Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The Ethereal Wickerman 12-29-03, 06:17 PM	I had the Draconomicon for xmas and was I impressed. I was pleased about the new tide of new dragons, with their age progression tables and everything (duh!), but anyway getting to the point. Do you have any ideas for a new true, planar, etc dragon?... I was thinking of Dragons based on various monsters, mainly aberrations... Gibbering Dragon (amorphous dragon covered in eyes, fangs and horns) Dracolithid (possibly template, tentacle-faced slimy dragon) Filcher Dragon (pale, guant oddly patterned ethereal dragon) Beholderkin Dragon (oversized multieyed dragon head) Blink Dragon (small slightly-furry friendly dragon) Acid Dragon (like a big draconic digestor) Displacer Dragon (lithe, purple-scaled dragon with two tentacles) Invisible Dragon (roughly-draconic invisible sentient mass) Stench Dragon (obese, wide-mouthed, small eyed somewhat flightless dragon) Umberdrake (exoskeletoned insectile bug-like dragon) Any ideas... :angel:
Insanity 12-29-03, 10:17 PM	You may have seen this before, but it close to being your Acid and Invisible dragons in one true dragon. Gelatinous Dragon (http://www.geocities.com/the_insane_one_42/dd3e/gelatino.html) It is one that I made some time ago and had revised it and updated for v3.5. Feedback is welcome.
the Horc 12-30-03, 01:05 AM	I want to see a Titanium dragon (hardcore defence, decent offence, lacking as a spell caster as compared to other dragons)
Chachi 12-30-03, 01:37 AM	I want to see some of the other Linnorms given the ol' update, particularly the 500' long Midgard Serpent, which was (according to the flavor text) something like a direct descendant of Jormungand. Additionally, some more "exotic" dragons. - Moon dragon. - Sun dragon. - Unseelie faerie dragon. - Aeolian dragon. - Cthonic dragon. An official conversion of the greater drakes would be nice, too... And maybe some new ones? I loved the Arsalon and the Vandalraug.
thalious 12-30-03, 04:08 AM	I made up a Blackgold Dragon. Don't have its stats handy. I just averaged out is base stats, and figured out from there. Not too hard IMO. Effective bugger. I have torched quite a few PC fannies with her.
ieattrollsforbreakfast 12-30-03, 06:08 AM	I always thought a line of radioactive dragons would be cool. They would all have some sort of aura that would poison/kill/give cancer. Uranium Dragon - An large, strong dragon with well developed magical skills. Radon Dragon - A small, light dragon that lives underground. It enjoys flying through the caves with near perfect manuveravility. Plutonium Dragon - A dangerous dragon to say the least. Hot tempered and extremely skilled with evocation. Nuclear breath weapon anyone?
RavinRay 12-30-03, 05:36 PM	I've gotten the Draconomicon for myself these holidays, and from what I've read all the new new dragons, especially the extraplanar ones, should inspire al of us draco-fans to come up with new ones. So, why not post our own dragons in a thread specifically for new dragons? I've gotten my subpsionic gem dragons (jade, opal, turquoise) posted at Psionics Handbook forum, and I have five more that I'm finishing the details on (aquatic chromatic, gem and metallic dragons, druid-like jewel dragons). In the meantime, new dragons are popping up on Monster Mayhem, such as the screeching dragon and temporal drake; 2e standby's like the mist dragon are being officially converted to 3.5e (so we should expect the cloud dragon - not the storm drake which has the same nickname); and we have this news from Mark Jindra, courtesy of the Psionics Handbook forum: Originally posted by Wotc_Mark I had a few PM's asking what is on the horizon for the minds eye. Well I can't really tell you everything but I can give you an idea of what we have planned. January... I've been digging through old Dragon articles and old D&D product for material on other psionic/gem dragons so we should see a few more psionic dragons this month... February is looking like a good month to do another Sardior month... Scott tells me he has lots of material to continue expanding on the material we have already presented. MJ :cool: There we have it. So, looks like ranks of the gem dragons will swell considerably, considering that the obsidian dragon was released in January 2002 along with the Legend of Sardior. Personally, I think the chromatics and metallic should also get new species, just to balance things out. (Maybe they, like hopefully with the new gems which might be based on subpsionics, will be a subcategory to distinguish them? Subchromatic and submetallic, anyone?) If there are some old 2e dragon's you wish to see converted, well, why don't we petition Skip and company to have 'em converted. How many 2e dragon's are there, waiting in the wings? Well, I went to the EN World - Morrus' D&D/d20 News & Reviews Site and found a list of monsters from the Dragon's Bestiary. I've compiled the list of all dragon-related info, so if anyone wants me to post 'em, just drop me a line. Finally, for a comprehensive list of d20 and 3e/3.5e dragons released by WotC and 3rd parties, go to http://mwtools.thyle.net/d_list.html, "3E Dragons"
Lord_BloodMoon 12-30-03, 05:53 PM	Moonstone Dragon is one I'd like to see again. I have it in my 2e Monstrous Compendium Annual Vol 4. Now that was an exotic dragon. I also want to see the Dragon-Kin, Albino Wyrm converted. Now that was a messed up monster of cool stuff. Plus, would help my underdark campaign :). I like most of the planar dragons they released in Draconomicon, my favorite being the Styx.
the Horc 12-30-03, 11:50 PM	Originally posted by ieattrollsforbreakfast Plutonium Dragon - A dangerous dragon to say the least. Hot tempered and extremely skilled with evocation. Nuclear breath weapon anyone? Yeah, make it collosal+ in size and have it have a massive racial hate-on for tokyo.
The Ethereal Wickerman 12-31-03, 03:05 AM	Originally posted by RavinRay [B]I've gotten the Draconomicon for myself these holidays, and from what I've read all the new new dragons, especially the extraplanar ones, should inspire al of us draco-fans to come up with new ones. So, why not post our own dragons in a thread specifically for new dragons? I've gotten my subpsionic gem dragons (jade, opal, turquoise) posted at Psionics Handbook forum, and I have five more that I'm finishing the details on (aquatic chromatic, gem and metallic dragons, druid-like jewel dragons).[B] I like the sound of your new Gem dragons, i'll have to check that out. I might make a couple of Dragons myself, especially a Gibbering one!. Astral Dragon (unusual, many-horned one-eyed planeshifting dragon) Inevitable Dragon (highly lawful, planar clockwork dragon) Pseudonatural Dragon (in need of a better name, but still a cool idea) Needle Dragon (spiny needle-spitting insectile dragon) Doppeldragon (a draconic doppelganger, and it can still turn into humanoids!) Glass Dragon (shiny skinned dragon with shards of glass for spines) Grave Dragon (small, ghoul-like 'living' dragon that eats corpses) Grizzly Dragon (wooly, tusken savage dragon)
Aeolius 12-31-03, 08:42 AM	In my undersea campaign I have coral, pearl, and abalone dragons.
Insanity 12-31-03, 10:17 AM	The Horc, I've been working on your idea of a titanium dragon if you don't mind. Lots of abjuration spell-like abilities so far. Here are some more of my true dragons: My True Dragons (http://www.geocities.com/the_insane_one_42/dd3e/dragons.html)
Damarkos 12-31-03, 11:35 AM	Originally posted by The Ethereal Wickerman Dracolithid (possibly template, tentacle-faced slimy dragon) I like the sound of that, I'm going to start work on it and I'll post it later. You guys can tell me what you think. Thanks, Damarkos
Vaalingrade Ashland 12-31-03, 01:28 PM	Ah, prehaps you've seen The Slave Dragon To'jin'kai (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=138157) , wickerman?
Lord of the Ninth 12-31-03, 09:53 PM	I have long wanted to see two things: The Playable Dragon: I haven't the slightest clue how this one works, but I would very much like to see it. and The Generic Dragon: This dragon is closer to a classical dragon, it doesn't have some weird color coding (I personally think the idea of chromatic=evil and metalic=good is too much like a "slay by number" guide). It might also not have the 'Always' in its alignment discriptor. Shouldn't be too tough though...
RavinRay 01-01-04, 06:28 PM	Originally posted by Lord of the Ninth I have long wanted to see two things: The Generic Dragon: This dragon is closer to a classical dragon, it doesn't have some weird color coding... It might also not have the 'Always' in its alignment discriptor... Hmmm, you can adapt the Wyrm from the d20 Modern setting. It has only two age categories, hatchling and adult, and modify the alignment from evil to any. It has a fire breath weapon, and a tail sting like a wyvern. I assume it has the dragon build and not drake (four legs, that is). I wish the April Fool's pink dragon would become official. I can imagine either the Seelie or Unseelie Courts of the Fey breed such a dragon to wreak mischievous pranks on mortals (is there a [Fey] subtype?).
Ogre4Hire 01-01-04, 10:31 PM	How about bringing back the Mercury, Purple, Steel, Orange, and Yellow dragons (you see a yellow dragon. It runs away).
Lord of the Ninth 01-02-04, 12:51 PM	I was kinda disapointed that the Wyrm in d20 Modern had int of 6 though (the hatchling and the adult?!). But I suppose that could work, but I think it would be easier to take one of the true dragons and modify it (I like age catagories). But if I just need it as a villain the Wyrm would work nicely (with a few changes, mostly making its int 6 for the hatchling and 14 for the adult). If you want some of the old dragons converted for 3e (maybe even 3.5, I'm not sure) Go Here (http://www.enworld.org/cc/index.php) . I thik they should have most of the ones you mentioned, Ogre4Hire. RavinRay, I don't thik there is a fey subtype, however I believe that there was a dragon magazine (I don't think I still have it) that had a dragon who had this weird thing where it had traits of dragons, fey and maybe even plants. That issue had a couple fey and pseudo-fey (changlings and this little burning things).
bordwok 01-04-04, 07:54 PM	Lord of the Ninth, I have worked on a new epic dragon, one that is not limited to an energy subtype and that is in some words, breed for combat. The primal dragon was developed along a seperate path than the 'true' dragons. I was inspired by re reading the entery in the monsters manual (3.0) that some scholars believe that all draconic races were spawned from a singal race of pure draconic blood. I have concieved my own interpretation of such a race of dragons. Aptly named the Primal Dragons. If anyone is interested in the dragon race just pm me or post here, it is in word format and can be redily e-mailed to those interested in it. Rather unique little dragon if I say so myself.
UndeadPenguin 01-04-04, 10:45 PM	I wanna see a feather dragon. You know like a small low CR dragon made out of feathers thats CG and soft and pillow like. Like a cute lovable hugable dragon. And it would have to be realy cute. It could shoot sharpened feathers or breathe lots of fluff to blind oppenents. And if you have a tar dragon you could tar and feather someone.
Lord of the Ninth 01-04-04, 11:41 PM	*Shakes head in disgust*
Willie the Duck 01-10-04, 05:39 PM	Originally posted by the Horc I want to see a Titanium dragon (hardcore defence, decent offence, lacking as a spell caster as compared to other dragons) um, you are aware that titanium is that ultralight steel replacement that they use in fighter jets, not tanks? Amazing defense is not what it is all about.
Naga_Slayer 01-10-04, 11:00 PM	Fantasy Flight's "Draconic Lore" has Chthonian Dragons (an obvious reference to it's tenticled face and the "Chthulu Mythos") that is basically a dragon that had an Illithis tadpole put in it's head and turned into a Mind Flayer Dragon. Personally, I just take the Underdark book and slap the template on myself. Templates are so fun. Some Dargons I'd like to see: I aggree with the Linnhorm updates. I like Linnhorms :D More eastern Dragons. Templates or rules for mix breeds. I know the half Dragon template is cool (and i use it as a quick fix... come up with some enat possiblities) but maybe a little sidebar that says the halfbreed gains 1 parents abilities every other age category, and the other parents on it's skipped categories.
The Ethereal Wickerman 01-11-04, 04:41 AM	Carrion Dragon (long, sinuous, multi-legged dragon with paralyzing tentacles) Arrowdragon (draconic relative of the Arrowhawk) Equine Dragon (horse-like, highly-earthy, less-magical dragon) Cockadrake (draconic cockatrice) Arachnoid Dragon (eight-legged underdark dragon)
ieattrollsforbreakfast 01-11-04, 08:56 AM	I made an Equine dragon a very long time ago...I wonder if I can dif it out... Nope cant find it... must have deleted it. I think it was based off a half dragon heavy warhorse with some alterations, such as better breath weapon, and recalculation of skills etc, as if it hadnt been templated.
LoricDAHPaladin 01-11-04, 11:54 AM	Making dragons as varied and prolific as this draconimicon seems to do dillutes the mystique and majesty of these creatures. The "oh, another one of these" dismissal comes to mind.
The Ethereal Wickerman 01-11-04, 12:10 PM	Originally posted by LoricDAHPaladin Making dragons as varied and prolific as this draconimicon seems to do dillutes the mystique and majesty of these creatures. The "oh, another one of these" dismissal comes to mind. You have a point, but think of this way. You see one the true dragons, Silver Dragons lets say. They evoke mystique because they are one of the purer dragons among many subraces. Then consider thr brown dragon from the MoF. A bunch of flightless, brown-skinned, burrowing dragons to me seems like one of a draconic majority of lesser dragons. Scaletaint Dragon (yuan-ti dragons anyone?) Tree Dragon (a big, draconic treant) Leaping Dragon (does anyone remember Gambados, well...) Hoop Dragon (based on the mystical Hoop-Snake);)
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 01-11-04, 01:56 PM	The dread Turbonium Dragon. :cookie: for anyone who gets the reference.
RavinRay 01-11-04, 03:57 PM	You don't have to use all the dragons in your campaign world, nor make them common. That way they'll remain majestic and mysterious. Imagine a world overrun by all the dragons presented in all the official D&D sources; it's gonna be the Council of Wyrms' Io's Blood Islands, but on a bigger scale.
RavinRay 01-12-04, 07:26 AM	Originally posted by Ogre4Hire How about bringing back the Mercury, Purple, Steel, Orange, and Yellow dragons (you see a yellow dragon. It runs away). In the latest "In the Works" (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20040111a), Mat Smith mentioned the Mulhorandi (aka Egyptian) pantheon of the Forgotten Realms setting. They just might include the yellow dragon. From what I know it lives in the Mulhorand region south of Faerûn and north of the Land of Fate (Al Qadim). But this yellow dragon ain't one of those "forgotten chromatic dragons" mentioned in an old Dragon issue and is specific to Toril. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Ogre4Hire 01-13-04, 07:50 PM	Currently, I'm working on my own breed of dragon: the dreaded Abyssal Dragon. It's basically a Red Dragon that's adapted to life in the Abyss, and now EVERYBODY is afraid of it. The critter is such a badass, even the Lords of the Abyss give it a wide berth (though they are fond of misdirecting visitors to its layer). I'll post it as soon as I get the stats worked out.
kcgallum 01-17-04, 08:56 PM	I sort of started writing a novel sort off based on worlds where chromatic dragons are evil and metallic dragons are good but not for long. basicaly i've got a great wyrm whos father was an amber dragon (red + gold) and mother a grey (silver + black) whos been wandering the astral planes eg space for millenia and finds dragons fighting each other. so hes got to restore the peace, unite chromatics and metalics and take out the false so called diety (probaby use tiamat in human form). After all this occurs on several worlds the dragons all depart and settle on a uninhabited world i.e no major sentient species. Ok so all the dragons are interbreeding now and so you've got all sorts of variants. In this "campaign world" wyverns and wyrms (basicaly winged serpents) are of the same intelligence of dragons albeit minor differences eg magic capabilities, so they also interbreed with dragons. This union produced dracos which i'm still working on. most have four wings but where left on planet to survive without any intervention. the dragons wanted them to have no bad experiences like what they had suffered where dragon fought dragon. I'm also working on a dragon that is an experiment by the dragons to create one who is a mix of all the five chromatic and metallic races. sorry if this might seem off topic but i though i might as well since this thread is about new true dragons.
AlienFromBeyond 01-17-04, 09:24 PM	Originally posted by Raymond_Luxury_Yacht The dread Turbonium Dragon. :cookie: for anyone who gets the reference. OMG, I actually know where that comes from. I want to cry now.
HyperactiveBuffalo 01-17-04, 10:33 PM	what ive always felt D&D needed was a significantly less powerful dragonkin. a creature that in all particulars looks like a dragon, but with far more limited spell casting, far lower intelligence, and quite a bit smaller. I created one myself using that cat with wings whos name is impossible for me to remember. I was always a fan of Anne McCaffery growing up, so I basically replicated her dragonettes. as for other dragons, just slap the illithid template from fiend folio on the dragon, whammo instant dracolithid, and as for the other ones, while the idea of a beholder-dragon is somewhat cool, does it 'fit' any setting you can think of? I do like the idea of dragon like creatures, especially landwyrms that have completely alien physiology. you could use the landwyrm as a base to create underdark dragons based on boron, uranium, iradium, etc. and make them very 'dirty' in nature, say a boron has lime green skin with deep crevices leading to a molten brown body, and constantly emits an area effect that requires a fort save or else you begin losing hitpoints (perminently perhaps) oh, and knights of the dinner table is rad. :angel:
Io, Lord of Wyrms 01-18-04, 06:23 AM	Dragons I would love to see in an official published product: -Planar Dragons for the remaining plains -The four or five linnorms that haven't been converted -The Spelljammer dragons: Radient, Sun, Moon and Stellar -A group of four-five fey/nature orientated dragons -Obisidan Dragon, and the excellent subpsionic dragons written on the Psionics Board by someone who I forget (sorry) -An epic gem and lung dragon -The Ferrous dragons -Cloud and Mist dragons published in a book -Mercury Dragon published in a book -Wurms and Greater Drakes published in a book -A weaker dragonic creature with low inteeligence, fire breath and no magical abilities -Symbols, portfolio and other such information for Task, Saridor and Kereska -An Illithid-Dragon, a Beholder-Dragon and Yuan-Ti-Dragon
RavinRay 01-18-04, 09:19 AM	Originally posted by Io, Lord of Wyrms Dragons I would love to see in an official published product: -Planar Dragons for the remaining plains The adamantine dragon of Bytopia is a good candidate for conversion to 3.5E -A group of four-five fey/nature oriented dragons Am converting the amber dragon to 3.5E, and made a pearl dragon as its aquatic counterpart (different from Aeolius'). Both have druid-like instead of sorcerous innate abilities. As for a fey-like dragon, aside from the faerie dragon, an official prankster-like pink dragon would be nice. (Hey, fey are known to be mischievous. I think there was a chocolate golem somewhere that might have been made by fey. Imagine a sugar golem created to wreak havok on a fey enemy's birthday party.) -Obisidan Dragon, and the excellent subpsionic dragons written on the Psionics Board by someone who I forget (sorry) That would be me. :) -An epic gem and lung dragon Let's wait for this month's Mind's Eye. As Mark Jindra said, there's gonna be another gem dragon. Maybe a neutral good diamond dragon to counterbalance the obsidian. The only epic lung dragon I can think of would be the Celestial Emperor's Jade Dragon (unrelated to my subpsionic gem dragon), unless it's an outsider/quasi-deity. -The Ferrous dragons The creator of the Inzeladun campaign setting has them converted to 3.5E on his website, except for the tungsten dragon. -A weaker draconic creature with low intelligence, fire breath and no magical abilities Let's transplant the Wyrm from d20 modern. Or get a half-red dragon/half-fire drake whose parents were a red dragon elemental master and its fire drake dragonkith/consort. Hmm, an interesting plot element. :)
Mithral Icesilver 01-18-04, 04:35 PM	Hey, Ray! Could you post a link to your subpsionic dragons or at least re-post them? I'd love to see them. Or mabey I could go search.
RavinRay 01-19-04, 07:25 AM	Here are the links to the three subpsionic gem dragon entries I posted (the opal, jade and turquoise dragons, in order of decreasing power). I am still checking for errors, and, especially, will change their innate psionic abilities as soon as I come up with subpsionic powers; that is, psionic powers with a [subpsionic] descriptor that only characters wielding subpsionic can use. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1988350#post1988350 http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1993835#post1993835 http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1994060#post1994060
Mithral Icesilver 01-19-04, 11:21 AM	They sound pretty neat. Unfortunately, I can't see them because of this screening program, which also didn't let me see the Mist or Mercury dragons on Monster Mayhem.
