Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Angelflesh 03-14-07, 08:42 PM	I thought this would be a cool idea. Why don't we follow in the footsteps of Elite Opponents and come up with our own templated monstrosities, or has anyone done it before?
Holy_Beholder 03-14-07, 10:16 PM	Elite Template Size: Increase by 1 HD:+16 HD Maximum Hit points per hit die Speed:Increases by 50 percent or 20 ft, whichever is greater Armor Class:+10 natural, +10 deflection Attack:+1 die damage. Special attacks:Aligned damage, automatically penetrates DR Special qualities;SR+10, Damage resistance +15/-- Fire resistance 10, Cold 10, Acid 10, Electricity 10, immunity to death effects Skills:+3 skill points per level Abilities: Str+10, Dex +10, Con +10, Int+10 if over 2, Wis +10, Cha +10 Feats:6 bonus Enviroment:Same Organization:Unique(until one dies) Challenge Rating +12 Advancement: Same Level Adjusment: +10 This template elite enough for you. It should be powerful enough if added to a decent monster. Well DUH I was being sarcastic. The way I see it, elites don't need templates, you should hand craft them. And they need to be named. Also, they should increase with the players
Angelflesh 03-14-07, 10:33 PM	Wtf? I'm talking about the Elite Opponents articles on the home page. Plus, that template is uncreative and boring. I don't need to a template to add a bunch of ridiculous bonuses to a creature.
runestar 03-14-07, 11:01 PM	He was being sarcastic....;)
Angelflesh 03-14-07, 11:10 PM	There is no way of determining that, nothing in his post supports that idea. Unless you know something i don't. The poorly designed template isn't evidence either, plenty of people come up with ridiculous stuff on these boards with seriousness in mind. I know, i'm a smart ass.:rolleyes:
Hammerclaw 03-14-07, 11:18 PM	Sarcasm aside, it is a good idea, if people aren't just slapping templates on, but also adding flavor. What is the creatures story. Crunch is fun, but the story is equally so. This sounds like a good time and place to ask this question. I swear I asked it before a year or two ago, but I can't find the answer either here or in whatever book references. When adding a template to a creature, any abilities the new template grants that are dependant on hit dice are dependant only on the creatures original hit dice and not any hit dice gain from class. The one exception are the half-templates which grants spell-like abilities. Is this correct?
Angelflesh 03-14-07, 11:29 PM	Unless the template specifies racial hit dice or hit dice from class levels, i think any hit dice the creature possesses should be considered.
Angelflesh 03-15-07, 12:14 AM	I'll start it off with something simple i suppose. This creature is a Dire Bear with the Chirurgic Creature (Book of Templates) and Evolved Creature (Arcana Evolved) templates applied. It's pretty simple, not too many changes. I used this creature in an adventure once, it was the pet/guardian of the villain. Ursus Large Magical Beast Hit Dice: 12d10+99 (165 Hp) Initiative: +5 Speed: 50ft Armor Class: 21 (-1 Size, +2 Deflection, +1 Dex, +9 Natural), Touch 12, Flat-footed 21 Base Attack/Grapple: +11/+15 Attack: Masterwork Shiv +22 Melee (3d6+12/17-20x2) Full Attack: 2 Masterwork Shivs +22 Melee (3d6+12/17-20x2) & Bite +16 Melee (3d8+6) Space/Reach: 10ft/5ft Special Attacks: Improved Grab, Magical Weapons, Sneak Attack Special Qualities: Damage Reduction 5/magic, Darkvision 60ft, Immunities, Low-light Vision, Scent, Spell Resistance 17, Weapon Appendages Saves: Fort +16, Ref +9, Will +9 Abilities: Str 35, Dex 13, Con 27, Int 4, Wis 12, Cha 10 Skills: Listen +10, Spot +10, Swim +9 Feats: Alertness, Endurance, Improved Critical (Shiv), Improved Initiative, Run, Sturdy, Toughness, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus (Shiv), Weapon Focus (Bite) Environment: Cold forests Organization: Solitary or pair Challenge Rating: 10.5 Treasure: None Alignment: Chaotic Neutral Advancement: 13-16 HD (Large), 17-36 HD (Huge) Level Adjustment: - This hulking bear has bony brow ridges and it's front legs have been cut off at the knee, large blades have been grafted in their place for it to stand on. It has a wildness and destructive gleam in it's cold, piercing eyes. Improved Grab (Ex): To use this abilty, the Ursus must hit with a shiv attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity, Magical Weapons (Sp): Once per day, an Ursus can magically enhance all it's grafted appendages as if by Greater Magic Weapon. Caster level equals the Ursus's total character Hit Dice. Unlike the spell, this ability lasts for a number of minutes equal to the Ursus's total racial and character Hit Dice + it's Constitution modifier + 50% (27). Sneak Attack (Ex): As described in the Rogue's class features except the extra damage is 1d6+1d6 per 2 racial Hit Dice the Ursus possesses. Should the Ursus score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied. Immunities (Ex): The Ursus is immune to fear and insanity spells and effects. Weapon Appendages (Ex): The Ursus's altered limbs grant it a -6 circumstance penalty to all Climb checks. The Ursus also takes a -6 circumstance penalty on all skills and endeavors requiring manual dexterity.
