Awakened Animal LA+2 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Awakened Animal LA+2 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Kurama Youko
10-29-04, 11:46 PM What say you people should we push wizard to give us a LA with spells like Awakened Animal?

Prehapes the ECL for Awakend Animals should be Animal HD + LA of 2 = ECL

What say you?
obrysii
10-30-04, 09:41 AM I'm a firm believer that Awakened animals/vermin do not have a level adjustment. I say this because: they cannot hold items, they're forever treated as 'outsiders' by people outside the group, good luck casting spells with sometic components!, good luck casting spells that you need components for because you cna't hold them, their natural attacks don't get irterinitiave (sp?) attacks.

Plus: Lycanthropy gives the best of both animal form and human form, for only animal HD + humanoid HD + 3 LA; Entothropy gives the best of both animal form and human form, for only animal HD + humanoid HD + 2 LA. Assuming the humanoid only has 1 HD, the animal/vermin form effectively gains one HD, and 2 or 3 LA. Awaken gives the creature two more HD, which are almost as bad as 2 LA. That's where it's balanced in regard to the core races.

This is all, of course, my opinion.
Kurama Youko
10-30-04, 04:43 PM The feat Surrogate Spell allows casters who cant speak normal spellcasting languages as well as use the somatic components of spells to use their natural appendages to cast spells while holding a component in some other appendage.

As far as the LA +2 not being with it because Lycanthropes have a +2 for artifical and +3 for naturals, then maybe your right. a LA +0 might be merited since the creatures natural HD are still retained and might be a measure of its balacing with a creature of appropritate class levels.

As far as equipment and things go i do remember seeing equipment that can be used by animals or in this case magical beast, i also remember reading in the Draconomicon that a Dragon can use alot of the same things a person of roughly humanoid appearance can. Such as gloves being slid over the front claws (Like finger-less gloves), bracers, hats, capes, cloaks, boots begin slightly altered so that they affix to its rear claws (like the Finger-less gloves), Rings, amulets, lenses, ect ect, even barding armor, if all this can be warrented by a intelligent four legged winged reptile then i fail to see how it wouldnt apply to a magical beast like a awakened animal?

I dont really see the extra attacks from high bab as a potiential problem, even then a its more than just that, they would indeed get those extra attacks so long as they are using a weapon to which they are proficent. A creature holding a special crafted mouth blade in its mouth for example would get all the attacks a fighter of his Bab would have. Sure it requires alot more special work in certain areas but i dont see it being any weaker than a character of equal hit dice.

a 4 animal hit dice wolf with 5 levels of druid, and a Afflicted Lycanthrope Werewolf LA+2 and 4 animal hd, with only 3 lvs of druid isnt really all that superior in my opinion and is kind of even hindered.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Kurama Youko 10-29-04, 11:46 PM	What say you people should we push wizard to give us a LA with spells like Awakened Animal? Prehapes the ECL for Awakend Animals should be Animal HD + LA of 2 = ECL What say you?
obrysii 10-30-04, 09:41 AM	I'm a firm believer that Awakened animals/vermin do not have a level adjustment. I say this because: they cannot hold items, they're forever treated as 'outsiders' by people outside the group, good luck casting spells with sometic components!, good luck casting spells that you need components for because you cna't hold them, their natural attacks don't get irterinitiave (sp?) attacks. Plus: Lycanthropy gives the best of both animal form and human form, for only animal HD + humanoid HD + 3 LA; Entothropy gives the best of both animal form and human form, for only animal HD + humanoid HD + 2 LA. Assuming the humanoid only has 1 HD, the animal/vermin form effectively gains one HD, and 2 or 3 LA. Awaken gives the creature two more HD, which are almost as bad as 2 LA. That's where it's balanced in regard to the core races. This is all, of course, my opinion.
Kurama Youko 10-30-04, 04:43 PM	The feat Surrogate Spell allows casters who cant speak normal spellcasting languages as well as use the somatic components of spells to use their natural appendages to cast spells while holding a component in some other appendage. As far as the LA +2 not being with it because Lycanthropes have a +2 for artifical and +3 for naturals, then maybe your right. a LA +0 might be merited since the creatures natural HD are still retained and might be a measure of its balacing with a creature of appropritate class levels. As far as equipment and things go i do remember seeing equipment that can be used by animals or in this case magical beast, i also remember reading in the Draconomicon that a Dragon can use alot of the same things a person of roughly humanoid appearance can. Such as gloves being slid over the front claws (Like finger-less gloves), bracers, hats, capes, cloaks, boots begin slightly altered so that they affix to its rear claws (like the Finger-less gloves), Rings, amulets, lenses, ect ect, even barding armor, if all this can be warrented by a intelligent four legged winged reptile then i fail to see how it wouldnt apply to a magical beast like a awakened animal? I dont really see the extra attacks from high bab as a potiential problem, even then a its more than just that, they would indeed get those extra attacks so long as they are using a weapon to which they are proficent. A creature holding a special crafted mouth blade in its mouth for example would get all the attacks a fighter of his Bab would have. Sure it requires alot more special work in certain areas but i dont see it being any weaker than a character of equal hit dice. a 4 animal hit dice wolf with 5 levels of druid, and a Afflicted Lycanthrope Werewolf LA+2 and 4 animal hd, with only 3 lvs of druid isnt really all that superior in my opinion and is kind of even hindered.