Did I run this troll right? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Did I run this troll right? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Bluebrush
11-24-03, 10:19 AM At the moment, I'm running a 3,0 version of "The sunless citadel" with five level 2, 32 point buy characters.

The party encountered a sorta-weak troll and defeated it.

The Barbarian (Unraging) and the Cleric of Kord just stood next to the troll and hacked at it while the ranger failed to shoot it with his longbow and the sorcerer magic missiled it for a few rounds. The rogue just wandered off mid battle to look at some statues.

The party beat the troll down to 0 hit points with subdual damage in less than four rounds, continued beating on it's corpse just to be sure, looted the body, set it alight with oil and kicked it's flaming corpse into a pit.

It seemed way to easy to me. Did I do something wrong?
Boudewijn Brendergast
11-24-03, 10:30 AM AFAICT you played it right, well if the troll did something in return during those four rounds that is...

Your players however came suspiciously close to metagame thinking, unless they beat every monster "to be sure" after it goes down and burn the corpse or their characters have encountered trolls before.
Bluebrush
11-24-03, 11:15 AM Yeah, the troll tried to claw and bite the barbarian, but didn't do too well.

Well a couple of them are experienced RPers. So they would themselves know how to do that.

And we had a ranger... Eh, maybe he knew how, since he knew it was a troll.
Meh. I'll just give them a little less XP than they would get for a normal troll, since it is a weak troll. And they had time to prepare.
Will Brandiman
11-24-03, 11:24 AM IMC the party just came up against a whole bunch of trolls but managed to defeat them by drawing them out in pairs rather than all at once and then beating/burning them. There are 4 level 4 characters. Even with a bit of advance warning and preparation they found it tough going and had to retreat and rest for the night before being able to continue.

I would say that if 2 level 2 characters can defeat a troll without much help from the rest of the party then something was going wrong. A level 2 character is unlikely to have more than about 20 hit points. A troll can do that in one round! What was it doing all this time? Knitting?
Mr.Waesel
11-24-03, 12:25 PM It was a weak troll.

I think its metagaming to assume you need to beat extra on a cretaure and brun it after its dead.
Tempus665
11-24-03, 12:51 PM That´s why the various Knowledge skills are handy: to determine what PC´s do and don´t know about certain monsters.
A succesful Knowledge (nature) check against a fairly high DC would have revealed whether or not the 2nd level PC´s knew about the troll´s regenerative ability, IMO.
lukelightning
11-24-03, 12:59 PM Plus you can see a troll regenerating. And if nobody knows how to defeat a regenerating creature's ability, then the XP value should be modified.

For me, it's not worth getting my knickers in a knot regarding metagaming and trolls. I figure the general populace knows what to do with a troll, just the same most modern day americans know it takes a wooden stake to kill a vampire, silver to kill a werewolf, and a bucket of water to knock off the Wicked Witch of the West (DR 15/H2O). Trolls are easily discribed (a big ugly green giant), so it's easy to transmit that knowledge (like the bedtime tale of Max the Heroic, who slew the evil trolls. "Mommy, what's a troll?" "It's an ugly green giant. Max killed them with fire.")
Bluebrush
11-24-03, 01:54 PM Originally posted by Will Brandiman
I would say that if 2 level 2 characters can defeat a troll without much help from the rest of the party then something was going wrong. A level 2 character is unlikely to have more than about 20 hit points. A troll can do that in one round! What was it doing all this time? Knitting?

Well, the magic missiles did help.
The Barbarian had a shield which brought his AC up to 20 and the cleric had blessed and Divine favoured his greatsword.
And they were flanking, since they were pretty much expecting something nasty to burst out of the ominous sarcauphagous they were prying open having faced some zombies earlier (Which also felt a tad too easy.)

This troll's stats:
Str: 15 Dex: 12 Con: 23 Int: 4 Wis: 3 Cha: 6
AC 18 Hp:42 +5/+5/+0 (d6+2 claws d6 bite)
Regen 3/round.

