Can two Dragons of Different Colors have Offspring? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Can two Dragons of Different Colors have Offspring? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Karasuko
12-21-06, 12:28 AM Hey guys! :) I was wondering, can two true dragons of different colors (for example, a Red and a Green) mate and have offspring? And if so, what color would the offspring be?

I know that this would hardly ever ever happen, and that to even suggest such a thing to a dragon could get me eaten or worse, but I'd really like to know if there is a rule in this kind of circumstance.

I'd be grateful for any information you guys have. Thanks! :D
obrysii
12-21-06, 12:33 AM Of course.

I can see where a Gold and a Silver dragon would mate for mutual benefits for their children: as a Half-fire and half-cold dragon, it is immune to both of those. The offspring of a Gold and Silver mating would be a force to be reckoned with: it would possess greater strength, durability, armor, and intelligence than it's parents, while gaining immunity to their sole weakness.

This assumes that you are adding the Half-Dragon template to the dragon. Of course, there are many different ways of doing it.
Karasuko
12-21-06, 12:43 AM A half-gold, half-silver dragon would be incredible indeed! :D

But would it be silver, or gold in appearance? Patches of both? The bodytype and horns of one but the color of the other? I think gold and silver mixed together is called electrum, so would it be an Electrum Dragon? :confused:

Sorry for all the questions, but I thirst for obscure knowledge. ;)
drakkonflye
12-21-06, 01:03 AM Maybe white gold?
Mostly pale gold scales with silvery highlights along the spine, tail, crown, and wings?
Karasuko
12-21-06, 01:11 AM Maybe white gold?
Mostly pale gold scales with silvery highlights along the spine, tail, crown, and wings?

Ooo! That sounds cool! :ayyyy!:

But what about the offspring of Red and Green dragons? Or even Red and Silver dragons? Would one color override the other?
SinisterSeraph
12-21-06, 01:46 AM Dragon had an article about this way back in 1st edition IIRC. The best way I've seen in third is to make the offspring the same as the mother, then add a half-dragon template from the father. A word of caution though, while a one-in-a-million gold/silver, or whatnot may be cool, be careful not to overdo it. using them too much will just dilute the impact the standard dragons can have, and your players will eventually learn to expect it. Beyond that, variations on the tried and true can be a blast.
Karasuko
12-21-06, 01:54 AM Oh don't worry. :) I figure that most dragons would be repulsed by the suggestion of it, so if I did use a crossbred dragon, it'd be a once in a campaign affair. Thanks for the advice! :bow:
katarl
12-21-06, 03:25 PM Wait, red and green, doesn't that make brown? Red and Blue will make Purple Dragons!

.... Okay, it probably doesn't work that way. A Half Dragon Dragon?
kyeudo
12-21-06, 03:47 PM I have actualy statted up a half-white dragon red dragon. He came out incredibly vicious and was bright pink. I'm starting to think that running my players against it would be a mistake.
Karasuko
12-21-06, 04:57 PM LOL! You would have to be vicious if you were bright pink! :tongue: It's kind of like "A Boy Named Sue". ;)

Color mixing works for some of them, such as Blue + Green = Blue-Green, or Red + Blue = Purple. But for some pairs it just doesn't seem to work, such as Green + Red = ??? :confused:

I think a Red + Gold or Silver dragon would be beautiful! Can you just imagine those sparkling, mettalic red scales? :love:

I have a thing about things that are red and shiny. If it is red and shiny, I'll like it. :D
ksbsnowowl
12-21-06, 10:33 PM My suggestion for statting out such mixed dragons, is merely add the half-dragon template for the "stronger" half to the base creature of the "weaker" half. Then give it both breath weapons usable an unlimited number of times per day.

For example, if you were mixing a Red and a White dragon, apply the Half Dragon (red) template to a White dragon.

