Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MonkeyPaladin 03-27-06, 02:15 PM	The party's wizard had polymorphed my jester (from Dragon Compendium, basically a bard variant) into a troll a few times, essentially giving us another front line fighter when it became useful to have one. Now that I reached 10th level in jester, I can cast polymorph myself. The troll form is great, even without regeneration, but I was wondering what else would be useful to become? According to the spell description, I don't get any of the monster's supernatural or spell-like abilities, but I do gain their stats and special attacks. I was looking through the MM but nothing stood out, any suggestions?
The Vorpal Tribble 03-27-06, 03:49 PM	Well, it depends on what you are going for. I don't know what the 'Jester' class is, but most can begin casting the spell at 7th level, so for 7HD creatures or below, here are some of the best. I'll also look into 10 HD creatures if you can change into them. For battle: Treant (7 HD) Speed: 30 ft. Armor Class: +13 natural Attacks: 2 slams Special Attacks: Double damage against objects, trample Stats: Str 29, Dex 8, Con 21 Annis (7 HD) Speed: 40 ft. Armor Class: +10 natural Attacks: 2 claws and 1 bite Special Attacks: Improved grab, rake, and rend Stats: Str 25, Dex 12, Con 14 Remorhaz (7 HD) Speed: 30 ft., burrow 20 ft. Armor Class: +11 natural Attacks: 1 Bite Special Attacks: Improved Grab, Swallow Whole Stats: Str 26, Dex 13, Con 21 Pthisic (HD 6) Speed: 30 ft. Armor Class: +8 natural Attacks: 2 claws and 1 bite Special Attacks: Mind Feed (yup, extraordinary Int draining power) Stats: Str 23, Dex 12, Con 21 If you want something thats really quick but also a pretty good fighter, gotta go with a very young Brass Dragon: Brass Dragon, very young (fire) (HD 7) Speed: Land 60 ft, fly 120 ft. (average), burrow 30 ft. Armor Class: +6 natural Attacks: 1 bite, 2 claws Special Attacks: - Stats: Str 13, Dex 10, Con 13 Its got a horrendous land and fly speed, and even burrow if neccessary. Another good idea is a grey ooze which lets you eat up another's weapons with their acid. Squeeze under doorframes and enter a stronghold and start disolving the supports to the place.
MonkeyPaladin 03-27-06, 04:03 PM	Thanks, there's some good options right there. And I have up to 10 HD to play with, it's essentially like the bard as a caster.
The Vorpal Tribble 03-27-06, 04:28 PM	A bit rushed at the moment, but here are some good 10HD or less creatures for combat: Abominable Yeti (HD 10) Speed: 40 ft., 20 ft. climb Armor Class: +8 natural Attacks: 2 claws Special Attacks: Constrict, Improved Grab Stats: Str 29, Dex 15, Con 22 Behir (HD 9) Speed: 40 ft., climb 15 ft. Armor Class: +11 natural Attacks: Constrict, improved grab, rake (6 claws!), swallow whole Special Attacks: 1 bite Stats: Str 26, Dex 13, Con 21 Bulette (HD 9) Speed: 40 ft., burrow 10 ft. Armor Class: +12 natural Attacks: 1 bite, 2 claws Special Attacks: Leap (4 claw attacks) Stats: Str 27, Dex 15, Con 20 Chimera (HD 9) Speed: 30 ft., fly 50 ft. (poor) Armor Class: +9 natural Attacks: 2 bites, 1 gore, and 2 claws Special Attacks: None Abilities: Str 19, Dex 13, Con 17 Smilodon (HD 9) Speed: 40 ft. Armor Class: +4 natural Attacks: Bite (x3 critical), and 2 claws Special Attacks: Improved grab, pounce, rake Stats: Str 24, Dex 14, Con 16 Near Water: Aboleth (HD 8) Speed: 10 ft., swim 60 ft. Armor Class: +7 natural Attacks: 4 tentacles Special Attacks: Slime Stats: Str 26, Dex 12, Con 20
malignor 03-27-06, 05:02 PM	Hydra! .. also dragons are great for a flying monster that can cast spells. This include Wyverns which in my eyes are the best dragon to polymorph into. They don't have a bunch of supernatural abilities (instead you get a poisonous stinger tail!) Bu you have to be flying to cast spells with a somatic component (boo hoo). Lastly, look up outsiders and monstrous humanoids for good stuff to turn into while keeping your equipment. Leonals and Barbed Devils are a great start (medium humanoid shape, great physical stats & natural armor, good extraordinary special attacks).
Ront Iron-Roar 03-27-06, 06:27 PM	You know you could always play a creature with a template. The artificer of my group used a scroll of Polymorph to turn himself into a half-red dragon cave troll. Cave Trolls are damage monkeys...