RavinRay 01-19-04, 04:04 PM	Okay, so you don't have to go to the Psionics forum, here's the overview of the subpsionic gem dragons. I'll omit the age and abilities tables so that when I edit them I don't have to do it twice. Subpsionic Gem Dragons The clerics of Sardior know of his destruction of his obsidian thane Seradess and the banishment of the obsidian dragons, but the reasons behind this remain unproven. One theory has it that Seradess experimented with the practice of subpsionics and subsequently turned to evil and took the rest of the obsidian dragons with her, something that Sardior could not tolerate. They have taken this as an indication that the pursuit of subpsionics may lead one to evil, and is something the Master of the Gem Dragons forbids or at the very least discourages his followers to pursue. However, this appears to be in contradiction with rumors of the emergence of three new gem dragon species, each of which specializes in the supposedly forbidden practice. The three newly discovered gem dragons are the jade, opal, and turquoise dragons. Encounters with them are so rare that they are considered legend by most people and even by the majority of the hierarchy of the church of Sardior. Aside from isolated groups of humans and humanoid races, only his highest-ranking clergy and other dragons are aware of their existence and true nature. These three dragon species live in more remote places than most other gem dragons, accounting for their rare encounters. Some individuals choose to reside underground and are thus seen somewhat more frequently by dwarves and other underground dwellers, but they minimize their contact with other races and prefer to use their psionic powers to erase any evidence of their existence. A few make their lairs in places that would seem barren to most humanoid races, such as areas overrun by lava or dried-up remains of long-ago disappeared lakes. Physically, they resemble other gem dragons, except that their scales have a softer sheen and are less translucent, and are rounded, not faceted. The reason for their need for secrecy is left up to Sardior himself; those clergy aware of their existence speculate that he is starting to assume a more pro-active role in the events of the world and is preparing for the time when the gem dragons will be drawn into conflict with sorcerers and wizards wielding Shadow Magic. Combat The three subpsionic dragons share the same benefits to their subpsionic powers that are chosen from the Clairsentience, Metacreativity, and Telepathy disciplines. The save DCs for such powers gain a +1 bonus and a +1 bonus on manifester level checks to overcome power resistance. Similarly, when attacking a normal psionic creature with mind thrust, psychic crush, or mind blast, they gain a +2 bonus to the Will save DCs. When defending against mind thrust, psychic crush, or mind blast by normal psionic creatures, the Will save DC is lowered by -2 and they have an additional point of mental hardness. They prefer to use these three attack modes almost to the exclusion of id insinuation and ego whip. Jade Dragon Dragon (Sonic) Climate/Terrain: Temperate and cold mountains Organization: Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, or very old: solitary, pair, or family (1-2 plus 2-5 offspring); ancient, wyrm, or great wyrm: solitary. Challenge Rating: Wyrmling 3; very young 5; young 7; juvenile 9; young adult 12; adult 15; mature adult 17; old 19; very old 20; ancient 22; wyrm 23; great wyrm 25. Treasure: Triple standard. Alignment: Always lawful neutral. Advancement: Wyrmling 8-9 HD (Small); very young 11-12 HD (Medium-size); young 14-15 HD (Medium-size); juvenile 17-18 HD (Large); young adult 20-21 HD (Large); adult 23-24 HD (Huge); mature adult 26-27 HD (Huge); old 29-30 HD (Huge); very old 32-33 HD (Huge); ancient 35-36 HD (Gargantuan); wyrm 38-39 HD (Gargantuan); great wyrm 41+ HD (Gargantuan). Level Adjustment: Wyrmling +4; very young +4; young +6; others - The mysterious jade dragons are the most passionless and secretive of the subpsionic gem dragons. They adhere to a highly rigid code of honor and law, and while generally dislike associating with other creatures, will not hesitate to deal harshly with hostile visitors. A jade dragon has translucent pale-green scales that reflect light with a soft sheen. The pupils fade as the dragon ages until the eyes resemble bright green orbs. Jade dragons reside in the most inaccessible mountain peaks, apart from other dragons. A great wyrm's lair will be modified by psionic reality alteration to make it as impregnable as possible (and comfortable for the dragon as well). Combat Jade dragons are highly territorial and very defensive of their lairs and employ devices to detect the approach of visitors from a considerable distance. Early in an encounter they will warn off intruders to leave unless they are satisfied with their stated mission. Persistent creatures who ignore the warnings are attacked without quarter. Extremely angry jade dragons have been known to permanently psionically disable enemies and leave them to the mercy of the elements. Breath Weapon (Su): A jade dragon has one breath weapon: a cone of ultrasonic vibratory force. In additional to making a Dexterity saving throw against force damage, creatures within the cone must succeed at a Fortitude save (versus the same DC) or be staggered for 1d4 rounds plus 1 round per age category of the dragon. It works as a shatter spell against nonmagical or nonpsionic objects. Opal Dragon Dragon (Air) Climate/Terrain: any land and underground Organization: Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, or very old: solitary, pair, or family (1-2 plus 2-5 offspring); ancient, wyrm, or great wyrm: solitary. Challenge Rating: Wyrmling 4; very young 5; young 7; juvenile 9; young adult 12; adult 15; mature adult 17; old 19; very old 20; ancient 22; wyrm 24; great wyrm 26. Treasure: Triple standard Alignment: Always neutral. Advancement: Wyrmling 8-9 HD (Small); very young 11-12 HD (Medium-size); young 14-15 HD (Medium-size); juvenile 17-18 HD (Large); young adult 20-21 HD (Large); adult 23-24 HD (Huge); mature adult 26-27 HD (Huge); old 29-30 HD (Huge); very old 32-33 HD (Gargantuan); ancient 35-36 HD (Gargantuan); wyrm 38-39 HD (Gargantuan); great wyrm 41+ HD (Colossal). Level Adjustment: Wyrmling +4; very young +5; young +6; others - Opal dragons are the most intelligent of the subpsionic gem dragons. They have a detached air, and seldom intervene in the affairs of others unless directly affected. An opal dragon has translucent gray scales at birth. As the dragon ages, they acquire an internal play of colors that gives the dragon a scintillating appearance. Opal dragons are equally at home in cold, windswept plateaus or warm semi-arid areas where former lakes have evaporated. Combat Opal dragons are reluctant fighters and prefer to parley. They will attempt to obfuscate opponents with deafening burst and ectoplasmic mist and will attack only if the intruders persist. Breath Weapon (Su): An opal dragon has one breath weapon: a cone of multicolored light that works like the color spray spell except that it also causes HP damage, even to blind creatures. Turquoise Dragon Dragon (Earth) Climate/Terrain: Any underground Organization: Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, or very old: solitary, pair, or family (1-2 plus 2-5 offspring); ancient, wyrm, or great wyrm: solitary. Challenge Rating: Wyrmling 3; very young 4; young 5; juvenile 8; young adult 11; adult 13; mature adult 16; old 18; very old 19; ancient 21; wyrm 22; great wyrm 24. Treasure: Triple standard Alignment: Always chaotic neutral. Advancement: Wyrmling 6-7 HD (Tiny); very young 9-10 HD (Small); young 12-13 HD (Medium-size); juvenile 15-16 HD (Medium-size); young adult 18-19 HD (Large); adult 21-22 HD (Large); mature adult 24-25 HD (Huge); old 27-28 HD (Huge); very old 30-31 HD (Huge); ancient 33-34 HD (Huge); wyrm 36-37 HD (Gargantuan); great wyrm 39+ HD (Gargantuan). Level Adjustment: Wyrmling +2; very young +3; young +4; juvenile +4; others - The scales of a turquoise dragon are a beautiful sky-blue in color, and the pupils fade as the dragon ages until the eyes resemble brilliant azure orbs. Turquoise dragons dwell in underground caverns and rugged areas full of canyons and mesas, where they can easily conceal themselves and stalk intruders unawares. Combat Turquoise dragons are capricious and erratic. They can be edgy towards visitors in one moment, then be taciturn the next. If they are in a lenient mood they may simply implant aversion. They have a somewhat twisted sense of humor and often take delight in observing other creatures fall victim to their pranks. Visitors who share their interest in the workings of the subconscious are welcome, however. Great wyrms are especially dangerous opponents because of their greater mental rage power. Breath Weapon (Su): A turquoise dragon has one breath weapon: a cone of obscuring steam that combines the effects of fire damage and fog cloud. And there you have it. I was inspired to create them following the obsidian dragon in The Mind's Eye a year ago, and decided that subpsionic dragons would make for different encounters. How did I choose opal, jade and turquoise for the subpsionic gem dragons? Well, these are the three most precious and best-known translucent to opaque gemstones, and they evoke a specific color (multicolor, green, and sky-blue respectively). I find it a case of serendipity that in subpsionics there are three disciplines that are suited for it and that there are three translucent to opaque gemstones. I like to theorize that as a result of specializing in subpsionics, a gem dragon’s scales turn more opaque.
darkdreamer_699 01-20-04, 03:20 PM	if im not mistaken cant most dragons polymorph into humnoids anyway? look at Gold and Silver Dragons read up in the monster manual
Incenjucar 01-20-04, 04:42 PM	Quasi-elemental dragons are fun to consider; Ash dragons: (which I'm working on) Not only do they have fire immunity without being a fire subtype, and a nasty, hard-to-resist breath attack.. but it DRAINS a HD from fire subtype creatures. Send these bad boys after a red. Also there's a lovely excuse for them to be shadow casters of some sort, since ash is also the opposite of radiance. Vacuum dragons: Swallow feats en mass? Salt Dragon: They HAVE had brine dragons... but they were fugly. Dust Dragon: Disintegrating breath weapon. You know you want to. Radiant Dragon: So many references to base it off of (Prismatic, Mercury, and Radiant) Mineral Dragon: Fears only rust dragons, turns everything else to fossils. Lightning Dragon: An offshoot of blues? Steam Dragon: Puff?
Vanigo 01-21-04, 03:04 AM	Hmm. Maybe there should even be a new category or two of dragons. How about beast dragons, wood dragons, or stone dragons? Granted, I don't know what each category would be...
Incenjucar 01-21-04, 03:42 AM	Well, frankly, there should be a more detailed taxonomy of creature types... Things like.. Tiger: Large Animal [(Mammal, Feline)] Tabby: Tiny Animal [(Mammal, Feline, Domestic)] Lizard folk: Medium-Size Monsterous Humanoid [(Reptile, Warm-Blooded, Amphibious)] Half-Celestial Lizard folk: Medium Size Monsterous Humanoid [Outsider, Native, Good (Reptile, Warm-Blooded, Amphibious)] Blue Dragon: X-Size Dragon [True Dragon, Air, Electric] Half-Fiendish Blue Dragon: X-Size Dragon [True Dragon, Outsider, Native, Air, Electric, Evil] Insectile Half-Fiendish Blue Dragon: X-Size Dragon [True Dragon, Outsider, Native, Air, Electric (Insect)] Etc etc etc. But that's a tad... complex.
tasslehoff220 01-21-04, 12:31 PM	I would like to see the return of the adamantine dragon from second edition. Probably an epic dragon but still, it would be cool to see. Even though its not a dragon I would also like to see an updated jabberwock. That thing was so cool. I loved how it came with the Jabberwocky poem. I'm betting it would have dr/vorpal now which would be cool cause its a type of dr that hasnt been seen yet.
Murr-Quan Lord #2 01-21-04, 01:25 PM	*looks up ... way up* The Plutonium dragon was actually first introduced in the Munchkin card game, and later statted out in the Munchkin Monster Manual or somesuch. It's supposed to be so powerful it's funny. The wyrmling can practically destroy continents, but its power decreases by half every 21,500 years, or however long the half-life of plutonium is. :)
HyperactiveBuffalo 01-21-04, 08:49 PM	tee-hee-hee. I always liked Munchkin. its just hillarious. while I agree that more dragon types would be fun, I dont think they are really needed... especially not those like the prismatic, or force. I really dont see the point of a dragon that can take on 4 40th level characters.
RavinRay 01-22-04, 07:14 AM	:bump: Ok, I'm posting my three aquatic dragons that I've developed over the last few months. The Level Adjustments might need tweaking, but I think I've got everything else covered. Just post your comments and errata. Thanks. AQUATIC DRAGON There are three known varieties of true aquatic dragons, each of which is an aquatic member of one of the three categories of true terrestrial dragons: aquamarine (gem), quicksilver (metallic), and sepia (chromatic). All aquatic dragons gain more abilities and greater power as they age. (Other aquatic creatures that have the dragon type do not.) They range in length from several feet upon hatching to more than 100 feet after attaining the status of great wyrm. The size of a particular dragon varies according to age and variety. Aside from their adaptation to an aquatic life, aquatic dragons are similar to their terrestrial relatives: they establish territories, hoard treasure, and consider themselves superior to all other creatures. They have extensive fins that propel them along the water, and they have four flippers tipped with claws. Their tails are comparatively short. All aquatic dragons speak Draconic and Aquan. Combat As with terrestrial dragons, an aquatic dragon attacks with its powerful claws and bite, and can also use a breath weapon and special physical attacks, depending on its size. It prefers to fight on the move, staying out of reach until it has worn down the enemy with ranged attacks. Older, more intelligent dragons are adept at sizing up the opposition and eliminating the most dangerous foes first (or avoiding them while picking off weaker enemies). Combat underwater is similar to that on land or in air, although there are notable differences which are listed below. The table below provides space and reach statistics for dragons of various sizes, plus the natural weapons a dragon of a certain size can employ and the damage those attacks deal. Amphibious: All aquatic dragons are amphibious and can breathe air as easily as water, but their mobility on land is highly limited and thus certain methods of attack such as crush have restrictions. Fin: The aquatic dragon can slam opponents with its fins, even when swimming. Fin attacks deal the indicated damage plus 1/2 the dragon's Strength bonus (round down) and are treated as secondary attacks. Flipper Slap: The aquatic dragon can slap one opponent each round with its flippers. A flipper slap deals the indicated damage plus 1-1/2 times the dragon's Strength bonus (round down) and is treated as a secondary attack. Crush (Ex): This special attack allows an aquatic dragon of at least Huge size to land on opponents as a standard action, using its whole body to crush them. Since aquatic dragons are incapable of sustained flight (unless they use flight spells), crush attacks are mostly used when dragons leap over the water to beach themselves onshore, or to land on ships. It can be used underwater, but due to the natural buoyancy of most creatures damage is only half that indicated below. However, aquatic dragons with the Power Dive feat can deal full damage. It is effective only against opponents three or more size categories smaller than the dragon (though it can attempt normal overrun or grapple attacks against larger opponents). A crush attack affects as many creatures as can fit under the dragon's body. Creatures in the affected area must succeed on a Reflex save (DC equal to that of the dragon's breath weapon) or be pinned, automatically taking bludgeoning damage during the next round unless the dragon moves off them. If the dragon chooses to maintain the pin, treat it as a normal grapple attack. Pinned opponents take damage from the crush each round if they don't escape. A crush attack deals the indicated damage plus 1-1/2 times the dragon's Strength bonus (round down). AQUATIC DRAGON SPACE/REACH, ATTACKS, AND DAMAGE Size Space/Reach* 1 2 2 2 Flipper 1 Crush Bite Claws Fins Slaps Crush** Small 5 ft./5 ft. 1d6 1d4 - - - Medium 5 ft./5 ft. 1d8 1d6 1d4 - - Large 10 ft./5 ft. 2d6 1d8 1d6 1d8 - (10 ft. with bite) Huge 15 ft./10 ft. 2d8 2d6 1d8 2d6 2d8 (15 ft. with bite) Gargantuan 20 ft./15 ft. 4d6 2d8 2d6 2d8 4d6 (20 ft. with bite) Colossal 30 ft./20 ft. 4d8 4d6 2d8 4d6 4d8 (30 ft. with bite) *An aquatic dragon's bite attack has reach as if the creature were one size category larger. All other attacks are made with the standard reach for the dragon's size. **An aquatic dragon's crush attack deals half damage underwater unless it uses the Power Dive feat. Spells/Psionics: A sepia or quicksilver dragon knows and casts arcane spells as a sorcerer of the level indicated in its variety description, gaining bonus spells for a high Charisma score. Quicksilver dragons can also cast spells from the cleric list or cleric domain lists as arcane spells. An aquamarine dragon learns and manifests psionic powers as a psion with Psychometabolism as its primary discipline. Skills: All aquatic dragons have skill points equal to (6 + Int modifier, minimum 1) x (Hit Dice + 3). Most purchase the following skills at the maximum ranks possible: Listen, Search, and Spot. The remaining skill points are generally spent on Concentration, Diplomacy, Escape Artist, Intimidate, Knowledge (any), Sense Motive, and Use Magic Device at a cost of 1 skill point per rank. All these skills are considered class skills for dragons. (Each dragon has other class skills as well, as noted in the variety descriptions.) Feats: All aquatic dragons have one feat, plus additional feats based on Hit Dice just like any other creature. Aquatic dragons favor Alertness, Blind-Fight, Cleave, Improved Initiative, Improved Sunder, Power Attack, Power Dive, Snatch, Weapon Focus (claw or bite), and any metamagic feat that is available and useful to sorcerers (metapsionic feat for aquamarine dragons). Dragon Movement Aquatic dragons use their fins to swim. A dragon that cannot use its fins can still swim using its flippers but at half speed. They are exceedingly strong swimmers and can cover vast distances quickly. A dragon's swimming speed is a function of its tactical swim speed, as shown on the table below. AQUATIC DRAGON SWIMMING SPEEDS ----- Dragon's Swim Speed ----- 30 feet 60 feet 90 feet One Hour Normal 4 miles 8 miles 12 miles Hustle 6 miles 12 miles 18 miles One Day Normal 60 miles 80 miles 100 miles Aquatic dragons cannot fly, but they can leap over the water and glide for a considerable distance. In order to do so they have to swim at top speed in a straight line close to the surface, then breach the surface with their fins spread. The maximum distance covered is 10 x the dragon's space, with a midpoint altitude equal to the dragon's space. The dragon can choose to stop gliding by folding its fins. Aquatic dragons are also limited to a crawl on land. Dragonhide Armorsmiths can work with the hides of aquatic dragons to produce armor or shields of masterwork quality. AQUAMARINE DRAGON Dragon (Aquatic, Sonic, Water) Climate/Terrain: Shallow aquatic. Organization: Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, very old, ancient, wyrm, or great wyrm: solitary, pair, or family (1-2 and 2-5 offspring). Challenge Ratings: Wyrmling 3; very young 4; young 6; juvenile 8; young adult 11; adult 14; mature adult 16; old 18; very old 19; ancient 21; wyrm 23; great wyrm 24. Treasure: Triple standard. Alignment: Always neutral. Advancement: Wyrmling 6-7 HD (Small); very young 9-10 HD (Medium-size); young 12-13 HD (Medium-size); juvenile 15-16 HD (Large); young adult 18-19 HD (Large); adult 21-22 HD (Huge); mature adult 24-25 HD (Huge); old 27-28 HD (Huge); very old 30-31 HD (Huge); ancient 33-34 HD (Gargantuan); wyrm 36-37 HD (Gargantuan); great wyrm 39+ HD (Gargantuan). Level Adjustment: Wyrmling +4; very young +4; young +6; others - Aquamarine Dragons by Age Age Size Hit Dice (hp) Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha Base Attack Fort Ref Will Breath Frightful Attack/ Save Save Save Weapon Presence Grapple (DC) DC Wyrmling S 5d12+5 (43) 13 10 13 12 11 11 +5/+2 +7 +5 +4 +5 2d6 (13) - Very young M 8d12+16 (73) 15 10 14 12 11 11 +8/+10 +10 +8 +6 +6 4d6 (16) - Young M 11d24+22 (102) 17 10 15 14 13 13 +11/+14 +14 +9 +7 +9 6d6 (17) - Juvenile L 14d12+42 (137) 19 10 16 15 15 14 +14/+22 +17 +12 +9 +11 8d6 (20) - Young adult L 17d12+68 (183) 23 10 18 16 15 15 +17/+27 +22 +14 +10 +13 10d6 (22) 21 Adult H 20d12+100 (235) 27 10 20 17 17 16 +20/+36 +26 +17 +12 +15 12d6 (25) 23 Mature adult H 23d12+115 (273) 29 10 21 18 17 17 +23/+40 +30 +18 +13 +17 14d6 (26) 25 Old H 26d12+156 (329) 31 10 22 19 19 18 +26/+44 +34 +21 +15 +19 16d6 (29) 27 Very old H 29d12+174 (372) 33 10 23 20 20 19 +29/+48 +38 +22 +16 +21 18d6 (30) 29 Ancient G 32d12+224 (436) 35 10 24 22 21 21 +32/+56 +40 +25 +18 +23 20d6 (33) 31 Wyrm G 35d12+280 (511) 39 10 27 23 22 21 +35/+60 +44 +27 +19 +25 22d6 (35) 33 Great wyrm G 38d12+304 (562) 43 10 27 24 24 23 +38/+64 +48 +29 +21 +28 24d6 (37) 35 Aquamarine Dragon Abilities by Age Age Speed Initiative AC Special Abilities Manifester SR Level* Wyrmling 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 16 (+1 size, +4 natural), Sonic immunity, - - swim 30 ft. touch 12, flat-footed 16 hear light Very young 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 18 (+7 natural), 18 - - swim 60 ft. touch 11, flat-footed Young 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 21 (+10 natural), 1st - swim 60 ft. touch 11, flat-footed 21 Juvenile 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 23 (-1 size, +13 natural), 3rd - swim 60 ft. touch 10, flat-footed 23 Young adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 26 (-1 size, +16 natural), DR 5/magic 5th 19 swim 60 ft. touch 10, flat-footed 26 Adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 28 (-2 size, +19 natural), Biofeedback 7th 21 swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 28 Mature adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 31 (-2 size, +23 natural), DR 10/magic 9th 22 swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 31 Old 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 34 (-2 size, +25 natural), Energy barrier 11th 24 swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 34 Very old 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 37 (-2 size, +28 natural), DR 15/magic 13th 25 swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 27 Ancient 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 39 (-4 size, +31 natural), Adapt body 15th 27 swim 90 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 39 Wyrm 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 41 (-4 size, +34 natural), DR 20/magic 17th 29 swim 90 ft. touch 7, flat-footed 41 Great wyrm 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 44 (-4 size, +37 natural), Affinity field 19th 31 swim 90 ft. touch 7, flat-footed 44 * Aquamarine dragons manifest powers as if psions with Psychometabolism as their primary discipline. Aquamarine dragons are among the most reclusive of marine dragons. Even aquatic races hardly encounter them. They are purported to be related to emerald dragons, as they share many abilities, but this is unproven. Aquamarine dragons have light blue scales tinged with green at birth. As they get older, the green fades until they are a clear seawater blue. Their rayed fins have scalloped edges like those of dragonfish. Most aquamarine dragons prefer to make their lairs near isolated atolls or seamounts, cultivating gardens of giant seaweed and coral to provide concealment from outsiders. They detest the chaotic disposition of topaz dragons, but do not consider them enemies. They are similarly nonaggressive towards bronze and quicksilver dragons, but avoid sepia dragons as much as possible. Combat Aquamarine dragons are retiring and avoid combat. They observe intruders unawares and use their psionic abilities to determine their intentions. If the interloper is harmless they will drive it off while remaining hidden for as long as possible. If their presence is revealed they will persuade it to leave peacefully. Should their lair be threatened they defend it aggressively. Breath Weapon (Su): Aquamarine dragons breathe a cone of keening sonic energy. If the cone is used in air, in additional to making a Dexterity saving throw against sonic damage, creatures within the cone must succeed at a Fortitude save (versus the same DC) or be deafened for 1d4 rounds plus 1 round per age category of the dragon. However, if the breath weapon is used underwater and the creatures cannot breathe water, they start to drown instead. Sonic Immunity (Ex): An aquamarine dragon is immune to sonic powers, spells, and effects. Psionics (Sp): At will-hear light; 3/day-biofeedback (adult or older), energy barrier (old or older); 1/day-adapt body (ancient or older), affinity field (great wyrm). Manifester level varies by age; save DC d20 + Strength modifier + power level. Attack/Defense Modes (Sp): At will-id insinuation/tower of iron will. An aquamarine dragon manifests powers and gains additional attack and defense modes, according to the rules of a psion. Skills: Heal, Hide, and Sense Motive are considered class skills for aquamarine dragons.