The reason? The half-dragon template provides numerous stat bonuses (Str +8, Con +2, Int +2, Cha +2). Why would mating with a weaker race of dragon produce a stronger, more hearty and robust creature than your natural offspring? Conversly, mating with a stronger race generally would produce a stronger, more hearty and robust offspring.

A juvenile red dragon is Large and has stats of Str 29, Dex 10, Con 19, Int 14, Wis 15, and Cha 14; Natural Armor of 15.

A juvenile white dragon is Medium and has stats of Str 17, Dex 10, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 11, and Cha 8; Natural Armor of 11.

Applying the Half-dragon template to the white dragon produces Str 25, Dex 10, Con 17, Int 10, Wis 11, and Cha 10, Natural Armor of 15 - something in-between the two parents. It may be worth arbitrarily making the mixed offspring take the larger of the two parent size categories for its given age category, but that's up to the DM.

If the DM feels like it, mix and match a few of the other special abilities, but don't give the sum of both - such would require a much larger LA or CR adjustment.
Norsesmithy
12-22-06, 03:10 AM Why would mating with a weaker race of dragon produce a stronger, more hearty and robust creature than your natural offspring?
Perhaps Hybrid Vigor?

Your suggestions seem good though. I had an epic paladin with several blood lines that explored his genealogy as he progressed through a far reaching, pantheon destroying campaign. He was the only character to live from the first session to the last, eventually fighting alongside things like Solars with class levels and demigods.

At retirement he was a young adult half-Red, Celestial, Spell-warped silver dragon Paladin 30 Cavalier 10 Sorcerer 16, I think.

Epic spell casting, Epic Smiting, ridiculous saves, unfortunately, he overshadowed some of the other players, even when they reached Divine Rank 0.

He had a stronghold, and ended up founding a nation, which he ruled for 50 years, and then he retired to raise a family (his most difficult epic spell made his rogue 8 fighter 2 Thief Acrobat 4 (player quit early in campaign, character helped manage the stronghold while my paladin did things like slay Lloth) girlfriend a young adult celestial half-red silver as well, and so the "Eternal Prince and Princess" as the citizens dubbed their seemingly unaging rulers abdicated their thrones and dropped off the face of the map, only to be aces in the hole, NPCs for the next 4000 years of the history of our groups home-brew world, (plus the matron and patron of an important group of dragons, who still participate in human politics, not to mention quelling any truely dangerous cultists (I wouldn't bet against him in battle, even against a god, he has since gained some Divine ranks, and could probably solo Gratz).

Perhaps if I find his sheet, I will post it somewhere.
ksbsnowowl
12-22-06, 08:27 AM Perhaps Hybrid Vigor?Hybrid Vigor usually affects fertility, and little else, though there are cases of other things.

But rarely does it translate into increased stature and musculature beyond the larger of the two parents.

I mean, for an extreme example, is a great dane going to have larger, more physically powerful offspring by mating with a chihuahua? No. But conversely the reverse is true.

(I'm completely ignoring the physical logistics of the mating act here - I said this was an extreme example.)
obrysii
12-22-06, 08:44 AM Lions and Tigers, with a lion mother, produces a far larger (albiet sicker) offspring: the Liger.
ksbsnowowl
12-22-06, 08:48 AM Lions and Tigers, with a lion mother, produces a far larger (albiet sicker) offspring: the Liger.Far larger than which? Larger than a lion or larger than a tiger?

Also, I'm not saying you can't do it the other way, it just makes more sense (in general, at least to me) to do it the way I listed.
obrysii
12-22-06, 09:00 AM Far larger than which? Larger than a lion or larger than a tiger?

Also, I'm not saying you can't do it the other way, it just makes more sense (in general, at least to me) to do it the way I listed.

The liger is significantly larger than either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_growth_disorders this is the cause, as it could be in Dragons as well.
ksbsnowowl
12-22-06, 10:37 AM In some sense, it is a type of hybrid dysgenesis [: defective development especially of the gonads (as in Klinefelter's syndrome)] when the growth disorder proves deleterious [: harmful often in a subtle or unexpected way], thus making it the opposite of heterosis or hybrid vigour.Again, negative, not positive effects. It may have a slight positive (larger animal), but on the whole is negative.

