evil, Extraplanar, Lawful) Hit Dice: 14d8+84 (147 hp) Initiative: +5 Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares) Armor Class: 32 (–1 size, +5 Dex, +18 natural) touch 14, flat-footed 27 Base Attack/Grapple: +14/+24 Attack: Spear +20 melee (2d6+9/x3 plus slow) or claw +19 melee (1d10+6) Full Attack: Spear +20/+15/+10 melee (2d6+9/x3 plus slow) and bite +14 melee (2d6+3) and tail +14 melee (3d6+3 plus slow); or 2 claws +19 melee (1d10+6) and bite +14 melee (2d6+3) and tail +14 melee (3d6+3 plus slow) Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. Special Attacks: Fear aura, slow, spell-like abilities, summon devil Special Qualities: Damage reduction 10/good, darkvision 60 ft., immunity to fire and poison, resistance to acid 10 and cold 10, regeneration 5, see in darkness, spell resistance 25, telepathy 100 ft. Saves: Fort +15, Ref +14, Will +15 Abilities: Str 23, Dex 21, Con 23, Int 22, Wis 22, Cha 20 Skills: Bluff +22, Climb +23, Concentration +23, Diplomacy +9, Disguise +5 (+7 acting), Intimidate +24, Jump +27, Knowledge (any three) +23, Listen +25, Move Silently +22, Search +23, Sense Motive +23, Spellcraft +23, Spot +25, Survival +6 (+8 following tracks) Feats: Alertness, Cleave, Combat Reflexes, Power Attack, Weapon Focus (spear) Environment: A lawful evil-aligned plane Organization: Solitary, team (2–4), squad (6–10), or troupe (1–2 ice devils, 7–12 bearded devils, and 1–4 bone devils) Challenge Rating: 13 Treasure: Standard coins; double goods; standard items Alignment: Always lawful evil Advancement: 15–28 HD (Large); 29–42 HD (Huge) Level Adjustment: — An ice devil is about 12 feet tall and weighs about 700 pounds. Combat An ice devil prefers to fight only when doing so serves its mission, but it never hesitates to attack when it deems a battle necessary—or likely to end in its victory. An ice devil’s natural weapons, as well as any weapons it wields, are treated as evil-aligned and lawful-aligned for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. Fear Aura (Su): An ice devil can radiate a 10-foot-radius fear aura as a free action. A creature in the area must succeed on a DC 22 Will save or be affected as though by a fear spell (caster level 13th). A creature that successfully saves cannot be affected again by the same ice devil’s aura for 24 hours. Other devils are immune to the aura. The save DC is Charisma-based. Slow (Su): A hit from an ice devil’s tail or spear induces numbing cold. The opponent must succeed on a DC 23 Fortitude save or be affected as though by a slow spell for 1d6 rounds. The save DC is Constitution-based. Spell-Like Abilities: At will—cone of cold (DC 20), fly, ice storm (DC 19), greater teleport (self plus 50 pounds of objects only), persistent image (DC 20), unholy aura (DC 23), wall of ice (DC 19). Caster level 13th. The save DCs are Charisma-based. Summon Devil (Sp): Once per day an ice devil can attempt to summon 2d10 lemures or 1d6 bearded devils, 2d4 bone devils with a 50% chance of success, or another ice devil with a 20% chance of success. This ability is the equivalent of a 4th-level spell. Regeneration (Ex): An ice devil takes normal damage from good-aligned weapons and from spells or effects with the good descriptor. Overall, they are pretty similar in power. So at best, you've bought yourself about 1 CR using templates. |
| Prime3203-11-07, 03:37 PM | Don't forget the fiendish half-dragon vampiric natural lycanthropic snail. :D Tremble at my illogical glory! |
| Secrets Untold03-11-07, 06:53 PM | Add multi-headed (learnean) in there somewhere. Half-dragon-hydra-werewolf-snail of evil! |