RavinRay 01-22-04, 07:16 AM	QUICKSILVER DRAGON Dragon (Aquatic, Water) Climate/Terrain: Shallow aquatic. Organization: Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, or very old: solitary, pair, or family (1-2 plus 2-5 offspring); ancient, wyrm, or great wyrm: solitary. Challenge Rating: Wyrmling 3; very young 4; young 5; juvenile 8; young adult 11; adult 13; mature adult 16; old 18; very old 19; ancient 21; wyrm 22; great wyrm 24. Treasure: Triple standard. Alignment: Always neutral good. Advancement: Wyrmling 6-7 HD (Small); very young 9-10 HD (Medium-size); young 12-13 HD (Medium-size); juvenile 15-16 HD (Large); young adult 18-19 HD (Large); adult 21-22 HD (Huge); mature adult 24-25 HD (Huge); old 27-28 HD (Huge); very old 30-31 HD (Huge); ancient 33-34 HD (Gargantuan); wyrm 36-37 HD (Gargantuan); great wyrm 39+ HD (Gargantuan). Level Adjustment: Wyrmling +2; very young +3; young +4; juvenile +4; others - Quicksilver Dragons by Age Age Size Hit Dice (hp) Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha Base Attack Fort Ref Will Breath Frightful Attack/ Save Save Save Weapon Presence Grapple (DC) DC Wyrmling S 6d12+6 (46) 13 10 13 12 13 12 +6/+3 +8 +6 +4 +6 2d6 (14) - Very young M 9d12+18 (75) 15 10 14 13 14 13 +9/+11 +11 +8 +6 +7 4d6 (16) - Young M 12d12+24 (104) 17 10 15 14 15 14 +12/+15 +15 +10 +7 +10 6d6 (18) - Juvenile L 15d12+45 (140) 20 10 16 16 17 16 +15/+24 +19 +12 +9 +12 8d6 (20) - Young adult L 18d12+72 (186) 23 10 18 16 17 16 +18/+27 +22 +14 +10 +14 10d6 (22) 22 Adult H 21d12+105 (233) 26 10 20 18 19 18 +21/+37 +27 +16 +12 +16 12d6 (24) 24 Mature adult H 24d12+120 (281) 29 10 21 18 19 18 +24/+41 +31 +19 +13 +18 14d6 (27) 26 Old H 27d12+162 (332) 31 10 22 20 21 20 +27/+45 +35 +21 +15 +20 16d6 (29) 28 Very old H 30d12+180 (387) 33 10 23 22 23 22 +30/+49 +39 +23 +16 +22 18d6 (31) 30 Ancient G 33d12+231 (446) 35 10 25 23 24 23 +33/+58 +42 +25 +18 +24 20d6 (33) 32 Wyrm G 36d12+288 (530) 38 10 27 25 26 25 +36/+60 +44 +28 +19 +27 22d6 (35) 35 Great wyrm G 39d12+351 (605) 40 10 29 26 27 26 +39/+64 +48 +30 +21 +29 24d6 (38) 37 Quicksilver Dragon Abilities by Age Age Speed Initiative AC Special Abilities Caster SR Level* Wyrmling 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 16 (+1 size, +5 natural), Poison immunity, - - swim 30 ft. touch 11, flat-footed 16 protected sight, liquid form Very young 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 18 (+8 natural), - - swim 60 ft. touch 10, flat-footed 18 Young 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 20 (-1 size, +11 natural), 1st - swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 20 Juvenile 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 23 (-1 size, +14 natural), 3rd - swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 23 Young adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 25 (-2 size, +17 natural), DR 5/magic 5th 19 swim 60 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 25 Adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 28 (-2 size, +20 natural), Murky water 7th 21 swim 60 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 28 Mature adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 31 (-2 size, +23 natural), DR 10/magic 9th 23 swim 60 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 31 Old 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 33 (-3 size, +26 natural), Purify water 11th 25 swim 60 ft. touch 7, flat-footed 33 Very old 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 36 (-3 size, +29 natural), DR 15/magic 13th 26 swim 60 ft. touch 7, flat-footed 36 Ancient 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 38 (-4 size, +32 natural), Scintillating 15th 28 swim 90 ft. touch 6, flat-footed 38 pattern Wyrm 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 40 (-4 size, +35 natural), DR 20/magic 17th 29 swim 90 ft. touch 5, flat-footed 40 Great wyrm 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 42 (-4 size, +38 natural), Sunburst 19th 31 swim 90 ft. touch 4, flat-footed 42 *Can cast clerical spells and spells from the Good, Sun and Water domains as arcane spells. Peaceful and gentle, but with a touch of playfulness, quicksilver dragons frequent the shallows of the open oceans and coastlines. They are said to share a recent ancestry with mercury dragons, but their demeanor stands in sharp contrast to the flighty and capricious nature of mercuries. A quicksilver dragon is born with shiny, mirror-like scales. As the dragon ages the scales appear to merge together until the dragon appears to be made of mercury, and full sunlight lends it a blinding brilliance. Its fins are shaped like those of a manta ray. Quicksilver dragons enjoy swimming in broad daylight just below the surface of the water. At the approach of ships, they dive deeper to avoid detection, but teasingly allow passengers fleeting glimpses of them. They like to swim alongside dolphin schools and socialize with the gregarious mammals, which recognize them as beneficent. Although they make lairs and maintain territories, they spend part of the year wandering the seas in pursuit of prey and to seek others of their kind, leaving the defense of their abodes to their allies, which include triton, sea elves, and merfolk. In turn, they provide aid and protection to them. They hate sahuagin, but their greatest enemies are the sepia dragons. They often ally themselves with bronze dragons; but while they are just as inquisitive about the dealings of other creatures, they lack the bronzes' fascination for warfare. This doesn't mean, though, that they won't take up the cause of good when evil threatens. Combat Quicksilver dragons avoid combat as much as possible, and would rather disable or confuse an enemy. A common tactic is to assume liquid form and use light spells to blind or daze their opponents before closing with their breath weapon and physical attacks. They use their buoyant breath weapon to force weak swimmers to the surface where they would be less formidable. Breath Weapon (Su): Quicksilver dragons have two types of breath weapon, a line of viscous poison or a cone of glutinous, buoyant bubbles. Creatures coated by the bubbles must succeed at a Reflex save or float helplessly to the surface for 1d6 rounds plus 1 round per age category of the dragon. Protected Sight (Ex): Quicksilver dragons cannot be blinded, dazzled, or dazed by light effects. Liquid Form (Su): At will as a standard action, a quicksilver dragon can assume a liquid form. This power works just like a gaseous form spell cast by a character of the dragon's age category or caster level (whichever is higher), except as follows: The dragon loses its natural armor bonus, but gains a deflection bonus to AC equal to twice its age category. The dragon gains damage reduction 10/magic, or, if the dragon is old enough to have damage reduction already, its damage reduction increases by 10 points. A quicksilver dragon in liquid form can be affected by currents, although it can't be dispersed or damaged. While in liquid form the dragon is indistinguishable from debris clouds and gains total concealment when in any kind of natural or magical debris cloud. The dragon cannot leave the water, use its natural weaponry or breath weapon, but it can use its spell-like abilities and spells. The dragon can swim at half its normal swimming speed. The dragon can dismiss the effect as a standard action. Murky Water (Sp): This spell is similar to fog cloud, except that it only works underwater. Three times a day an adult or older dragon can cause murky water to swirl from a designated point, obscuring all sight, including darkvision, beyond 5 feet. A creature within 5 feet has concealment (attacks have a 20% miss chance). Creatures farther away have total concealment (50% miss chance, and the attacker can't use sight to locate the target). A moderate current (11+ mph) disperses the murk in 4 rounds; a strong current (21+ mph) disperses the murk in 1 round. Purify Water (Sp): Once per day an old or older quicksilver dragon can purify 1 cubic feet of water per caster level, cleaning it of acids, poisons (including the dragon's own breath weapon) and other contaminants. Magic items (such as potions) and items in a creature's possession with an [evil] descriptor must succeed on a Will save (DC equal to that of the dragon's frightful presence) or become useless. This ability is the equivalent of the cleric spell purify food and drink. Its range is equal to that of the dragon's frightful presence. Spell-Like Abilities: 3/day-scintillating pattern (ancient or older); 1/day-sunburst (great wyrm). Skill: Bluff, Knowledge, and Survival are considered class skills for quicksilver dragons.
RavinRay 01-22-04, 07:18 AM	SEPIA DRAGON Dragon (Aquatic, Water) Climate/Terrain: Deep aquatic. Organization: Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, or very old: solitary, pair, or family (1-2 plus 2-5 offspring); ancient, wyrm, or great wyrm: solitary. Challenge Rating: Wyrmling 3; very young 4; young 5; juvenile 7; young adult 10; adult 12; mature adult 15; old 17; very old 18; ancient 20; wyrm 21; great wyrm 23. Treasure: Triple standard. Alignment: Always neutral evil. Advancement: Wyrmling 6-7 HD (Small); very young 9-10 HD (Medium-size); young 12-13 HD (Medium-size); juvenile 15-16 HD (Large); young adult 18-19 HD (Large); adult 21-22 HD (Huge); mature adult 24-25 HD (Huge); old 27-28 HD (Huge); very old 30-31 HD (Huge); ancient 33-34 HD (Gargantuan); wyrm 36-37 HD (Gargantuan); great wyrm 39+ HD (Gargantuan). Level Adjustment: Wyrmling +4; very young +4; young +6; others - Sepia Dragons by Age Age Size Hit Dice (hp) Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha Base Attack Fort Ref Will Breath Frightful Attack/ Save Save Save Weapon Presence Grapple (DC) DC Wyrmling S 5d12+5 (38) 13 10 13 8 11 8 +5/+2 +7 +5 +4 +4 2d6 (13) - Very young M 8d12+16 (67) 15 10 14 9 11 9 +8/+10 +10 +7 +5 +6 4d6 (15) - Young M 11d12+22 (95) 17 10 15 10 12 10 +11/+14 +14 +9 +7 +7 6d6 (17) - Juvenile L 14d12+42 (131) 20 10 16 12 13 12 +14/+23 +18 +11 +8 +10 8d6 (19) - Young adult L 17d12+68 (175) 23 10 18 12 13 12 +17/+26 +21 +14 +10 +11 10d6 (22) 19 Adult H 20d12+100 (222) 26 10 20 14 15 14 +20/+36 +26 +16 +11 +14 12d6 (24) 21 Mature adult H 23d12+115 (269) 29 10 21 15 16 15 +23/+40 +30 +18 +13 +15 14d6 (28) 23 Old H 26d12+156 (320) 31 10 22 16 17 16 +26/+43 +33 +20 +14 +18 16d6 (29) 26 Very old H 29d12+174 (374) 33 10 23 17 18 17 +29/+47 +37 +22 +16 +20 18d6 (30) 28 Ancient G 32d12+224 (433) 35 10 25 18 19 18 +32/+56 +40 +24 +17 +22 20d6 (32) 30 Wyrm G 35d12+280 (508) 37 10 27 19 20 19 +35/+60 +44 +27 +19 +22 22d6 (35) 32 Great wyrm G 38d12+304 (566) 39 10 27 21 22 21 +38/+63 +47 +29 +20 +26 24d6 (37) 34 Sepia Dragon Abilities by Age Age Speed Initiative AC Special Abilities Caster SR Level Wyrmling 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 15 (+1 size, +4 natural), Acid immunity - - swim 30 ft. touch 11, flat-footed 15 Very young 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 17 (+7 natural), - - swim 60 ft. touch 10, flat-footed 17 Young 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 19 (+10 natural), - - swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 19 Juvenile 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 22 (-1 size, +13 natural), 1st - swim 60 ft. touch 9, flat-footed 22 Young adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 24 (-1 size, +16 natural), DR 5/magic 3rd 18 swim 60 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 24 Adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 27 (-2 size, +19 natural), Darkness 5th 19 swim 60 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 27 Mature adult 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 30 (-2 size, +22 natural), DR 10/magic 7th 21 swim 60 ft. touch 8, flat-footed 30 Old 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 32 (-2 size, +25 natural), Unholy blight 9th 23 swim 60 ft. touch 7, flat-footed 32 Very old 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 35 (-2 size, +28 natural), DR 15/magic 11th 24 swim 60 ft. touch 7, flat-footed 35 Ancient 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 37 (-4 size, +31 natural), Dominate animal 13th 26 swim 90 ft. touch 6, flat-footed 37 Wyrm 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 40 (-4 size, +34 natural), DR 20/magic 15th 27 swim 90 ft. touch 6, flat-footed 40 Great wyrm 20 ft. (4 squares), +0 42 (-4 size, +37 natural), Tsunami 17th 29 swim 90 ft. touch 5, flat-footed 42 The malevolent sepia dragons roam the abyssal depths of the oceans, although they also venture to the sunlit reaches to wreak havoc on other marine life and seafarers. They have strikingly similar abilities with black dragons, but it is unclear if the two varieties are in fact related. Sepia dragons have fine, grayish-brown scales that give their hides a smooth finish. Their fins ripple as they swim. Sepia dragons are vicious, dominating predators. They seek to subjugate other marine races and kill those that resist. They savor the flesh of giant squid and octopus and thus compete with sperm whales, but find kraken formidable opponents. On the occasions that they venture to the surface it is to seek treasure to plunder from passing vessels, gathering the cargo and slaying the crew. The rare pirate ship has been known to avoid destruction, but only by regularly attacking coastal villages beyond the dragon's reach and turning over a significant portion of the spoils. Among other aquatic races, only the sahuagin ally themselves with sepia dragons, and quicksilver dragons are their mortal enemies. Combat Sepia dragons are masters of stealth and prefer ambush. In direct combat, they churn the water with their powerful fins to disorient and slow down their opponents before closing in with physical attacks. Breath Weapon (Su): A sepia dragon has one breath weapon, a line of inky, oily acid. Acid Immunity (Ex): A sepia dragon is immune to acid attacks. Dominate Animal (Sp): An ancient or older sepia dragon can use this ability three times per day. It works as the spell dominate animal except that it can affect a number of aquatic animals whose combined HD does not exceed twice the dragon's level, or one animal regardless of HD. Spell-Like Abilities: 3/day-darkness (adult or older), unholy blight (old or older); 1/day-tsunami (great wyrm). Skills: Appraise, Intimidate, and Spot are considered Class Skills for sepia dragons.
tasslehoff220 01-22-04, 11:30 PM	I like these but the Quicksilver or "Mercury" dragon im pretty sure already exists. Maybe it was from 2nd ed though cause i dont remember from where.
Incenjucar 01-23-04, 12:46 AM	Mercury Dragons existed in 2e, and, likely, before. They had a searing light breath weapon, and could blind creatures with the reflection of moonlight or greater illumination concentrated by their wings. They were poisonous to eat, but lacked a poison attack. They were spiffy.
The Ethereal Wickerman 01-23-04, 04:58 AM	Anacondragon (a massive constritor with horns and wings) Chemical Dragon (a mass of sentient draconic acid inside a thin but strong skin-like membrane shaped like a dragon)
RavinRay 01-23-04, 05:16 AM	Originally posted by tasslehoff220 I like these but the Quicksilver or "Mercury" dragon im pretty sure already exists. Maybe it was from 2nd ed though cause i dont remember from where. Yep, and Skip converted the Mercury to 3.5e recently. Which is why I decided to name them Quicksilver, in as much as in the 2e Savage Coast of Mystara, there was a Crimson Dragon that is related to the Red Dragon. I was thinking of using Gallium, since it is the only other metal that is liquid at room (tropical anyway) temperature, hence the liquid form ability. If there is too much confusion between Mercury and Quicksilver I may as well rename it, but if not I could add the Gallium Dragon as well. Originally posted by Incenjucar Quasi-elemental dragons are fun to consider... Well, frankly, there should be a more detailed taxonomy of creature types... Things like.. Insectile Half-Fiendish Blue Dragon: X-Size Dragon [True Dragon, Outsider, Native, Air, Electric (Insect)] Incenjucar, are you thinking about true dragons, or additions to the elemental drakes? When you think about it, with the planar dragons and elemental drakes, the planes are becoming populated with dragons. I don't see any reason why the elemental drakes can't live in the Inner Planes, and just as it is implied that the shadow dragon can also reside in the Plane of Shadow, I guess they can do so in their namesake planes. Incenjucar's insectile dragon (inspired by Savage Species I guess) gives me an idea. What if you want to run a campaign based entirely on Small and smaller creatures (such as Fey PC), and you want to deal with draconic-flavored monsters? That's where you can, say use dragon-like dragonflies (the most logical to me). Originally posted by HyperactiveBuffalo while I agree that more dragon types would be fun, I dont think they are really needed... especially not those like the prismatic, or force. I really dont see the point of a dragon that can take on 4 40th level characters. HyperactiveBuffalo has a point. When does it reach the point when having too many dragons in your campaign world makes them so common they lose their legendary reputation? Frankly, if you were to use all the dragons in official sources, you are gonna have a Colossal headache. The reason I made aquatic dragons is to give aquatic-based campaigns more than bronze and topaz dragons, and still retain the feel (in as much as I can) of the classic chromatic and metallic dragons, and the gem as well. Toril has lots of true dragons, and we're just talking about Faerûn. Add in the lung dragons of Kara-tur, the (not yet converted) Maztican and Mulhorand dragons and lesser dragons. Krynn has just the metallic and chromatic dragons plus wyverns, dragon turtles and sea dragons, but it manages them quite nicely. Just my rambling, meandering thoughts...
HyperactiveBuffalo 01-23-04, 06:02 AM	Anacondragon (a massive constritor with horns and wings) only one comment, and not a very constructive one really... its been clearly stated that in 3rd edition all dragons are quadrapedal.
WizO_Sith 01-23-04, 10:48 PM	Since there is already an Adamantine Dragon, what I'd like to see are metalic Dragons of the other "Fantasy" metals in D&D, like a Mithril Dragon, fer instance.
RavinRay 01-24-04, 08:27 AM	Originally posted by WizO_Sith Since there is already an Adamantine Dragon, what I'd like to see are metalic Dragons of the other "Fantasy" metals in D&D, like a Mithril Dragon, fer instance. Could anyone supply a list of such metals? In the meantime, the following have already appeared in 3E/3.5E/d20: gold, silver, bronze, copper, brass, steel, and mercury. In Vincent Darlage's Inzeladun campaign setting setting there are five ferrous dragons (iron, chromium, cobalt, nickel, and tungsten) (http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/hosted/adilbrand/inzeladun/monsters/dragons/dragonsferrous.htm). I just checked, according to Microsoft Encarata there are four metals that are liquid at room temperature: mercury, cesium, gallium, and rubidium (in order of higher melting point). So, if anyone wants to build more aquatic metallic dragons (aquametallic?), you can use these metals for the names. Suggested breath weapons are as follows: Quicksilver: poison-based, (because of mercury poisoning). Cesium: electricity-based (it emit electrons when exposed to light). Gallium: cold-based (it can be supercooled and expands when frozen, like ice). Rubidium: fire-based (it ignites spontaneously in air).
Incenjucar 01-24-04, 12:19 PM	Metals that have no 3e whole-race statistic: Electrum Platinum Lead Zinc Tin Aluminum D&D Metals: Aurorum (Metal that can be rejoined when sundered) Solarian Truesteel (Metal that increases crit confirmation) Ysgardian Heartwire (Metal that is only used as wire, that decreases attacker's hit confirmation) Green Steel Red Steel
SSj3goblin 01-25-04, 11:29 AM	Yellow? plus more fiendish and celestials dragons...