Again, the DM could do it either way, but my suggestion seems to make more sense (again, at least to me).
obrysii
12-22-06, 10:50 AM Or you could just say that the might and magic of dragons enables enhanced strength and power.
DebiHuman
12-22-06, 12:08 PM With regards to the Red and Green Dragon, first you need to find a common ground where they would both be found. Could be a dominance thing where one is much older and bigger (and it doesn't even matter which gender it is). Or they may be together because of mutual protection from something (both could be disabled in some way). Or perhaps Tiamat is just warped and has mutated some green and red dragons... there could be a lot of reasons for red and green dragons to create offspring.

Getting back to the liger which are bigger and heavier than either of its parents -- the males are sterile but the females are fertile -- you could follow suit for the red/green dragon.

As for the offspring -- they probably have muddy looking scales with both red and green mottled. Or the scales on the back could be green and scales on the belly could be red. Or perhaps one is just a genetic freak of nature (perhaps like a reticulated python) with both red and green scales. Just in time for the holidays -- the freakish Christmas Dragon -- this dragon isn't exactly easy to camogflage.

You could even base it off the Florida green water snake. "The Florida green water snake (Nerodia floridana) has a heavy body that grows to four feet long. The Florida green water snake swims in the water and dives for crayfish, fish, frogs and other amphibians. It is found in swamps, marshes, ponds, and ditches. In its green phase, it is olive above; in its brown phase it is brown. (It may be reddish in south Florida.) In all colorings it is speckled with brown bands. The snake's underside is cream colored. " You could have a dragon that changes color as it ages.

Debby
Millennium
12-22-06, 12:35 PM In situations like this where two creatures give half-templates, I usually use the mother's race as the base and apply the father's half-template. This is a mostly arbitrary decision; you could just as easily have a creature take after its father by using its race as the base and applying the mother's half-template. But for certain combinations, the mechanics of childbirth just plain work better when the child takes after its mother.

Not that I actually play out the mechanics of giving birth, mind you. But it heads off player questions to have an answer ready.
alchemyprime
12-22-06, 12:46 PM The main problem with Metallics and Chromatics is their reliance on color. My Half-Red Silver I used came out okay (we called him the Brazen Dragon) but the half-gren red seems to be the only problem.

So, why not make his scales mixed? Like a tabby cat, red with green stripes? He would get Disguise Self as a spell, because he's tired of people making fun of him! Oh, and make him hatched on Dec 24th, and name him Santanamos, or Santa, the Christmas Dragon, who hates Christmas and plans to steal it from a small halfling village!

Sorry. I just watched Itsudatte My Santa! on YouTube and How The Grinch Stole Christmas on abc Family, so the two are stuck in my head.
Karasuko
12-22-06, 04:12 PM As for the offspring -- they probably have muddy looking scales with both red and green mottled. Or the scales on the back could be green and scales on the belly could be red. Or perhaps one is just a genetic freak of nature (perhaps like a reticulated python) with both red and green scales. Just in time for the holidays -- the freakish Christmas Dragon -- this dragon isn't exactly easy to camogflage.

LOL "Run! It's the dreaded Christmas Dragon!!!" :rofl:

Mixing the scales like a patterned snake's skin is a pretty good idea! :D Perhaps the pattern of the scales is different in each (extremely rare) case. I kind of feel sorry for it, because most likely other dragons will view it as a perversion to their noble race and attack it. Poor little red/green dragon... :(

In situations like this where two creatures give half-templates, I usually use the mother's race as the base and apply the father's half-template. This is a mostly arbitrary decision; you could just as easily have a creature take after its father by using its race as the base and applying the mother's half-template. But for certain combinations, the mechanics of childbirth just plain work better when the child takes after its mother.

