Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sulacu 06-05-07, 10:51 AM	Our DM has been up to creating a new campaign for us to play in. It is, as the title says, about cheating death, adventurously traveling to the reaches of the world to transcend into the planes where the dead roam and are carried over to the final end. This is going to be a pretty high level campaign, as the thoughts of actually cheating death are quite a bit too ambitious for those lower level characters. So, we've been making critters and maps for the campaign for several weeks now, but one thing we still haven't got. A type of Dragon that would live in the underworld or the 'fringe' (plane between life and death), etc. So I decided to try and I made this: LINK (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Lethus_Dragon_%28DnD_Creature%29). We're likely going quite up into Epic levels, which is something I took care to remember while building it, but if I'm off with CR, things can be either difficult or roaringly easy during play, which are things I want to avoid. Might the CR progression I have picked work well, or should I opt for lower/higher progressions? Some help will be very appreciated. :)
Orchomenos 06-05-07, 12:55 PM	We could perhaps think of a better name... "Lettuce Dragon" doesn't seem that threatening...
Sulacu 06-05-07, 01:01 PM	Well, I am pretty cool with it being threatening. The etymological origins of the dragon's name is the river Lethus after all. Touch its water and forget yourself forever. Any thoughts about the CRs, though?
Orchomenos 06-05-07, 01:56 PM	Isn't it the Styx that makes you forget everything? Oh, nevermind. Anyway, I suggest it as a running gag in your campaign; the wyrm would keep on explaining it is not about salad, but about the water of the dreaded river... Ok, comparing with a Red Dragon of approximatively equal size and HD, the Lethus dragon should have Challenge Ratings: Wyrmling 7; very young 10; young 13; juvenile 17; young adult 20; adult 21; mature adult 24; old 26; (...) Or comparing with a Prismatic Dragon of approximatively equal size and HD, the Lethus dragon should have Challenge Rating: (...) juvenile 14; young adult (19); adult 22; mature adult 29; old 32; very old 35; ancient 39; wyrm 43; great wyrm 47 This mostly concord with your own estimation, but I seem to be very higher for the Wyrm and Great Wyrm. To enforce the "Darkness" aspect, I would push Shadow Walk at an higher level, and give him the Shadow Dancer's Shadow Jump ability. It would give him an edge in combat.
Sulacu 06-05-07, 02:11 PM	I started in a somewhat middle situation, the Old Lethus dragon, which I first compared to the Adult Force Dragon. Old Lethus has lesser ability scores, lesser DCs, although it has about the same breath weapon damage and DC and it can teleport through shadow at will, and its caster level is roughly equal. The Adult Force dragon has CR 31, so I went for 29, and tried to estimate the rest of the CRs with that as a benchmark/intermediary. Perhaps I should let the CR increase just slightly faster because when a Lethus gets 'very old', its DR changes from magic to epic and its abilities start to get really high. I also opted to put no limit on distance for its shadow walk, and it can use it wherever it is due to its own shadowy smoke stuff...
R.M.G.C.L.F. 06-05-07, 05:33 PM	How can you have "darkness immunity", since darkness isn't really a damage type or an attack? Shadow walk wouldn't be much use, since half of the planes it lives in aren't connected to the plane of shadow.
Sulacu 06-05-07, 05:36 PM	Let me rephrase that. The creature is not affected negatively by any effects associated with darkness, whether it's impaired vision or movement. It's not always about damage. Furthermore, our campaign does not use the D&D cosmology. It uses light and shadow as two opposites that are present almost everywhere in the cosmos. I won't say, though, that that still requires some work.
mharb 06-08-07, 02:25 AM	Furthermore, our campaign does not use the D&D cosmology. It uses light and shadow as two opposites that are present almost everywhere in the cosmos. I won't say, though, that that still requires some work. There is no requirement to have a shadow plane in your campaign... but the spell "shadow step" without a shadow plane, makes no more sense than "astral projection" without an astral plane.
Sulacu 06-08-07, 07:34 AM	Yes, God, Alright, it cracks away and pops back up like Nightcrawler. Semantics........ Although, I have also considered the realm to be coterminous to the Ethereal and Coexistent and Coterminous to the Shadow Plane, as if on the other side of the coin together with prime material... The realm itself is called Secundis, or Realm of the Second Breath where spirits are carried over and reinvested. The draft of it all is still very raw.