Hammerclaw 03-16-07, 09:24 PM	When adding a template to a creature, any abilities the new template grants that are dependant on hit dice are dependant only on the creatures original hit dice and not any hit dice gain from class. The one exception are the half-templates which grants spell-like abilities. Is this correct? I knew I seen it somewhere. Savage Species has it on page 18 under Templated Characters. "Class level does not affect the Hit Die total when determining the powers granted by a template. IN other words, a celestial elf Fighter 1 has the same template powers as a celestial elf fighter 5." It does go on to make an exception, "There is one exception to the above rule. When a template grants spell-like abilities that have a caster level, the total of the Character's Hit Dice plus class level is the caster level." A couple clarifications point out how HD type doesn't change due to the application of a template if the creatue only had one hit die as that hit die would be replaced by the 1st class level it takes and how skill points wouldn't be changed for similar reasons. Anyway, I got a few ideas floating around in my head. Including a funny one. I'll post them once I get them worked up.
Domriso 03-16-07, 09:33 PM	This sounds like a really good idea. And I agree that it has to have actual useful fluff added to it, not just throwing on as many templates as possible to create an uber-creature. I have a bunch of ideas myself, and I'll start op on them now.
Angelflesh 03-17-07, 12:00 AM	A couple clarifications point out how HD type doesn't change due to the application of a template if the creatue only had one hit die as that hit die would be replaced by the 1st class level it takes and how skill points wouldn't be changed for similar reasons. I don't know if you are talking about how i changed the Dire Bear's HD to d10, but one of the templates actually called for it. It literally says the base creature's HD are increased by one size (minimum d12).
M1kh43l_P4r4d1s0 03-17-07, 12:07 AM	Book of Templates what book is this?
Hammerclaw 03-17-07, 08:15 AM	Quote: A couple clarifications point out how HD type doesn't change due to the application of a template if the creatue only had one hit die as that hit die would be replaced by the 1st class level it takes and how skill points wouldn't be changed for similar reasons. I don't know if you are talking about how i changed the Dire Bear's HD to d10, but one of the templates actually called for it. It literally says the base creature's HD are increased by one size (minimum d12). I am sorry. I didn't mean to imply you did your Dire Bear wrong. This was just a general statement that went along with answering the question I asked earlier in the thread. My statement above only applies to monsters with character classes. For example: If you put the half-dragon template on an high elf who goes on to become a wizard, that wizard wouldn't have d6 for hit dice through out his life. Just d4. Another example: A half-dragon gnoll that becomes a 2nd leve ranger would have 2d10 from his humanoid hit dice increasing according to the template and 2d8 for his normal ranger hit dice. Again, this has no affect on your work on the Dire Bear. Just putting it out there in answering my earlier question.
Domriso 03-17-07, 11:52 AM	Should we make several versions of the base creature in question, or just ones that we think of?