That's true, I hadn't thought of that! :eek: But I figure all dragons must start off small enough to fir into their eggs, so it shouldn't be too much of a hassle, I hope. :)

So, why not make his scales mixed? Like a tabby cat, red with green stripes? He would get Disguise Self as a spell, because he's tired of people making fun of him! Oh, and make him hatched on Dec 24th, and name him Santanamos, or Santa, the Christmas Dragon, who hates Christmas and plans to steal it from a small halfling village!

LOL well I can imagine how much frustration and anger he'd need to unleash after centuries of rejection and mockery! :ahem: And with evil on both sides of his lineage, he's probably not someone you want to mess with! :devil:

As for fertility or infertility, I suppose you could go either way. On one hand, since dragons are so infused with magic that they are able to breed with almost anything, its not hard to imagine that they could very well produce fertile offspring with another kind of dragon. But on the other hand, crossbreeding with another kind of dragon might be so innately unnatural that their offspring would be infertile.

I suppose it depends on the whim of the DM. :D
The Vorpal Tribble
12-22-06, 04:17 PM Heh, my first thought when I saw this thread is, 'It'd be pretty messed up if dragons couldn't mate, considering how nothing that lives is safe from a dragon, up to and including treants, gelatinous cubes and toads.'
drakkonflye
12-22-06, 10:34 PM Regarding breath weapons:
If you choose to cross-breed dragons, here are some suggestions for possible breath weapons based on types:

Red+green= Flaming acid, cone effect that deals half fire and half acid damage

Red+blue= Firestorm, cone effect that deals half fire and half electric damage

Red+black= Corrosive fire, cone effect that deals half fire and half acid damage

Red+white= Coldfire, cone effect that deals half fire and half cold damage

Green+blue= Electric cloud, cloud effect that deals half acid and half electric damage

Green+black= Since both have acid-based breath weapons, the dragon might instead have the option to use either a cloud effect or a line effect whenever it breathes as it chooses

Green+white= Acid cloud, cloud effect that deals half acid and half cold damage

Blue+black= Acid bolts, line effect that deals half electric and half acid damage

Blue+white= Cold bolts, line effect that deals half electric and half cold damage

Black+white= Black ice, line effect that deals half acid and half cold damage

This is just the chromatic dragons, with the first type for each pair listed presumably being the dominant parent type (based on characteristics as listed for each dragon, not gender of parents) and therefore choosing the type of weapon, I.E. cone, cloud, or line. This is akin to the Energy Admixture metamagic feat in the Complete Arcane, but does not double the effective damage dice. The amount of damage dealt for the dragon's age category is unchanged. Presumably the metallic dragons would follow a similar pattern, with dominance being from strongest to weakest: Gold, Silver, Bronze, Brass, and Copper.

As another option, you could choose to have each dragon gain Clinging Breath as a bonus feat (as per Draconomicon), with the exception that the effect does primary damage as per the dominant parent type's breath weapon, and secondary damage the following round as per the secondary parent type's breath weapon. If you do this though, you should still apply the +1 round between breath attacks as per the feat.

Myself, I prefer the first method.
drakkonflye
12-22-06, 10:37 PM Oh, and no, I didn't overlook the possibility of cross-breeding chromatic and metallic dragons. I just find it hard to fathom myself how such a pairing could be without some form of divine intervention or major alignment changes considering how opposed the two races are. Then again, such a pair would make for one helluva campaign hook! :plotting:
Karasuko
12-22-06, 10:49 PM Wow!! :eek: Thanks drakkonflye!! :D It must have taken you a while to come up with all those breath weapons! Thanks for all your trouble! :bow:
savant_warlord13
12-24-06, 08:16 PM It happens alot in my games. Heck, the home city of the PCs has a tungusta dragon on the council of mages.
Karasuko
12-24-06, 09:07 PM It happens alot in my games. Heck, the home city of the PCs has a tungusta dragon on the council of mages.

