An intelligent construct? [Archive] - Wizards Community

An intelligent construct? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
turalisj
07-12-05, 05:44 PM Are there any templates to make a normal construct, such as an iron golem, into an itelligent creature that can take class levels and such? If so, what is the book it is in?

Thanks,
Tualisj
Goodly_Knight
07-12-05, 07:11 PM Not sure, but aren't warforged constructs?
Might want to check the ebboron campaign setting book. You don't need to buy it, just go to the local bookstore, it may be of some use.
urial angel of death
07-12-05, 07:21 PM in savage species there is the awaken construct spell and there is also a template that makes them fleshy and living
turalisj
07-12-05, 09:00 PM ok. too bad my local library doesn't have any dnd books...
obrysii
07-13-05, 12:22 AM Awaken Construct would work. It's like Awaken, but for humanoid-shaped Constructs.
Slagger the Chuul
07-13-05, 11:49 AM There's only one problem with using awaken construct for golems (as opposed to constructs in general); immunity to magic. Although Savage Species does include a monster class entry for flesh golems, it doesn't go so far as to explain exactly how they become intelligent.
obrysii
07-13-05, 12:44 PM I would rule that it bypasses the Golem's magical immunity.

I'd also rule that it works on Animated Objects and makes them always animated...as it makes sense: you're burning 5,000xp to awaken one of these things!
Seraph of Babel
07-13-05, 02:17 PM The dread golem template (d20 Ravenloft) also makes a construct intelligent.

Also, Dragon #327 (p.73) has a rudimentary intelligence option for crafting constructs. CL12+, base cost +8k gp, CR +0 (up to 11HD) or +1 (12-23HD) or +2 (24+HD). THe construct gains Int = 1/2 caster level, getting skills and feats according to its HD.
Cosmosis
07-13-05, 06:01 PM The spells awaken construct and incarnate construct, both from Savage Species, turn mindless constructs into living, thinking creatures. I have no idea how the two spells are distinguished from each other.
I'm pretty certain that awakened constructs lose all supernatural and spell-like abilities, including magic immunity. And they have a negative level adjustment.
Goodly_Knight
07-13-05, 06:51 PM Libraries rarely have DnD books, i was thinking a schulers or barnes and nobel... :P
obrysii
07-13-05, 09:22 PM The spells awaken construct and incarnate construct, both from Savage Species, turn mindless constructs into living, thinking creatures. I have no idea how the two spells are distinguished from each other.
I'm pretty certain that awakened constructs lose all supernatural and spell-like abilities, including magic immunity. And they have a negative level adjustment.

Awaken Construct does just that: it awakens a construct

Incarnate Construct applies a template, weakening the construct significantly.
Slagger the Chuul
07-14-05, 04:07 AM I'd also rule that it works on Animated Objects and makes them always animated...as it makes sense: you're burning 5,000xp to awaken one of these things!

The spell specifically covers those:
The spell doesn't work on constructs that are only constructs temporarily (such as objects affected by an animate objects spell).

It's pretty clear about this.
turalisj
07-14-05, 04:19 AM well, then can someone pm me the spell/template?
obrysii
07-14-05, 11:26 AM It's pretty clear about this.

That's kind of what I said, isn't it?

However, I said I think it should cover animated objects because it's a 9th level spell and you have to burn 5,000xp. That's how much Wish costs. Animated Objects aren't even as powerful as some (most) golems, so long as you don't do something that just screams 'cheese' (such as "Oh, I cast it on my psionically hardened magically reenforced obdurium statue of a man in a chariot").

You can't even animate a Colossal animated object until you have 32 caster levels.
Slagger the Chuul
07-14-05, 12:51 PM That's kind of what I said, isn't it?

However, I said I think it should cover animated objects because it's a 9th level spell and you have to burn 5,000xp.

You said you'd rule it that way, which isn't quite the same thing. I agree that it wouldn't be a problem for most animated objects, but they cover such a broad range of possibilities that its almost asking for exploitation.

The most dangerous animated objects are made out of foil.
obrysii
07-14-05, 01:15 PM You said you'd rule it that way, which isn't quite the same thing. I agree that it wouldn't be a problem for most animated objects, but they cover such a broad range of possibilities that its almost asking for exploitation.