Angelflesh 03-17-07, 12:22 PM	I am sorry. I didn't mean to imply you did your Dire Bear wrong. This was just a general statement that went along with answering the question I asked earlier in the thread. My statement above only applies to monsters with character classes. For example: If you put the half-dragon template on an high elf who goes on to become a wizard, that wizard wouldn't have d6 for hit dice through out his life. Just d4. Another example: A half-dragon gnoll that becomes a 2nd leve ranger would have 2d10 from his humanoid hit dice increasing according to the template and 2d8 for his normal ranger hit dice. Again, this has no affect on your work on the Dire Bear. Just putting it out there in answering my earlier question. No problem, just wasn't sure. Should we make several versions of the base creature in question, or just ones that we think of? Whatever you want, if you wanna put up 3, 4, or even 10, go to town.
Domriso 03-17-07, 10:41 PM	I created this creature by applying the Fire Element template from the Manual of the Planes (193) to the ahuizotl. The fyrlon is a relative of the ahuizotl (Fiend Folio 14). While the ahuizotl dwells within freshwater lakes waiting for its victims, the fyrlon dwells within magma. Most usually encountered on the Elemental Plane of Fire, the fyrlon are also found in volcanoes and magma lakes. Fyrlon Large Elemental (Aquatic, Fire) Hit Dice: 7d8+14 (45 hp) Initiative: +2 Speed: 20 ft., swim 40 ft. Armor Class: 17 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +6 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 15 Base Attack/Grapple: +5/+14 Attack: Tail Hand +10 (1d6+5) Full Attack: Tail hand +10 (1d6+5) plus 1d4 fire, Bite +4 (2d6+2) plus 1d4 fire Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft. (10 ft. with tail) Special Attacks: Blinding strike, Burn, drowning, improved grab, Heat Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., Immunity to Fire, voice mimicry Saves: Fort +4, Ref +4, Will +5 Abilities: Str 21, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 11, Cha 15 Skills: Bluff +13, Diplomacy +4, Disable Device +, Disguise +4, Hide +6, Intimidate +4, Spot +7, Survival +, Swim +20, Feats: Combat Reflexes, Skill Focus (Bluff), Weapon Focus (tail hand) Environment: Any warm freshwater Organization: Solitary Challenge: 6 Treasure: Standard Alignment: Usually Chaotic Evil Advancement: 8-14 HD (Large); 15-21 HD (Huge) Level Adjustment: - As you walk through the fiery chaos of the Elemental Plane of Fire, you happen upon a lake of magma. Stepping closer to look out upon the magnificence of it the magma in front of you erupts. A huge four-fingered hand grabs your chest and pulls you into the burning liquid. Blinding Strike: If a fyrlon scores a successful critical hit with its tail hand or bite the victim becomes permanently blind. Drowning: If a fyrlon pins a grappled in any depth of water it attempts to drown the victim. Improved Grab: If a fyrlon hits an opponent that is at least one size category smaller than itself with its tail hand attack, it deals normal damage and attempts to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity (grapple bonus +14). It can immediately attempt to drown its victim in water. Thereafter, the fyrlon has the option to conduct the grapple normally, or it can simply use its tail to hold the opponent, albeit at a -20 penalty, but the fyrlon is not considered grappled. Each successive grapple check deals full tail hand damage. Heat: In addition to its normal damage, the fyrlon deals extra 1d4 fire damage with its natural weapons. Burn: Those struck by the natural weapon of a fyrlon must succeed on a DC 14 Reflex save or be set on fire. They remain on fire for 1d4 rounds. Those striking a fyrlon must also make a Reflex save or be set on fire. Voice Mimicry: A fyrlon can mimic voices easily. With a successful Bluff check it can mimic a voice perfectly. Skills: Fyrlons have a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or to avoid a hazard and can always choose to take 10 on Swim checks.
Hammerclaw 03-18-07, 08:12 AM	I created this creature by applying the Fire Element template from the Manual of the Planes (193) to the ahuizotl. The fyrlon is a relative of the ahuizotl (Fiend Folio 14). While the ahuizotl dwells within freshwater lakes waiting for its victims, the fyrlon dwells within magma. Most usually encountered on the Elemental Plane of Fire, the fyrlon are also found in volcanoes and magma lakes. Now that was cool. I preserved the flavor of the original creature yet made it totally new. Also, it really wouldn't work with the Earth or Air Element Templates. Very deadly when you figure they are dragging a victim into magma or liquid fire.