Slagger the Chuul 01-26-04, 03:42 AM	I've always thought that since there's bronze and brass dragons, there should be zinc and tin dragons. I started to write up electrum dragons, along with billon and shakudo dragons, but I quickly decided that I've just use a standard metallic with a different colour scheme. An aurorum dragon would be pretty nasty; you cut it to pieces and it can reassemble itself. Collecting the pieces of one would make a good quest (to achieve or foil). Astral Driftmetal, Entropium, and Urdrukar are also available.
RavinRay 01-26-04, 04:54 AM	What do you guys think? Do you want me to expand the aquatic dragons? If so, I could create the rubidium and cesium dragons, and make the Gallium Dragon a consort to the Platinum Dragon. Likewise, I would add an ultramarine dragon, plus one other color, for the chromatic dragons, and create Kingu, Tiamat's consort (in Babylonian mythology). Then, two more gem dragons plus a consort for Sardior. I need more gemstone names relating to water or the sea if possible (but not pearl).
howlingwolf 01-26-04, 06:01 AM	Consumed dragons! Normal dragons or maybe Elemental Masters who got a little -too- close to the elemental power in their bodies. Dragons -literally- made of what their particular element or closest relative is. Granted they may be considered more a 'Normal Elemental' but imagine the scenes you could have going.. Those ruins? Those draconic statues. Damn. One seems to be breathing.. Dragons made of fire bursting from the top of erupting volcanoes anyone? Wow look! It's a dragon carved into the glacier! Oh damn! It blinked! O_O Or maybe some simpler variations. Make them even more serpentine than the typical oriental dragon. No arms. No legs. Is it a giant snake, or is it a dragon? Tick tock tick tock... Ectoplasmic Dragon maybe? Although granted that might be a bit closer to the Etheral one. Plus most people probably don't have the psionics handbook due to disliking the 'MP system' ^_^
DragonFan 01-30-04, 10:38 PM	I want too see the Adamantite Dragon. It was the massive bruiser of Dragonkind, a lover of physical combat. It existed in 2ed and hope to see 3.5ed.
HyperactiveBuffalo 01-31-04, 06:51 AM	howlingwolf.... white dragons often lay in the shadows of glaciers to blend in for just that purpose. Reds have been known to make their lairs in volcanoes, etc. why not just use regular dragons more creatively?
Ogre4Hire 02-01-04, 04:10 PM	Originally posted by howlingwolf Consumed dragons! Normal dragons or maybe Elemental Masters who got a little -too- close to the elemental power in their bodies. Dragons -literally- made of what their particular element or closest relative is. Granted they may be considered more a 'Normal Elemental' but imagine the scenes you could have going.. Those ruins? Those draconic statues. Damn. One seems to be breathing.. Dragons made of fire bursting from the top of erupting volcanoes anyone? Wow look! It's a dragon carved into the glacier! Oh damn! It blinked! O_O Or maybe some simpler variations. Make them even more serpentine than the typical oriental dragon. No arms. No legs. Is it a giant snake, or is it a dragon? Tick tock tick tock... Ectoplasmic Dragon maybe? Although granted that might be a bit closer to the Etheral one. Plus most people probably don't have the psionics handbook due to disliking the 'MP system' ^_^ Actually, I believe that the elemental and half-elemental templates from MoTP do that already.
RavinRay 02-02-04, 09:09 AM	Anyone ever considered crossing lung dragons with "Western" dragons? I'm just curious what the offspring would be like. Here, listed below, is what I think are the counterpart dragons. Gold dragon and T'ien lung. Gold dragons look partly oriental anyway, and in the 1ed and 2ed MM's they were distinctly wingless or could assume that shape. Even some of the names given in the Draconomicon sound Oriental. Cloud dragon and Chiang lung. Okay, the cloud dragon ain't officially converted yet (but why is the storm drake nicknamed "cloud dragon?"), and chiang lung are more water than air based, but they appear to be the closest in ability. Mist dragon and Shen lung. Similar to previous item. Storm drake and Tun mi lung. Copper dragon / Emerald dragon and Li lung. Dragon turtle and Lung wang. How would such cross-breeds grow? Would they start out as yu lung, or yu lung that resemble the "western" wyrmling? Also, I wish that Medrinia, Bahamut's aquatic dragon assistant in Dragon Magazine 260, could be updated to 3e and made a consort. If I could contact the author, Keith Francis Strohm, I'd like to make her the Gallium Dragon, Bahamut's consort. Now for suggested names for more planar dragons... Cerulean dragon (cerulean is blue, from heaven) - for an Upper Plane dragon, perhaps Elysium Viridian dragon (green, from plant) - maybe for the Beastlands
Whatwereyouexpecting 02-02-04, 12:14 PM	I still want a balanced playible race that is a subspecie of dragon thats actually intellegent...
RavinRay 04-01-04, 09:59 AM	Flower Drake Tiny Dragon Hit Dice: 4d12+4 (27 hp) Initiative: +2 Speed: 20 ft. (4 squares), fly 50 ft. (perfect) Armor Class: (+1 size, +4 Dex, +4 natural), touch 15, flat-footed 15 Base Attack/Grapple: 4 Attack: Bite +13 melee (1d6+1) Full Attack: Bite +13 melee (1d6+1) and 2 claws +8 melee (1d4) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Breath weapon, scintillating pattern Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., immunity to magic sleep effects and paralysis, low-light vision, scent Saves: Fort +7, Ref +10, Will +8 Abilities: Str 13, Dex 18, Con 12, Int 13, Wis 15, Cha 14 Skills: Knowledge (nature) +11, Move Silently +15 Feats: Flyby Attack, Hover Environment: Forests and gardens Organization: Solitary or pair Challenge Rating: 2 Treasure: None Alignment: Always neutral Advancement: 5-6 HD (Tiny), 7-8 (Small) Level Adjustment: +2 The flower drake is a small, nectar-feeding creature that bears a remarkable resemblance to both bats and hummingbirds. Some speculate that it is related to the faerie dragon, perhaps representing an ancestral stage, but this is unproven. A flower drake looks like a bat except that it has colorful scales that have an iridescent sheen. Its snout is somewhat elongated, and it has an extensible tongue for probing into flowers. Unlike bats, however, a flower drake is mostly diurnal, and thus avoids direct competition with them. COMBAT Flower drakes are pugnacious and surprisingly unfraid of creatures many times their size. They have been known to drive away predators intent on raiding their nests. Breath Weapon (Su): A flower drake's breath weapon is a 5-foot cone of allergenic, perfumed gas. Creatures that fail a DC 14 Will save become fascinated with the drake and does not harm it for 1d6 rounds. Scintillating pattern (Sp): This is similar to the spell, but the drake can cast this only once a day and has to hover for a full round, creating a 2 foot-radius pattern centered on itself. Because of the low hit die of the drake and its modest Charisma score, it works as a 2nd-level spell cast by a 4th-level sorceror. A DC 14 Will save negates. By the way... April Fools! :ayyyy!:
Myst_the_Moonscout 04-03-04, 10:00 PM	What I would like to see are the serpent-dragons from celtic or norse tradition: sea serpents with draconic heads and fore-arms and sometimes great wings. (I have a dragon I created a few months ago, I would post it but I used the layout from the WOTC websight and some of the writing and that may have copyright issues)
EnSabaNur 04-24-04, 01:38 AM	I have something that you may want to consider; Stygian Wyrms also known as Abyssal Dragons. These Dragons would be the Ultimate personification of Evil and Chaos. Prevailent among all the lower planes. These Dragons would inspire fear in the most powerful Pit Feinds and Balors and that is saying a great deal (Arch-Devils and Abyssal Lords along with truly evil gods such as Nerull, Lloth Etc. would be the most likley to deal with these dragons on an equal basis.) There appearance would be that of a heavly muscular Dragon with razor sharp teeth and claws. their scales would be polished black like scorched metal and the scales would also be razor sharp which would make Grapple attacks ill advised. their Eyes would be glowing red with white pupils like white hot coals. Their wings would have three uses the first is naturally flight, the second would be if folded would be like battering rams the third would be as edged weapons, the wings would be razor sharp. These Dragons would make Terrifying enemies for even the most powerful adventurers. Their magical abilities would not only be undeniably powerful but unspeakably malignant. The breath weapons would be just as frightful and frightfully potent. These Dragons have a deep hatred towards mortal spellcasters that would summon them. When there on a mortal world they can easily become leaders of cults as well as become the tyrants of vast empires. These dragons would also feed on souls and instigating ethnic cleansings would be the quickest means in satisfying their vile hungers they would collaberate with Hellfire Wyrms as well if it suted ther own sinister agendas. These Dragons would possess intelegence that few beings can match and they are supremely methodical and patiant. along with the the shared immunities of other dragons they would also be immune to mind effecting spells as well. Let me know what you think
tasslehoff220 04-26-04, 02:59 AM	Stygian dragons and Abyssal Drakes both already exist in the draconomicon. As for them being the ultimate choas/evil and their collaboration, up to the dm I guess but when it comes to dragons Ive generally seen solitary and/or selfish behavior in most games Ive played and books Ive read. There are exceptions to every rule though. Still, I personally wouldnt create a race, even if it a race of dragons which is on level terms with the demon lords and evil gods of the abyss.
JustaPlayer 04-26-04, 08:09 AM	Demodragon. This one comes from the cartoon of old. If I'm not mistaking Venger bred it to fight Tiamat, maybe it was to fight the kids. It has two body/head colors one side black, the other blue, and about 8 long tentacles sprouted from it's body which it could use to grapple. I don't think it got into breath weapons, but I think I would make one do Con drain and the other Level drain. Maybe give it some spell-like abilities. *shrug* Of course this would be a unique extraplanar dragon. I would probably try to place the CR in the mid 30s. Maybe even make it some kind of Demom Lord now too. Book of Vile Draco-Darkness anyone?
howlingwolf 04-28-04, 04:56 AM	Domesticated Dragons? Kinda like the urban gargoyles from Kellemore ( Or however it's spelt ) Glass Dragon - Turn invisible, spider climb along glass like copper does with stone, shape glass aka Shape Rock, breathe shards. Sommat like that. Grey/Stone Dragon - Blends against rockwork like said gargoyles. Heh. Thought just struck. Imagine if the centerpiece of a town, a nice big dragon sculpture wakes up one day. ^_^ That fluff dragon though. ^_^ Just imagine them in pairs in a noble's home.. 'Darling! The pillows are chewing my hair again!' 'Sweetie, the cushions are walking off!'
Ramses III 05-01-04, 05:41 AM	TROGDOR THE BURNINATOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
tasslehoff220 05-01-04, 12:23 PM	I would say that its a safe bet to say that one wins.
nagilfarswake 05-01-04, 02:53 PM	make that one more vote for trogdor. seriously though, a glass dragon would be really, really cool. breath weapon that does slashing damage, dr x/bludgeoning, stuff like that. someone wanna stat that baby up?
EnSabaNur 05-01-04, 11:43 PM	The Abyssal Dragons would be for truly Epic foes and those who are tired of faceing the Demons and Devils; Besides even Pit Fiends and Balors should have Predators that even they fear. As for Aquatic Dragons, Kick this Idea around. Haver you considered the possibility of Dragon Whales? These Creatures would be a mixture of both whales and dragons and would be the ultimate guardians of the deep. One of their weapons would be their deafening songs that could shatter stone and steel. Another would be Dragon Sharks, which would be a mixture of both Dragons and sharks, Sahuagin would consider these creatures as Holy Warriors of Sekolah and these monsters would be the ultimate terrors of the depths on the par with the Krakens and other aquatic monsters. Highly intellegent they would be able to cast spells; magical capabilities along with the physical power they would prove lethal foes.
Isran_Imrador 05-02-04, 12:35 PM	luck dragon! Lim. wish / wish as spellike abi.
Doberfuhr 05-02-04, 01:16 PM	Yes, as a matter of fact I have an idea. It is a dragon called "Draco Tractus Digestivus Terribilis"- a large, worm-like brown monstruosity that lives exclusively in the lower parts of Gary Gygax's large intestine. Sometimes, when it tries to escape from this terrible imprisonment, it is packed in by one of Gary's friends (like Ed Greenwood for instance, provided he can move his schmaltz bladder out of the way); other times it just sits there, getting bigger, sweeling old Gary up until, in a feat of great bravery and endurance it is expunged after much effort, grunting, and thrusting and gracefully dumped into a bowl of water. Oh, the doorbell. That must be Ed ready for another packing. Ernie, go get the Lubex, this might take some time.
Talking_Sword 05-02-04, 01:58 PM	If you're going to go this far with all these different dragons, you might as well hear my idea for one: Uranium Dragon Breath Weapon: Atomic fire!!! And yes, it would look like Godzilla.
TheDreamcatcher 05-06-04, 02:03 AM	Why restrict yourselves to the physical when you can make a dragon based on...Time!! Specific dragons I would like to see converted into 3.5 are the Children of Bahamat (as described in a Dragon magazine article from years back) and the Spawn of Tiamat. Was there not an Electrum dragon in 2E? I do believe there is already a dragon based on the Nine Hells of Baator...the Hellfire Wyrm. It is a nasty critter. As for pure comedy, it would be interesting to see Puff the Magic Dragon. Oh wait, they already did that with the Faerie dragons. :D Of course, Io's avatar is the biggest of all. In 2E, I think it was over 800 ft. long. 55% chance of swallowing anything, if I remember correctly, and something along the lines of having an 80% chance of automatically hitting anything. Fun stuff! Sincerely, The DreamCatcher
Asta Kask 05-06-04, 07:09 AM	Originally posted by RavinRay What do you guys think? Do you want me to expand the aquatic dragons? If so, I could create the rubidium and cesium dragons. No. Do not, repeat not do that. Rubidium and cesium react extremely violently with water and an aquatic rubidium dragon would have a very, very short lifespan. It's the same as the potassium and sodium dragons, who can't go out in the rain. Fruit Dragons anyone? Apple dragon (tastes good, +4 to Computer skills) Pear dragon (known for its noble bearing) Orange dragon (also a chromatic... sorry, dragon of color) Plum dragon (eat meat, Fort save DC 12 or spend the next three days in the bathroom) Banana dragon Kiwi dragon etc., etc. Anyone know the stats of Cowdragon?
RavinRay 05-06-04, 08:00 AM	Originally posted by TheDreamcatcher Specific dragons I would like to see converted into 3.5 are the Children of Bahamat (as described in a Dragon magazine article from years back) and the Spawn of Tiamat. The DreamCatcher [/B] Actually, over at 3.0 Resources boards, someone updated Medrinia (http://p085.ezboard.com/f3ebb85430frm10.showMessage?topicID=1701 .topic) to 3E. I'm in the process of promoting Medrinia to the rank of a lesser deity, as the consort of Bahamut and the ruler of the aquametallic dragons. Course, that means Tiamat has to have her own consort as well, and so I am writing up Kingu, who is her consort in Babylonian mythology, and appropriately, a power of the sea. As for the rest of the children of Bahamut and spawn of Tiamat, Vanathor (http://p085.ezboard.com/f3ebb85430frm10.showMessage?topicID=1703 .topic) has been converted as well.
RavinRay 05-06-04, 08:08 AM	Originally posted by Asta Kask No. Do not, repeat not do that. Rubidium and cesium react extremely violently with water and an aquatic rubidium dragon would have a very, very short lifespan. It's the same as the potassium and sodium dragons, who can't go out in the rain. Yep, when I checked the periodic table, I noticed that they are extremely reactive. However, mercury, gallium, rubidium and cesium are the only metals that are liquid at or near room temperature. I thought that the reactivity of Rb and Cs would make for very interesting breath weapons and behavior. However, if you have any other suggestions, I'd welcome them, Now, here's my names for the aquachromatic, aquametallic, and aquatic gem dragons: Aquachromatic: beige (the color of sand), sepia, ultramarine (a deep blue pigment) Aquametallic: cesium, quicksilver, rubidium Aquatic gem: aquamarine, jasper, zircon
Aedgwyn 05-11-04, 08:09 AM	I think all the ideas for new dragons are good.:angel:
Kurama Youko 05-12-04, 10:44 PM	I'd like to see a personal favorite dragon from an entirely different genre of game be converted and made into a true dragon, maybe even epic level. I speak of the Kaiser Dragon (of Breath of Fire fame, preferably the one from part 3 or part 4.) a Ruby Dragon would be cool to, (mostly because thats my birthstone. I was really upset that the gem dragons didnt included my birthstone, I took it as a personal insult. :)) Maybe do a dragon based on the elements of nature. (again borrowing names and concepts from that game i mentioned before.) Wind Dragon, Grass Dragon (I did a lesser dragon version of this dragon on the monster lair board.), Sea Dragon (the Oceanus is okay i suppose though i wasnt to keen on its artwork.) Mud Dragon, so on and so forth. What if there was a furry dragon. Like fugor from the Never Ending Story, (I dont really know if he was a dragon par say but what if it was a dragon that resembled him a little.) Marble Dragon or Drake, Granite Dragon or Drake, Sand Dragon. Blood Dragon and Flesh Dragon (the Flesh Dragon could look like a dragon who has no skin and you see the muscles and bone structure the creatue.) The Blood Dragon could look like Carnage of Spiderman fame but in Dragon shape. What if there were Dragons with slight aspects of different races. Sure we have half dragons that add the aspects of dragons to different races but what if there was a true dragon that had aspects of other races and there true dragons. Like the Elven Dragon or Drow Dragon. Like a Elven Dragon having pointy ear like frills or something and some kind of hair composed main that is luxurious. They could also have similar if not the same exact intrest as the races to which they derive their name.
Myst_the_Moonscout 05-13-04, 01:38 AM	Originally posted by Kurama Youko I'd like to see a personal favorite dragon from an entirely different genre of game be converted and made into a true dragon, maybe even epic level. I speak of the Kaiser Dragon (of Breath of Fire fame, preferably the one from part 3 or part 4.) a Ruby Dragon would be cool to, (mostly because thats my birthstone. I was really upset that the gem dragons didnt included my birthstone, I took it as a personal insult. :)) I know how you feel, my birthstone is aquamarine. Oh well, I'll make my own. Ya the dragons in BOF four were pretty cool, Kaiser particularly.
RavinRay 05-13-04, 06:35 AM	Myst, Kurama Youko, There is a ruby gem dragon - Sardior, the Ruby Dragon and the gem dragons' deity. He ranks alongside Bahamut and Tiamat. See the archives of The Mind's Eye (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/main.asp?x=dnd/psi/welcome,3) for info about him and his church. As for the aquamarine dragon, I created one some time ago, and it is posted on this very thread several posts back. Just go back one page and you will see it, along with other aquatic dragons. Hmmm, the glass dragon could be an aberrant, degenerate, or renegade gem dragon, since obsidian is actually a naturally occuring, volcanic glass, And the obsidian dragons turned renegade and became evil (check this on Sardior info). There were 2e, player-created dragons named after rocks, like granite, marble, etc. A search at Google might turn up some links. Cheers!
heinzk23111 05-17-04, 11:55 AM	I like the idea of Elemental dragons: Earth (Stone is a good one), Water (Freshwater & salt water??) Air (basically an almost invisible dragon that wind walks, uses force spells) Brown dragon (any alignment) yellow dragon (sand dragon) Or how about the semi-dragons Animal intelligence, Breath weapon, no magic not much bigger than say 15ft (good riding animal)
tummyk 05-31-04, 12:53 AM	I seem to recall an old April Fools day edition of Dragon with goofy monsters-Including a pink dragon that breathed soap bubbles for a breath weopon. (Save or be blinded by soap) Would like to see a 3.5 E version.
Graf Orlok 06-04-04, 06:56 PM	What about a Kobold Dragon? It's a bunch of symbiotic Kobolds, which can fuse into a big dragon form. Funny if he is about being defeated and breaks up into dozens of Kobolds running away. Screaming, of course.
Dravidian 06-05-04, 05:49 PM	Im not quite sure if any of u have posted about dragons from the Abyss or the Nine Hells. I definetely dont beleive in making Dragons with a little pinch of other races intertwined in there dragon race. things like a kobold dragon or a Dracolithid (personally i dont even like the dragons in MM2). But the opnly extra dragons that id accept are those from extraplanar dragons such as personal body gaurds of specific deities and those of the MM and the ELH.
EnSabaNur 06-06-04, 08:43 PM	If you all want an extremlly evil race of Dragons kick this idea around; Blight Dragons. These Dragons would be the consumate Necromancers among dragons as well as masters of Vile Magics. an encounter with these horrific Wyrms would be a brush with death. they would have two kinds of breath weapons the first would be a cone of intense frost and cold the second would be a cone of verulent plagues and diseases and to really put adventurers through a wringer they are also Life Drinkers/Soul Eaters. and if that isn't enough of a horror they would also possess the power to create truly powerful undead. even the most skilled paladins would be truly hard pressed to stand against such a horror. They would easily coexist with GraveWyrms and as well work in partnerships with Abyssal Lords and other demonic Puppet- Masters
TigerWolfe 06-08-04, 03:05 AM	how about a gem dragon for each months birth stone
RavinRay 06-08-04, 05:49 AM	Originally posted by TigerWolfe how about a gem dragon for each months birth stone It's on the drawing board (sort of). Garnet - I want to make Sardior's aquatic dragon consort a dark red dragon. Aquamarine - done, but am revising. An aquatic gem dragon. Jasper - another aquatic dragon dragon in the works. Carnelian - a quasi-goddess who is the patron of the subpsionic gem dragons (jade, opal, turquoise). Carnelian is an opaque red variety of chalcedony that was highly prized as signet rings by ancient sovereigns. This carnelian dragon would oppose Sardior's ex-advisor Blithen. Plus, the Ruby, Garnet, and Carnelian Dragons would comprise a sort of Red Triumvirate. Zircon - the third aquatic gem dragon.