It is possible to just KO a troll and then let a nice fire do all the work, right?
Galduil lvl15/1 NWN
11-24-03, 07:20 PM Lets see, one versus 5 guys at level 2... the numbers were totally against that troll. Now maybe two or three trolls that would have been nice. I figured out that it is all about the numbers of enemies. Now that you know they can handle 1 troll now you can dish a couple of more things at them.

Oh yeah one last thing, at least you didn't have 3 guys at level 1 fighting three trolls. Needless to say we died quickly, I will never let that guy DM ever again!
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht
11-24-03, 07:32 PM Originally posted by Bluebrush
This troll's stats:
Str: 15 Dex: 12 Con: 23 Int: 4 Wis: 3 Cha: 6
AC 18 Hp:42 +5/+5/+0 (d6+2 claws d6 bite)
Regen 3/round.

It is possible to just KO a troll and then let a nice fire do all the work, right? Why'd you water down the troll that much?!
Bluebrush
11-24-03, 07:48 PM It's a pre-prepared module.

Seems the troll was an elf that was changed into a troll.

Oh, and I should clarify the roles the PCs had in felling the troll:

Cleric: Hack! (2d6+8 damage)
Barbarian: Smash! (1d8+4 damage)
Ranger: Miss! (1d8+1 damage which never hit, dammit.)
Sorcerer: Miss-ile! (1d4+1 damage.)
Rogue: Well, I see I'm not needed. I'll check out these statues over here. (Wanders off to do some searching.)
the_heart
11-25-03, 08:58 AM thats a very watered down troll! hopefully its CR will have been modified already, but might be worth double checking.

as long as you were full attacking one character at a time, then you did fine. sometimes the dice just don't fall fair. another time and that troll could have hurt the party a lot worse. and yes, it's a shortcut but you can let the oil work as is, but would probably be more accurate to treat it as a 'coup de grace' using the burning oil.(note for next time, maybe :) )

metagaming vs character knowledge is a tough one. i tend to prefer a more lenient stance, especially with monsters as relatively common as trolls.

(for those who feel you need to punish a metagaming party just remember to include Trolls that actually heal faster from fire/acid and require cold/electric damage to stop the regen *evil laugh*)
Sproik
11-25-03, 10:21 AM Originally posted by the_heart
(for those who feel you need to punish a metagaming party just remember to include Trolls that actually heal faster from fire/acid and require cold/electric damage to stop the regen *evil laugh*)

Er... isn't it reasonable to assume that the characters would know you can only finish off a troll with fire? It would seem like common folk knowledge to me. Like knowing that silver does in werewolves, or garlic seriously annoys vampires...

A troll doesn't seem exotic enough to be an unknown factor in a D+D game.
bitnine
11-25-03, 10:40 AM Wow. That's like the wussy little sister of the wussiest troll in wussland. Watered down enough I think you might want to term it a near-troll.

Anyways, the only think that I mighta done different is have senior wusstroll try to grapple someone when things started looking hairy.

Though, all in all, looking at its stats, it wasn't (apparently) meant to be a challenging fight.
quaiven
11-25-03, 05:55 PM It was meant for a party of 1-2 level. If you threw a real troll at them they would have been decimated.
Oakspar77777
11-26-03, 11:36 PM (1) True, the Troll was a wuss, but it should not have stood still and let itself be flanked. Remember, it can make a 5' step and still make all of its attacks. If it goes diagnal to one of the flankers, with its reach, at least one of the flankers will either have to forgo attack or take an attack of opertunity. Not even a rabid dog will let you circle it (I've tried, it bolted, and I had to kill it [didn't know it was rabid at the time and I was helping the animal service guy try to catch it]).

Trolls also know where there weaknesses are, and will go for spellcasters if they get a chance to reduce the fire/acid risk (not to mention, unarmored characters are yummier).

(2) Giants fall under the Knowledge: Nature heading. The DC to know something about a foe is 10+HD. For a normal Troll that is a DC of 16 (I'm not sure how many HD yours had).