Tungusta? :confused: Sorry if I'm dense, but what does tungusta mean? Thanks! :D

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Karasuko 12-21-06, 12:28 AM	Hey guys! :) I was wondering, can two true dragons of different colors (for example, a Red and a Green) mate and have offspring? And if so, what color would the offspring be? I know that this would hardly ever ever happen, and that to even suggest such a thing to a dragon could get me eaten or worse, but I'd really like to know if there is a rule in this kind of circumstance. I'd be grateful for any information you guys have. Thanks! :D
obrysii 12-21-06, 12:33 AM	Of course. I can see where a Gold and a Silver dragon would mate for mutual benefits for their children: as a Half-fire and half-cold dragon, it is immune to both of those. The offspring of a Gold and Silver mating would be a force to be reckoned with: it would possess greater strength, durability, armor, and intelligence than it's parents, while gaining immunity to their sole weakness. This assumes that you are adding the Half-Dragon template to the dragon. Of course, there are many different ways of doing it.
Karasuko 12-21-06, 12:43 AM	A half-gold, half-silver dragon would be incredible indeed! :D But would it be silver, or gold in appearance? Patches of both? The bodytype and horns of one but the color of the other? I think gold and silver mixed together is called electrum, so would it be an Electrum Dragon? :confused: Sorry for all the questions, but I thirst for obscure knowledge. ;)
drakkonflye 12-21-06, 01:03 AM	Maybe white gold? Mostly pale gold scales with silvery highlights along the spine, tail, crown, and wings?
Karasuko 12-21-06, 01:11 AM	Maybe white gold? Mostly pale gold scales with silvery highlights along the spine, tail, crown, and wings? Ooo! That sounds cool! :ayyyy!: But what about the offspring of Red and Green dragons? Or even Red and Silver dragons? Would one color override the other?
SinisterSeraph 12-21-06, 01:46 AM	Dragon had an article about this way back in 1st edition IIRC. The best way I've seen in third is to make the offspring the same as the mother, then add a half-dragon template from the father. A word of caution though, while a one-in-a-million gold/silver, or whatnot may be cool, be careful not to overdo it. using them too much will just dilute the impact the standard dragons can have, and your players will eventually learn to expect it. Beyond that, variations on the tried and true can be a blast.
Karasuko 12-21-06, 01:54 AM	Oh don't worry. :) I figure that most dragons would be repulsed by the suggestion of it, so if I did use a crossbred dragon, it'd be a once in a campaign affair. Thanks for the advice! :bow:
katarl 12-21-06, 03:25 PM	Wait, red and green, doesn't that make brown? Red and Blue will make Purple Dragons! .... Okay, it probably doesn't work that way. A Half Dragon Dragon?
kyeudo 12-21-06, 03:47 PM	I have actualy statted up a half-white dragon red dragon. He came out incredibly vicious and was bright pink. I'm starting to think that running my players against it would be a mistake.
Karasuko 12-21-06, 04:57 PM	LOL! You would have to be vicious if you were bright pink! :tongue: It's kind of like "A Boy Named Sue". ;) Color mixing works for some of them, such as Blue + Green = Blue-Green, or Red + Blue = Purple. But for some pairs it just doesn't seem to work, such as Green + Red = ??? :confused: I think a Red + Gold or Silver dragon would be beautiful! Can you just imagine those sparkling, mettalic red scales? :love: I have a thing about things that are red and shiny. If it is red and shiny, I'll like it. :D
ksbsnowowl 12-21-06, 10:33 PM	My suggestion for statting out such mixed dragons, is merely add the half-dragon template for the "stronger" half to the base creature of the "weaker" half. Then give it both breath weapons usable an unlimited number of times per day. For example, if you were mixing a Red and a White dragon, apply the Half Dragon (red) template to a White dragon. The reason? The half-dragon template provides numerous stat bonuses (Str +8, Con +2, Int +2, Cha +2). Why would mating with a weaker race of dragon produce a stronger, more hearty and robust creature than your natural offspring? Conversly, mating with a stronger race generally would produce a stronger, more hearty and robust offspring. A juvenile red dragon is Large and has stats of