Return of the Flumph 03-27-06, 07:57 PM	Giants. They are blocks of muscle and natural armor with no supernatural abilities to miss out on.
malignor 03-27-06, 08:32 PM	You know you could always play a creature with a template. The artificer of my group used a scroll of Polymorph to turn himself into a half-red dragon cave troll. Cave Trolls are damage monkeys...Sadly, since Polymorph is based off of Alter Self, no templates are allowed. Otherwise a polymorpher can just use Knowledge - Arcana to know about half-dragon <Insert monster name here> and turn into an better armored, stronger, hardier and winged version of anything. Especially since the half-dragon doesn't add any hitdice.
Dench 03-27-06, 09:05 PM	Why not take the "Master Transformigist" PrC from the Complete Arcane? It lets you take supernatural abilities and extraordinary abilities from the creatures you transform into. It's a great choice if you are going to specialize into a transformational caster.
The Vorpal Tribble 03-27-06, 11:23 PM	Giants. They are blocks of muscle and natural armor with no supernatural abilities to miss out on. I can only find a single Giant at 10 HD or less, and thats the Bog Giant from the Fiend Folio that has a mesely +7 natural armor, 24 strength, and Rock Throwing. I don't think I even mentioned a 7 HD creature as weak as that.
Ront Iron-Roar 03-28-06, 10:47 AM	Sadly, since Polymorph is based off of Alter Self, no templates are allowed. Otherwise a polymorpher can just use Knowledge - Arcana to know about half-dragon <Insert monster name here> and turn into an better armored, stronger, hardier and winged version of anything. Especially since the half-dragon doesn't add any hitdice. HA! I knew it! You can't add templates. Thank you for the info.
The Vorpal Tribble 03-28-06, 01:13 PM	Continued... 10-headed Hydra (HD 10) Speed: 20 ft., swim 20 ft. Armor Class: +11 natural Attacks: 10 bites (each doing 1d10+5) Special Attacks: - Stats: Str 21, Dex 12, Con 20 Note: 10 heads doing an average of 10 points of damage each, for an 'average' of 100 points of damage a round. Yowza! Black Pudding (HD 10) Speed: 20 ft., climb 20 ft. Armor Class: - Attacks: 1 slam Special Attacks: Acid, constrict, improved grab Stats: Str 17, Dex 1, Con 22 Note: Yeah, the black pudding may not look like much, but it can disentegrate all types of weapons and armor, and it weighs 18,000 lbs! Roper (HD 10) Speed: 10 ft. Armor Class: +14 natural Attacks: 6 strands and bite Special Attacks: Drag, strands, weakness Stats: Str 19, Dex 13, Con 17 Note: Each one of those strands are 50 feet long and deal 2d8 strength damage per round! Even ogres will be collapsing within but a few touches. And unless your opponent has high ranks in escape artist, each touch makes it less likely you'll be able to break free of its hold. It can then destroy you at its leisure. Also has the highest natural armor of any creature I've thus mentioned. Criosphinx (HD 10) Speed: 30 ft., fly 60 ft. (poor) Armor Class: +11 natural Attacks: 1 gore and 2 claws Special Attacks: pounce, rake Stats: Str 23, Dex 10, Con 17 Note: Nothing really special here, just a strong flying creature with three natural attacks and heavy natural armor Tendriculous (HD 9) Speed: 20 ft. Armor Class: +9 natural Attacks: 1 bite and 2 tendrils Special Attacks: Improved grab, paralysis, swallow whole Stats: Str 28, Dex 9, Con 22 Note: Extremely strong creature who can swallow up its enemies right and left, leaving them paralyzed inside and unable to even attempt to escape. Will'o'wisp (HD 9) Speed: Fly 50 ft. (perfect) Armor Class: +9 deflection Attacks: 1 shock Special Attacks: - Stats: Str 1, Dex 29, Con 10 Note: This may also not look like much, but you have a nifty perfect fly speed, and the attack is a touch, thus ignoring armor, that deals electricity damage. Its also easily the most dextrous creature we've yet run across, so combined with its deflection you get a +18 to your AC in one go! This thing is great for hit and run tactics. So all in all I've given you 11 creatures at or right around 10 HD that in their own ways are horrendously effective combatants or just plain ole run awayers.