(3) Yes, fire put to a Trolls corpse will kill it. Coupe de Grace (including critical dmg x2) with normal oil and fire will do 2d6 damage and give it a Fort save or die. See the PHB for info on the CdG.
(4) Your characters seem a little full of hubris. I think you need to toss something at them that has the very real potential of killing one of them. Once they loose 950gp and a character's level to raise one from the dead, you won't see them wandering off while anything is left standing. I mean it sounded like your Rogue had a perfect opertunity to circle arround and sneak attack the Troll.
Edymnion
11-27-03, 12:50 AM Yeah, I gotta agree, if the rogue was passing up sneak attacks to go look around at the scenary, its time to lay some smack down on the party to make them realize that they won't win all the time. Stick something big and nasty in that the party should not be able to beat. Put them up against a half-red dragon troll (aka immune to fire) with a half dozen levels of barbarian.

You don't even really have to kill them. Just have the thing snort in disgust that the PCs are so wimpy as to not be worth the trouble of finishing off, and throw their unconcious bodies out in the gutter. Good blow to the ego will do them good, especially if they don't realize they should just run in the first place.
Mr.Waesel
11-27-03, 10:47 AM Originally posted by Oakspar77777
[BTrolls also know where there weaknesses are, and will go for spellcasters if they get a chance to reduce the fire/acid risk (not to mention, unarmored characters are yummier).
[/B]

The Troll only had int 4.
Bluebrush
11-27-03, 11:19 AM The rogue was standing on the other side of an open pit, as was the sorcerer.

So no attacking the sorcerer and no sneak attacks.

Oh, and as for something which could kill them, The barbarian was critted to unconciousness by a goblin. ^_^;;

And I'm having worries about the final EL6-ish encounter at the end, when they will probably still be level 2.

And the Large Thouqqa they may or may not fight, at their choosing.
RhoxandRoll
11-27-03, 11:21 AM Waiting for ieattrollsforbreakfast to come around soon...;)

Joking aside, I think you ran the troll fine.
Of course that rogue is a different story...
Dalaeck
11-27-03, 02:48 PM Trolls do not die that easily. When a troll is brought to negatives you can attempt a coup-de-grace against it with fire to kill it. It still gets a fortitude save and Trollish fortitude is, well, trollish fortitude. Casually dousing it with fire is not likely to work.
Asser Carabel
11-27-03, 03:52 PM if INT was 4 I don't belive it ever was Elf ?
Flubunga
11-27-03, 04:46 PM Well, my party of 5 level 7 charachters got 1 killed by 1 normal troll in a cave. It went after an OA samurai. the samurai didn't have much AC(he had 18). He had 67 HP. However, the *&$@ing wizard cast fireball first turn- samurai down to 40HP, troll down to 60 HP. Troll gets beat on. It then has 30 HP left. It moves back and waits. I had a family, this was the dad. The #*)!ing wiz then proceeds to cast a foreball, half frying my samurai. Samurai thought he could make the save. Then troll hits with both claws, rends, and kills the samurai. Lcky thing I gave each player a Ring of True Resurrection for a stupid/unlucky death.
Talmar
11-28-03, 06:46 AM Well, I guess I'm the only one who disagrees with the trolls death.

When I run a troll I track two columns of hit points. Fire/Acid Damage and other damage. A troll will not regenerate Fire/Acid damage but will regenerate all other damage.

E.X. My party has done 100hp damage to a 75hp troll. 50 points of that damage was done with fire. With 50 points of fire damage the troll will regenerate the other 25 eventually.

In your example I would track how long the troll burned and for how many hit points. If the fire damage exceded the trolls hp's then it is dead dead. However, if the fire burned itself out after kicking the troll down a pit then the troll would eventually regenerate the non fire damage. This could be a great opportunity to solidify a recurring enemy.

See what your pc's think in 10 levels when they run into a troll that's obviously taken fire damage in the past but is not decked out in magic items with numerous levels in fighter and wearing a ring of fire resistance.

On a side note trolls are my favorite monster as a dm. The most difficult battle my party had was against a group of 1/2 red dragon troll barbarians, each with a ring of acid resistance. What better guards for a red dragons lair?
Sproik
11-28-03, 06:56 AM Originally posted by Talmar
On a side note trolls are my favorite monster as a dm. The most difficult battle my party had was against a group of 1/2 red dragon troll barbarians, each with a ring of acid resistance. What better guards for a red dragons lair?

