Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Veander 04-20-07, 11:01 PM	Ok, I've just noticed that in order to use Dragons, I actually have to build them. Not quite sure why, other than there are so many ages of each (thus not enough room in the books). In any event, is there any real science to choosing skills and feats? Veander
KillerVole 04-20-07, 11:06 PM	I'm not sure about skill and feat choice, but if you want prestatted dragons, Draconomicon has dragons of all MM colors and age categories statted for you.
Veander 04-20-07, 11:24 PM	Oh wow, interesting. I do actually have a few dragons NOT in there, so knowing the science behind it might be interesting.
KillerVole 04-20-07, 11:35 PM	As far as other feats and skills, you could use a Great Wyrm as a base, then remove feats and skills to the appropriate level, starting with those that the dragon is not eligible to have. It could take a while, though. Sorry I don't have a better answer. Of course, if you're seriously into dragon customizing, check out "Draconomicon". The entire book's about it.
runestar 04-21-07, 02:36 AM	I guess the only science is deciding how tough a battle you want it to be. Dragons can be quite complex foes to run, since they have so many options available to them, and their choice of feats can greatly influence the way they are run. Do you want them to be combat brutes, gish builds or more caster-oriented? There are so many ways of playing them, and no 2 battles might be similar.:) Plus, I would probably end up swapping out feats for other choices for quite a number of the MM monsters anyways to better fit a particular concept, rather then simply playing them straight from the book.:P
RavinRay 04-22-07, 02:51 AM	There are programs and scripts out there that let you generate a statted dragon at any age category (mostly the 10 classic ones), or you can create a spreadsheet that lets you calculate the number of feats, total skill points, maximum class skill ranks, and maximum cross-class skill ranks available. Choosing which skills, and in particular which feats, is another matter altogether. There are general dragon class skills, then class skills for each species. And if you want to be really fastidious about feats, you'll have to start with a feat at that a dragon meets the prerequsites for at wymling age, then add more feats as you mentally age the dragon before arriving at your preferred age category. Essentially, it's the reverse of KillerVole's technique.
ank 04-22-07, 03:47 PM	Want to make it easy on yourself? Give it straight, easy combat feats and skills, wasting any leftovers on knowledge checks. Give the dragon power attack, improved bull rush, snatch (if they can get it), awesome blow, weapon focus, and improved natural attack. That ought to make it nice and easy to run if you want a "quick" dragon build. I personally think that it is much better to customize a dragon to their limit, particuarily because they make great villians/heros, but thats up to you.
Dead_Weasel 04-22-07, 06:27 PM	Dragons are intended to be unique creatures, which is why they have to be built from the ground up every freaking time. However, the Draconomicon's sample dragons are very good for starting with, since you can swap out skills/feats/spells to make the dragon you want.
runestar 04-22-07, 10:47 PM	No improved rapidstrike?:mad: That should be a no brainer for any creature who meets the prerequisites...:P
Chicago Gamer 04-23-07, 06:01 PM	Best link I know of: http://mikael.borjesson.net/dnd/monster-list.asp