Tenzhi 06-11-04, 10:16 PM	Originally posted at The Dragon Foundation (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=47802) by me, I'm reposting it here at the suggestion of drachentoeter. Zhi Lung (Sage Dragon) Enigmatic and aloof, the rare Zhi Lung doesn't seem to have a place in the Celestial Bureaucracy. Instead they seem content to gather vast amounts of knowledge and follow their own, seldom understood paths. A Zhi Lung's body is long and serpentine, coiling in on itself in almost hypnotic patterns as it moves. Its scales are bright silver in its juvenile years, seeming to tarnish black as it ages until the dragon is almost entirely black with silver-edged scales. Great, flowing silvery eyebrows overshadow unseen eyes, and a matching beard and whiskers adorn its muzzle - giving it the appearance of a wise old man. From a Zhi Lung's head sprout great antlers - the colour of ivory in the dragon's youth, they eventually become jet black as the dragon matures. Zhi Lung live wherever their unique path in life takes them, often never settling down in one place for very long (for most dragons this might be problematic, but a Zhi Lung's horde is made up of knowledge). Zhi Lung enjoy eating finely wrought metal, especially if it is enchanted. Though some have been known to develop quite a taste for elf. Zhi Lung Dragon (Spirit) AGE HD Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha Special Abilities Juvenile 20 27 12 19 18 18 18 Breathless, fire and cold immunity, immune to level drain Young Adult 23 29 12 21 20 20 20 DR 5/rosewood Adult 26 31 12 23 22 22 22 Deflecting Force Mature Adult 29 33 12 25 24 24 24 DR 10/rosewood Old 32 37 10 27 26 26 26 Adaptation Very Old 35 39 10 29 28 28 28 DR 15/rosewood Ancient 38 41 10 31 30 30 30 Wyrm 41 43 10 33 32 32 32 DR 20/rosewood Great Wyrm 44 45 10 35 34 34 34 Fear Breath AGE Size Speed* NA DC SR Weapon (DC) Juvenile L 40'/100' +15 -- -- 6d10 (22) Young Adult H 40'/100' +18 27 22 8d10 (25) Adult H 40'/100' +21 29 24 10d10 (26) Mature Adult H 40'/100' +24 31 26 12d10 (29) Old G 40'/150' +27 34 28 14d10 (31) Very Old G 40'/150' +30 37 30 16d10 (34) Ancient G 40'/150' +33 39 32 18d10 (36) Wyrm C 40'/150' +36 42 34 20d10 (39) Great Wyrm C 40'/150' +39 44 36 22d10 (41) * Speed before the slash is for normal movement, swim, and burrow. Speed after the slash is flying speed, average maneuverability. NA: Natural Armor bonus. A Zhi Lung's natural armor is weaker than a typical dragon's. Class abilities: A Zhi Lung retains the class abilities it acquired as a Chin Lung. In addition, a Zhi Lung may only advance in age categories by gaining further class levels. Its BAB and saving throws will vary depending on which classes it advances in, and it will have a variety of class abilities. Breath Weapon (Su): A Zhi Lung has two types of breath weapons - a cone of fire and a cone of cold. Breathless (Ex): A Zhi Lung does not need to breathe. Fly (Su): Though wingless, a Zhi Lung can fly magically due to a magic clear pearl embedded in their brain. If removed from the dragon, this pearl loses its magic but is still worth 5,000 GP. The dragon can cease or resume flight as a free action. Deflecting Force (Su): A Zhi Lung of adult age or older is surrounded by an invisible field of force that grants it a deflection bonus to AC equal to its Charisma bonus. Adaptation (Ex): Once per round as a full-round action, a zhi lung of old age or older may adapt to an environment it is in and become immune to any harmful effects of that environment. Additionally, a zhi lung may use this ability to gain energy immunity against a specific type of energy. Chin Lung (Man Dragon) Lung dragons are creatures of spirit made flesh. The larval form of the rare Zhi Lung dragon is a clear example of this trait at work. Whereas other Lung dragons are born into flesh as a Yu Lung, the Zhi Lung is born as a spirit within a (1 HD) humanoid being. Such beings often do not know they are a dragon until late in their humanoid life, and many die before they can awaken their draconic nature. Chin Lung possess the traits of whatever humanoid they are born as. As soon as they acquire 5 class levels, they gain the abilities of a wyrmling and become aware of their draconic nature. Anytime after it achieves 20 class levels, the Chin Lung can choose to shed its humanoid form and become a full-fledged juvenile Zhi Lung. If the Chin Lung dies after it achieves 20 class levels, but before it chooses to become a Zhi Lung, the death of its humanoid form automatically (and immediately) triggers the transformation. A newly formed Zhi Lung has full hit points. For some reason, the humanoid form of a Chin Lung is noticeably smaller or larger than a typical member of that humanoid race. They also often possess prodigious silver-white eyebrows (or eye ridges, scales, etc as appropriate). The life span of a Chin Lung is twice that of a normal member of the appropriate humanoid race. AGE HD Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha Special Abilities Wyrmling 5 +2 +2 +2 +4 +4 +2 Inferior Dragon Abilities Very Young 10 +4 +2 +4 +4 +4 +2 Reincarnate Young 15 +6 +2 +6 +4 +4 +2 Plane Shift Inferior Dragon Abilities: A Chin Lung lacks the standard lung dragon abilities of invisibility, alternate form, and plane shift. Reincarnate: When it is killed, a Chin Lung of very young or young age will reincarnate (as the spell) within a number of hours equal to its HD when it died. It will be reincarnated as a member of the same race with the minimum number of HD needed to be one age category less than when it was killed. Plane Shift: A young Chin Lung regains the standard Lung dragon plane shift ability.
Kzfanhgod 06-14-04, 09:08 PM	I wonder if there could it possible to make a nine head dragon race who wasn't the big guy dragon aka Io??? Since I know there are some legend regarding a nine headed serpent...
EnSabaNur 06-15-04, 09:06 PM	A race of Dragons that has nine heads. That sounds extra cool, the question would be would they be of the purest good or of the ultimate evil?
Kzfanhgod 06-16-04, 05:49 AM	I was kind of thinking between the line of nine diffrent alignment dragon, some sort like the Demogorgon in the Book of Vile Darkness...however it could be also neutral in alignment as I feel that there isn't many Pow Neutral Dragon around...
Selkie_Guardian 06-21-04, 05:24 PM	Heres 2: The Astral Dragon: Carefree wanderers of space (yes space) these epic dragons are benevolent unless prevoked. There wrath is terrefying however and they are mighty beyond belief. They should be immune to Fire, Cold and Radiation. They breathe a cone of Nuclear fire, Half fire dammage, Hanf radiation dammage. I could also deal cosntitution dammage. The Retrebutive Dragon: Harsh and overrulling, these red and silver epic dragons are judjes. They breathe a cone of retrebution: Extra dive of dammage agaisn chatoic creatures, empowerd dammage agains lawful creatures. Causes good creatures to become shacken. No aditional effect agianst lawful creatures.
Kzfanhgod 06-22-04, 08:32 AM	The Astral Dragon? The Retrebutive Dragon? Holy where you get these Dragons?? DragonLance??
Selkie_Guardian 06-22-04, 03:00 PM	Originally posted by Kzfanhgod The Astral Dragon? The Retrebutive Dragon? Holy where you get these Dragons?? DragonLance?? No Just My own Head! I've never played dragon lance! Oh by the way, another one: The Void Dragon: Cold and compassionless, the Void dragon lurks in space, waiting for unfortunets to devour.
RavinRay 06-23-04, 05:19 AM	Originally posted by Selkie_Guardian The Retrebutive Dragon: Harsh and overrulling, these red and silver epic dragons are judjes. They breathe a cone of retrebution: Extra dive of dammage agaisn chatoic creatures, empowerd dammage agains lawful creatures. Causes good creatures to become shacken. No aditional effect agianst lawful creatures. Actually, the retributive dragon sounds like the silver dragons that act as enforcers to Lendys, the lawful neutral draconic god of justice. I'd say, get an advanced (lawful neutral) silver dragon, then add the lawful archdragon template from Dragon 321, and you've got Lendys' enforcers. Although, I'd rather that instead of three silver dragons, they'd be one silver, one blue, and one emerald dragon, or even axial dragons.
Incenjucar 06-23-04, 06:27 AM	There's already astral dragons, and its anime-strange.
momus69 06-23-04, 03:20 PM	In as far as purple dragons go (my favorite color) wouldnt a half red blue dragon be more powerful since a half red blue would be fully immune to fire and electricity, whereas a purple dragon has a limited immunity to both? A neat dragon idea might be the six winged dragon (FFVII), how about just oddly situated dragons like Brain Wyrms, that have to feed off psychic or mental energies. Wonder if they will bring back those female half dragons from 2nd ed. How about a geni derived dragon that has to grant wishes? I always like cursed dragons that start out as puny humans that have to develop back into their draconic self. How do you react when you thought you only had 100 years to live then turn around and out live the elf?
Kzfanhgod 06-24-04, 05:01 AM	Actually how about this dragon idea...make a Phantom Dragon, which you need to destroy both his astral form in the shadow realm and his meterial form?? Sort of like a lich but not an undead version...however dragon like this most probably a epic one...sign,,,
Rurik "The Silent" 06-27-04, 06:10 PM	Originally posted by Ogre4Hire Currently, I'm working on my own breed of dragon: the dreaded Abyssal Dragon. It's basically a Red Dragon that's adapted to life in the Abyss, and now EVERYBODY is afraid of it. The critter is such a badass, even the Lords of the Abyss give it a wide berth (though they are fond of misdirecting visitors to its layer). I'll post it as soon as I get the stats worked out. in the MMII there is a dragon that is much like this, it is a verycapable fighter and excellent spellcaster. There is not progression for it tho. I really want to see wizards expand the HELLFIRE WYRM. it is my favorite dragon by far, i love the picture, i love deamons and i love dragons, this is basically a dragon-deamon dragon, very impressive. i love it
Rurik "The Silent" 06-27-04, 06:15 PM	ide really like to see a hydra type dragon, one that can generate extra heads. That would be a nice twist
Ghostie Ghost 06-30-04, 05:42 PM	Calzone dragon! (they have a Calzone golem so why not a dragon?) Mirror dragon, similar to the glass dragon, only smooth and if you break him your gonna have bad luck for the next 700000000 years.
Zif 07-01-04, 09:28 AM	The latest Monster Mayhem was the Gravbeast, which inspired me to create a Gravitic Dragon (http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~akluck/grav.txt). It's not entirely fleshed out, and is missing all descriptive text, but I've decided that it's dark purple, so you've got at least that much to go on. :D The link is just to a txt file, so unless you don't mind horizontal scrollbars, I reccomend saving the file and opening it in notepad with Wordwrap on.
Amaron Blackthorn 07-01-04, 01:46 PM	Some of the new planar dragons are pretty neat.
Regdar6 07-07-04, 01:51 AM	I haven't had time to read the whole forum yet, but if anyone could, I would like to see the stats of the dreeaded turbonium dragon. Someone has prolbably already got the cookie, but the Turbonium dragon is from Dork Tower, in one of the comics it eats them, very funny. Well then, Regdar out
obrysii 07-07-04, 12:46 PM	Originally posted by heinzk23111 Brown dragon (any alignment) They're in Monsters of Faerun.
theyettie 07-14-04, 12:40 AM	i didn't read every reply to this thread yet so if i took someones' answer don't be ******. it would be cool to see the stats on a chamelion dragon. i know there are a ccouple dragons out there (shadow and mist dragons) that can blend in with there enviornment somwhat, but one that could blend in with any enviornment would be a DMs dreem. p.s. if anyone has stats on dragons they have made up i would love to have them. please send them to me
Dassadec 10-03-04, 11:52 AM	i didn't read every reply to this thread yet so if i took someones' answer don't be ******. it would be cool to see the stats on a chamelion dragon. i know there are a ccouple dragons out there (shadow and mist dragons) that can blend in with there enviornment somwhat, but one that could blend in with any enviornment would be a DMs dreem. p.s. if anyone has stats on dragons they have made up i would love to have them. please send them to me Going Plaid could have a 50% chance to stun or kill a Chamelion Dragon. :D
The Vorpal Tribble 10-03-04, 12:52 PM	Wrote this not too long ago, leaning a bit more to the exotic than the other dragons. Hows it look? -- Dragon Uncarnate Dragon (Dream, Incorporeal) Climate/Terrain: Any Organization: Wyrmling: solitary; very young, young, juvenile, and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); else: solitary, pair, or family (1-2, and 2-5 very young) Treasure: None Alignment: Always chaotic neutral Dragon uncarnates are ultimately imaginative, creative and unpredictable. They dislike anything that hints at routine or conforming to a norm. They value uniqueness and surprise above all other things. Some say they come from the unheard of liasons of an ethereal and a ectoplasmic dragon, while others say the first dragon uncarnate was a great wyrm of a mind drake that managed to become pure thought. A predator of the medium of thoughts and dreams, a dragon uncarnate is incorporeal and can appear to anyone as any creature it likes, though it rarely bothers, appearing before them in its natural form as a dragon with a very long, sinuous body and tail that extends far out of sight, with no visible end. Its scales are in constant motion, lifting off of the dragon and rearranging and wandering about its surface before lying flat. They are slightly transparent, resembling pure crystal, with the faintest of white glows. It has massive, mebranous wings that perfectly reflect light, having a mirror-like effect. The head of the dragon is long and indistinct with blurred features that never quite come into focus. Two black holes in the face are the shape of eyes, though within tiny white lights chase and revolve about each other. Four thick tentacles protrude from around its mouth, two on top, two on the bottom, eerily resembling a mindflayer's maw. The mouth itself is toothless, with only a dark hole of fathomless depth within. Dragon Uncarnates are almost always on the move, but they are known to often mentally craft themselves a lair in out-of-the-way areas within the Dream Plane/Mindfields. This is, as ofton as not, miles above with large openings in the air itself. These lairs do not always have gravity thats corresponds with the outter pull. Dragon Uncarnates breed by use of metaconcert to combine their minds. Together they produce a mindegg that the female keeps within her until a suitable mind can be found. Dragon Uncarnates communicate telepathically. Combat: A dragon uncarnate usually has no need to fight, stealthily invading a mind and putting them to sleep. Once within the dream the dragon uncarnate has full sway over events. Normally this consists of the dragon sending the dreamer through tests and obstacles requiring imaginative strategies or original thinking to escape. These tests may be cruel and sadistic or quite enjoyable, but either way the dreamer must be creative and win before the dragon allows the sleeper to wake. The dragon drains one temporary level of wisdom from its victim, feeding off of the creativity produced. Those who solve its riddles quickly or do something so unexpected that the dragon uncarnate did not think of it, is normally the recipient of a mind egg, if the dragon is mature. The riddles and scenarios are simple to figure when the dragon is young, but as it ages they become increasingly more difficult. Breath Weapon (Ps): A Dragon Uncarnate has one type of breath weapon, a spray of fragmented mindblades as thrown by a soulknife. Detect Dreams (Ps): The dragon can use this ability at will such as if using the Detect Psionics ability except it can only detect dreaming beings. the dragon can scan a 60-degree arc each round: By concentrating for one round it knows if there are anyone sleeping within the arc; 2 rounds of concentration reveals the exact number of sleeping folk; and three rounds reveal their exact location and their race, allowing it to make a jump straight into their minds. Dreamless Telepathy (Compulsion) [Evil, Mind-Affecting] Level: Telepath 4 Display: Mental Manifesting Time: 1 Range: Medium (100 feet +10/level) Target: One living creature Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: Will negates Power Resistance: Yes Power Points: 7 The subject's brain functions are subtely altered so that the target cannot achieve a dream state. He is able to sleep, but not dream, allowing the use of related spells and psionics against the subject, but the subject themselves are unable to use psionics or magic the next day without their much needed mental downtime. All ability damage caused by this cannot be healed naturally until the subject gets a good night's sleep. Dreamless cannot be dispelled, for a change is made directly to the workings of the brain itself, causing an extended condition. This affect can be removed by psychic chicurgery, reality revision, and similiar effects. Restoration, Heal, Greater Restoration, Bend Reality and Limited Wish remove the affliction. This can only be used if the subject is awake. A second usage of this ability restores the brain to proper balance. Over 8 days, the subject suffers more and more severe reprocussions from the lack of healthy sleep. Subjects that don't dream are unaffected by this power. Those who meditate instead of dreaming are still affected as they are blocked from the neccessary subconscious interaction to refresh themselves. First day: The subject becomes edgy and tired, resulting in a the loss of a point of both intelligence and wisdom. (Int -1, Wis -1, Cha -0) Second day: The subject's adrenaline tries to make up for the lack of sleep, resulting in a +1 bonus to constitution and reflex saves. The mind however is even more weary, resulting in the loss of an additional point of intelligence and wisdom. (+1 Con, Int -2, Wis -2, Cha -0, +1 Reflex) Third day: The subject's adrenaline high wears off, and their entire body is weary with fatigue, resulting in 2 points of constitution, strength, dexterity damage. The subject also takes a -2 penalty on reflex saves. An additional point of intelligence, wisdom and charisma is lost. They also take a -1 to all skill checks. (Str -2, Dex -2 Con -2, Int -3, Wis -3, Cha -1, -2 Reflex, -1 Skill checks) Fourth day: The subject becomes both fatigued and shaken. Two additional points of intelligence, wisdom and charisma are lost. They also take a -2 to all skill checks. They also start to see things that are not there or feel sensations that do not truely exist. (Str -2, Dex -2, Con -2, Int -5, Wis -5, Cha -3, -2 Reflex, -2 Skill Checks, Fatigued, Shaken) Fifth Day: The subject becomes exhausted. Two additional points of intelligence, wisdom and charisma damage. They also take a -4 to all skill checks. They are continuously in the grip of illusions. The subject will panic once every hour unless they make a successful will save (DC 12). (Str -2, Dex -2, Con -2, Int -7, Wis -7, Cha -7, -2 Reflex, -4 Skill Checks, Fatigued, Shaken) Sixth Day: The subject must make a Will save (DC 10) or go insane. They also two additional points of intelligence and wisdom, and two points of charisma. (Str -2, Dex -2, Con -2, Int -9, Wis -9, Cha -9, -2 Reflex, -4 Skill Checks, Fatigued, Shaken) Seventh Day: The subject must make a Will save (DC 10) or go insane. Even if the save is made they are reduced to a gibbering wreck, unable to act in any way and are considered helpless. (Str -2, Dex -2, Con -2, Int -9, Wis -9, Cha -9, -2 Reflex, -4 Skill Checks, Fatigued, Shaken) Eighth Day: The subject falls into a coma, and dies 2d4 hours later, no will save. Augment: Augment: For every additional two power points spent this power affects another target, and the manifestation time increases by 1 round. Incorporeal Subtype: A dragon uncarnate has no physical body. It can be harmed only by other incorporeal creatures, magic weapons or creatures that strike as magic weapons, and spells, spell-like abilities, or supernatural abilities. He is immune to all nonmagical attack forms. Even when hit by spells or magic weapons, it has a 50% chance to ignore any damage from a corporeal source (except for positive energy, negative energy, force effects, or attacks made with ghost touch weapons). A dragon uncarnate can enter or pass through solid objects. It can sense the presence of creatures or objects within a square adjacent to his current location, but enemies have total concealment (50% miss chance) from a dragon uncarnate that is inside an object. To see farther from the object it is in and attack normally, the dragon uncarnate must emerge. An dragon uncarnate inside an object has total cover, but when he attacks a creature outside the object he only has cover, so a creature outside with a readied action could strike at it as he attacks. An dragon uncarnate cannot pass through a force effect unless using dream travel. A dragon uncarnate's attacks pass through (ignore) natural armor, armor, and shields, although deflection bonuses and force effects work normally against it. It can pass through and operate in water as easily as he does in air. An dragon uncarnate cannot fall or take falling damage. It cannot make trip or grapple attacks, nor can it be tripped or grappled. In fact, it cannot take any physical action that would move or manipulate an opponent or its equipment, nor is it subject to such actions. Incorporeal creatures have no weight and do not set off traps that are triggered by weight. An incorporeal creature moves silently and cannot be heard with Listen checks if it doesn’t wish to be. It has no Strength score, so its Dexterity modifier applies to both its melee attack rolls and its ranged attack rolls. Nonvisual senses, such as scent and blindsight, are either ineffective or only partly effective with regard to incorporeal creatures. Incorporeal creatures have an innate sense of direction and can move at full speed even when they cannot see. Incorporeal Touch (Ps): A dragon uncarnate deals damage with its claws same as a normal would, but does it with its incorporeal touch, ignoring nonmagical armor and shields. Mind Egg (Ps): To reproduce a dragon uncarnate lies a mind egg within the consciousness of individuals who have shown themselves to be of unusual resourcefulness and imagination. This egg takes 800 full days to 'hatch' at which point it has completely taken over the host's personality. The human to all appearances is the same, and the wyrmling uncarnate has been within him long enough to know how to control the body and have it act in the general way it did before. Once the wyrmling has grown one size category it is mature enough to leave the host. The host is left with his own personality intact, but is dazed for a day, and has no recollection of what has transpired since the day the wyrmling 'hatched'. Psychic chirugery can remove a mind egg, but not the wyrmling. Healing spells and abilities are useless as the egg/wyrmling is not damaging the host in any way. While the wyrmling is in possession of the body it takes damage to the host as its own. It also takes all the physical abilities and properties of the host. The host gains the Wild Talent feat after it has been released, the possession of the wyrmling having strengthened and expanded the mind to fit its needs during its growth. Mind Melody (Ps): The mindsong is an odd malady that is picked up after telepathic discourse with a mind much more powerful than the subject's, leaving a sort of psionic ringing in the mind that disrupts telepathic communication. It is also passed by telepathic contact with one suffering from this affliction. The first day it takes three extra power points to use any kind of telepathy. The second day twice as many. The third day a player must use up every one of their allotted psionic points to attempt or hear even the briefest message. After three days of this, the ringing forms into a melody that starts to play in the subjects mind. Most of those whom have had this have mentioned that the tune is almost always lovely beyond words. However, every day for the next week it grows louder and louder. The first day of the melody the player is telepathically deaf, and cannot send or receive. It hits its peak at the eighth day of the illness, where the melody is so loud that they cannot even hear normally, and no psionic abilities can be concentrated on. This last for two solid days before slowly becoming softer, reversing the effects until no song is heard, only a ringing, and then this to disappears at the end of the second eight-day. All in all this mental malady takes 18 days to disappear after contacting. While ringing the subject takes a -2 to concentration and listen checks. While the melody plays the subject takes -6 to concentration and listen checks. At peak no concentration, listening or psionic abilities is possible, even with the Unconditional Power feat. A second bout of this disease leaves a subject partially psionically deafened, causing a permanent doubling of psionic points to use telepathic powers and they act as if Dazed during the peak two days. A third bout leaves the subject permanently telepathically deaf and they act as if Insane during the peak. A fourth bout leaves the subject permanently insane as the melody continues unabated. It can be cured by Psychic Chirurgery, but the manifester has a chance of contacting the malady in doing so (a roll of 1 on a six sided die means it has spread to the manifester). Reality Revision can also cure the mindsong. Subconscious Banishment: As psionic banishment, except the banishment is to the plane of dreams, affects all living, thinking creatures. Their bodies are not physically sent, only their minds, making Dream Travel unusable to return. Their physical body remains living, but in a deep coma, such as if under Suspend Life except they are unaware of what is happening about their bodies. Their minds can only be called back using psychic chicurgery, revivify, or any other spells for bringing the soul back to the body. Psionic Powers: At will - Dream haunting, Dream travel, Incorporeal touch, Mind Melody, Uncarnate bridge, Read Thoughts, ; 6/day - Psionic sleep; 2/day - Mass psionic sleep; 1/day - Dreamless, Subconscious Banishment; 1/month - genesis, 4/month - Mind egg, Metaconcert Dragon Uncarnate By Age Age Size HitDice AC AB FS RS WS Wymling * * * +4 * * +10 Very Young S 6d12 17 (+1 size, +3 dex, +3 deflect) +6 +3 +8 +12 Young S 9d12 18 (+1 size, +3 dex, +4 deflect) +9 +5 +10 +14 Juvenile S 12d12 20 (+1 size, +4 dex, +5 deflect) +12 +6 +12 +16 Young Adult M 15d12 20 (+6 deflect, +4 dex) +16 +8 +14 +18 Adult M 18d12 23 (+7 deflect, +6 dex) +20 +10 +16 +20 Mature Adult M 21d12 24 (+8 deflect, +6 dex) +24 +12 +17 +22 Old L 24d12 25 (-1 size, +7 dex, +9 deflect) +28 +14 +19 +25 Very old L 27d12 26 (-1 size, +7 dex, +10 deflect) +32 +15 +20 +28 Ancient H 30d12 28 (-2 size, +9 dex, +11 deflect) +36 +17 +22 +30 Wyrm G 33d12 27 (-4 size, +9 dex, +12 deflect) +38 +18 +24 +33 Great Wyrm C 36d12 25 (-8 size, +10 dex, +13 deflect) +42 +20 +25 +35 BW(DC) Fear DC SR 2d4 - - 4d4 - - 6d4 - - 8d4 - - 10d4 25 22 12d4 27 24 14d4 30 26 16d4 33 28 18d4 35 29 20d4 37 31 22d4 40 32 24d4 42 34 Dragon Uncarnate Abilities By Age Age Speed Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha Special Abilities Wyrmling - * * * * * * Uncarnate, fatelink, incorporeal subtype, psionic sleep Very Young - - 16 12 16 17 16 Dream Haunting, incorporeal touch Young - - 16 12 18 19 18 Dream Travel Juvenile - - 19 15 20 21 20 Uncarnate bridge Young Adult - - 19 17 22 23 22 Mindegg, Metaconcert Adult - - 22 17 24 25 24 Psionic mass sleep Mature Adult - - 22 19 26 27 26 Mind Melody, Damage reduction 5/+1 Old - - 25 21 28 29 28 Detect Dreams Very old - - 25 21 30 31 30 Dreamless Ancient - - 28 23 32 33 32 Genesis Wyrm - - 28 25 34 35 34 Damage reduction 15/+2 Great Wyrm - - 31 25 36 37 36 Subconscious Banishment Psion Level** - - - 1st 3rd 5th 7th 9th 11th 13th 15th 17th * A dragon uncarnate wyrmling has only the stats of its current host. ** Can also manifest abilities from the psychic warrior category.
