Post/Author/DateTime	Post
OamuTheMonk 07-02-05, 02:09 AM	Dire Sawback Large Animal Hit Dice: 8D8 +24 (60HP) Initiative: +0 Speed: 20', Swim 50' Armor Class: 18 (+9 Natural, -1 Size) touch 10, flat-footed 18 Base Attack/Grapple: +6/+18 Attack:Bite (10') +14 melee (2d6+12) Full Attack:Bite (15') +14 melee (2d6+12) Space/Reach:10'/10' (15' with Lunging Strike) Special Attacks:Improved Grab, Lunging Strike, Crushing Grip Special Qualities:Scent, Hold Breath Saves:Fort +9, Ref +6, Will +3 Abilities:Str 27, Dex 11, Con 17, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 10 Skills:Hide +4*,Swim +10 Feats:Improved Natural Attack (Bite), Improved Natural Armor, Weapon Focus (Bite) Environment:Warm Marshes Organization:Solitary CR:7 Treasure:None Alignment:Always Neutral Advancement:9-14HD (Large); 15-20HD (Huge) This massive turtle has a flat, serrated, disk-like shell that seems too small for it's stout, muscular body. A long, ridged tail propels it quickly through the murky water, and it's bony, scar-covered head sits at the end of a sinewy neck that seems to extend for nearly it's full body length. It's hooked, beaklike jaw seems powerful enough to crush the strongest limb. A Dire Sawback is a territorial and aggressive predator that attacks invaders with savage tenacity. Combat A Dire Sawback usually attacks from ambush, seizing an opponent's nearest limb, then attempting to sever it with its Crushing Grip ability. Crushing Grip(Ex): To use this ability, a Dire Sawback must first successfully grapple a foe. Once it has done this, it crushes the opponent's grappled extremity, automatically dealing bite damage(2d6 +12), as well as 1d4 points of Strength damage. Hold Breath (Ex): A Dire Sawback can hold it's breath for a number of rounds equal to four times it's Constitution score before it risks drowning. Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, a Dire Sawback must hit with a bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold, and can use it's Crushing Grip ability. Lunging Strike (Ex): A Dire Sawback has an exceptionally long neck, and can move short distances more quickly than it's mass would suggest. If it makes a full attack, a Dire Sawback can attack a foe up to 15' away, as though it's reach were naturally that long. *A Dire Sawback has a +4 racial bonus on hide checks in marshes and swamps. As always, looking for CR opinions, as well as any criticisms or comments anyone might have...
Great Cthulhu 07-02-05, 12:48 PM	CR 8-10 if you ask me.
OamuTheMonk 07-02-05, 12:51 PM	I was aiming for 7-8. What do you think the CR-boosting aspects are? What did you think of the Special abilities?
Norhg 07-02-05, 12:58 PM	Rather cr 7. Compare it to Dire Tiger at and you will see that it is quite far behind -grapple. Though, it would be pretty dangerous to go up against 4 of these at level 11. Whole party grappled... not fun!
Great Cthulhu 07-02-05, 01:15 PM	I was aiming for 7-8. What do you think the CR-boosting aspects are? What did you think of the Special abilities? He just seems to have a lot of pouncing in clawing, if you know what I mean. I actually reread it and know I think maybe CR 7-9, rather than 8-10.
Ogre4Hire 07-02-05, 05:03 PM	What's the normal Reach? (you forgot the Space/Reach in the Stat Block). Very interesting creature, I might just have to print up the stats for it (party's about to go swamping :devil: ).
OamuTheMonk 07-02-05, 07:43 PM	Dire Sawback Large Animal Hit Dice: 8D8 +24 (60HP) Initiative: +0 Speed: 20', Swim 50' Armor Class: 17 (+8 Natural, -1 Size) touch 10, flat-footed 17 Base Attack/Grapple: +6/22 Attack:Bite (10') +14 melee (2d6+12) Full Attack:Bite (15') +14 melee (2d6+12) Space/Reach:10'/10' (15' with Lunging Strike) Special Attacks:Improved Grab, Lunging Strike, Crushing Grip Special Qualities:Scent, Hold Breath Saves:Fort +9, Ref +6, Will +3 Abilities:Str 27, Dex 11, Con 17, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 10 Skills:Hide +4*,Swim +10 Feats:Improved Natural Attack (Bite), Improved Grapple, Weapon Focus (Bite) Environment:Warm Marshes Organization:Solitary CR:8-10? Treasure:None Alignment:Always Neutral Advancement:9-14HD (Large); 15-20HD (Huge) Um. No I didn't. Not this time, anyway...
OamuTheMonk 07-02-05, 07:50 PM	Very interesting creature, I might just have to print up the stats for it (party's about to go swamping :devil: ). If you use Miniatures, any decent educational toy/teaching supply store will have tons of well-sculpted animal minis--Like scale 10' snapping turtles.
OverzealousMephit 07-03-05, 02:45 PM	I'd say 7/8 considering it has animal intelligence. Of course if it wanted to that monster could cause some problems around water, grappling characters and going under.
The Vorpal Tribble 07-03-05, 03:02 PM	I'd say its a good round 6th level, 7 absolute tops. Snapping turtle with a vengeance, I like ;)
OamuTheMonk 07-03-05, 08:02 PM	I decided to replace Improved Grapple (since he doesn't meet the prerequisites, unless you count Improved Natural Attack) with Improved Natural Armor. This makes him defensively a little tougher, while lowering his impressive Grapple mod to a more reasonable level. I'm thus setting the CR at 6, the low end of the suggestions. Any other last minute comments? I briefly considered a Tail whip, but I wanted to keep the monster concept simple.