Ah, ok. And yes, that's why I love animated objects so much. However, the spell does state "humanoid-shaped" constructs, and so that does limit what you can Awaken (I suppose it makes some sense...it disallows you from Awakening a castle, or something like that...although that'd be neat).

The most dangerous animated objects are made out of foil.

How so? Sure, it can bind and fly...but Hardness 1, if that.
heartripper
07-14-05, 05:36 PM don't know if this hasn't been posted but, just make a maug from fiend folio!, oh and I think you can make an incarnate.
obrysii
07-15-05, 01:00 AM don't know if this hasn't been posted but, just make a maug from fiend folio!, oh and I think you can make an incarnate.

The maug is pretty nice...especially if you've got Wands of Repair Light Damage.

Edit: I'm dumb and misunderstood.
VampiricBloodlustNemesis
07-15-05, 11:58 AM As I have mentioned to some people in my other posts, I possess a book called the Advanced Bestiary from Green Ronin Publishing Co. from the D20 system. It has a template known as the lifespark construct which is a great asset to significantly increasing the minds of constructs.
Slagger the Chuul
07-15-05, 01:10 PM How so? Sure, it can bind and fly...but Hardness 1, if that.

Hardness is based on the material, not how thick it is (just D&D weirdness). Make yourself a Large humanoid cutout from adamantine foil and you've got an animated object that can blind, constrict, fly (clumsily) and trample, with hardness 20 and improved speed from having legs.

Then you awaken it and call it "Flat Stanley". :)

don't know if this hasn't been posted but, just make a maug from fiend folio!, oh and I think you can make an incarnate.

I've tried the maug; it was a good lesson in how much it sucks to not get any benefit from healing spells. The warforged have it easy by comparison.
mvincent
07-15-05, 01:59 PM I said I think it should cover animated objectsA reasonable RAW interpretation might be to allow it to affect Animated objects made permanent by the Permanency spell.
gerbilattack
07-15-05, 02:26 PM :teach: Awaken: Constucts gain 3d6 int, wis, and cha...
Incarnate: they become a humanoid roughly the same size and shape, but any weapon arms bocome normal arms, with appropriate digits...
:twitch:

(what i'd do is play a mithril constuct... because i can) approx 50,000 gp no golem powers, but no ECL20 either... (6hd 6la) approx
____________
All may be fair in love and war, but here, there's RULES...
obrysii
07-15-05, 02:38 PM Hardness is based on the material, not how thick it is (just D&D weirdness). Make yourself a Large humanoid cutout from adamantine foil and you've got an animated object that can blind, constrict, fly (clumsily) and trample, with hardness 20 and improved speed from having legs.

Then you awaken it and call it "Flat Stanley". :)

That scares me.

I must send it after my party! Bahaha.
OamuTheMonk
07-15-05, 02:56 PM Theres a spell in Savage Species that allows you to permanently animate objects: Minor Servitor.
mvincent
07-15-05, 05:02 PM Awaken: Constucts gain 3d6 int, wis, and cha...Can you maximize and/or empower that?

Flat Stanley the wise
Slagger the Chuul
07-16-05, 03:35 AM You won't normally be able to do both pre-epic (since it would be the equivalent of a 10th-level spell), but awaken seems to be a perfectly valid option for Empower or Maximize if you have the spell slots for it.

Of course, awaken construct is somewhat higher in level than a normal awaken, so you'll be just that little bit further into epic levels before you can improve it.
mvincent
07-16-05, 05:37 PM You won't normally be able to do both pre-epic (since it would be the equivalent of a 10th-level spell)A rod of maximization should keep it down to pre-epic levels.
obrysii
07-16-05, 06:11 PM Sudden Maximize will also do the trick.
Slagger the Chuul
07-16-05, 07:35 PM That's what the "normally" bit is for.

Naturally, if you want both improvements to awaken construct pre-epic, you'll need a rod or Sudden feat for both Empower and Maximize.
Catra
07-16-05, 08:04 PM Or you could use soul bind , and construct an apparatus to let the soul control the construct through the gem, similar to an intelligent item ("soul blade") resurrecting its owner ('s in the DMG, look it up), only, not. Then you could have multiple constructs for multiple purposes, and as long as the gem doesn't get destroyed when the construct does, you can just make (or buy) a new construct for your entrapped soul.