Str 29, Dex 10, Con 19, Int 14, Wis 15, and Cha 14; Natural Armor of 15. A juvenile white dragon is Medium and has stats of Str 17, Dex 10, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 11, and Cha 8; Natural Armor of 11. Applying the Half-dragon template to the white dragon produces Str 25, Dex 10, Con 17, Int 10, Wis 11, and Cha 10, Natural Armor of 15 - something in-between the two parents. It may be worth arbitrarily making the mixed offspring take the larger of the two parent size categories for its given age category, but that's up to the DM. If the DM feels like it, mix and match a few of the other special abilities, but don't give the sum of both - such would require a much larger LA or CR adjustment.
Norsesmithy 12-22-06, 03:10 AM	Why would mating with a weaker race of dragon produce a stronger, more hearty and robust creature than your natural offspring? Perhaps Hybrid Vigor? Your suggestions seem good though. I had an epic paladin with several blood lines that explored his genealogy as he progressed through a far reaching, pantheon destroying campaign. He was the only character to live from the first session to the last, eventually fighting alongside things like Solars with class levels and demigods. At retirement he was a young adult half-Red, Celestial, Spell-warped silver dragon Paladin 30 Cavalier 10 Sorcerer 16, I think. Epic spell casting, Epic Smiting, ridiculous saves, unfortunately, he overshadowed some of the other players, even when they reached Divine Rank 0. He had a stronghold, and ended up founding a nation, which he ruled for 50 years, and then he retired to raise a family (his most difficult epic spell made his rogue 8 fighter 2 Thief Acrobat 4 (player quit early in campaign, character helped manage the stronghold while my paladin did things like slay Lloth) girlfriend a young adult celestial half-red silver as well, and so the "Eternal Prince and Princess" as the citizens dubbed their seemingly unaging rulers abdicated their thrones and dropped off the face of the map, only to be aces in the hole, NPCs for the next 4000 years of the history of our groups home-brew world, (plus the matron and patron of an important group of dragons, who still participate in human politics, not to mention quelling any truely dangerous cultists (I wouldn't bet against him in battle, even against a god, he has since gained some Divine ranks, and could probably solo Gratz). Perhaps if I find his sheet, I will post it somewhere.
ksbsnowowl 12-22-06, 08:27 AM	Perhaps Hybrid Vigor?Hybrid Vigor usually affects fertility, and little else, though there are cases of other things. But rarely does it translate into increased stature and musculature beyond the larger of the two parents. I mean, for an extreme example, is a great dane going to have larger, more physically powerful offspring by mating with a chihuahua? No. But conversely the reverse is true. (I'm completely ignoring the physical logistics of the mating act here - I said this was an extreme example.)
obrysii 12-22-06, 08:44 AM	Lions and Tigers, with a lion mother, produces a far larger (albiet sicker) offspring: the Liger.
ksbsnowowl 12-22-06, 08:48 AM	Lions and Tigers, with a lion mother, produces a far larger (albiet sicker) offspring: the Liger.Far larger than which? Larger than a lion or larger than a tiger? Also, I'm not saying you can't do it the other way, it just makes more sense (in general, at least to me) to do it the way I listed.
obrysii 12-22-06, 09:00 AM	Far larger than which? Larger than a lion or larger than a tiger? Also, I'm not saying you can't do it the other way, it just makes more sense (in general, at least to me) to do it the way I listed. The liger is significantly larger than either. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_growth_disorders this is the cause, as it could be in Dragons as well.
ksbsnowowl 12-22-06, 10:37 AM	In some sense, it is a type of hybrid dysgenesis [: defective development especially of the gonads (as in Klinefelter's syndrome)] when the growth disorder proves deleterious [: harmful often in a subtle or unexpected way], thus making it the opposite of heterosis or hybrid vigour.Again, negative, not positive effects. It may have a slight positive (larger animal), but on the whole is negative. Again, the DM could do it either way, but my suggestion seems to make more sense (again, at least to me).