I used a troll priest who had simply cast protection from elements (twice, once for fire and once for acid). That didn't amuse the party at all, but I laughed and laughed...

Bear in mind while it is true that a troll requires fire or acid damage to destroy it, it can indeed be subjected to a coup de gras while unconscious from non-lethal damage, provided you perform it with fire or acid.

Since revising the monster for my campaign, I have also elected that piercing a troll through the heart will prevent its regeneration as well (which is of course a rather difficult thing to do... unless you have a big spike and a sledge-hammer).
quaiven
11-28-03, 10:14 AM As I stated before, this "Troll" was designed to face a party of 1st through 2nd level characters, so it was significantly weaker than an average troll. If it had been and average troll the party would have been destroyed. The "Sunless Citadel" module is not the greatest one ever written. The "Troll" was there for no reason other than to put a scare into the PC's, and give them some exp. It's CR was only 3, it didn't have the full regeneration powers of a troll, it only regenerated 3 hp per round instead of 5. And it's attacks were much weaker than an average troll. The original poster wanted to know if she ran the "Troll" right because it seemed to die so easily. The answer is yes. The "Troll" was supposed to die. It was not supposed to be that tough of an encounter. Heck my characters had a much tougher time defeating the Quasit that guarded the "Troll" than the "Troll" it's self.
Bluebrush
11-28-03, 04:44 PM Originally posted by Asser Carabel
if INT was 4 I don't belive it ever was Elf ?

I think the shock of being turned into a troll and sealed in a sarcophagus for a few centuries might have driven him a tad insane.
Bluebrush
11-28-03, 04:49 PM Originally posted by quaiven
Heck my characters had a much tougher time defeating the Quasit that guarded the "Troll" than the "Troll" it's self.

Ah, I love that little quasit. ^_^ Especially where the cleric and him both flipped each other off at the same time, which was pretty uncanny.

Talmar's post made me wonder something, can trolls heal fire/acid damage as a normal person can? From bedrest and such?
quaiven
11-28-03, 05:13 PM yes...cure light wounds works well to

