ECL, Level adjustments, Monsters why are they so confusing? [Archive] - Wizards Community

ECL, Level adjustments, Monsters why are they so confusing? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
BloodyBones
03-29-04, 11:35 AM I called the wizards of the coast game support line to ask a simple question "does the Half fiend dreagoloth (monsters of fearun) have a level adjustment?" Because when i looked in the 3.5 update it didn't have one. So when i talk to the representative he said if the monster doesn't have a level adjustment use the hit dice as the ECL so i gave him examples of very powerful monsters (pit fiend, balor, dragons) and he said the same thing. I asked him if a 20th level fighter fought a balor(20 hit dice) would it be a even fight and he said yes.:uh-huh:. So i told the other people in my gaming group and they couldn't believe it but W.O.C must know what there talking about. The next day a friend of mine called and said he doesn't care what W.O.C. says the hit dice of monsters without a level adjustment is not the ECL because a planetar(angel) is 14 hit dice and can cast 9th level spells.:OMG! And i kinda agree what the hell is wizards of the coast talking about? If a 14th level cleric fought a planetar the cleric would die.:teach: Anybody that has some thoughts on this subject would be very appreciated.
:rant:
cwslyclgh
03-29-04, 04:21 PM it is only confusing to the dumb-rear that answered your question... if a creature is listed as having -- in its LA line in the MM (or where ever) it means that the designers did not feel that it was appropriate as a Player CHaracter race, and thus no level adjustment was needed (ie people would not be playing them)... they also did this for most creatures that had a level adjustrment that would put thier tottal ECL (Level adjustment + racial HD) over 20.

in short the custormer service guy you talked to didn't know his rear from a hole in the ground (at least on this subject). Of course from doing a little checking on the boards, and from my personal experience, customer service is flat out wrong over 50% of the time.

a creature with no level adjustment to their ECL is listed as +0 in the LA line of thier stat block (Examples: Halfling on page 149 of the MM and Goblins on page 133).
cwslyclgh
03-29-04, 04:21 PM double post

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
BloodyBones 03-29-04, 11:35 AM	I called the wizards of the coast game support line to ask a simple question "does the Half fiend dreagoloth (monsters of fearun) have a level adjustment?" Because when i looked in the 3.5 update it didn't have one. So when i talk to the representative he said if the monster doesn't have a level adjustment use the hit dice as the ECL so i gave him examples of very powerful monsters (pit fiend, balor, dragons) and he said the same thing. I asked him if a 20th level fighter fought a balor(20 hit dice) would it be a even fight and he said yes.:uh-huh:. So i told the other people in my gaming group and they couldn't believe it but W.O.C must know what there talking about. The next day a friend of mine called and said he doesn't care what W.O.C. says the hit dice of monsters without a level adjustment is not the ECL because a planetar(angel) is 14 hit dice and can cast 9th level spells.:OMG! And i kinda agree what the hell is wizards of the coast talking about? If a 14th level cleric fought a planetar the cleric would die.:teach: Anybody that has some thoughts on this subject would be very appreciated. :rant:
cwslyclgh 03-29-04, 04:21 PM	it is only confusing to the dumb-rear that answered your question... if a creature is listed as having -- in its LA line in the MM (or where ever) it means that the designers did not feel that it was appropriate as a Player CHaracter race, and thus no level adjustment was needed (ie people would not be playing them)... they also did this for most creatures that had a level adjustrment that would put thier tottal ECL (Level adjustment + racial HD) over 20. in short the custormer service guy you talked to didn't know his rear from a hole in the ground (at least on this subject). Of course from doing a little checking on the boards, and from my personal experience, customer service is flat out wrong over 50% of the time. a creature with no level adjustment to their ECL is listed as +0 in the LA line of thier stat block (Examples: Halfling on page 149 of the MM and Goblins on page 133).
cwslyclgh 03-29-04, 04:21 PM	double post