Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ronyon 10-25-04, 08:25 PM	What I need from you is your best undead, created withen the 3.5 rules. Ideally,they should be either mindless or if inteligent, have the potential to be of nuetral or good. The positions I am trying to fill are Mounts,Wand Bearers,Body Guards,Advisors,Scouts/Spys,and Familiers among other things. I am playing a nuetral godless cleric of Necromancy. My avoidance of inteligent evil undead is a function of practicalness and morality. My DM will accept any official 3.5 source material, but no home brews( I am afraid he isnt very creative-but he does let me play a NecroCleric!). In a perfect world, there will be a defined method for building these beasties, but as long as they are built with approved templates and whatnot, I think I can get them in there. The Undead Horse/Mount is especially of interest to me, as I intend to use it as cover, and it shouldnt stand out to much(I will disguse it through mundane and magical means). If builds are to much, any sugestion will be apreciated, and i thank you all in advance! :D
R.M.G.C.L.F. 10-25-04, 08:40 PM	*cackles* You are going to get far, far, far more than you will ever want. :devil: Give me a little time to gather them together.
R.M.G.C.L.F. 10-25-04, 08:49 PM	*stops short* Ooooooh, 3.5 existing creatures. In that case, I'm sorry to say it but your screwed. 3.5 sharply and violently elimanates any possible unliving ally for a neutral cleric.
ronyon 10-25-04, 10:15 PM	Yeah,I know that there are few if any nuetral/good undead, and that the mindless dead are universally evil. That, I dont care about.Sure, Animate dead is an evil spell, and these are evil cteatures, per the R.A.W., but who cares? I plan on casting plenty of "good" spells(there are some right?), and doing "good" deeds. As for hanging out with evil undead being corrupting, well if that is true, i guess I will have to be an elemental cleric as well, and rebuke/control some "good" elementals(there are some right?) Even if these balncing mesures fail, who cares? I will act in character, no matter what. I will be judged by my own conscience. So the alignment/mindlessness restriction is mostly due to the fact that an inteligent freewilled undead would make for a dangerous servant. One idea I had was to create a Crypt Thing whose object to protect was its own skeletal body.Not very powerful, but power aint my thing,dig? I already plan on having a pack of skeletal riding dogs, armored in thier own taxidermied hides, but Im looking for more useful animals/monsters to animate. A cloak that is actually a squid or octopus was mentioned in an old thread. I think I would favor a brace of snakes, so eack one could Aid me in combat. Ther is also the Crypt Thing, Which is of the alignment it had in life, I think. See, I have ideas , just not the knowledge/expertise to execute them... Can you help me? Any sugestions would be good, and the even a balance check for anything i come up with would be nice. For example, could six small skeletal snakes remain hidden/diguised on my person? Can I comand them to Aid me or is that too complex? Do they take penalties for "riding" me even though they are not trying to control me(or are they...Doc Ock any one?) Finally is there any way to make them better than just Skeletons? Is It worth it? :confused: :D
The Vorpal Tribble 10-25-04, 10:28 PM	I wrote this some time ago when I first started learning how to use 3.5 ed. May be a bit clunky, but I like the theme of the thing: -=-=-=-=- Wicker The brush rustles and a humanoid figure rises from the ground. A beautifully shined and gleaming skeleton held together by masterfully woven grass, hemp, and vine strides forward... Description: Wickers are holy undead, brought to life by a divine ritual of good. Wickers are unique in their being an undead with no ties to evil and of being as much a construct as an undead. They are alike normal skeletons and zombies in doing their creator's bidding without fear or hesitation, but only because that commanding them has been deemed worthy and deeply good. More guardians than servants, a wicker does what it is told, but is not limited to the commands. A wicker must have its form destroyed before it will allow harm to its summoner. They have a quarter the intelligence they did while living, and will occasionally give advice based on past life experiences. Wickers generally follow you, stealthily or boldly, but can be talked into following commands that does not require your presence. They remain animated until they are destroyed. (A destroyed wicker cannot be animated again.) Only one wicker may be summoned at a time per spell caster. The wicker summoned will obey your command indefinetely. Reguardless of how many times this spell is used, you may only control one wicker per caster level. If this number is exceeded the wickers no longer feel the need to blindly follow your command. They may or may not continue aiding you, but will act of their own accord. Combat: Wickers use any weapons they were skilled in in the living days, including natural weapons but without the original addition of acid, fire, cold or the like. Magic Circle against Evil (Su): A wicker has a continuous magic circle against evil that effects a 60-foot radius. The aura can be dispelled but the wicker can create it again as a free action on its next turn. Psionics: A wicker's soul resonates strongly with the souls of others, giving it a sort of psionic ability. At will (continuous) - Aura sight. This ability is always correct and infallible with the range of a 20th level psion. 