Domriso 03-18-07, 10:46 AM	That's basically what I figured. It was kind of strange, I had a dream the night before about a fiery ahuizotl and that's where I came up with the idea from.
Domriso 03-21-07, 05:41 PM	I created these creatures by applying the arachnoid template (Underdark 80), the chameleon creature template (Underdark 82), the Hiveling template (Book of Templates 135), and the Heightened template (Book of Templates 133) to a goblin. At first I just had the arachnoid goblin, but they weren’t that fierce, so then I added the chameleon to give it some ability to hide, but it still wasn’t that dangerous. I then added the Hiveling template to make them slightly stronger and the Heightened template to give them a little boost. I used these in a campaign where am absentminded wizard made a couple of these creatures but then forgot about them and let them escape. Spidermind Goblin Small Aberration (Augmented Goblin) Hit Dice: 1d10+1 (7 hp) Initiative: +3 Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares), climb 20 ft. Armor Class: 18 (+1 size, +3 Dex, +4 Natural), touch 14, flat-footed 15 (all AC’s increase by +2 if within 20 ft. of another Spidermind Goblin) Base Attack/Grapple: +0/-3 Attack: Bite +1 (1d4 plus poison) Full Attack: Bite +1 (1d4 plus poison) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Swarm Attack Special Qualities: Blindsight 20 ft., Darkvision 60 ft., Immunity to all mind-affecting effects, Limited Telepathy, Low-light vision, Shared Senses, Uncanny Dodge, Saves: Fort +2, Ref +4 (+6 if within 20 ft. of another Spidermind Goblin), Will +0 Abilities: Str 13, Dex 19, Con 14, Int 8, Wis 11, Cha 8 Skills: Climb +17, Hide +22, Jump +7, Listen +2, Move Silently +8, Search +2, Spot +8 Feats: Alertness, Environment: Temperate plains Organization: Pair, Gang (4-9), Squad (10-20), or Colony (50-300) Challenge Rating: 4 Treasure: Standard Alignment: Usually lawful evil Advancement: By character class Level Adjustment: ─ A group of figures suddenly drop in front of you and all spontaneously attack. As you retreat to regain your composure you see that the creatures are stranger than you would expect. They look like oversized spiders, but have a humanoid quality to them. They have six arms and two legs, and a face that looks like a goblin’s. They suddenly dart behind a rock and you go after them, but they’ve disappeared. You realize what happened too late, as several jaws bite into you and the poison runs free. The Spidermind Goblins are a species of goblin that live in the Underdark and have adapted to survive. Long time enslavement by the drow warped their bodies into spider-like shapes and granted them amazing abilities to climb, as well as a poisonous bite. But when their escaped the drows’ clutches they found themselves very weak and easily killed. After long periods of time in the underground caverns they began to adapt by changing their skin’s coloring, allowing chameleon-like hiding ability. Furthermore they became mentally linked and gained the ability to sense other creatures around them by echolocation. Spidermind Goblins commonly prey on drow and other civilized races, but will attack others that invade their home. The illithids have a keen interest in these creatures because they naturally developed telepathy, but only between other Spidermind Goblin’s. The drow hate these creatures because they feel that they are bastardizations of Lloth’s favored creatures. The drow regularly attempt genocide on the Spidermind Goblins, especially if a colony begins to get close to a drow city. COMBAT Spidermind Goblins will usually stalk opponents by hiding and climbing on the walls, staying out of reach of their enemies attacks. They will then all drop in around a single target and attack at once, making use of their swarm attack. They quickly try and find rocks to hide behind, so they can blend with the colors and then regroup for another attack. Poison: Initial and Secondary damage 1d3 Strength, DC 13. Swarm Attack: If two or more Spidermind Goblins are in combat and within 20 ft. of each other, and are able to sense an individual target each creature gains a +1 on attack rolls against said target per two Spidermind Goblins making the attack. Limited Telepathy: A Spidermind Goblin can communicate telepathically with any other Spidermind Goblin within 11 miles. Shared Senses: A Spidermind Goblin can use the senses (hearing, sight, smell) of another Spidermind Goblin at will. This can extend for 210 ft. and can be maintained for 12 minutes before a connection must be re-established. Uncanny Dodge: A Spidermind Goblin retains its AC bonus while flat-footed, as long as another Spidermind Goblin is within 20 ft. and can sense the attacker. Skills: Goblins have a +8 racial bonus on Move Silently, +4 on Ride checks, +14 racial bonus on Hide checks, +6 racial bonus on Jump and Spot checks, +16 racial bonus on Climb checks, and can always take 10 on climb checks. Where is everybody? Am I the only one with ideas?
