Dragon cohorts [Archive] - Wizards Community

Dragon cohorts [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
MisterGam
03-10-04, 10:46 PM I wonder what wizards is doing. my DM and I are trying to work on a comprimise for a dragon rider prestige class. In the draconomicon, it states that a young red dragon ECL is 19 under dragon cohorts, the ECL for it being a pc is 20. Now the monster manual states that the young red dragon is challenge rating 6. in the defenders of faith it states that the young red dregon is an ECL 11 for a cohort. Im wondering how a challenge rating 6 is an ECL 19 or 20. Any DM's that could help rule on this would be much appreciated. I could go into more depth with savage species. and will if a have to.
darkkender
03-12-04, 01:32 AM first with the advent and minor changes incorporated with the updates to the system called 3.5, DOT will obviously have some inconsistancies as compared to a text wrote after the 3.5 updates such as the draconomicon. Same could be said with SS and the exact nature of the charts they use, while most of the material including how to build a savage progresion is viable it is still slightly different. Now on to the next part challenge rating and effective character level do not ever really match except on low CR creatures. CR is setup for a case by case challenge while ECL is setup for long term player purposes and should not be compared when it comes to monsters as characters that is why they are there own seperate set of rules.
Everach
03-12-04, 04:12 PM According to the v3.5 SRD, a young red dragon is:

13HD + 6LA = 19ECL for a cohort.
It's also a CR7 encounter.
MisterGam
03-18-04, 11:08 AM So what your saying is that i could take my party of 6th level PC's and throw them up against a 20th level charater using just the base book and they should have a pretty easy time getting rid of him?? I dont think so. there is a huge difference between a 20 level charater and a challenge rating 6 monster
Everach
03-18-04, 11:41 AM Here's what the numbers mean.

A young red dragon has innate abilities, racial hit dice, skills, feat selection and fighting ability to match a 19th level PC in pure playability.

The same red dragon in a straightforward diplomatic, puzzle, OR fight encounter is closer to a 6th level character.

Dragons have a lot of general use as a PC and are weighted accordingly. But a little guy like this isn't so tough in a straight fight.

Further Example; An NPC wizard5/Rogue5/Fighter5/Cleric5 is technically a CR20. But in a straight fight, a 10th level party can win without much trouble.
MisterGam
03-18-04, 01:14 PM see no wthat makes alot more since. Thanks

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MisterGam 03-10-04, 10:46 PM	I wonder what wizards is doing. my DM and I are trying to work on a comprimise for a dragon rider prestige class. In the draconomicon, it states that a young red dragon ECL is 19 under dragon cohorts, the ECL for it being a pc is 20. Now the monster manual states that the young red dragon is challenge rating 6. in the defenders of faith it states that the young red dregon is an ECL 11 for a cohort. Im wondering how a challenge rating 6 is an ECL 19 or 20. Any DM's that could help rule on this would be much appreciated. I could go into more depth with savage species. and will if a have to.
darkkender 03-12-04, 01:32 AM	first with the advent and minor changes incorporated with the updates to the system called 3.5, DOT will obviously have some inconsistancies as compared to a text wrote after the 3.5 updates such as the draconomicon. Same could be said with SS and the exact nature of the charts they use, while most of the material including how to build a savage progresion is viable it is still slightly different. Now on to the next part challenge rating and effective character level do not ever really match except on low CR creatures. CR is setup for a case by case challenge while ECL is setup for long term player purposes and should not be compared when it comes to monsters as characters that is why they are there own seperate set of rules.
Everach 03-12-04, 04:12 PM	According to the v3.5 SRD, a young red dragon is: 13HD + 6LA = 19ECL for a cohort. It's also a CR7 encounter.
MisterGam 03-18-04, 11:08 AM	So what your saying is that i could take my party of 6th level PC's and throw them up against a 20th level charater using just the base book and they should have a pretty easy time getting rid of him?? I dont think so. there is a huge difference between a 20 level charater and a challenge rating 6 monster
Everach 03-18-04, 11:41 AM	Here's what the numbers mean. A young red dragon has innate abilities, racial hit dice, skills, feat selection and fighting ability to match a 19th level PC in pure playability. The same red dragon in a straightforward diplomatic, puzzle, OR fight encounter is closer to a 6th level character. Dragons have a lot of general use as a PC and are weighted accordingly. But a little guy like this isn't so tough in a straight fight. Further Example; An NPC wizard5/Rogue5/Fighter5/Cleric5 is technically a CR20. But in a straight fight, a 10th level party can win without much trouble.
MisterGam 03-18-04, 01:14 PM	see no wthat makes alot more since. Thanks