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bluebrush 11-24-03, 10:19 AM	At the moment, I'm running a 3,0 version of "The sunless citadel" with five level 2, 32 point buy characters. The party encountered a sorta-weak troll and defeated it. The Barbarian (Unraging) and the Cleric of Kord just stood next to the troll and hacked at it while the ranger failed to shoot it with his longbow and the sorcerer magic missiled it for a few rounds. The rogue just wandered off mid battle to look at some statues. The party beat the troll down to 0 hit points with subdual damage in less than four rounds, continued beating on it's corpse just to be sure, looted the body, set it alight with oil and kicked it's flaming corpse into a pit. It seemed way to easy to me. Did I do something wrong?
Boudewijn Brendergast 11-24-03, 10:30 AM	AFAICT you played it right, well if the troll did something in return during those four rounds that is... Your players however came suspiciously close to metagame thinking, unless they beat every monster "to be sure" after it goes down and burn the corpse or their characters have encountered trolls before.
Bluebrush 11-24-03, 11:15 AM	Yeah, the troll tried to claw and bite the barbarian, but didn't do too well. Well a couple of them are experienced RPers. So they would themselves know how to do that. And we had a ranger... Eh, maybe he knew how, since he knew it was a troll. Meh. I'll just give them a little less XP than they would get for a normal troll, since it is a weak troll. And they had time to prepare.
Will Brandiman 11-24-03, 11:24 AM	IMC the party just came up against a whole bunch of trolls but managed to defeat them by drawing them out in pairs rather than all at once and then beating/burning them. There are 4 level 4 characters. Even with a bit of advance warning and preparation they found it tough going and had to retreat and rest for the night before being able to continue. I would say that if 2 level 2 characters can defeat a troll without much help from the rest of the party then something was going wrong. A level 2 character is unlikely to have more than about 20 hit points. A troll can do that in one round! What was it doing all this time? Knitting?
Mr.Waesel 11-24-03, 12:25 PM	It was a weak troll. I think its metagaming to assume you need to beat extra on a cretaure and brun it after its dead.
Tempus665 11-24-03, 12:51 PM	That´s why the various Knowledge skills are handy: to determine what PC´s do and don´t know about certain monsters. A succesful Knowledge (nature) check against a fairly high DC would have revealed whether or not the 2nd level PC´s knew about the troll´s regenerative ability, IMO.
lukelightning 11-24-03, 12:59 PM	Plus you can see a troll regenerating. And if nobody knows how to defeat a regenerating creature's ability, then the XP value should be modified. For me, it's not worth getting my knickers in a knot regarding metagaming and trolls. I figure the general populace knows what to do with a troll, just the same most modern day americans know it takes a wooden stake to kill a vampire, silver to kill a werewolf, and a bucket of water to knock off the Wicked Witch of the West (DR 15/H2O). Trolls are easily discribed (a big ugly green giant), so it's easy to transmit that knowledge (like the bedtime tale of Max the Heroic, who slew the evil trolls. "Mommy, what's a troll?" "It's an ugly green giant. Max killed them with fire.")
Bluebrush 11-24-03, 01:54 PM	Originally posted by Will Brandiman I would say that if 2 level 2 characters can defeat a troll without much help from the rest of the party then something was going wrong. A level 2 character is unlikely to have more than about 20 hit points. A troll can do that in one round! What was it doing all this time? Knitting? Well, the magic missiles did help. The Barbarian had a shield which brought his AC up to 20 and the cleric had blessed and Divine favoured his greatsword. And they were flanking, since they were pretty much expecting something nasty to burst out of the ominous sarcauphagous they were prying open having faced some zombies earlier (Which also felt a tad too easy.) This troll's stats: Str: 15 Dex: 12 Con: 23 Int: 4 Wis: 3 Cha: 6 AC 18 Hp:42 +5/+5/+0 (d6+2 claws d6 bite) Regen 3/round. It is possible to just KO a troll and then let a nice fire do all the work, right?
Galduil lvl15/1 NWN 11-24-03, 07:20 PM	Lets see, one versus 5 guys at level 2... the numbers were totally against that troll. Now maybe two or three trolls that would have been nice. I figured out that it is all about the numbers of enemies. Now that you know they can handle 1 troll now you can dish a couple of more things at them. Oh yeah one last thing, at least you didn't have 3 guys at level 1 fighting three trolls. Needless to say we died quickly, I will never let that guy DM ever again!
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 11-24-03, 07:32 PM	Originally posted by Bluebrush This troll's stats: Str: 15 Dex: 12 Con: 23 Int: 4 Wis: 3 Cha: 6 AC 18 Hp:42 +5/+5/+0 (d6+2 claws d6 bite) Regen 3/round. It is possible to just KO a troll and then let a nice fire do all the work, right? Why'd you water down the troll that much?!