Master Agnald 10-03-04, 09:50 PM	Hummm... I always thought a good idea for a dragon would be some sort of mechanic or partially mechanic dragon... it could be immune to magic like a golem :devil: ... and have some nasty machine-like attacks.
The Vorpal Tribble 10-03-04, 10:31 PM	*grins* --- Reeptlecarn Desription: This once might have been a dragon but now appears to be as much automotive as reptile. It has a vaguely beetled shape with a rounded top and broad front with two very muscular back legs with five long-clawed toes. The front has two monster truck-sized wheels with well-worn treads. It has two doors one each side with a claw like extension resembling a handle. It has two divided windshields with resting wipers. Its front headlights are directly above the chrome front bumper, with slitted reptilian pupils behind the protective glass cover. Its hood is highly flexible, with rows of curved teeth that gleam metalically. From the back compartment grows a long, powerful tail. A leathery, wrinkled, light-tan to murky greenish gray skin covers the entire creature. From beneath and to the side of the tail an exhaust pipe puffs with each of the creature's exhalations. Combat: Reeptlecarn prefers to lie in wait beneath piles of wreckage, or submerged within large bodies of water. It will then rev its engine and spin its wheels frantically towards you, its back legs giving it extra push and momentum. Red breaking lights will flash directly in warning, giving the barest warning before it springs. Breath Weapon (Su): Every 1d4 rounds Reeptlecarn can spew out a line of battery acid 100 ft long., dealing 14d4 points of acid damage. Hardness (Ex): Reetlecarn's internal structure is mainly steel reinforcement, giving it a hardness of 10. Improved Overrun (Ex): Once it is no longer hidden it will make an attempt to ram its opponent if of medium size or larger, or merely run over if of smaller. My Light (Ex): Reeptlecarn can turn on its headlights and beam forth a 60-foot cone of light. Tail Slap (Ex): This creature can slap one opponent each round with its tail, dealing 2d6 damage plus 1-1/2 times its strength bonus (round down), and is treated as a secondary attack. Trample (Ex): Reeptlecarn can trample creatures two or more sizes smaller than itself, dealing damage equal to the object's slam damage + 1-1/2 times its strength bonus. Up the Wall (Ex): It can chase a creature up a sheer surface like the psionic ability Walk Walk by use of its back claws to grip and its front tires pulling upwards, and can be found clinging to the sides of buildings at times. It cannot hang upside down. Psi Abilities: At will/Compression to a maximum of small. Size and type: Huge Construct Hit-dice: 12d10 +50 Initiative: +0 Speed: 60 ft. (land), climb 40 ft. Armor class: 22 (-2 size, -2 dex, +16 natural), touch 7, flat footed 13 Base attack/grapple: +6/+19 Space/reach: 20 ft. long, 10 ft. tall Attack: Slam +10 melee, 3d20 +10 Full attack: 1 Slam +10 melee, 3d20 +10 Special Attacks: Tail slap, trample Special Qualities: Construct traits, darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision. Saves: Fort 18, Ref 8, Will 5 Abilities: Str 26, Dex 6, Con -, Int 4, Wis 1, Cha 3 Skills: Climb +24*, Listen +6, Intimidate +10, Hide +9, Feats: Improved overrun, Up the walls, Stand Still, Power Attack Environment: Any Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 14-16 Treasure: Triple Standard Alignment: Neutral Advancement: - Level Adjustment: -
RavinRay 10-08-04, 11:50 AM	Well, Penny Williams just gave us a new true dragon from the Forgotten Realm's Shining South. To quote from 10 Reasons Why DMs Should Get The Shining South (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/news/20041008news): 6. New Monsters: The monsters detailed in The Shining South include a new, wingless, true dragon (the rattelyr), Which is the Colossal monster depicted.
Rinian2 10-09-04, 12:33 AM	How about an H.R. Giger Alien Dragon? Boiling acid breath weapon, ridiculous cunning, reflexes, and instincts, the scary no-eyes thing, and pity the hero who cuts the Giger Dragon's hide ... acid for blood! One downside would be that most of the treasure would have been destroyed by the very same acid. I'm fairly sure I've seen an old Dragon magazine cover with one of these guys going up against a fighter jet! Going Plaid could have a 50% chance to stun or kill a Chamelion Dragon.Heh heh heh, "Can't ... do ... plaid ..." THUD!
RavinRay 10-09-04, 08:52 PM	The Art Gallery for Shining South is up, and check out the new picture of the rattelyr (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ssouth_gallery/84379.jpg). Looks like a dragon with the hood of a cobra and the rattle of, well, a rattlesnake. If it does have the least bit amount of snake genes (or whatever amounts to genes in your setting), I'd be a bit disappointed for it as a true dragon, as I expect such creatures to be purely draconic, with none of their abilities deriving from "outside" heritages. Even if you make the call that the dragon completely subsumes those genes. Now for a much uglier beast; not a dragon per se, but a hybrid nonetheless, the mantimera (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ssouth_gallery/84373.jpg), which, in this case, is a cross between, you guessed it, a manticore and a blue-dragon-based chimera. Nasty critter you've got there.
RPGfish 10-09-04, 08:59 PM	I may just be replying while not knowing what I am talking about, but are Platinum Ruby Saphire Emerald Diamond Crystal in the book? I have tried creating them into random maps, yet this would require creating new random encounter lists, maps, ect. If they are in there I should really consider getting several monster manuals instead of the 1 I have.
The Vorpal Tribble 10-10-04, 02:07 AM	I had the oddest thought the other day of a thri-kreen/dragon halfbreed... man wouldn't that be a looker.
DarkDragonlord 10-10-04, 10:30 AM	i have a few draconic ideas: limbo dragon (mounts for the gith) blade dragon (deadly warriors native to archon) blitz wyrm (a type of dragon made from hermes) void dragon (a dragon made of void)
RavinRay 10-10-04, 11:13 AM	I may just be replying while not knowing what I am talking about, but are Platinum Ruby Saphire Emerald Diamond Crystal in the book? Respectively: Bahamut, the god of the metallic dragons Sardior, the god of the gem dragons (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/psi/psi20030124a) Lawful neutral gem dragon (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/we/we20010330a) Lawful neutral gem dragon Proposed new gem dragon (various versions by various people) Chaotic neutral gem dragon
Rodent of Unusual Size 10-13-04, 07:50 AM	Yeah, Emerald, Crystal and Sapphire are in the book... Void Dragon is a creature from the world of Rokugan in fact, ie an oriental dragon, like Water, Fire, Earth and Air. Void is the so-called fifth element. They also seem to have Thunder and Jade, but they are not as great as the elementals.
Mizik 10-21-04, 04:06 AM	Magnetic dragon: thought dragon: Gravitaionnal dragon: Mimic Dragon:
RavinRay 11-13-04, 05:54 PM	The Art Gallery for Eberron's Sharn: City of Towers has a new dragon, the spiretop dragon. No idea as to whether it is a true or lesser dragon, but it seems highly urbanized, like some Greyhawk/steel dragons are in Oerth and Faerûn, respectively. And the MM3 writers say new dragons ain't needed - except in Eberron and the Forgotten Realms, apparently. (Not that you can't use these dragons in your campaign.) Boy, if London, New York, and other cities have problems with pigeon poop, imagine the nightmare Sharn must have. :D http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/sharn_gallery/84603.jpg
R.M.G.C.L.F. 11-15-04, 06:50 AM	Some great, powerful, positive and negative energy dragons. Negative energy dragon has two breath weapons, a cone of slay living and a cone of animate dead. Positive energy dragon has a cone of transmute undeath to death and a cone of raise dead. Negative dragon also gets an eye beam of create undead while positive gets eye beam of ressurection, and they've each got a spell like ability once per day with the negative having create greater undead and the positive having true ressurection. They would probably be unique since they're so powerful, maybe even Divine Rank 0.
RavinRay 03-14-05, 04:43 AM	The latest of the environmentally-themed books, Sandstorm (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/177390000), has a new dragon which is depicted in the Art Gallery (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ag/20050311a), the sand dragon (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/sand_gallery/87620.jpg). Don't know yet if it is a true dragon or lesser dragon. So, in deserts we have blue dragons, brass dragons, desert landwyrms, air drakes, brown dragons, and rattelyr dragons (?) (the latter two in the Forgotten Realms). Getting to be quite crowded there. http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/sand_gallery/tn_87620_jpg.jpg
RavinRay 04-08-05, 03:44 AM	Check out this post (http://www.enworld.org/showpost.php?p=2131604&postcount=1) from EN World for a complete list of all dragons in all official WotC sources (WotC books, web articles, and Dragon and Dungeon magazines).
urial angel of death 04-08-05, 06:39 PM	Scaletaint Dragon (yuan-ti dragons anyone?) already done in either serpant kingdoms or MM3
D&D_Madness 5000 04-08-05, 11:40 PM	How about an evil dragon from another planar who's black, it's cool!
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 04-10-05, 01:49 PM	Edit: Doh! Beaten to it. By several months. Anyways, somewhere I had a sheet on which I wrote a bunch of dragons down that I was going to create eventually. I never got around to it, and it's been about 4 years since I've even seen the paper, but I know it's around here somewhere. If I find it, I'll post the dragons. I do remember a few though. Pestilence Dragon - Spreads disease Fossil Dragon Moss Dragon And since I had come up with a Pestilence Dragon, I might as well suggest War Dragons, Death Dragons, Famine Dragons, and, just for the hell of it, Ronnie Soak Dragons.
RavinRay 09-15-05, 05:45 AM	Time to :bump: this thread again to the top of the forum, because of some dragon-related news. First up is the incarnum dragon from Magic of Incarnum. Don't know if this is a lesser or true dragon (probably true), but I'd guess it's non-good, and has innate spellcasting abilities different from other dragons. http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/moi_gallery/91216.jpg Next are the "missing" chromatic dragons from Dragon Magazine: they first appeared in 1ed (my guess) in Dragon 65, in 2ed in Dragon 248, and will finally be in 3.5ed in the Dragon Compendium (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa&origin=). (Some Paizo message board members have already been in the know since at least July.) What this possibly means is that, if Toril's yellow dragon of Mulhorand ever gets officially converted, it will have to have a new name. Oh, and I'm just wondering whether those three will be "true" chromatic dragons or merely similar to them, like the mercury and steel dragons are to metallic dragons. Coz if it's the former case, then there need to be three new metallic dragons to balance them.
OamuTheMonk 09-15-05, 02:12 PM	Surely a lesser Dragon based on a charming 1967 cartoon is an acceptable option. He's at the bottom of my Herculoids (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=500694) thread.
JiCi 09-15-05, 09:19 PM	Wasn't there a family of dragon species which could cast druid spells and one of them had a tree sap breath weapon or something like that ?
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 09-15-05, 09:30 PM	Wasn't there a family of dragon species which could cast druid spells and one of them had a tree sap breath weapon or something like that ? Amber Dragons. They kicked ass.
JiCi 09-16-05, 07:05 AM	Amber Dragons. They kicked ass. Ok, where can I take a look at them ?
RavinRay 09-16-05, 08:04 AM	Amber dragons are 2e, but I've made my own 3.5e amber dragon along with its aquatic counterpart the pearl dragon. (Both are based on organic gemstones.)
JiCi 09-16-05, 08:14 AM	Oh, ok. Say RavinRay, is it just me or your Aquamarine Dragon isn't updated to 3.5 ? Its psionic powers follow the 3.0 rules, such as d20 + str mod + power level. Aside from that, your dragons look great. Can't wait to pit them against my PCs.
RavinRay 09-16-05, 08:18 AM	Yup, that was a 3.0 aquamarine dragon way back. It's now 3.5. I'd actually want someone to playtest it before I submit my aquatic dragons proposal to Paizo's Dragon...
JiCi 09-18-05, 02:17 PM	Yup, that was a 3.0 aquamarine dragon way back. It's now 3.5. I'd actually want someone to playtest it before I submit my aquatic dragons proposal to Paizo's Dragon... Hmm, well they don't seem overpowered, their behavior are quite representative and they make perfect half-dragons ;) (with swim speed equals to land speed; if Large or larger, this swim speed is doubled because of their fins)
JiCi 09-27-05, 09:03 PM	bump come on, this topic rocks.
RavinRay 09-30-05, 08:29 AM	Okay, the Dragon Compendium Table of Contents (http://paizo.com/download/dragon/compendium/TableOfContents.pdf) is out courtesy of Paizo, and it's official: the orange, purple, and yellow dragons are listed as chromatic dragons. So with eight chromatics (is the brown dragon of the Realms a true chromatic?), the metallics are outnumbered, unless the steel dragon (but it can be LN) and mercury dragon (only one breath weapon) are considered, which still leaves the ranks one short. And no, the turbonium dragon ain't a metallic.
JiCi 10-01-05, 07:56 AM	Okay, the Dragon Compendium Table of Contents (http://paizo.com/download/dragon/compendium/TableOfContents.pdf) is out courtesy of Paizo, and it's official: the orange, purple, and yellow dragons are listed as chromatic dragons. So with eight chromatics (is the brown dragon of the Realms a true chromatic?), the metallics are outnumbered, unless the steel dragon (but it can be LN) and mercury dragon (only one breath weapon) are considered, which still leaves the ranks one short. And no, the turbonium dragon ain't a metallic. Where did you get that ? Is it 3.0 or 3.5 ? And I recalled hearing that all dragons associated with a color is an evil chromatic dragon, so a brown dragon IS a chromatic dragon. The only thing that proved wrong is that, in the 2e edition, they stated that a brown dragon isn't a true chromatic dragon because it has no wings, just as the steel dragon isn't a true metallic dragon because it only has i breath weapon instead of two. IMO, these are bogus reasons.
RavinRay 10-01-05, 11:08 AM	Where did you get that ? Is it 3.0 or 3.5 ? Are you referring to the chromatics? The ToC doesn't mention the individual dragons, but the write-up for the Compendium does. The missing chromatics are one of the more popular requests for a 3.5 monster conversion as it has been requested both here and at the Paizo message boards quite a number of times, and have been converted at EN World as well. And yes, they are gonna be 3.5.
RavinRay 10-14-05, 05:06 PM	Heads up! Dragon #337 (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/issues/2005/337) (Nov. 2005) has another dragon, per the solicits: Monsters of the Mind by Kevin Baase, Eric Jansing, and Oliver Frank Five horrible monsters that prey on your thoughts. Revisit old classics like the ustilagor and explore new horrors like the brainstealer dragon. So, will it be psionic?
Dungeons & Donuts 10-15-05, 12:37 AM	Bacon Dragon, Car Insurance Dragon, Home-Loan Dragon, Celestial Lesser Cheese Dragon... :)
JiCi 11-12-05, 09:35 AM	Heads up! Dragon #337 (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/issues/2005/337) (Nov. 2005) has another dragon, per the solicits: Monsters of the Mind by Kevin Baase, Eric Jansing, and Oliver Frank Five horrible monsters that prey on your thoughts. Revisit old classics like the ustilagor and explore new horrors like the brainstealer dragon. So, will it be psionic? Just got the Dragon issue ! and this dragon is wicked: it's like an half-illithid dragon, except it has 12 age categories and doesn't have wing attacks; it DOES have wings but aren't suited for battle. Now if I can just figure out how to create a half-dragon of that kind.
RavinRay 12-02-05, 07:21 AM	:bump: ing this one as it has become not just a thread for posting homebrew dragons, but a clearing post of sorts for new official dragons appearing in both Wizards and Paizo products.