malignor 03-28-06, 01:14 PM	Criteria: Toughest while keeping equipment (medium humanoid shape) 1-7 HD Hound Archon: 40' speed, +9 natural AC, 1d8bite + 1d4slam, Str 15, Dex 10, Con 13 Bralani: 40' speed, +6 natural AC, 1d6slam, Str 18, Dex 18, Con 17 Babau: +8 natural AC, 1d6/1d6claw + 1d6bite, 2d6 sneak attack, Str 21, Dex 12, Con 20, +8 racial bonus on Hide, Listen, Move Silently, and Search Succubus: 50' flight (average), +9 natural AC, 1d6/1d6claw, Str 13, Dex 13, Con 13, +8 racial bonus on Listen and Spot Bearded Devil: 40' speed, +7 natural AC, 1d6/1d6claw, Beard (disease), Battle Frenzy (as barbarian rage), Str 15, Dex 15, Con 17 Rakshasa: 40' move, +9 natural AC, 1d4/1d4claw + 1d6bite, Str 12, Dex 14, Con 16, +4 racial bonus on Bluff and Disguise Sahuagin: 30' swim, +5 natural AC, 1d4/1d4talon + 1d4bite, 1d4/1d4 rake underwater, blood frenzy, Str 14, Dex 13, Con 12, multiattack (feat), +8 racial bonus on Swim checks. Can choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. Can run action while swimming, in a straight line. Underwater, a sahuagin has a +4 racial bonus on Hide, Listen, and Spot 8 HD Chain Devil: +8 natural AC, 2d4/2d4(19-20)chains (10' reach), Str 15, Dex 15, Con 15, +8 racial bonus on Craft checks involving metalwork Night Hag: +11 natural AC, 2d6bite (plus disease), Str 19, Dex 12, Con 18 9 HD Erinyes: 50' fly (good), +8 natural AC, Str 21, Dex 21, Con 21, Dodge (feat), Mobility (feat) Green Hag: 30' swim, +11 natural AC, 1d4/1d4 claws, Mimicry (animal sounds), Str 19, Dex 12, Con 12, +8 racial bonus on Swim checks. Can choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. Can run action while swimming, in a straight line. 10 HD Ghale: 50' move, 150' fly (perfect), +14 natural AC, Str 25, Dex 12, Con 15 12 HD Astral Deva: 50' move, 150' fly (good), +15 natural AC, 1d8 slam, Str 22, Dex 18, Con 18 Trumpet Archon: 40' move, 90' fly (good), +14 natural AC, Str 20, Dex 17, Con 23 Barbed Devil: +13 natural AC, 2d8/2d8claw, improved grab, 3d8impale, Str 23, Dex 23, Con 23 Leonal: 60' move, +14 natural AC, 1d6/1d6claw + 1d8bite, pounce, 1d6/1d6 rake, Str 27, Dex 17, Con 20, +4 racial bonus on Balance, Hide, and Move Silently.
The Vorpal Tribble 03-28-06, 01:33 PM	The new form may be of the same type as the subject or any of the following types: aberration, animal, dragon, fey, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, plant, or vermin. Therefore 'no' outsiders. Your List: Outsiders Astral Deva Babau Barbed Devil Bearded Devil Bralani Chain Devil Erinyes Ghaele Hound Archon Leonal Night Hag Rakshasa Succubus Trumpet Archon Non-Outsiders Green Hag Sahuagin See the problem? ;) Edit: Well, there is one way of getting around this that I just noticed. Play a planetouched for a measely +1 LA and you can turn into an Outsider as well.
malignor 03-28-06, 01:43 PM	Well that sucks. I totally overlooked that. Silly, since outsider forms lose most of their abilities because of the "no supernatural abilities" note. == UPDATED LIST == Aranea - Humanoid Form: 50' movement, 25' climb, +1 natural AC, Str 11, Dex 15, Con 14, Iron Will (feat), +2 racial bonus on Jump, Listen, and Spot checks, +8 racial bonus on Climb and can always choose to take 10 on Climb checks even if rushed or threatened. Aranea - Hybrid Form: 25' climb, +1 natural AC, 1d6bite (poisonous) or web (BR10), Str 11, Dex 15, Con 14, Iron Will (feat), +2 racial bonus on Jump, Listen, and Spot checks, +8 racial bonus on Climb and can always choose to take 10 on Climb checks even if rushed or threatened. Gargoyle: 40' move, 60' fly (average), +4 natural AC, 1d4/1d4 claw + 1d6 bite + 1d6 gore, Str 15, Dex 14, Con 18, +2 racial bonus on Hide, Listen, and Spot (+8 hide if among stone) Green Hag (see above) Sahuagin (see above) Troglodyte: +6 natural AC, 1d4/1d4claw + 1d4 bite, stench, Str 10, Dex 9, Con 14, multiattack (feat), +4 hide (+8 if underground or rocky)
MonkeyPaladin 04-09-06, 06:38 PM	Thanks, these are all very useful. And I really like the gray render as something to become as well, very nice bite attack.
forrestfire15 04-14-06, 05:55 PM	if you can get your hands on a scroll of shapechange (17th) do this: ancient pyroplastic dragon gargantuan, 20d6 (sonic and fire) breath weapon, disintigrate breath weapon, spell-like abilities: 3/day-produce flame, sound burst, 1/day-fire storm, incendiary cloud, power word stun, pyrotecknics, shatter, shout, wall of fire, wall of stone DR20/magic, DR5/good immune fire, sonic AC39 SPeed 60ft, fly 150ft(clumsy), climb 40ft, burrow 45ft.
savant_warlord13 04-14-06, 06:00 PM	I can't remember if you keep spell-like abilities or not, but if you do, succubus is an excellent choice
Grug the Just 04-15-06, 01:42 AM	If you need a great combat brute for the HD, War Troll.