Bluebrush 11-24-03, 07:48 PM	It's a pre-prepared module. Seems the troll was an elf that was changed into a troll. Oh, and I should clarify the roles the PCs had in felling the troll: Cleric: Hack! (2d6+8 damage) Barbarian: Smash! (1d8+4 damage) Ranger: Miss! (1d8+1 damage which never hit, dammit.) Sorcerer: Miss-ile! (1d4+1 damage.) Rogue: Well, I see I'm not needed. I'll check out these statues over here. (Wanders off to do some searching.)
the_heart 11-25-03, 08:58 AM	thats a very watered down troll! hopefully its CR will have been modified already, but might be worth double checking. as long as you were full attacking one character at a time, then you did fine. sometimes the dice just don't fall fair. another time and that troll could have hurt the party a lot worse. and yes, it's a shortcut but you can let the oil work as is, but would probably be more accurate to treat it as a 'coup de grace' using the burning oil.(note for next time, maybe :) ) metagaming vs character knowledge is a tough one. i tend to prefer a more lenient stance, especially with monsters as relatively common as trolls. (for those who feel you need to punish a metagaming party just remember to include Trolls that actually heal faster from fire/acid and require cold/electric damage to stop the regen evil laugh)
Sproik 11-25-03, 10:21 AM	Originally posted by the_heart (for those who feel you need to punish a metagaming party just remember to include Trolls that actually heal faster from fire/acid and require cold/electric damage to stop the regen evil laugh) Er... isn't it reasonable to assume that the characters would know you can only finish off a troll with fire? It would seem like common folk knowledge to me. Like knowing that silver does in werewolves, or garlic seriously annoys vampires... A troll doesn't seem exotic enough to be an unknown factor in a D+D game.
bitnine 11-25-03, 10:40 AM	Wow. That's like the wussy little sister of the wussiest troll in wussland. Watered down enough I think you might want to term it a near-troll. Anyways, the only think that I mighta done different is have senior wusstroll try to grapple someone when things started looking hairy. Though, all in all, looking at its stats, it wasn't (apparently) meant to be a challenging fight.
quaiven 11-25-03, 05:55 PM	It was meant for a party of 1-2 level. If you threw a real troll at them they would have been decimated.
Oakspar77777 11-26-03, 11:36 PM	(1) True, the Troll was a wuss, but it should not have stood still and let itself be flanked. Remember, it can make a 5' step and still make all of its attacks. If it goes diagnal to one of the flankers, with its reach, at least one of the flankers will either have to forgo attack or take an attack of opertunity. Not even a rabid dog will let you circle it (I've tried, it bolted, and I had to kill it [didn't know it was rabid at the time and I was helping the animal service guy try to catch it]). Trolls also know where there weaknesses are, and will go for spellcasters if they get a chance to reduce the fire/acid risk (not to mention, unarmored characters are yummier). (2) Giants fall under the Knowledge: Nature heading. The DC to know something about a foe is 10+HD. For a normal Troll that is a DC of 16 (I'm not sure how many HD yours had). (3) Yes, fire put to a Trolls corpse will kill it. Coupe de Grace (including critical dmg x2) with normal oil and fire will do 2d6 damage and give it a Fort save or die. See the PHB for info on the CdG. (4) Your characters seem a little full of hubris. I think you need to toss something at them that has the very real potential of killing one of them. Once they loose 950gp and a character's level to raise one from the dead, you won't see them wandering off while anything is left standing. I mean it sounded like your Rogue had a perfect opertunity to circle arround and sneak attack the Troll.
Edymnion 11-27-03, 12:50 AM	Yeah, I gotta agree, if the rogue was passing up sneak attacks to go look around at the scenary, its time to lay some smack down on the party to make them realize that they won't win all the time. Stick something big and nasty in that the party should not be able to beat. Put them up against a half-red dragon troll (aka immune to fire) with a half dozen levels of barbarian. You don't even really have to kill them. Just have the thing snort in disgust that the PCs are so wimpy as to not be worth the trouble of finishing off, and throw their unconcious bodies out in the gutter. Good blow to the ego will do them good, especially if they don't realize they should just run in the first place.
Mr.Waesel 11-27-03, 10:47 AM	Originally posted by Oakspar77777 [BTrolls also know where there weaknesses are, and will go for spellcasters if they get a chance to reduce the fire/acid risk (not to mention, unarmored characters are yummier). [/B] The Troll only had int 4.
Bluebrush 11-27-03, 11:19 AM	The rogue was standing on the other side of an open pit, as was the sorcerer. So no attacking the sorcerer and no sneak attacks. Oh, and as for something which could kill them, The barbarian was critted to unconciousness by a goblin. ^_^;; And I'm having worries about the final EL6-ish encounter at the end, when they will probably still be level 2. And the Large Thouqqa they may or may not fight, at their choosing.