MrAdam 12-02-05, 12:29 PM	Personally, I've never been too into dragons (i've never gotten into the fact that chromatic dragons are evil, metalic dragons are good, and gem dragons are neutral...and psionic) RECENTLY, HOWEVER I had a revalation! After reading other RPGs (including that vile paladium fantasy rpg) and Several fantasy novels (Including the Pern books, Harry Poter ect.) and seeing some movies (Including Harry Poter +the goblet of fire: which finally made dragons scary again!) I came to a grand revalation! I don't NEED D+D's "colorful" Dragons! I can make my own! SO here are some Ideas I have! Mud Dragon- Looking like a great tyranosaurus tiny, nearly useless wings and scales that look like overlaping plates of wet mud, and glowing pinpoints of hatefull red light for eyes, This swamp dwelling dragon, resents all intrusion into it's lair, and deals with any intrusion hashly. While mud dragons lack the ability to fly, they can jump hundreds of yards with their powerfull legs (assisted by their wings) Mud Dragons breath blasts of scalding hot mud Wooly Dragon- An extremely primitive dragon, Wooly Dragons are hulking dracoforms covered in long, thick hair.Wooly Dragons lack functional wings, and aren't terribly bright, their, mouths runneth over with virulent venom, wich they can spit with frightening acuracy. Dragon Toad- Resembling a monstrous frog covered in slick black flesh, glowing golden eyes, massive, majestic wings and a stubby, stinger tipped tail, Dragon Toads are sedentry dragons, content to lie half-submerged in their swampy homes all day, snagging passing creatures with their hundred-foot long harpoon-tipped tongues to be hauled into it's mouth as a quick snack. Dragon Toads can ocasionally be roused by offers of food or treasure to give advice or occasionally hire out it's services as a mercenary. When in battle, dragon toads are horrifying opponents, Leaping about the battlefield crushing it's foes beneath it's bulk. Angel Dragon- While these creatures may look beautiful and angelic, with their long sinuous forms, pearl like scales that give off soft white light, majestic, crystalyne wings and short, almost canine faces with long whiskers and beutiful golden eyes, Angel dragons are wicked, cruel, malicious creatures who delight in causing pain and suffering. While small, Angel Dragons, delight in combat, tearing apart even much larger creatures, with their claws and teeth, and their fearsome breath weapon, a rain of razor sharp crystaline fragments. Angel Dragons dwell in inaccesible aeries, that they fill with all sorts of luxuries and slaves who wait on them hand and foot.
RavinRay 12-23-05, 07:31 AM	Starting off 2006, the Year of Dragons, Paizo has for issue #339 (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/issues/2006/339) (January cover date, but out already), plenty of dragon goodies. From the solicits: Classic Creatures by Sean K Reynolds From the animus to the xvart, sixteen of Grayhawk, Mystara, and Ravenloft’s deadliest denizens return to menace your campaign. This includes the greyhawk dragon. Dragon Kings by Chris Flipse and Jon Sederqvist Defile the land and raise your own empire as one of Dark Sun’s godlike dragon kings. The first in Dragon’s new Year of Dragons anniversary series. Plus! The Ecology of the Draconian... Written by Dragonlance Campaign Setting team member Cam Banks, this details the popular dragonmen of Krynn. Dragon Toad- Resembling a monstrous frog covered in slick black flesh, glowing golden eyes, massive, majestic wings and a stubby, stinger tipped tail... While not a dragon toad per se, the amphidragon of Krynn resembles it physically. You can find the draft 3.x stats here (http://www.dl3e.com/fan/rules/12680.aspx), but the official stats are in the Bestiary of Krynn (http://dragonlance.com/products/SVP-4801.aspx).
JiCi 12-23-05, 09:40 AM	Starting off 2006, the Year of Dragons, Paizo has for issue #339 (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/issues/2006/339) (January cover date, but out already), plenty of dragon goodies.You bet, but the Greyhawk Dragon is actually the Steel Dragon, published by WotC for a Monster Mayhem article. Say RavinRay, you're good with dragons, are you. There has been quite a commotion about felldrakes. Ever since I posted my platinum felldrake (see below), some other guys started posting their own felldrakes: CWSLYCLGH posted a winged felldrake (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=556284) and a plated felldrake (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=557405) and Athanathos will eventually post its own. But some guy called Savant Warlord 13 kept saying that all of us are wrong about a felldrake's true shape: must not have wings, breath weapons, yaddy yaddy yadda. I would like to have your opinion on this, as well as your opinion on my homebrewed felldrake if you don't mind. :D Platinum Felldrake Large Dragon HD: 10d12+50 (115 hp) Initiative: +5 Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares), 120 ft. (average) Armor Class: 25 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +15 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 24 Base Attack/Grapple: +10/+21 Attack: Bite +16 melee (2d6+7) Full Attack: Bite +16 melee (2d6+7) and 2 fore claws +14 melee (1d8+3) and tail slap +14 melee (1d8+10) Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. (5 ft. with fore claws and hind claws) Special Attacks: Breath weapon, hind claws 1d8+3 Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., immunity to cold, magic sleep effects and paralysis, low-light vision, +4 to saves vs. fire effects, scent. Saves: Fort +12, Ref +8, Will +9 Abilities: Str 24, Dex 13, Con 20, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12 Skills: Diplomacy +11, Listen +14, Search +10, Sense Motive +12, Spot +14, Survival +12 Feats: Alertness, Flyby Attack, Multiattack, Improved Initiative Environment: Cold plains Organization: Solitary or pairs Challenge Rating: 8 Treasure: None Alignment: Always neutral good Advancement: 11-18 HD (Large); 19-24 HD (Huge) Level Adjustment: +6 This long, sinuous dragon is covered in silver-white scales that sparkle and gleam with a light on their own. Its catlike eyes shift between the blue of an azure sky and the chill of a frozen glacier, as its mood determines. Its head has several tentacle whiskers protruding from the cheeks, under its chin and behind the eyebrows. There is also a strangle and pleasant winter breeze surrounding this dragon and its breath feels cold and chilling. The felldrakes trace their origin to Bahamut the Platinum Dragon. After helping a group of powerful elf wizards turn back a demonic invasion, Bahamut created the felldrakes to guard the elves against future incursions. All felldrakes have the blood of Bahamut in their veins and are fierce, loyal and good at heart. Sages have debated on if the platinum felldrake is just another Aspect of Bahamut or an completely new creature. To Bahamut himself, he knows that this felldrake is the first of its kind that resemble its creator, not a divine replica that can be summoned by rituals and spells. A platinum felldrake is often mistaken for a Large silver dragon, but observers can tell the difference, since it does not sport a pair of horns nor a spine crest. Many priests mistook it for an Aspect of Bahamut, but many missing abilities betrayed the felldrake’s true nature. Like all the felldrakes, they can exceptional guards, protectors and even battle steeds to those who can afford it. Platinum felldrakes speak Common, Draconic and Sylvan. So far, only this felldrake has been known to communicate with other common races. Combat A platinum felldrake can withstand several hits and can wipe out multiple opponents all at the same time. Before entering melee, platinum felldrakes generally circle in midair before diving toward the opponent, whether it is airborne itself. It uses its breath weapon as often as it can, leaving frozen shards in the aftermath of a battle. Breath weapon (Su) : 40-ft. cone of cold, once every 1d4 rounds, 6d8 of cold damage, Reflex DC 20 half. The save DC is Constitution-based. Hind claws (Ex) : When airborne or when grappling, a platinum felldrake can rake using its hind claws instead, much like a pouncing feline. It can make 2 rakes, each at a +14 attack bonus and the hind claws deal 1d8+3 pts of damage. Platinum felldrakes as Special Mounts At the DM’s option, a paladin of 15th level or higher can call a platinum felldrake as his or her special mount. For the purposes of the mount’s bonus Hit Dice, natural armor, Strength adjustment, Intelligence score and special powers, treat the paladin as if he or she was ten levels lower than actual. Last Edit: Dec 24 2005
RavinRay 12-23-05, 05:27 PM	Jici, there's an interesting discussion here (http://paizo.com/dragon/messageboards/generalDiscussion/16Monsters16MONSTERSWOW) about the greyhawk/steel dragon. As for the felldrakes, the way I read the Monster Manual II and Draconomicon entries, it doesn't preclude Bahamut creating winged felldrakes in the future. Perhaps the three original ones, followed by the spiked, were wingless. It's not far-fetched to see Bahamut necessitating the need to create winged felldrakes, say for tree-dwelling elves. The lack of wing slam attacks is a good way to balance its lesser CR, since I think it should be better reserved for true dragons. Is its fire resistance 10 the reason it doesn't have the cold subtype? Looking at the Draconomicon, it falls between a young and juvenile silver dragon in terms of CR (7 and 10 respectively). I think you balanced it out pretty well. It doesn't have spells, but it has better dexterity, flying maneuverability (though slower), larger breath weapon, and tail and rake attacks as compared to the young silver.
JiCi 12-23-05, 06:41 PM	As for the felldrakes, the way I read the Monster Manual II and Draconomicon entries, it doesn't preclude Bahamut creating winged felldrakes in the future. Perhaps the three original ones, followed by the spiked, were wingless. It's not far-fetched to see Bahamut necessitating the need to create winged felldrakes, say for tree-dwelling elves.Ok, that's reassure me, thanks. The lack of wing slam attacks is a good way to balance its lesser CR, since I think it should be better reserved for true dragons. Is its fire resistance 10 the reason it doesn't have the cold subtype?Let me get this straight: you're telling me it's too powerful for its CR due to its additionnal wing attacks, is that it ? Now that you mention it, you're right. I'll correct it right amay, and yes you're right about the resistance to fire. I wanted a creature immune to cold, but not weak against fire. So no cold subtype and a minor resistance to fire. Looking at the Draconomicon, it falls between a young and juvenile silver dragon in terms of CR (7 and 10 respectively). I think you balanced it out pretty well. It doesn't have spells, but it has better dexterity, flying maneuverability (though slower), larger breath weapon, and tail and rake attacks as compared to the young silver.Gee... :D ... thanks, that's the first time someone tells me that. Feel free to tell me if there is another problem with my monster.
RavinRay 12-24-05, 02:18 AM	No, I think you've pretty much nailed it down for your felldrake. It's just stronger than a young silver dragon but weaker than a juvenile. As a substitute for fire resistance, you could give it a +n bonus on saving throws versus fire. And, having no wing attacks is compensated for by the tail and rake attacks. Hope this helps. :)
JiCi 12-24-05, 07:35 AM	No, I think you've pretty much nailed it down for your felldrake. It's just stronger than a young silver dragon but weaker than a juvenile. As a substitute for fire resistance, you could give it a +n bonus on saving throws versus fire. And, having no wing attacks is compensated for by the tail and rake attacks. Hope this helps. :)Yes it does, thanks. I wanted to create a dragon that could also serve a mount, but cooler looking than a dragonnel. Also, the Aspect of Bahamut was quite a piece of artwork, so why not make a felldrake that looks like it. I guess I did a great job, but I couldn't done without some support. So, who wants a platinum felldrake-riding Platinum Knight/Vassal of Bahamut ?
Karn Dragonsbane 12-24-05, 08:35 AM	Hmmm... I was thinking of doing the same thing... about the thread. Well, please, don´t stat those types. Original ideas are hard to come by: Source Starfire ???? (the ???? dragon is going to be some kind of blue mage, but I haven´t decided its name yet) Really, don´t.
zzap1990 12-24-05, 12:32 PM	the Trap Dragon it would live in the ground like a trap door spider and has a kobold like apendage that sticks above the ground and threatens people to attack it so when they come nere the dragon rears up and blast them away!
savant_warlord13 12-24-05, 12:48 PM	You bet, but the Greyhawk Dragon is actually the Steel Dragon, published by WotC for a Monster Mayhem article. Say RavinRay, you're good with dragons, are you. There has been quite a commotion about felldrakes. Ever since I posted my platinum felldrake (see below), some other guys started posting their own felldrakes: CWSLYCLGH posted a winged felldrake (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=556284) and a plated felldrake (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=557405) and Athanathos will eventually post its own. But some guy called Savant Warlord 13 kept saying that all of us are wrong about a felldrake's true shape: must not have wings, breath weapons, yaddy yaddy yadda. I would like to have your opinion on this, as well as your opinion on my homebrewed felldrake if you don't mind. :D Platinum Felldrake Large Dragon HD: 10d12+50 (115 hp) Initiative: +5 Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares), 120 ft. (average) Armor Class: 25 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +15 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 24 Base Attack/Grapple: +10/+21 Attack: Bite +16 melee (2d6+7) Full Attack: Bite +16 melee (2d6+7) and 2 fore claws +14 melee (1d8+3) and tail slap +14 melee (1d8+10) Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. (5 ft. with fore claws and hind claws) Special Attacks: Breath weapon, hind claws 1d8+3 Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., immunity to cold, magic sleep effects and paralysis, low-light vision, +4 to saves vs. fire effects, scent. Saves: Fort +12, Ref +8, Will +9 Abilities: Str 24, Dex 13, Con 20, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12 Skills: Diplomacy +11, Listen +14, Search +10, Sense Motive +12, Spot +14, Survival +12 Feats: Alertness, Flyby Attack, Multiattack, Improved Initiative Environment: Cold plains Organization: Solitary or pairs Challenge Rating: 8 Treasure: None Alignment: Always neutral good Advancement: 11-18 HD (Large); 19-24 HD (Huge) Level Adjustment: +6 This long, sinuous dragon is covered in silver-white scales that sparkle and gleam with a light on their own. Its catlike eyes shift between the blue of an azure sky and the chill of a frozen glacier, as its mood determines. Its head has several tentacle whiskers protruding from the cheeks, under its chin and behind the eyebrows. There is also a strangle and pleasant winter breeze surrounding this dragon and its breath feels cold and chilling. The felldrakes trace their origin to Bahamut the Platinum Dragon. After helping a group of powerful elf wizards turn back a demonic invasion, Bahamut created the felldrakes to guard the elves against future incursions. All felldrakes have the blood of Bahamut in their veins and are fierce, loyal and good at heart. Sages have debated on if the platinum felldrake is just another Aspect of Bahamut or an completely new creature. To Bahamut himself, he knows that this felldrake is the first of its kind that resemble its creator, not a divine replica that can be summoned by rituals and spells. A platinum felldrake is often mistaken for a Large silver dragon, but observers can tell the difference, since it does not sport a pair of horns nor a spine crest. Many priests mistook it for an Aspect of Bahamut, but many missing abilities betrayed the felldrake’s true nature. Like all the felldrakes, they can exceptional guards, protectors and even battle steeds to those who can afford it. Platinum felldrakes speak Common, Draconic and Sylvan. So far, only this felldrake has been known to communicate with other common races. Combat A platinum felldrake can withstand several hits and can wipe out multiple opponents all at the same time. Before entering melee, platinum felldrakes generally circle in midair before diving toward the opponent, whether it is airborne itself. It uses its breath weapon as often as it can, leaving frozen shards in the aftermath of a battle. Breath weapon (Su) : 40-ft. cone of cold, once every 1d4 rounds, 6d8 of cold damage, Reflex DC 20 half. The save DC is Constitution-based. Hind claws (Ex) : When airborne or when grappling, a platinum felldrake can rake using its hind claws instead, much like a pouncing feline. It can make 2 rakes, each at a +14 attack bonus and the hind claws deal 1d8+3 pts of damage. Platinum felldrakes as Special Mounts At the DM’s option, a paladin of 15th level or higher can call a platinum felldrake as his or her special mount. For the purposes of the mount’s bonus Hit Dice, natural armor, Strength adjustment, Intelligence score and special powers, treat the paladin as if he or she was ten levels lower than actual. Last Edit: Dec 24 2005 It has too many limbs to be a Felldrake, and as for the part about this being the only Felldrake to communicate, that is simply untrue. All Felldrakes talk. Its just that in most cases, nobody understands them because of their obscure languages. You are also wrong about what I have been saying. I said I thought it might say in the MM2 that felldrakes are wingless and have no breath weapons. I was wrong about the breath weapons, as I made a point of mentioning, and later agreed that as long as they did not have extra limbs, wings would be okay in a felldrake. (think wyvern) Where did hind claws come from? Have you ever heard of a rake attack? And how does a creature of this size get average manuverability? And with a constitution based DC for its breath weapon, the DC should be 15, not 20. A way around this would be to say it gets a racial bonus on the save DC, as was done with the neogi. I think you also may have too many feats in there, but I am unsure of that.
DMaster42 12-24-05, 02:13 PM	hey Insanity i was just looking at your dragons and i realized that Necromancy Dragon would be perfect in my campaign, but i wanted to ask your permission before i used it. So do I have your permission to use it?
JiCi 12-24-05, 03:01 PM	It has too many limbs to be a Felldrake, and as for the part about this being the only Felldrake to communicate, that is simply untrue. All Felldrakes talk. Its just that in most cases, nobody understands them because of their obscure languages.Too many limbs ? A felldrake doesn't a fixed shape you know. That's what I have been trying to tell you since the beginning. Until we know for sure that felldrakes are just quadruped wingless dragons, we can make them just like we please. I'm not breaking any rule, this rule doesn't exist... for now. Do you understand ? As for the languages, this is the only felldrake so far who also speaks Common. The others speak Sylvan and Draconic only. You are also wrong about what I have been saying. I said I thought it might say in the MM2 that felldrakes are wingless and have no breath weapons. I was wrong about the breath weapons, as I made a point of mentioning, and later agreed that as long as they did not have extra limbs, wings would be okay in a felldrake. (think wyvern)see above. Beside, don't you think a Bahamut-lookalike felldrake is nice ? You're also telling me that a two-headed felldrake isn't a felldrake anymore. Geez... you sure know how to break a person's bubble. Where did hind claws come from? Have you ever heard of a rake attack?It is written in the MM 3.5 that airborne dragons can make additional claw attacks with their hind legs, but not with their wings, hence the idea. And how does a creature of this size get average manuverability?Size isn't much of a criteria of manuverability. Rocs are gargantuan and have average manuverability. Thunderbirds are huge and have good manuverability. And with a constitution based DC for its breath weapon, the DC should be 15, not 20. A way around this would be to say it gets a racial bonus on the save DC, as was done with the neogi.The DC for a breath weapon is 10 + 1/2 the creature's HD + con modifier: 10 + 5 (10 / 2) + 5 (20 -> 5) = 20. I think you also may have too many feats in there, but I am unsure of that.For the feats, its 1 + 1/3 HD, so one for 1, 3, 6 and 9 HD.
savant_warlord13 12-24-05, 03:27 PM	It says in the monster manual 2 that they are wingless! What more do you want? No, I do not think a Bahamut-lookalike Felldrake is nice As for manuverability, take a look at the manuverability of some other dragons.
RavinRay 12-24-05, 05:27 PM	Let's settle this wingless felldrake issue once and for all. The entry in the Monster Manual II does not a priori disallow variant winged felldrakes with four legs in the future. That's what exceptions to the rules are for. Take a look at the intro for true dragons in Monster Manual. It mentions them as winged and flying, but in the later books Monsters of Faerûn and Shining South two dragons from the Forgotten Realms, the brown dragon and the rattelyr dragon, cannot fly (vestigial wings and totally wingless, respectively). It also mentions breath weapons, but fang dragons, instead of having a breath weapon, have a Constitution-draining bite. These cases set the precedents. Ever heard of house rules and Unearthed Arcana? If you don't want this felldrake in your game (because it's "not nice"), that's your call. JiCi wants to use them in his game, that's his call. BTW, you don't have to quote the entire stats as one large block - just the relevant parts. Live and let live... :dragon:
savant_warlord13 12-24-05, 05:40 PM	limbs evolving away are one thing. growing extras are quite another
RavinRay 12-24-05, 05:50 PM	You missed the point, I'm afraid. It's about variants, whether growing limbs or losing them. ("Hey look, ain't that an eight-legged sunwyrm with wings in the Fiend Folio?" "What, eight legs? Isn't that too many for a dragon?") This is splitting too many hairs and I will conclude this debate. Nuff said.
savant_warlord13 12-24-05, 05:56 PM	Felldrake is a much more specific category than dragon. <SNIP>
Olly 12-24-05, 07:43 PM	I had an idea in the shower the other day for a half-green dragon African elephant. It was a real "Eureka!" moment for me. Mainly, I just thought it'd be cool to have a dragon with a trunk and big, flappy ears. ;) Stats can be found in the Monster Request thread.
ubernex 12-24-05, 09:30 PM	I had an idea in the shower the other day for a half-green dragon African elephant. It was a real "Eureka!" moment for me. Mainly, I just thought it'd be cool to have a dragon with a trunk and big, flappy ears. ;) Stats can be found in the Monster Request thread. I find that imagry so moving that it inspired me to create a wooly-dragon. Same concept, just use a Mastodon instead of the elephant. Thanks for the inspiration Olly.
R.M.G.C.L.F. 12-24-05, 10:14 PM	THIS (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=555880) The Deskrill, also called a Bone Dragon, started out with the idea of a more traditional type of dragon. Unlike the DnD true dragons, it is of sub-human intelligence, although fairly wise and charismatic. It's the kind of creature that can be tricked by a clever hero, but it has to be an actually clever trick, not just a cat in boots daring them to change into a mouse. The other core idea is its teeth will grow into skeleton warriors when planted. It also has some blighting powers, long-term attacks that make people regret doing battle with it even if they win, and a skulking, scary, lurking manner reminiscent of the undead.
CelestialBarbarian 12-24-05, 10:57 PM	I want to see some of the other Linnorms given the ol' update, particularly the 500' long Midgard Serpent, which was (according to the flavor text) something like a direct descendant of Jormungand. Um, Jormungandr IS the Midgard Serpent. :D
CelestialBarbarian 12-24-05, 11:02 PM	How about bringing back the Mercury, Purple, Steel, Orange, and Yellow dragons (you see a yellow dragon. It runs away). For what it's worth, I'd like to see all of these redone for 3.5 too.
