being pulled down by an Ankheg [Archive] - Wizards Community

being pulled down by an Ankheg [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Nicholas the Paladin
10-26-05, 03:14 PM Hi Guys,

In a few weeks I''m starting a new adventure, which will also take place on the plains and in the desert.(PC's about lvl 6)

I'm thinking about making the PC's fight some ankhegs.

What I'm wondering about is that the MM states that ankhegs, after grabbing their victims, pull them back down underground.

Won't that kill the PC outright? How on earth can a PC get out? (or can his friends be of any help?)

THanks !
Super_Demolition_Christ
10-26-05, 11:10 PM *bump*

Im bumping this early because Im going to throw some Ankhegs in too:D
jazzman831
10-27-05, 06:21 PM It specifically says that it brings his "dinner" back into his tunnel (it is important to note that the MM says that it takes twice as long to build a tunnel than to move through sand), so I don't see why the other party members couldn't follow it. Also, the grabbed character is grappled, so he can try and break the grapple once per turn. The monster manual doesn't really discribe HOW the ankheg grapples its victims, and how it burrows, so you would have to make it up. For an easier encounter I would say that it cannot deal grappling damage and tunnel at the same time (it holds you with different legs than the ones with which it burrows) and the victim does not block the ankheg (i.e. it does not provide cover). If you wanted to make it the opposite extreme you could just reverse everything: it deals bite damage (similar to a creature with constriction) every turn, it can burrow and hold you at the same time, and it used the victim as a sheild. The rules are pretty sparse, so I think it's mostly just improvising. Part of this reason is because they would have to make up too many rules just for this one creature (for example, how does one follow a creature with a burrow speed? Can you dig with a greataxe?).
Nicholas the Paladin
10-28-05, 07:29 AM It specifically says that it brings his "dinner" back into his tunnel (it is important to note that the MM says that it takes twice as long to build a tunnel than to move through sand), so I don't see why the other party members couldn't follow it. . I'm thinking about making the hole big enough to move through easily (even in fullplate). It is a large animal after all.
The question is, what is the penalty for attacking a burrowing creature in it's tunnel, with weapons. But of course thats improvisable.

Also, the grabbed character is grappled, so he can try and break the grapple once per turn. The monster manual doesn't really discribe HOW the ankheg grapples its victims, and how it burrows, so you would have to make it up. .there are rules for this, so this can be done
For an easier encounter I would say that it cannot deal grappling damage and tunnel at the same time (it holds you with different legs than the ones with which it burrows) and the victim does not block the ankheg (i.e. it does not provide cover). . Or the Ankheg takes it's victim to an underground lair, in which PC's can manouver better.
If you wanted to make it the opposite extreme you could just reverse everything: it deals bite damage (similar to a creature with constriction) every turn, it can burrow and hold you at the same time, and it used the victim as a sheild. .let's see what happens, first
The rules are pretty sparse, so I think it's mostly just improvising. Part of this reason is because they would have to make up too many rules just for this one creature (for example, how does one follow a creature with a burrow speed? Can you dig with a greataxe?).OKay I get your point; improvise ..... and make it a CR3 encounter
DungeonMaster
10-28-05, 10:01 AM The only situation I allow a monster to drag an opponent underground is when the opponent is helpless, usually dying and unconscious but paralzed happens particularly with ghouls.
Otherwise I find it too deadly.
The exception to that rule of mine are creatures that can swallow whole of course (the purple worm for instance).

If you're going to allow the monster to drag a living, kicking and screaming PC down a rough-dug tunnel of it's own creation I suggest making sure it can pull/push/drag the PC's weight with it's raw strength and then adding a hefty factor (x2 or x4) for the PC resisting as much as possible.
Nicholas the Paladin
10-28-05, 10:49 AM If you're going to allow the monster to drag a living, kicking and screaming PC down a rough-dug tunnel of it's own creation I suggest making sure it can pull/push/drag the PC's weight with it's raw strength and then adding a hefty factor (x2 or x4) for the PC resisting as much as possible.
Opposed strength check? with penalties for the PC? (this should be the livelyhood of the Ankheg)
psionichamster
10-28-05, 01:24 PM Improved Grab (Ex)
To use this ability, an ankheg must hit with its bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If the ankheg is damaged after grabbing its prey, it retreats backward down its tunnel at its land speed (not its burrow speed), dragging the victim with it.

so it charges, hits w/ its bite attack, starts a grapple. the party whacks it, mr. "i'm in a grapple w/ a 10' long bug that's eating me" gets to make his opposed grapple/escape artist roll to break free. (or anything else he/she wants to do) if the poor sap gets taken, he's moving at spd 30' back down his long tunnel.