Of course, it would have to be friendly to you, or it would just crush you and take your valuables.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
turalisj 07-12-05, 05:44 PM	Are there any templates to make a normal construct, such as an iron golem, into an itelligent creature that can take class levels and such? If so, what is the book it is in? Thanks, Tualisj
Goodly_Knight 07-12-05, 07:11 PM	Not sure, but aren't warforged constructs? Might want to check the ebboron campaign setting book. You don't need to buy it, just go to the local bookstore, it may be of some use.
urial angel of death 07-12-05, 07:21 PM	in savage species there is the awaken construct spell and there is also a template that makes them fleshy and living
turalisj 07-12-05, 09:00 PM	ok. too bad my local library doesn't have any dnd books...
obrysii 07-13-05, 12:22 AM	Awaken Construct would work. It's like Awaken, but for humanoid-shaped Constructs.
Slagger the Chuul 07-13-05, 11:49 AM	There's only one problem with using awaken construct for golems (as opposed to constructs in general); immunity to magic. Although Savage Species does include a monster class entry for flesh golems, it doesn't go so far as to explain exactly how they become intelligent.
obrysii 07-13-05, 12:44 PM	I would rule that it bypasses the Golem's magical immunity. I'd also rule that it works on Animated Objects and makes them always animated...as it makes sense: you're burning 5,000xp to awaken one of these things!
Seraph of Babel 07-13-05, 02:17 PM	The dread golem template (d20 Ravenloft) also makes a construct intelligent. Also, Dragon #327 (p.73) has a rudimentary intelligence option for crafting constructs. CL12+, base cost +8k gp, CR +0 (up to 11HD) or +1 (12-23HD) or +2 (24+HD). THe construct gains Int = 1/2 caster level, getting skills and feats according to its HD.
Cosmosis 07-13-05, 06:01 PM	The spells awaken construct and incarnate construct, both from Savage Species, turn mindless constructs into living, thinking creatures. I have no idea how the two spells are distinguished from each other. I'm pretty certain that awakened constructs lose all supernatural and spell-like abilities, including magic immunity. And they have a negative level adjustment.
Goodly_Knight 07-13-05, 06:51 PM	Libraries rarely have DnD books, i was thinking a schulers or barnes and nobel... :P
obrysii 07-13-05, 09:22 PM	The spells awaken construct and incarnate construct, both from Savage Species, turn mindless constructs into living, thinking creatures. I have no idea how the two spells are distinguished from each other. I'm pretty certain that awakened constructs lose all supernatural and spell-like abilities, including magic immunity. And they have a negative level adjustment. Awaken Construct does just that: it awakens a construct Incarnate Construct applies a template, weakening the construct significantly.
Slagger the Chuul 07-14-05, 04:07 AM	I'd also rule that it works on Animated Objects and makes them always animated...as it makes sense: you're burning 5,000xp to awaken one of these things! The spell specifically covers those: The spell doesn't work on constructs that are only constructs temporarily (such as objects affected by an animate objects spell). It's pretty clear about this.
turalisj 07-14-05, 04:19 AM	well, then can someone pm me the spell/template?
obrysii 07-14-05, 11:26 AM	It's pretty clear about this. That's kind of what I said, isn't it? However, I said I think it should cover animated objects because it's a 9th level spell and you have to burn 5,000xp. That's how much Wish costs. Animated Objects aren't even as powerful as some (most) golems, so long as you don't do something that just screams 'cheese' (such as "Oh, I cast it on my psionically hardened magically reenforced obdurium statue of a man in a chariot"). You can't even animate a Colossal animated object until you have 32 caster levels.
Slagger the Chuul 07-14-05, 12:51 PM	That's kind of what I said, isn't it? However, I said I think it should cover animated objects because it's a 9th level spell and you have to burn 5,000xp. You said you'd rule it that way, which isn't quite the same thing. I agree that it wouldn't be a problem for most animated objects, but they cover such a broad range of possibilities that its almost asking for exploitation. The most dangerous animated objects are made out of foil.