3/day - Recall Death. This ability can be used three times a day and is only usable on evil alignments. Wickers also use telepathy to communicate and be understood by any creature within 200 ft. -=-=-=-=- Size and type: The creature's type changes to undead. It retains all subtypes as it did while living. Speed: Wickers are quite quick and agile in opposition to their evil equivalents. They seem to be full of life and joy that was weighted down by their earthly forms, allowing 10 ft. to be added to the creature's original living speed. Those that could fly in life are dropped down to clumsy because of lack of feathers or hide, only able to glide for short distances. Armor Class: Zombie Standard Base Attack: Zombie Standard Attack: Zombie Standard. Damage: Zombie Standard Special Attacks: Zombie standard + spell-like abilities Special Qualities: Zombie standard though does not gain the Single Actions Only quality, and has vulnerability to fire, which means it takes half again as much (+50%) damage from fire. Abilities: A wickers strength is decreased by -2, its Dexterity by +2, and has no constitution score. Skills: a wicker retains the skills used while in life (excluding original psionic abilities and magic), unlike standard undead. Feats: Wickers generally lose most of their feats (up to DM's discretion) but gain Toughness. Environment: Any land and underground. Challenge rating: Depends on hitdice. Treasure: none Alignment: Always Neutral Good Advancement: Zombie normal Level adjustment: - Construction: A wicker costs at least 275 gp to create for a minimum of a small creature, depending on the size of the beast required for actual price. The first task is to find any mostly complete skeleton, (though requiring the skull), of a human or any other creature that died with honor and with a good alignment, most commonly from the remains of monks, holy low-level warriors such as paladins, or good druids. Its bones are scrubbed and cleaned and purified for beautification with holy water. Flask per size: Small: 3 flasks Medium: 5 flasks Large: 10 flasks Huge: 30 flasks Gargantuan: 90 flasks Colossal: 200 flasks Grasses and vines are then taken from holy ground, such as a cemetery or blessed earth, which must be thickly woven through and about the bones into the look of clothing; cloak, boot and glove if of humanoid origin. The skull is generally covered by a hemp hood to hide its features. If of animalistic origin it appears as it did in life, though with a coat of shaggy grassy fur with protruding claw, tooth, or sting as it applies. The creature's master may assemble the body or hire someone else to do the job. Creating the body requires a Craft (weaving) check (DC 17). You must place a piece of polished amber (containing a seed) worth at least 10 gp per hitdice of the creature into the ribcage of each corpse you wish to animate. The magic of the spell causes the amber to crack and the seed inside to suddenly sprout and the resulting plant to twine about the skeleton, holding it firmly together. After the body is woven it is animated through a holy ritual that involves the casting of Entangle, Holy Aura, Holy Smite, Magic Circle Against Evil, and Ressurection.
R.M.G.C.L.F. 10-25-04, 11:18 PM	Core creatures only. That leaves ghosts and the occassional good or neutral aligned mummy. All mindless undead are evil despite lacking the capacity to hate, feel, or think. The crypt thing doesn't really move around much, it only works for dungeons. Ghosts are limited by creation conditions and bound to their deathplace and task. So, basically you can have mummies, and, uh, mummies. And keep in mind that the majority you encounter will be evil, so you'll have to search high and low for a good or neutral aligned mummy, and then figure out how to get it to help you. Like I said, you're screwed.
The Vorpal Tribble 10-26-04, 12:12 AM	Oh... core creatures... wasnt reading very carefully... well then... yeah. What R.M.G.C.L.F. said ;) Perhaps someone could help me turn this into a template?
ronyon 10-26-04, 04:14 PM	Core creatures only. That leaves ghosts and the occassional good or neutral aligned mummy. All mindless undead are evil despite lacking the capacity to hate, feel, or think. The crypt thing doesn't really move around much, it only works for dungeons. . Oh well...How about your best evil mindless undead? And mummies? As far as Core goes, well as long as its 3.5, and WotC published it might pass muster. The mindless undead dont bother me,evil or not. Its the inteligent and evil that are real trouble. As far as the Crypt Thing goes, it is built to watch over a particular site or object , so if I build it, it will be an object,and a portable one at that.Still, it is a kinda lame undead,and I would like better. I would love a statted standard Crypt Thing humen commener( from Ferun) but I dont have those books... R.M.G.C.L.F., I know you have issues with the whole "Undead=Evil" thing, and I dont blame you. But seeing as that how things are, what are the best evil undead to use? :)
R.M.G.C.L.F. 10-26-04, 05:17 PM	It's not that, I just assumed that as a neutral cleric you would avoid evil undead of any kind. Even in the case of mindless evil undead, you're pretty much stuck with skeletons and zombies. I find that red dragon skeletons tend to be the most effective, with good base abilities and natural attacks plus they are immune to both cold and fire. My personal suggestion would be to hold out for the Libris Mortis.
Mage of Sembia 10-26-04, 06:12 PM	In the Eberron Campaign Handbook, they have a good version of undead, which are turned by evil clerics and rebuked by good clerics.
R.M.G.C.L.F. 10-26-04, 06:33 PM	Ah, but that kind of violates the "core" thing, seeing as Eberron is an alternate campaign setting.