Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Kiirnodel 08-04-04, 07:40 PM	I am just wondering if anyone wouls allow an awakened animal as a PC race (provided they give sufficient background and such) Here is an example of a monstrous progression: BAB HD Skills Fort Ref Will Abilities 1. +1 1d10 (2+Int)x4 +2 +2 +0 Feat, +X Escape Artist, Weapon finesse 2. +2 2d10 2+Int +3 +3 +0 Lesser Rage, +2 Con 3. +2 2d10 -- +3 +3 +0 Scent, +2 Dex, +2 Wis, +1 Natural armor, Track 4. +3 3d10 2+Int +3 +3 +1 Rage, +2 Dex, +2 Con, Feat Badger class features: Small Size Base land speed of 30 and a burrow speed of 10. +2 Dex, -2 Str, -2 Cha They are quick but small in frame and not very social. Low-light vision Automatic languages: common Favored Class: Barbarian Proficiencies Badgers are proficient with only thier natural weapons. Class skills Climb (Str), Escape Artist (Dex), Listen (Wis), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis). Lesser Rage (Ex): As rage, but only +2 str and con and +1 will. Escape Artist: Every level in Badger adds a racial bonus to escape Artist checks Max +4. Any ideas or critiques?
obrysii 08-04-04, 07:50 PM	I'd allow Awakened Animals. I'd think they'd be LA +0, however, as the two additional HD they gain from being Awakened show sufficely cover whatever small bonuses they gain.
Kiirnodel 08-04-04, 07:57 PM	LA +0? Hmmm, I guess that'd be fair the badger I made has a LA +1 I mean +6 Dex, +4 Con, +2 Wis at the cost of -2 str and cha? I guess we might need more opinions!
Aranthir 08-04-04, 09:02 PM	Awakened Cat +2 Dex +2 Wis -2 Con +4 Move Silently I don't know what to add...but cats r cool.
Kiirnodel 08-04-04, 09:10 PM	I love cats too...but cats get -8 str...and a fractional HD :( Since their type changes to magical beast...does that mean theri HD bonuses too? Example Awakened Wolf becomes a magical beast Magical beasts have good fort and ref (no change) but good BAB and a d10 HD (improvement) How does that work out?
obrysii 08-04-04, 09:12 PM	I said +0 LA because racial HD play a part of determining LA and ECL's...so the 2 bonus HD from awakening it have to be counted in.
Kiirnodel 08-04-04, 09:26 PM	Yeah, they get HD but I think some of them deserve a +1 LA for their HD... Wolverine is a good example and I think the Brown Bear might have more than a +1LA...
obrysii 08-04-04, 10:20 PM	Originally posted by Kiirnodel Yeah, they get HD but I think some of them deserve a +1 LA for their HD... Wolverine is a good example and I think the Brown Bear might have more than a +1LA... But the Brown Bear also has more HD, too. A level 9 fighter vs. a level 1 fighter Brown Bear....which will win the fight?
Kiirnodel 08-05-04, 12:13 AM	Brown Bear assuming they had the same equipment...in gold cost I mean look at the fuzzy beast! +16 str? I have some sample ones being popped out now: Badger, Cat and Wolf! Alright Puss 'n' Boots Awakened Cat Swashbuckler 3 Chaotic Neutral Str 2 Dex 21 Con 10 Int 14 Wis 12 Cha 13 HP: 14 Fort +7 Ref +13 Will +4 Base Attack +6/+1 Initiative +7 AC: 18 touch: 17, flat footed 13 (+dodge) Feats: Blooded Dodge Stealthy Weapon finesse Skills: Balance +20 Climb +9 Hide +26 (+30 in tall grass) Jump +15 Listen +4 Move Silently +19 Spot +6 Tumble +12 Abilities: Low-light vision Scent Grace +1 Insightful strike note that cats hit points are cut in half Full attack Rapier +14/+9 and Bite +8 melee Damage d3-1 crit 18-20/2 and d3-2 crit 20/x2 Equipment: Rapier +1 Bracers of armor +1 Cloak of Resistance +1 5 potions of cure light wounds 1 Potion of Fox's Cunning 1 Potion of Bull's Strength 10 gold Explorers Outfit Also meet: Grunj Awakened Boar Barbarian 4 Neutral Evil Str 22 Dex 13 Con 20 Int 8 Wis 14 Cha 6 HP: 106 Fort +13 Ref +6 Will +4 Base Attack +9/+4 Initiative +1 AC: 22 touch: 11, Flat footed: 22 Feats: Improved Natural Attack: Gore Power Attack Toughness Weapon Focus: Gore Skills: Jump +19 Listen +9 Spot +8 Survival +4 Abilities: Ferocity Low-light vision Scent Rage 2/day Illiteracy Fast Movement Uncanny Dodge Trap sense +1 Full Attack Gore +17/+12 melee Damage 2d6+10 crit 20/x2 Equipment: Belt of Giants Strength +2 Amulet of Mighty Fists +1 Tusk-Ring of Protection +1 Studded Leather Barding +2 While Raging: Str 26 Con 24 HP:124 Fort +15 Ref +6 Will +6 AC: 20 (Touch: 9, Flat footed 20) Full Attack: Gore +19/+14 Damage: 2d6+13 crit 20/x2 Hehe...