obrysii 12-22-06, 10:50 AM	Or you could just say that the might and magic of dragons enables enhanced strength and power.
DebiHuman 12-22-06, 12:08 PM	With regards to the Red and Green Dragon, first you need to find a common ground where they would both be found. Could be a dominance thing where one is much older and bigger (and it doesn't even matter which gender it is). Or they may be together because of mutual protection from something (both could be disabled in some way). Or perhaps Tiamat is just warped and has mutated some green and red dragons... there could be a lot of reasons for red and green dragons to create offspring. Getting back to the liger which are bigger and heavier than either of its parents -- the males are sterile but the females are fertile -- you could follow suit for the red/green dragon. As for the offspring -- they probably have muddy looking scales with both red and green mottled. Or the scales on the back could be green and scales on the belly could be red. Or perhaps one is just a genetic freak of nature (perhaps like a reticulated python) with both red and green scales. Just in time for the holidays -- the freakish Christmas Dragon -- this dragon isn't exactly easy to camogflage. You could even base it off the Florida green water snake. "The Florida green water snake (Nerodia floridana) has a heavy body that grows to four feet long. The Florida green water snake swims in the water and dives for crayfish, fish, frogs and other amphibians. It is found in swamps, marshes, ponds, and ditches. In its green phase, it is olive above; in its brown phase it is brown. (It may be reddish in south Florida.) In all colorings it is speckled with brown bands. The snake's underside is cream colored. " You could have a dragon that changes color as it ages. Debby
Millennium 12-22-06, 12:35 PM	In situations like this where two creatures give half-templates, I usually use the mother's race as the base and apply the father's half-template. This is a mostly arbitrary decision; you could just as easily have a creature take after its father by using its race as the base and applying the mother's half-template. But for certain combinations, the mechanics of childbirth just plain work better when the child takes after its mother. Not that I actually play out the mechanics of giving birth, mind you. But it heads off player questions to have an answer ready.
alchemyprime 12-22-06, 12:46 PM	The main problem with Metallics and Chromatics is their reliance on color. My Half-Red Silver I used came out okay (we called him the Brazen Dragon) but the half-gren red seems to be the only problem. So, why not make his scales mixed? Like a tabby cat, red with green stripes? He would get Disguise Self as a spell, because he's tired of people making fun of him! Oh, and make him hatched on Dec 24th, and name him Santanamos, or Santa, the Christmas Dragon, who hates Christmas and plans to steal it from a small halfling village! Sorry. I just watched Itsudatte My Santa! on YouTube and How The Grinch Stole Christmas on abc Family, so the two are stuck in my head.
Karasuko 12-22-06, 04:12 PM	As for the offspring -- they probably have muddy looking scales with both red and green mottled. Or the scales on the back could be green and scales on the belly could be red. Or perhaps one is just a genetic freak of nature (perhaps like a reticulated python) with both red and green scales. Just in time for the holidays -- the freakish Christmas Dragon -- this dragon isn't exactly easy to camogflage. LOL "Run! It's the dreaded Christmas Dragon!!!" :rofl: Mixing the scales like a patterned snake's skin is a pretty good idea! :D Perhaps the pattern of the scales is different in each (extremely rare) case. I kind of feel sorry for it, because most likely other dragons will view it as a perversion to their noble race and attack it. Poor little red/green dragon... :( In situations like this where two creatures give half-templates, I usually use the mother's race as the base and apply the father's half-template. This is a mostly arbitrary decision; you could just as easily have a creature take after its father by using its race as the base and applying the mother's half-template. But for certain combinations, the mechanics of childbirth just plain work better when the child takes after its mother. That's true, I hadn't thought of that! :eek: But I figure all dragons