RhoxandRoll 11-27-03, 11:21 AM	Waiting for ieattrollsforbreakfast to come around soon...;) Joking aside, I think you ran the troll fine. Of course that rogue is a different story...
Dalaeck 11-27-03, 02:48 PM	Trolls do not die that easily. When a troll is brought to negatives you can attempt a coup-de-grace against it with fire to kill it. It still gets a fortitude save and Trollish fortitude is, well, trollish fortitude. Casually dousing it with fire is not likely to work.
Asser Carabel 11-27-03, 03:52 PM	if INT was 4 I don't belive it ever was Elf ?
Flubunga 11-27-03, 04:46 PM	Well, my party of 5 level 7 charachters got 1 killed by 1 normal troll in a cave. It went after an OA samurai. the samurai didn't have much AC(he had 18). He had 67 HP. However, the &$@ing wizard cast fireball first turn- samurai down to 40HP, troll down to 60 HP. Troll gets beat on. It then has 30 HP left. It moves back and waits. I had a family, this was the dad. The #)!ing wiz then proceeds to cast a foreball, half frying my samurai. Samurai thought he could make the save. Then troll hits with both claws, rends, and kills the samurai. Lcky thing I gave each player a Ring of True Resurrection for a stupid/unlucky death.
Talmar 11-28-03, 06:46 AM	Well, I guess I'm the only one who disagrees with the trolls death. When I run a troll I track two columns of hit points. Fire/Acid Damage and other damage. A troll will not regenerate Fire/Acid damage but will regenerate all other damage. E.X. My party has done 100hp damage to a 75hp troll. 50 points of that damage was done with fire. With 50 points of fire damage the troll will regenerate the other 25 eventually. In your example I would track how long the troll burned and for how many hit points. If the fire damage exceded the trolls hp's then it is dead dead. However, if the fire burned itself out after kicking the troll down a pit then the troll would eventually regenerate the non fire damage. This could be a great opportunity to solidify a recurring enemy. See what your pc's think in 10 levels when they run into a troll that's obviously taken fire damage in the past but is not decked out in magic items with numerous levels in fighter and wearing a ring of fire resistance. On a side note trolls are my favorite monster as a dm. The most difficult battle my party had was against a group of 1/2 red dragon troll barbarians, each with a ring of acid resistance. What better guards for a red dragons lair?
Sproik 11-28-03, 06:56 AM	Originally posted by Talmar On a side note trolls are my favorite monster as a dm. The most difficult battle my party had was against a group of 1/2 red dragon troll barbarians, each with a ring of acid resistance. What better guards for a red dragons lair? I used a troll priest who had simply cast protection from elements (twice, once for fire and once for acid). That didn't amuse the party at all, but I laughed and laughed... Bear in mind while it is true that a troll requires fire or acid damage to destroy it, it can indeed be subjected to a coup de gras while unconscious from non-lethal damage, provided you perform it with fire or acid. Since revising the monster for my campaign, I have also elected that piercing a troll through the heart will prevent its regeneration as well (which is of course a rather difficult thing to do... unless you have a big spike and a sledge-hammer).
quaiven 11-28-03, 10:14 AM	As I stated before, this "Troll" was designed to face a party of 1st through 2nd level characters, so it was significantly weaker than an average troll. If it had been and average troll the party would have been destroyed. The "Sunless Citadel" module is not the greatest one ever written. The "Troll" was there for no reason other than to put a scare into the PC's, and give them some exp. It's CR was only 3, it didn't have the full regeneration powers of a troll, it only regenerated 3 hp per round instead of 5. And it's attacks were much weaker than an average troll. The original poster wanted to know if she ran the "Troll" right because it seemed to die so easily. The answer is yes. The "Troll" was supposed to die. It was not supposed to be that tough of an encounter. Heck my characters had a much tougher time defeating the Quasit that guarded the "Troll" than the "Troll" it's self.
Bluebrush 11-28-03, 04:44 PM	Originally posted by Asser Carabel if INT was 4 I don't belive it ever was Elf ? I think the shock of being turned into a troll and sealed in a sarcophagus for a few centuries might have driven him a tad insane.
Bluebrush 11-28-03, 04:49 PM	Originally posted by quaiven Heck my characters had a much tougher time defeating the Quasit that guarded the "Troll" than the "Troll" it's self. Ah, I love that little quasit. ^_^ Especially where the cleric and him both flipped each other off at the same time, which was pretty uncanny. Talmar's post made me wonder something, can trolls heal fire/acid damage as a normal person can? From bedrest and such?
quaiven 11-28-03, 05:13 PM	yes...cure light wounds works well to