obrysii 08-05-04, 11:59 AM	Originally posted by Kiirnodel Brown Bear assuming they had the same equipment...in gold cost I mean look at the fuzzy beast! +16 str? A level 9 fighter has higher saves and higher BaB. It has more feats, easier to acquire equipment, and can use weapons. The only thing that the brown bear gets is 1. Unbalanced ability scores, so that MIGHT be worth an LA. So ECL 10.
Kiirnodel 08-05-04, 12:15 PM	They will have the SAME BAB if they have the same HD since magical beasts have good BAB! You have a point about those feats though
Conaill 08-14-04, 11:14 PM	Crossposted from the Awakened Animals thread... If the item is magical or wild or something is it possible for animals to wield weapons??? Masters of the Wild (3.0) has an "Opposable" weapon enchantment that allows a weapon to be used by an animal without opposable thumbs. Market Price: +1 bonus. I don't know if there is a similar enchantment in any of the 3.5 supplements. Savage Species also has some weapons that can be used by animals, such as a tail club. I believe there may be a few more of those either in the Arms & equipment Guide or in the Ultimate Equipment Guide. SS also has a "Necklace of Natural Weapons" on which you can cast any weapon enchantment, which then applies to one or more of your natural weapons. This is often a better choice for animals with good natural weapon attacks. Market Price: 600 gp plus the price of the weapon enchantment, times the number of natural weapons affected.
Conaill 08-14-04, 11:23 PM	A few details to keep in mind when constructing awakened animals... 1) HD stays at d8, and BAB is 3/4 HD. An awakened animal is not just type "Magical Beast", but rather "Magical Beast (Augmented Animal)", which means it keeps the animal HD size, BAB and save progression. (See the link in my sig for the full story.) 2) Not having hands can be a PITA, but you can often work around it. For example, Monk can often be a good class choice for an awakened animal: no weapons needed! Might as well take Vow of Poverty as well and do away with equipment altogether... 3) Tiny and smaller animals suffer MAJOR drawbacks in melee combat. For one, they have a Reach of 0', which means that swashbuckling cat will draw an AoO everytime he tries to attack anyone! They typically also have very low strength... 4) You really need to write out a full "acid test" to figure out LA. Just eyeballing the stats probably won't cut it. So far, we wound up assigning a LA of +1 or higher to all of the larger animals we tried (Baboon, Riding Dog, Hyena and Wolf +1, Dire Wolf, Heavy Warhorse and Tiger +3). Small animals are hard to estimate because they are so unbalanced...
Kiirnodel 08-14-04, 11:38 PM	I guess Shadows of the Last War has a typo then :( OH Well, thanks for those comments (BTW, that cat is basically a joke) Some new ideas I thought of were making feats for animal monks so they can attack with such as monk attacks (or add a bite to a flurry or flurry with a bite or whatever) and a NEW Ranger progression (Multiattack, Improved Multiattack, Rapidstrike) or something that allows many attacks for animals that lack the ability to use the feats. How about eschew materials as bonus feats for the animals?
Aeolius 08-14-04, 11:41 PM	Animals as PCs was the basis for this campaign concept I have yet to run... Nature of the Beast (http://www.lobi.com/nob)