obrysii 07-14-05, 01:15 PM	You said you'd rule it that way, which isn't quite the same thing. I agree that it wouldn't be a problem for most animated objects, but they cover such a broad range of possibilities that its almost asking for exploitation. Ah, ok. And yes, that's why I love animated objects so much. However, the spell does state "humanoid-shaped" constructs, and so that does limit what you can Awaken (I suppose it makes some sense...it disallows you from Awakening a castle, or something like that...although that'd be neat). The most dangerous animated objects are made out of foil. How so? Sure, it can bind and fly...but Hardness 1, if that.
heartripper 07-14-05, 05:36 PM	don't know if this hasn't been posted but, just make a maug from fiend folio!, oh and I think you can make an incarnate.
obrysii 07-15-05, 01:00 AM	don't know if this hasn't been posted but, just make a maug from fiend folio!, oh and I think you can make an incarnate. The maug is pretty nice...especially if you've got Wands of Repair Light Damage. Edit: I'm dumb and misunderstood.
VampiricBloodlustNemesis 07-15-05, 11:58 AM	As I have mentioned to some people in my other posts, I possess a book called the Advanced Bestiary from Green Ronin Publishing Co. from the D20 system. It has a template known as the lifespark construct which is a great asset to significantly increasing the minds of constructs.
Slagger the Chuul 07-15-05, 01:10 PM	How so? Sure, it can bind and fly...but Hardness 1, if that. Hardness is based on the material, not how thick it is (just D&D weirdness). Make yourself a Large humanoid cutout from adamantine foil and you've got an animated object that can blind, constrict, fly (clumsily) and trample, with hardness 20 and improved speed from having legs. Then you awaken it and call it "Flat Stanley". :) don't know if this hasn't been posted but, just make a maug from fiend folio!, oh and I think you can make an incarnate. I've tried the maug; it was a good lesson in how much it sucks to not get any benefit from healing spells. The warforged have it easy by comparison.
mvincent 07-15-05, 01:59 PM	I said I think it should cover animated objectsA reasonable RAW interpretation might be to allow it to affect Animated objects made permanent by the Permanency spell.
gerbilattack 07-15-05, 02:26 PM	:teach: Awaken: Constucts gain 3d6 int, wis, and cha... Incarnate: they become a humanoid roughly the same size and shape, but any weapon arms bocome normal arms, with appropriate digits... :twitch: (what i'd do is play a mithril constuct... because i can) approx 50,000 gp no golem powers, but no ECL20 either... (6hd 6la) approx ____________ All may be fair in love and war, but here, there's RULES...
obrysii 07-15-05, 02:38 PM	Hardness is based on the material, not how thick it is (just D&D weirdness). Make yourself a Large humanoid cutout from adamantine foil and you've got an animated object that can blind, constrict, fly (clumsily) and trample, with hardness 20 and improved speed from having legs. Then you awaken it and call it "Flat Stanley". :) That scares me. I must send it after my party! Bahaha.
OamuTheMonk 07-15-05, 02:56 PM	Theres a spell in Savage Species that allows you to permanently animate objects: Minor Servitor.
mvincent 07-15-05, 05:02 PM	Awaken: Constucts gain 3d6 int, wis, and cha...Can you maximize and/or empower that? Flat Stanley the wise
Slagger the Chuul 07-16-05, 03:35 AM	You won't normally be able to do both pre-epic (since it would be the equivalent of a 10th-level spell), but awaken seems to be a perfectly valid option for Empower or Maximize if you have the spell slots for it. Of course, awaken construct is somewhat higher in level than a normal awaken, so you'll be just that little bit further into epic levels before you can improve it.
mvincent 07-16-05, 05:37 PM	You won't normally be able to do both pre-epic (since it would be the equivalent of a 10th-level spell)A rod of maximization should keep it down to pre-epic levels.
obrysii 07-16-05, 06:11 PM	Sudden Maximize will also do the trick.
Slagger the Chuul 07-16-05, 07:35 PM	That's what the "normally" bit is for. Naturally, if you want both improvements to awaken construct pre-epic, you'll need a rod or Sudden feat for both Empower and Maximize.
Catra 07-16-05, 08:04 PM	Or you could use soul bind , and construct an apparatus to let the soul control the construct through the gem, similar to an intelligent item ("soul blade") resurrecting its owner ('s in the DMG, look it up), only, not. Then you could have multiple constructs for multiple purposes, and as long as the gem doesn't get destroyed when the construct does, you can just make (or buy) a new construct for your entrapped soul. Of course, it would have to be friendly to you, or it would just crush you and take your valuables.