An ankheg burrows with legs and mandibles. A burrowing ankheg usually does not make a usable tunnel, but can construct a tunnel; it burrows at half speed when it does so. It often digs a winding tunnel up to 40 feet below the surface in the rich soil of forests or farmlands. The tunnel is 5 feet tall and wide, and from 60 to 150 feet long ([1d10 + 5] × 10).

5' wide tunnel means you do the 5' stepping pc-train down the tunnels, and the halfling/gnome/goblin/dog up front. when moving w/ the prey, the ankheg won't be able to use his acid spit or bite the pc. and the pc would get another break-free attempt each round.

(see rules for grappling for specifics)

but this goes to show...DON'T PUT ANY PART OF YOUR BODY IN A HOLE. period. and the adventurers who learn that one without putting anything in holes (often when a compariot makes the fatal error) are better off for it.

namaste'
the hamster
Phrennzy
10-28-05, 04:22 PM I love Ankhegs.

From Grapple:

No Movement: You can’t move normally while grappling. You may, however, make an opposed grapple check (see below) to move while grappling.

Move: You can move half your speed (bringing all others engaged in the grapple with you) by winning an opposed grapple check. This requires a standard action, and you must beat all the other individual check results to move the grapple.
Note: You get a +4 bonus on your grapple check to move a pinned opponent, but only if no one else is involved in the grapple.

So the Ankheg breaks through the ground and attacks, using it's improved grab to begin a grapple.

It can then make a grapple check (next round) to drag the victim down with it.

The tunnel an Ankheg is making should be big enough for others to follow, however, there are rules (that I cannot find in the SRD) for fighting in cramped spaces. I'd apply these, since the party will be hunched when fighting. (I think it's like -2 to hit unless using piercing weapons).