must start off small enough to fir into their eggs, so it shouldn't be too much of a hassle, I hope. :) So, why not make his scales mixed? Like a tabby cat, red with green stripes? He would get Disguise Self as a spell, because he's tired of people making fun of him! Oh, and make him hatched on Dec 24th, and name him Santanamos, or Santa, the Christmas Dragon, who hates Christmas and plans to steal it from a small halfling village! LOL well I can imagine how much frustration and anger he'd need to unleash after centuries of rejection and mockery! :ahem: And with evil on both sides of his lineage, he's probably not someone you want to mess with! :devil: As for fertility or infertility, I suppose you could go either way. On one hand, since dragons are so infused with magic that they are able to breed with almost anything, its not hard to imagine that they could very well produce fertile offspring with another kind of dragon. But on the other hand, crossbreeding with another kind of dragon might be so innately unnatural that their offspring would be infertile. I suppose it depends on the whim of the DM. :D
The Vorpal Tribble 12-22-06, 04:17 PM	Heh, my first thought when I saw this thread is, 'It'd be pretty messed up if dragons couldn't mate, considering how nothing that lives is safe from a dragon, up to and including treants, gelatinous cubes and toads.'
drakkonflye 12-22-06, 10:34 PM	Regarding breath weapons: If you choose to cross-breed dragons, here are some suggestions for possible breath weapons based on types: Red+green= Flaming acid, cone effect that deals half fire and half acid damage Red+blue= Firestorm, cone effect that deals half fire and half electric damage Red+black= Corrosive fire, cone effect that deals half fire and half acid damage Red+white= Coldfire, cone effect that deals half fire and half cold damage Green+blue= Electric cloud, cloud effect that deals half acid and half electric damage Green+black= Since both have acid-based breath weapons, the dragon might instead have the option to use either a cloud effect or a line effect whenever it breathes as it chooses Green+white= Acid cloud, cloud effect that deals half acid and half cold damage Blue+black= Acid bolts, line effect that deals half electric and half acid damage Blue+white= Cold bolts, line effect that deals half electric and half cold damage Black+white= Black ice, line effect that deals half acid and half cold damage This is just the chromatic dragons, with the first type for each pair listed presumably being the dominant parent type (based on characteristics as listed for each dragon, not gender of parents) and therefore choosing the type of weapon, I.E. cone, cloud, or line. This is akin to the Energy Admixture metamagic feat in the Complete Arcane, but does not double the effective damage dice. The amount of damage dealt for the dragon's age category is unchanged. Presumably the metallic dragons would follow a similar pattern, with dominance being from strongest to weakest: Gold, Silver, Bronze, Brass, and Copper. As another option, you could choose to have each dragon gain Clinging Breath as a bonus feat (as per Draconomicon), with the exception that the effect does primary damage as per the dominant parent type's breath weapon, and secondary damage the following round as per the secondary parent type's breath weapon. If you do this though, you should still apply the +1 round between breath attacks as per the feat. Myself, I prefer the first method.
drakkonflye 12-22-06, 10:37 PM	Oh, and no, I didn't overlook the possibility of cross-breeding chromatic and metallic dragons. I just find it hard to fathom myself how such a pairing could be without some form of divine intervention or major alignment changes considering how opposed the two races are. Then again, such a pair would make for one helluva campaign hook! :plotting:
Karasuko 12-22-06, 10:49 PM	Wow!! :eek: Thanks drakkonflye!! :D It must have taken you a while to come up with all those breath weapons! Thanks for all your trouble! :bow:
savant_warlord13 12-24-06, 08:16 PM	It happens alot in my games. Heck, the home city of the PCs has a tungusta dragon on the council of mages.
Karasuko 12-24-06, 09:07 PM	It happens alot in my games. Heck, the home city of the PCs has a tungusta dragon on the council of mages. Tungusta? :confused: Sorry if I'm dense, but what does tungusta mean? Thanks! :D