Chimera Skeleton in MM1 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Chimera Skeleton in MM1 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Bytestorm
08-16-05, 09:07 AM I applied the Skeleton Template to the Chimera-Creature in MM1 and got the same results as the premade Chimera Skeleton found in the examples of the Skeleton Templates.

But I got a little difference I cannot understand. In the book the second "Bite" and the "Gore"-Attack got a +7-Bonus, but when the Chimera loses her Multiattack-Feat (because of Skeleton-Template) these attack-values should go down to +4, don't they?
Great Cthulhu
08-16-05, 12:51 PM I applied the Skeleton Template to the Chimera-Creature in MM1 and got the same results as the premade Chimera Skeleton found in the examples of the Skeleton Templates.

But I got a little difference I cannot understand. In the book the second "Bite" and the "Gore"-Attack got a +7-Bonus, but when the Chimera loses her Multiattack-Feat (because of Skeleton-Template) these attack-values should go down to +4, don't they?
It could be a typo in the MM that they forgot to change. WotC isn't perfect you know. (They're still good, but not perfect.)
Bytestorm
08-16-05, 08:44 PM Ah, I am very new to D&D and RPG at all. But I rechecked it several times and with opinions of other. Seems to be wrong in the book. It's ok, just good to know.

I am very happy with the WotC-Products, D&D is great!
Slagger the Chuul
08-17-05, 05:57 AM For the chimera, the attacks of all three heads seem to be treated as primary attacks, rather than secondary ones. The only secondary attack is their claws. The skeletal chimera has an appropriate reduction in the attack bonus of its claws.

While this makes sense (logically) and is written in the statistics block of the normal chimera, it really should have been explicitly mentioned in the chimera's Combat section.
Bytestorm
08-17-05, 08:06 AM Oke, where to see what attacks of her full-attack are primary and secondary? Only because of the attack-values +12/+10?
Slagger the Chuul
08-17-05, 12:56 PM Oke, where to see what attacks of her full-attack are primary and secondary? Only because of the attack-values +12/+10?

Pretty much. Like I said, they really should have made a special mention of this, since it's an abnormal situation. It's quite clear what they've done when you look at the statistics and note that this is a three-headed creature.

If you wanted to compare it to something similar, you can look to the hydra. The only real difference between how the bite attacks of these creatures operate is that each head of the chimera deals a different amount of damage. This means that each bite needs to be noted as a separate weapon.

You'll notice that since the chimera has more than one primary natural weapon, it adds its normal Strength modifier (instead of 1 1/2 times its Strength modifier) to those attacks. If only one of those bite attacks was the primary natural weapon, it would add +6 to damage instead of +4, with the secondary natural weapons (the other two bites and the claws) adding only +2.
ShinQuickMan
08-17-05, 02:32 PM Pretty much. Like I said, they really should have made a special mention of this, since it's an abnormal situation. It's quite clear what they've done when you look at the statistics and note that this is a three-headed

If you wanted to compare it to something similar, you can look to the hydra. The only real difference between how the bite attacks of these creatures operate is that each head of the chimera deals a different amount of damage. This means that each bite needs to be noted as a separate weapon.creature.

You'll notice that since the chimera has more than one primary natural weapon, it adds its normal Strength modifier (instead of 1 1/2 times its Strength modifier) to those attacks. If only one of those bite attacks was the primary natural weapon, it would add +6 to damage instead of +4, with the secondary natural weapons (the other two bites and the claws) adding only +2.

Actually, you could also look at creatures that have claws as their primary attack. When they make 2 claw attacks, they don't take the -5 penalty (or -2 with multiattack) for their second claws (or more, if they have it). So, the same thing could be said for creatures with multiple heads (and purhaps other limbs that are considered natural weapons).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bytestorm 08-16-05, 09:07 AM	I applied the Skeleton Template to the Chimera-Creature in MM1 and got the same results as the premade Chimera Skeleton found in the examples of the Skeleton Templates. But I got a little difference I cannot understand. In the book the second "Bite" and the "Gore"-Attack got a +7-Bonus, but when the Chimera loses her Multiattack-Feat (because of Skeleton-Template) these attack-values should go down to +4, don't they?
Great Cthulhu 08-16-05, 12:51 PM	I applied the Skeleton Template to the Chimera-Creature in MM1 and got the same results as the premade Chimera Skeleton found in the examples of the Skeleton Templates. But I got a little difference I cannot understand. In the book the second "Bite" and the "Gore"-Attack got a +7-Bonus, but when the Chimera loses her Multiattack-Feat (because of Skeleton-Template) these attack-values should go down to +4, don't they? It could be a typo in the MM that they forgot to change. WotC isn't perfect you know. (They're still good, but not perfect.)
Bytestorm 08-16-05, 08:44 PM	Ah, I am very new to D&D and RPG at all. But I rechecked it several times and with opinions of other. Seems to be wrong in the book. It's ok, just good to know. I am very happy with the WotC-Products, D&D is great!
Slagger the Chuul 08-17-05, 05:57 AM	For the chimera, the attacks of all three heads seem to be treated as primary attacks, rather than secondary ones. The only secondary attack is their claws. The skeletal chimera has an appropriate reduction in the attack bonus of its claws. While this makes sense (logically) and is written in the statistics block of the normal chimera, it really should have been explicitly mentioned in the chimera's Combat section.
Bytestorm 08-17-05, 08:06 AM	Oke, where to see what attacks of her full-attack are primary and secondary? Only because of the attack-values +12/+10?
Slagger the Chuul 08-17-05, 12:56 PM	Oke, where to see what attacks of her full-attack are primary and secondary? Only because of the attack-values +12/+10? Pretty much. Like I said, they really should have made a special mention of this, since it's an abnormal situation. It's quite clear what they've done when you look at the statistics and note that this is a three-headed creature. If you wanted to compare it to something similar, you can look to the hydra. The only real difference between how the bite attacks of these creatures operate is that each head of the chimera deals a different amount of damage. This means that each bite needs to be noted as a separate weapon. You'll notice that since the chimera has more than one primary natural weapon, it adds its normal Strength modifier (instead of 1 1/2 times its Strength modifier) to those attacks. If only one of those bite attacks was the primary natural weapon, it would add +6 to damage instead of +4, with the secondary natural weapons (the other two bites and the claws) adding only +2.
ShinQuickMan 08-17-05, 02:32 PM	Pretty much. Like I said, they really should have made a special mention of this, since it's an abnormal situation. It's quite clear what they've done when you look at the statistics and note that this is a three-headed If you wanted to compare it to something similar, you can look to the hydra. The only real difference between how the bite attacks of these creatures operate is that each head of the chimera deals a different amount of damage. This means that each bite needs to be noted as a separate weapon.creature. You'll notice that since the chimera has more than one primary natural weapon, it adds its normal Strength modifier (instead of 1 1/2 times its Strength modifier) to those attacks. If only one of those bite attacks was the primary natural weapon, it would add +6 to damage instead of +4, with the secondary natural weapons (the other two bites and the claws) adding only +2. Actually, you could also look at creatures that have claws as their primary attack. When they make 2 claw attacks, they don't take the -5 penalty (or -2 with multiattack) for their second claws (or more, if they have it). So, the same thing could be said for creatures with multiple heads (and purhaps other limbs that are considered natural weapons).