Not instant death, and a fun, exciting fight. Especially if you have 2 ankhegs attacking two targets, dragging both. Who do you save?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Nicholas the Paladin 10-26-05, 03:14 PM	Hi Guys, In a few weeks I''m starting a new adventure, which will also take place on the plains and in the desert.(PC's about lvl 6) I'm thinking about making the PC's fight some ankhegs. What I'm wondering about is that the MM states that ankhegs, after grabbing their victims, pull them back down underground. Won't that kill the PC outright? How on earth can a PC get out? (or can his friends be of any help?) THanks !
Super_Demolition_Christ 10-26-05, 11:10 PM	bump Im bumping this early because Im going to throw some Ankhegs in too:D
jazzman831 10-27-05, 06:21 PM	It specifically says that it brings his "dinner" back into his tunnel (it is important to note that the MM says that it takes twice as long to build a tunnel than to move through sand), so I don't see why the other party members couldn't follow it. Also, the grabbed character is grappled, so he can try and break the grapple once per turn. The monster manual doesn't really discribe HOW the ankheg grapples its victims, and how it burrows, so you would have to make it up. For an easier encounter I would say that it cannot deal grappling damage and tunnel at the same time (it holds you with different legs than the ones with which it burrows) and the victim does not block the ankheg (i.e. it does not provide cover). If you wanted to make it the opposite extreme you could just reverse everything: it deals bite damage (similar to a creature with constriction) every turn, it can burrow and hold you at the same time, and it used the victim as a sheild. The rules are pretty sparse, so I think it's mostly just improvising. Part of this reason is because they would have to make up too many rules just for this one creature (for example, how does one follow a creature with a burrow speed? Can you dig with a greataxe?).
Nicholas the Paladin 10-28-05, 07:29 AM	It specifically says that it brings his "dinner" back into his tunnel (it is important to note that the MM says that it takes twice as long to build a tunnel than to move through sand), so I don't see why the other party members couldn't follow it. . I'm thinking about making the hole big enough to move through easily (even in fullplate). It is a large animal after all. The question is, what is the penalty for attacking a burrowing creature in it's tunnel, with weapons. But of course thats improvisable. Also, the grabbed character is grappled, so he can try and break the grapple once per turn. The monster manual doesn't really discribe HOW the ankheg grapples its victims, and how it burrows, so you would have to make it up. .there are rules for this, so this can be done For an easier encounter I would say that it cannot deal grappling damage and tunnel at the same time (it holds you with different legs than the ones with which it burrows) and the victim does not block the ankheg (i.e. it does not provide cover). . Or the Ankheg takes it's victim to an underground lair, in which PC's can manouver better. If you wanted to make it the opposite extreme you could just reverse everything: it deals bite damage (similar to a creature with constriction) every turn, it can burrow and hold you at the same time, and it used the victim as a sheild. .let's see what happens, first The rules are pretty sparse, so I think it's mostly just improvising. Part of this reason is because they would have to make up too many rules just for this one creature (for example, how does one follow a creature with a burrow speed? Can you dig with a greataxe?).OKay I get your point; improvise ..... and make it a CR3 encounter
DungeonMaster 10-28-05, 10:01 AM	The only situation I allow a monster to drag an opponent underground is when the opponent is helpless, usually dying and unconscious but paralzed happens particularly with ghouls. Otherwise I find it too deadly. The exception to that rule of mine are creatures that can swallow whole of course (the purple worm for instance). If you're going to allow the monster to drag a living, kicking and screaming PC down a rough-dug tunnel of it's own creation I suggest making sure it can pull/push/drag the PC's weight with it's raw strength and then adding a hefty factor (x2 or x4) for the PC resisting as much as possible.
Nicholas the Paladin 10-28-05, 10:49 AM	If you're going to allow the monster to drag a living, kicking and screaming PC down a rough-dug tunnel of it's own creation I suggest making sure it can pull/push/drag the PC's weight with it's raw strength and then adding a hefty factor (x2 or x4) for the PC resisting as much as possible. Opposed strength check? with penalties for the PC? (this should be the livelyhood of the Ankheg)
psionichamster 10-28-05, 01:24 PM	Improved Grab (Ex) To use this ability, an ankheg must hit with its bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If the ankheg is damaged after grabbing its prey, it retreats backward down its tunnel at its land speed (not its burrow speed), dragging the victim with it. so it charges, hits w/ its bite attack, starts a grapple. the party whacks it, mr. "i'm in a grapple w/ a 10' long bug that's eating me" gets to make his opposed grapple/escape artist roll to break free. (or anything else he/she wants to do) if the poor sap gets taken, he's moving at spd 30' back down his long tunnel. An ankheg burrows with legs and mandibles. A burrowing ankheg usually does not make a usable tunnel, but can construct a tunnel; it burrows at half speed when it does so. It often digs a winding tunnel up to 40 feet below the surface in the rich soil of forests or farmlands. The tunnel is 5 feet tall and wide, and from 60 to 150 feet long ([1d10 + 5] × 10). 5' wide tunnel means you do the 5' stepping pc-train down the tunnels, and the halfling/gnome/goblin/dog up front. when moving w/ the prey, the ankheg won't be able to use his acid spit or bite the pc. and the pc would get another break-free attempt each round. (see rules for grappling for specifics) but this goes to show...DON'T PUT ANY PART OF YOUR BODY IN A HOLE. period. and the adventurers who learn that one without putting anything in holes (often when a compariot makes the fatal error) are better off for it. namaste' the hamster
Phrennzy 10-28-05, 04:22 PM	I love Ankhegs. From Grapple: No Movement: You can’t move normally while grappling. You may, however, make an opposed grapple check (see below) to move while grappling. Move: You can move half your speed (bringing all others engaged in the grapple with you) by winning an opposed grapple check. This requires a standard action, and you must beat all the other individual check results to move the grapple. Note: You get a +4 bonus on your grapple check to move a pinned opponent, but only if no one else is involved in the grapple. So the Ankheg breaks through the ground and attacks, using it's improved grab to begin a grapple. It can then make a grapple check (next round) to drag the victim down with it. The tunnel an Ankheg is making should be big enough for others to follow, however, there are rules (that I cannot find in the SRD) for fighting in cramped spaces. I'd apply these, since the party will be hunched when fighting. (I think it's like -2 to hit unless using piercing weapons). Not instant death, and a fun, exciting fight. Especially if you have 2 ankhegs attacking two targets, dragging both. Who do you save?