CelestialBarbarian 12-24-05, 11:09 PM	um, you are aware that titanium is that ultralight steel replacement that they use in fighter jets, not tanks? Amazing defense is not what it is all about. Titanium is only as strong as steel but weighs only 55% as much, which makes it good for the leading edges of fast-flying aircraft so that the edges don't melt from friction with the air. The Soviets used to make entire submarine hulls out of titanimum because they had control of much of the world's titanium sources, because titanium resists corrosion, (probably because titanium is lighter than steel, although Soviet designers didn't seem to care too much about making massive, heavy equpiment), and because a titanium hull pretty much guaranteed that a Soviet sub would defeat the magnetic sensors of the main US torpedos of the 1980s. So anyway a titanium dragon would have the same sort of good defense as a steel dragon, but would be faster (which could translate both into faster traveling speeds and a higher Dexterity).
CelestialBarbarian 12-24-05, 11:29 PM	Templates or rules for mix breeds. I know the half Dragon template is cool (and i use it as a quick fix... come up with some enat possiblities) but maybe a little sidebar that says the halfbreed gains 1 parents abilities every other age category, and the other parents on it's skipped categories. Gary Gygax has exactly this sort of thing for 3.0 in The Slayer's Guide to Dragons.
CelestialBarbarian 12-24-05, 11:34 PM	Currently, I'm working on my own breed of dragon: the dreaded Abyssal Dragon. It's basically a Red Dragon that's adapted to life in the Abyss, and now EVERYBODY is afraid of it. The critter is such a badass, even the Lords of the Abyss give it a wide berth (though they are fond of misdirecting visitors to its layer). I'll post it as soon as I get the stats worked out. The Draconomicon already has an abyssal dragon.
CelestialBarbarian 12-24-05, 11:47 PM	I still want a balanced playible race that is a subspecie of dragon thats actually intellegent... How about a cute and cuddly pikadragon that has epic level thunderbolt and thunder attacks?! ;) pikaCHU!
CelestialBarbarian 12-25-05, 12:00 AM	Hummm... I always thought a good idea for a dragon would be some sort of mechanic or partially mechanic dragon... it could be immune to magic like a golem :devil: ... and have some nasty machine-like attacks. Sorta like Mecha-Godzilla? :D
CelestialBarbarian 12-25-05, 12:14 AM	Hummm... I always thought a good idea for a dragon would be some sort of mechanic or partially mechanic dragon... it could be immune to magic like a golem :devil: ... and have some nasty machine-like attacks. That reminds me. Under original D&D I made up a monster called a dragon golem, and gave dragons a spell that allowed them to create a dragon golem. A dragon would create a dragon golem (or more than one) to help guard its treasure. The dragon golem was shaped like a dragon and had the dragon's type of breath weapon, but had the sort of immunity to magic that the original golem types (flesh, stone and iron) had. I think I had a 1st Ed version of them, but I don't think I updated them every for 2nd Ed, must likes 3.0 or 3.5.
CelestialBarbarian 12-25-05, 12:24 AM	Next are the "missing" chromatic dragons from Dragon Magazine: they first appeared in 1ed (my guess) in Dragon 65, in 2ed in Dragon 248, and will finally be in 3.5ed in the Dragon Compendium (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa&origin=). (Some Paizo message board members have already been in the know since at least July.) Is the Dragon Compendium available only from Wizards? I just checked on Amazon.com and didn't see it there. Thanks! :)
RavinRay 12-25-05, 06:53 AM	The Draconomicon already has an abyssal dragon. If you're referring to the abyssal drake, then yes, while it does have red dragon and wyvern ancestry (and physically resembles the latter), it is also part demon and has the outsider (chaotic, evil, extraplanar, fire) type. OTOH, Ogre4Hire's dragon seems like the chaotic evil counterpart of the lawful evil hellfire wyrm from Monster Manual II. Although Garyx the CE draconic god of fiery destruction is in Pandemonium I can see him taking interest in these critters. Is the Dragon Compendium available only from Wizards? AFAIK you'll have to order it direct from Paizo (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa).
RavinRay 12-25-05, 07:12 AM	Got this from a thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=543781) at the Future Releases forum. To quote the salient parts: July Monster Manual IV Any true dragons here? Let's ask Gwendolyn F.M. Kestrel! August Dragons of Faerun This is not about new dragons, but prominent dragons of Faerûn. Think of the Wyrms of the North (column).
CelestialBarbarian 12-25-05, 10:06 AM	If you're referring to the abyssal drake, then yes, while it does have red dragon and wyvern ancestry (and physically resembles the latter), it is also part demon and has the outsider (chaotic, evil, extraplanar, fire) type. OTOH, Ogre4Hire's dragon seems like the chaotic evil counterpart of the lawful evil hellfire wyrm from Monster Manual II. I was just pointing out that the Abyss already has a dragon with "abyssal" in the name. Although Garyx the CE draconic god of fiery destruction is in Pandemonium I can see him taking interest in these critters. I'm not quite sure if they invented Garyx to honor or to mock Gary Gygax, but he had no comment when I mentioned it to him by email. Since Garyx is supposed to be insane, he might not take an interest in much of anything. AFAIK you'll have to order it direct from Paizo (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa). Yeah, that's what I was afraid of. Do you have it? Is it any good? Worth $40? Thanks.
RavinRay 12-26-05, 12:29 AM	Yeah, that's what I was afraid of. Do you have it? Is it any good? Worth $40? Thanks. How I wish. International shipping costs so much more... OTOH, I've got uncles flying in for a wedding, maybe one of them can give me this for Christmas. :D Reviews have been mixed over at the Paizo message boards, though more on the positive.
CelestialBarbarian 12-26-05, 04:18 AM	How I wish. International shipping costs so much more... OTOH, I've got uncles flying in for a wedding, maybe one of them can give me this for Christmas. :D Reviews have been mixed over at the Paizo message boards, though more on the positive. Oh, I see you're overseas. Sorry about that. Anyway I'm mostly interested in the 3.5 updates of the missing chromatic dragons: purple, yellow and orange. Somehow I don't think that each one of them is worth $13.33! :D
RavinRay 03-31-06, 02:19 AM	Heads up! Another true dragon from Dragon magazine, issue 343. It's a creature catalog issue, and as a bonus there are stats, and a pic, of a sample hex dragon, available here (http://paizo.com/store/magazines/dragon/issues/2006/343). http://paizo.com/image/dragon/343/06HexDragon.jpg
tridiak 03-31-06, 03:57 AM	Dragon of physical might (need some name). Key abilities : immune to all spells or spell-like abilities whose spell level is less than it's age level. Catch : it cannot shut this ability off. It therefore cannot benefit from any spell that is helpful. Immune to Su effects at age level X. Has no supernatural powers or spell-like abilities. Cannot cast spells. SR = 3xage level. Breath weapon is Ex, not Su. Can use it a number of times per day equal to it's 1+Con modifier. DR is 2/- per age level. Cannot select any feat which is "magical"
Kraleck 03-31-06, 06:58 AM	Edit: wrong page
JiCi 03-31-06, 07:09 AM	Heads up! Another true dragon from Dragon magazine, issue 343. It's a creature catalog issue, and as a bonus there are stats, and a pic, of a sample hex dragon, available here (http://paizo.com/store/magazines/dragon/issues/2006/343). http://paizo.com/image/dragon/343/06HexDragon.jpgOoooooooooooooh... Nice, way nice. An evil dragon with a poisonous breath weapon.
RavinRay 04-06-06, 07:32 AM	And that was just the tip of the iceberg. According to this Dragon #343 thread (http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=173495) from EN World, there is also a tome dragon, and four more planar dragons for the Abyss, Elysium, Astral Plane, and Gray Waste. That leaves Arcadia, Elysium, Pandemonium, Baator, the Inner Planes, and the Plane of Shadow without any native true dragons. The shadow dragon is a Material Plane native; the hellfire wyrm is not a true dragon (and it seems to spend more time on the Material Planes than in Baator), and the elemental drakes are all more closely related to the wyvern. These dragons are gonna be the single biggest reason I'm getting this issue! :dragon:
JiCi 04-06-06, 07:50 AM	And that was just the tip of the iceberg. According to this Dragon #343 thread (http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=173495) from EN World, there is also a tome dragon, and four more planar dragons for the Abyss, Elysium, Astral Plane, and Gray Waste. That leaves Arcadia, Elysium, Pandemonium, Baator, the Inner Planes, and the Plane of Shadow without any native true dragons. The shadow dragon is a Material Plane native; the hellfire wyrm is not a true dragon (and it seems to spend more time on the Material Planes than in Baator), and the elemental drakes are all more closely related to the wyvern. These dragons are gonna be the single biggest reason I'm getting this issue! :dragon:Huh... the Howling Dragon is native from Pandemonium.
RavinRay 04-06-06, 08:37 AM	Oops, missed that. My bad. :banghead:
JiCi 05-19-06, 09:06 AM	Got Dragon #344: we have: Astral Dragon (Astral Plane) Chole Dragon (Abyss) Elysian Dragon (Elysium) Gloom Dragon (Hades) as well as an article "Ecology of the Dracolich" What's weird is that they considered the hellfire wyrm to be a native TRUE dragon from Baator, which we all know it's not true. Preview for Dragon #345: we will get 3 new aquatic dragons (don't know if they're true of not) (Hey Ravinray, did you ask Dragon to publish your 3 aquatic dragons in this issue ? You did make a chromatic, a gem and a metallic.)
RavinRay 05-19-06, 09:11 AM	OMIGOSH! You're kidding! No, those aren't mine. 344 ain't here yet (darn!), I'm gonna get it together with some Marvel comics. I'm gonna kick myself if these are aquatic true dragons. I really worked out the basic stats for my aquatic dragons and really want Paizo to seriously consider it.
JiCi 05-19-06, 09:16 AM	OMIGOSH! You're kidding! No, those aren't mine. 344 ain't here yet (darn!), I'm gonna get it together with some Marvel comics. I'm gonna kick myself if these are aquatic true dragons. I really worked out the basic stats for my aquatic dragons and really want Paizo to seriously consider it.We don't know for sure if they're true dragons or not. It could be something like a felldrake, a spawn of Tiamat or even a linnorm. The preview described them as sea serpents, though it would be a shame to consider these creatures just as magical beasts.
RavinRay 07-06-06, 08:22 AM	The mercury, steel, and mist dragons, which first appeared in the Monster Mayhem (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/mm) column, will appear in Dragons of Faerûn, according to the July previews (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20060706a).
JiCi 07-06-06, 08:31 AM	The mercury, steel, and mist dragons, which first appeared in the Monster Mayhem (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/mm) column, will appear in Dragons of Faerûn, according to the July previews (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20060706a).The steel dragon has already been published in a recent Dragon magazine as the Greyhawk Dragon. Okay so the name isn't the same, but everything else is. I was a bit disappointed with the sea serpents. I was expecting aquatic versions of true dragons, not sea serpents with 12 age categories, but I guess you can cook up some nasty encounters on high seas with these.
RavinRay 07-06-06, 09:01 AM	Still haven't gotten a copy of that, so they're true dragons after all? Ok, got beaten to the punch, but mine are physically not serpentine, but really dragon-like with fins instead of wings. Not surprising on the steel/Greyhawk dragon, since it was Skip Williams who did both.
JiCi 07-06-06, 04:58 PM	Still haven't gotten a copy of that, so they're true dragons after all? Ok, got beaten to the punch, but mine are physically not serpentine, but really dragon-like with fins instead of wings. Not surprising on the steel/Greyhawk dragon, since it was Skip Williams who did both.They're not true dragons. They are sea serpents that grow with 12 age categories like the true dragons. The crested sea serpent, lantern sea serpent et spiked sea serpent are serpentine, wingless, webbed-clawed and fin-tailed creatures.
RavinRay 07-20-06, 07:23 AM	Well I finally have the issue, and I must say I'm kinda impressed. I have no way of comparing them to the sea wyrm as I don't have Fiend Folio. But no spellcasting ability. I agree. Still, that leaves room in the seas for more dragons. There aren't any good ones (alignment-wise) yet. Going back to Dragons of Faerûn, about the only real new thing we're going to see with the three aforementioned dragons are pictures. And I'm just curious, but there's no mention of an appendix which I'm guessing might be necessary for gem dragons. Because, if the book will mention all the 20+ dragons of Wyrms of the North, it will have to stat out individual gem dragons; and it will need to do so with the 3.5 psionics rules in the Expanded Psionics Handbook and Complete Psionic. Since this has never been done officially, will this be done? Of course, and I must disclose, there's a self-serving reason for me to mention this, the link in my sig being that reason.
Witch 07-20-06, 08:27 AM	My Truth Dragons are finished, but I haven't managed to put them online yet. Those who are interested, here's a sample, without the advancement: http://community.dicefreaks.com/viewtopic.php?t=4680
JiCi 07-20-06, 08:43 AM	Cool ! never though of a truenamer dragon before, nicely done. Havng Unname as a spell-like ability can be frightning. At least this dragon is neutral good. Can't wait for you to post the entire entry.
RavinRay 07-20-06, 08:44 AM	Cool concept, as we now have dragons (both true and lesser) encompassing magic (arcane and divine), psionics, incarnum, and now truespeech.
JiCi 07-20-06, 08:46 AM	Cool concept, as we now have dragons (both true and lesser) encompassing magic (arcane and divine), psionics, incarnum, and now truespeech.All we need now is Shadow magic and Binding magic.
Witch 07-20-06, 09:12 AM	I've considered doing those too. However, I just don't care about Shadow Magic enough to create a dragon based on it. And somehow, a Binding Dragon seemed wrong :)
JiCi 07-20-06, 06:00 PM	I've considered doing those too. However, I just don't care about Shadow Magic enough to create a dragon based on it. And somehow, a Binding Dragon seemed wrong :)Well, I wasn't imposing you anything. It's your choice. But now, I would like to see the entire Truth Dragon progression
Witch 07-20-06, 06:19 PM	I'd be willing to post it. The issue is, however, that I have the tables only in a word-format, and I cannot code it easily here.
JiCi 07-20-06, 07:19 PM	I'd be willing to post it. The issue is, however, that I have the tables only in a word-format, and I cannot code it easily here.I have posted a dragon all with tables and stuff; perfect for this thread. Diamond Dragon (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=625792) Click on the "Quote" button and just copy the [code] section. Just make sure you write everything in it. At best, you could make a PDF file from your Word file and put it on a server.
Sorcen_Anenooata 07-20-06, 08:01 PM	I havent read through the whole thread yet but it seems noone has had the idea of my blood dragon so heres the link The Blood Dragon (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=671511) Go ahead and continue posting your own personal ideas and stats for it. It needs alot of work but should be interesting when complete. EDIT: The Blood Dragon is now completed and has been statted by the great BladefellMaster. same link as before.
KingGolem 07-21-06, 03:12 AM	In the thread "designing a new dragon", i posted the Alchemy Dragon.
Dracomortis 07-21-06, 02:19 PM	The problem with balancing chromatic dragons vs. metallic dragons is that, even if we start throwing in colors like pink or teal, there's still more metals than colors, unless we get really caried away and have things like forest green or firetruck red dragons. Hell, there's even more gems than colors. On a related note, has there ever been a grey dragon? It's the only color I can think of that hasn't been done (that I know of).
CelestialBarbarian 07-22-06, 01:15 AM	The problem with balancing chromatic dragons vs. metallic dragons is that, even if we start throwing in colors like pink or teal, there's still more metals than colors, unless we get really caried away and have things like forest green or firetruck red dragons. Hell, there's even more gems than colors. On a related note, has there ever been a grey dragon? It's the only color I can think of that hasn't been done (that I know of). Nothing says that you have to create a new chromatic dragon type for each new metallic dragon type you create.
RavinRay 07-22-06, 07:45 AM	Well, Dracomortis does have an interesting point. Back in the good ol' days of 1e, you just had 5 chromatic dragons, 5 metallic dragons, that's it. Fast forward to 3.5e. There are now scores of dragons, and while the chromatics have their ranks added to (in a fashion) with the orange, purple, and yellow dragons in the Dragon Compendium, the metallics have not. Neither the mercury nor steel/Greyhawk dragons is considered a "true" metallic dragon, though there is 2e material that treats them close enough. Now, if we are going to use up the periodic table for metallic dragon names (and even add alloys while we're at it), a nagging issue for is is that, the majority of these metals were not discovered in antiquity, and as a result have "techie" sounding names. The turbonium dragon aside (and which DM seriously uses it), does a francium dragon, lanthanide dragon or europium dragon sound pleasant to hear? Personally, I would restrict gem names to those of more well-known gemstones, and not use organic gemstones (amber and pearl). The International Colored Gemstone Association (http://www.gemstone.org) is an excellent source. I have a "grand dragon project" that brings the chromatic, gem, and metallic dragon families to equal status with each other by giving each family 12 dragons. Yes, you heard me, 12 dragons. This includes the renegade obsidian dragons for the gems (mentioned in the Mind's Eye (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psb/20030124b), a gray dragons, and some more.
JiCi 07-22-06, 09:09 AM	I have a "grand dragon project" that brings the chromatic, gem, and metallic dragon families to equal status with each other by giving each family 12 dragons. Yes, you heard me, 12 dragons. This includes the renegade obsidian dragons for the gems (mentioned in the Mind's Eye (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psb/20030124b), a gray dragons, and some more.12 dragons per category huh ? Chromatic: - Red - White - Black - Blue - Green - Yellow - Orange - Purple - Brown - ??? - ??? - ??? Metallic: - Gold - Silver - Bronze - Copper - Brass - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? Gem: - Amethyst - Crystal - Emerald - Sapphire - Topaz - Obsidian - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? - ??? You know, the Adamantine Dragon could be considred a metallic dragon, even if it has the Extraplanar subtype. It has 2 breath weapons, a good alignment and a metallic scale color. Cold Iron and Mithral dragons could be cool. As for the gems, well Diamond (excluding mine, since it is a non-psionic variety), Jade, Turquoise, Pearl and Amber are good choices.
CelestialBarbarian 07-22-06, 09:19 AM	Well, Dracomortis does have an interesting point. Back in the good ol' days of 1e, you just had 5 chromatic dragons, 5 metallic dragons, that's it. Fast forward to 3.5e. There are now scores of dragons, and while the chromatics have their ranks added to (in a fashion) with the orange, purple, and yellow dragons in the Dragon Compendium, the metallics have not. Neither the mercury nor steel/Greyhawk dragons is considered a "true" metallic dragon, though there is 2e material that treats them close enough. Now, if we are going to use up the periodic table for metallic dragon names (and even add alloys while we're at it), a nagging issue for is is that, the majority of these metals were not discovered in antiquity, and as a result have "techie" sounding names. The turbonium dragon aside (and which DM seriously uses it), does a francium dragon, lanthanide dragon or europium dragon sound pleasant to hear? Personally, I would restrict gem names to those of more well-known gemstones, and not use organic gemstones (amber and pearl). The International Colored Gemstone Association (http://www.gemstone.org) is an excellent source. I have a "grand dragon project" that brings the chromatic, gem, and metallic dragon families to equal status with each other by giving each family 12 dragons. Yes, you heard me, 12 dragons. This includes the renegade obsidian dragons for the gems (mentioned in the Mind's Eye (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psb/20030124b), a gray dragons, and some more. You know, the KKK has a Grand Dragon too. ;) (Sorry, I couldn't resist the pun.) Seriously though, while there's nothing wrong with having an equal number of each major category of dragon--chromatic, metallic and now gem--there's no necessity for it either. So have you determined all 36 names? I'm with JiCi in wanting to know the names of the additional ones. As I recall, not all of the color-named dragons--orange, purple, and yellow dragons--from Draconomicon qualify as true chromatic dragons, so if you're going to include them among your 12 chromatics, you might as well include mercury and adamantine dragons among the metallics. I'd include the diamond dragon among the gem dragons, whether it has psionics or not. I've got a mithril dragon in my campaign--you might recall I mentioned it wa back when this thread was last active--and I'm guessing that you'll have one too. I agree with you that dragons named after the higher metals don't sound very appropriate for D&D. I'd skip even things like the uranium dragon, and indeed probably all metals discovered after the Middle Ages, since D&D generally have a medieval feel to it. I think that still leaves plenty of mentals, and the lead dragon comes to my mind for the first time just now.
Dracomortis 07-23-06, 01:38 PM	Here's some ideas for metallic dragons. I don't know if all these were in common use during the Middle Ages, but they occur often enough that they would have probably known about them. Well, except mithral, but you know... Aluminum Dragon Chrome Dragon Cobalt Dragon Electrum Dragon Iron Dragon Lead Dragon Mithral Dragon Nickel Dragon Platinum Dragon Tin Dragon Zinc Dragon
JiCi 08-28-06, 11:45 AM	Cool concept, as we now have dragons (both true and lesser) encompassing magic (arcane and divine), psionics, incarnum, and now truespeech.You may now add the Sublime Way with my Martial Dragon (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=691542) As a bonus, here's my Grey Dragon (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=685598), a new chromatic dragon.
JiCi 08-29-06, 11:57 AM	I'd be willing to post it. The issue is, however, that I have the tables only in a word-format, and I cannot code it easily here.Why don't you send it to my by email ? I could rearrange it for you and post it here.
JiCi 09-11-06, 11:36 AM	bump