Domriso 03-24-07, 09:46 PM	Ah, Curostyllisis. I originally created this creature to submit to the Dragon Competition, but by the time I had written up my entry the thread had been locked. So he sat in the back of my mind, waiting. But he is one of my favorite creations. The mechanics of him are that he is a Sand dragon with the Half-Dragon (red) template. Nothing very special about that, except the idea I had for him was his background story. He had a hollowed out mountain that he had found, courtesy of a wounded great wyrm gold dragon which he had found and subsequently killed, claiming the gold dragon’s home. But, since that time, he had gone through some redecorating. My idea was that Curostyllisis had developed the ability to use both of his breath weapons at once, effectively creating a cone of super-heated liquid glass. In that way he had encased his enemies, which included anyone who happened to come to his home. He now had taken over the gold dragon’s territory and had begun to demand tributes of living creatures with which he would turn into glass statues. He had become infatuated with his own abilities. A less complex creation, but one I found interesting. Curostyllisis Mature Adult Half-Red Dragon, Sand Dragon Huge Dragon (Earth, fire) Hit Dice: 21d12+105 (256 hp) Initiative: +0 Speed: 30 ft., burrow 20 ft., Fly 120 ft. (poor) AC: 34 (-2 size, +26 Natural), touch 8, Flat-footed 34 BAB/G: +21/+42 Attack: Bite +32 (2d8+12), 2 Claws +32 (2d6+12), 2 Wings +32 (1d8+12), Tail Slap +32 (2d6+12), Crush +32 (2d8+12) Space/Reach: 15 ft./10 ft. (15 ft. with bite) Special attacks: Breath weapon (fire or sand), Spell-like ability: At will- haboob (Sandstorm 117), 3/day- dispel water (Sandstorm 114), Special Qualities: Tremorsense 60 ft., DR 10/magic, SR 21, Saves: Fort+26, Ref+ 14, Will+ 19 Abilities: Str 36, Dex 11, Con 21, Int 18, Wis 18, Cha 18 Feats: Dragon Breath, Endurance, Flyby attack, Improved Overrun, Power Attack, Snatch, Stealthy, Track Skills: Climb +17, Hide +19, Intimidate +24, Knowledge (nature) +6, Listen +24, Move Silently +21, Spellcraft +12, Spot +24, Survival +25 Breath Weapon (Su): Curostyllisis has two different kinds of breath weapons, a 50 ft. cone of sand, which deals 12d4 points of damage. He also has a 50 ft. cone of fire, which deals 6d8 points of damage. Each has a DC 24 to get half damage. I won't let it die! I like this thread! Even if I am the only one posting on it!
Domriso 03-24-07, 11:11 PM	I would like to have at least some feedback on my creatures, or at least someone saying something... I am in the process of creating a rather deadly creature. I'll give you a hint: the idea of how to create such a being came from here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20070223a). It is especially interesting in an epic arctic campaign.
RoninFrosty 03-24-07, 11:32 PM	I left all my books in my car, and I'm far too lazy to get them at the moment, but this thread is great! I really like the idea. Also, the glass/breath weapon concept is brilliant! You seem to have a mind for these things.
Domriso 03-25-07, 11:37 AM	I've liked the concept of templates since I began playing DnD, and I constantly play with different ways to get what I want, which includes breaking a few rules. I personally like to play for the flavor of the encounter, rather than if it is techniquely overpowered or not.