Elementals vs. Paraelementals [Archive] - Wizards Community

Elementals vs. Paraelementals [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Edymnion
09-18-04, 05:44 PM Was looking through the art gallery for the MMIII, and noticed the Storm Elemental. Now, other than the fact that this is perfect for my storm themed sorceress to nab as an elemental familiar, shouldn't this be a Storm Paraelemental?

Looks to me like the Plane of Storms would lie on the boarder of the Elemental Plane of Air and the Plane of Chaos, making it a Paraelmental Plane, not a true Elemental Plane.

So, shouldn't it be a Paraelemental, like the Smoke or Salt Paraelementals?
And can I possibly say Paraelemental any more times in one post?
SphericalTime
09-18-04, 05:59 PM Was looking through the art gallery for the MMIII, and noticed the Storm Elemental. Now, other than the fact that this is perfect for my storm themed sorceress to nab as an elemental familiar, shouldn't this be a Storm Paraelemental?

Looks to me like the Plane of Storms would lie on the boarder of the Elemental Plane of Air and the Plane of Chaos, making it a Paraelmental Plane, not a true Elemental Plane.So, shouldn't it be a Paraelemental, like the Smoke or Salt Paraelementals?What Plane of Chaos? There's the inner planes of Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Positive Energy and Negative energy? Are you talking about negative and air? I thought that was dust or something.

And, since in 3.5 the paraelemental planes are nearly gone, I'd have to say that if they wanted to use the Paraelemental planes as a source of elementals, they'd have to bring the planes back first.

And can I possibly say Paraelemental any more times in one post?No.
Edymnion
09-18-04, 06:02 PM What Plane of Chaos? There's the inner planes of Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Positive Energy and Negative energy? Are you talking about negative and air? I thought that was dust or something.Nope, there are also a plane of Law, and a plane of Chaos. Check the entry for the Formians, they're from one of the Lawful planes.
malykoth
09-18-04, 06:12 PM Nope, there are also a plane of Law, and a plane of Chaos. Check the entry for the Formians, they're from one of the Lawful planes.

Yes and no...you are refering to the "outer planes", which are (metaphysically speaking) quite different and completely separate from the elemental planes. This is not to say that elementals can't have alignment subtypes or that outsiders can't have elemental subtypes, of course. This also assumes that you're stuck using the approved 3.5 d20 cosmology. If your campaign world has a specific plane of law and a specific plane of chaos, then I guess there could be quite a few more para-elementals...or quasi-elementals...or, maybe semi-elementals?
Teron Gorefiend
09-18-04, 06:20 PM Nope, there are also a plane of Law, and a plane of Chaos. Check the entry for the Formians, they're from one of the Lawful planes.
That's Mechanus, but it's one of the outer planes and, like Limbo (the "plane of chaos"), doesn't border the inner planes. If I recall correctly, the closest thing to a plane of storms is the quasi-elemental plane of lightning between the planes of air and positive energy.
headlessfriar
09-18-04, 11:19 PM So, shouldn't it be a Paraelemental, like the Smoke or Salt Paraelementals?
And can I possibly say Paraelemental any more times in one post?

And Salt is a Quasielement, not a Paraelement. Negative + Water = Salt.
Edymnion
09-18-04, 11:28 PM And Salt is a Quasielement, not a Paraelement. Negative + Water = Salt.I never can remember which is which...
Dackad
09-19-04, 01:55 PM I never can remember which is which...
Quasielemental planes are when the Positive and Negative Energy Planes interact with the Inner Planes.
Paraelemental Planes are when the various Inner Planes interact with each other.
Shemeska the Marauder
09-19-04, 10:59 PM Paraelemental Planes:

Earth/Fire = Magma
Water/Air = Ice
Water/Earth = Ooze
Air/Fire = Smoke

Quasielemental Planes (negative touched)

Earth/Negative Energy = Dust
Air/Negative Energy = Vacuum
Fire/Negative Energy = Ash
Water/Negative Energy = Salt

Quasielemental Planes (positive touched)

Earth/Positive Energy = Mineral
Air/Positive Energy = Lightning
Fire/Positive Energy = Radience
Water/Positive Energy = Steam

Each of the quasielemental planes has border regions with their main element and energy plane, as well as two bordering quasielemental planes and two bordering paraelemental planes. So many fun little areas to play around with. The inner planes gave me darn going on a year worth of locales and critters. 'Guide to the Inner Planes' and the PS Monstrous Compendium III (Inner Planes Appendix) rocked.
Edymnion
09-19-04, 11:30 PM Quasielemental planes are when the Positive and Negative Energy Planes interact with the Inner Planes.
Paraelemental Planes are when the various Inner Planes interact with each other.Ah, thank you (both of you).
I've been more or less using the two interchangibly for years, and nobody called me on it. Glad to know the proper terms.
Shemeska the Marauder
09-19-04, 11:51 PM You're welcome http://arcanofox.foxpaws.net/shemmysmile.gif

I'd give you all the border regions of each plane, but it'd be a massive post and I don't have my books immediately handy. You'd enjoy it much more, and save my fingertips the torment, if you snagged a copy of 'Guide to the Inner Planes'. ;)
Dackad
09-20-04, 12:13 AM No problem. ;)

I remember I used to make fun of the rampant proliferation of elemental planes in 2nd Edition (and Planescape), but for whatever ungodly reason, I've grown quite fond of them.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Edymnion 09-18-04, 05:44 PM	Was looking through the art gallery for the MMIII, and noticed the Storm Elemental. Now, other than the fact that this is perfect for my storm themed sorceress to nab as an elemental familiar, shouldn't this be a Storm Paraelemental? Looks to me like the Plane of Storms would lie on the boarder of the Elemental Plane of Air and the Plane of Chaos, making it a Paraelmental Plane, not a true Elemental Plane. So, shouldn't it be a Paraelemental, like the Smoke or Salt Paraelementals? And can I possibly say Paraelemental any more times in one post?
SphericalTime 09-18-04, 05:59 PM	Was looking through the art gallery for the MMIII, and noticed the Storm Elemental. Now, other than the fact that this is perfect for my storm themed sorceress to nab as an elemental familiar, shouldn't this be a Storm Paraelemental? Looks to me like the Plane of Storms would lie on the boarder of the Elemental Plane of Air and the Plane of Chaos, making it a Paraelmental Plane, not a true Elemental Plane.So, shouldn't it be a Paraelemental, like the Smoke or Salt Paraelementals?What Plane of Chaos? There's the inner planes of Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Positive Energy and Negative energy? Are you talking about negative and air? I thought that was dust or something. And, since in 3.5 the paraelemental planes are nearly gone, I'd have to say that if they wanted to use the Paraelemental planes as a source of elementals, they'd have to bring the planes back first. And can I possibly say Paraelemental any more times in one post?No.
Edymnion 09-18-04, 06:02 PM	What Plane of Chaos? There's the inner planes of Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Positive Energy and Negative energy? Are you talking about negative and air? I thought that was dust or something.Nope, there are also a plane of Law, and a plane of Chaos. Check the entry for the Formians, they're from one of the Lawful planes.
malykoth 09-18-04, 06:12 PM	Nope, there are also a plane of Law, and a plane of Chaos. Check the entry for the Formians, they're from one of the Lawful planes. Yes and no...you are refering to the "outer planes", which are (metaphysically speaking) quite different and completely separate from the elemental planes. This is not to say that elementals can't have alignment subtypes or that outsiders can't have elemental subtypes, of course. This also assumes that you're stuck using the approved 3.5 d20 cosmology. If your campaign world has a specific plane of law and a specific plane of chaos, then I guess there could be quite a few more para-elementals...or quasi-elementals...or, maybe semi-elementals?
Teron Gorefiend 09-18-04, 06:20 PM	Nope, there are also a plane of Law, and a plane of Chaos. Check the entry for the Formians, they're from one of the Lawful planes. That's Mechanus, but it's one of the outer planes and, like Limbo (the "plane of chaos"), doesn't border the inner planes. If I recall correctly, the closest thing to a plane of storms is the quasi-elemental plane of lightning between the planes of air and positive energy.
headlessfriar 09-18-04, 11:19 PM	So, shouldn't it be a Paraelemental, like the Smoke or Salt Paraelementals? And can I possibly say Paraelemental any more times in one post? And Salt is a Quasielement, not a Paraelement. Negative + Water = Salt.
Edymnion 09-18-04, 11:28 PM	And Salt is a Quasielement, not a Paraelement. Negative + Water = Salt.I never can remember which is which...
Dackad 09-19-04, 01:55 PM	I never can remember which is which... Quasielemental planes are when the Positive and Negative Energy Planes interact with the Inner Planes. Paraelemental Planes are when the various Inner Planes interact with each other.
Shemeska the Marauder 09-19-04, 10:59 PM	Paraelemental Planes: Earth/Fire = Magma Water/Air = Ice Water/Earth = Ooze Air/Fire = Smoke Quasielemental Planes (negative touched) Earth/Negative Energy = Dust Air/Negative Energy = Vacuum Fire/Negative Energy = Ash Water/Negative Energy = Salt Quasielemental Planes (positive touched) Earth/Positive Energy = Mineral Air/Positive Energy = Lightning Fire/Positive Energy = Radience Water/Positive Energy = Steam Each of the quasielemental planes has border regions with their main element and energy plane, as well as two bordering quasielemental planes and two bordering paraelemental planes. So many fun little areas to play around with. The inner planes gave me darn going on a year worth of locales and critters. 'Guide to the Inner Planes' and the PS Monstrous Compendium III (Inner Planes Appendix) rocked.
Edymnion 09-19-04, 11:30 PM	Quasielemental planes are when the Positive and Negative Energy Planes interact with the Inner Planes. Paraelemental Planes are when the various Inner Planes interact with each other.Ah, thank you (both of you). I've been more or less using the two interchangibly for years, and nobody called me on it. Glad to know the proper terms.
Shemeska the Marauder 09-19-04, 11:51 PM	You're welcome http://arcanofox.foxpaws.net/shemmysmile.gif I'd give you all the border regions of each plane, but it'd be a massive post and I don't have my books immediately handy. You'd enjoy it much more, and save my fingertips the torment, if you snagged a copy of 'Guide to the Inner Planes'. ;)
Dackad 09-20-04, 12:13 AM	No problem. ;) I remember I used to make fun of the rampant proliferation of elemental planes in 2nd Edition (and Planescape), but for whatever ungodly reason, I've grown quite fond of them.