Elemental Savant Question(s) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Elemental Savant Question(s) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Garrett_Longbottle
04-16-08, 03:26 PM Hi All,

I'm thinking about turning my 6th level Warmage into an Elemental Savant and had a couple questions. In the description of the Elemental Savant's "Elemental Speciality", it states that "When the savant casts a spell that normally deals energy damage, its energy descriptor changes to the savant's chosen energy type , and it deals damage of that energy type instead of its normal energy type." First question, does this apply to all energies or just the four main elemental ones which are fire, acid, electricity and cold. It's a tough call whether or not to turn him into an Elemental Savant as you're really pigeon-holed for the type of damage you can now do.

Another thing is that the warmage gets all the 4th level "Orb" spells. Does this mean that all these spells will now just be "Orb of Electricity" spells?:confused:
Sinfire Titan
04-16-08, 03:54 PM 1: Only to the primary energy types you can choose from.
2: If the Orb deals Force or Sonic damage, then no. All of the others have their damage changed to the chosen type, but still have the same secondary effects.
Mercurius
04-16-08, 03:59 PM Yeah, it's not a good PrC for casters, especially WarMages whose sole strength is having every energy type you might want at your beck and call. I'd advise against taking it, unless you really really only want to deal electricity damage for some reason.
Garrett_Longbottle
04-16-08, 04:11 PM 1: Only to the primary energy types you can choose from.
2: If the Orb deals Force or Sonic damage, then no. All of the others have their damage changed to the chosen type, but still have the same secondary effects.

Thanks for the reply. I'm still kind of confused. If you look in the CArc on page 34, it gives and example of a Warmage/Elem savant. The spells with a "sonic" descriptor are being energy substituted to fire. Energy Substitution only makes reference to the four main ones that I had listed. However, in Tome and Blood of the 3.0, it did list sonic as a descriptor in the Energy Substitution feat. Could this be some kind of hangover from 3.0 that wasn't corrected in this prestige class? CArc is supposed to be 3.5, right?
Sinfire Titan
04-16-08, 05:10 PM Thanks for the reply. I'm still kind of confused. If you look in the CArc on page 34, it gives and example of a Warmage/Elem savant. The spells with a "sonic" descriptor are being energy substituted to fire. Energy Substitution only makes reference to the four main ones that I had listed. However, in Tome and Blood of the 3.0, it did list sonic as a descriptor in the Energy Substitution feat. Could this be some kind of hangover from 3.0 that wasn't corrected in this prestige class? CArc is supposed to be 3.5, right?

Right. In both the Minis Handbook (3.5) and Tome and Blood (3.0) Energy Substitution allows you to pick Sonic damage. They changed this in CArc, but got rid of the +1 spell slot adjustment.
Garrett_Longbottle
04-16-08, 05:42 PM 1: Only to the primary energy types you can choose from.
2: If the Orb deals Force or Sonic damage, then no. All of the others have their damage changed to the chosen type, but still have the same secondary effects.

Thanks for the reply. I'm still kind of confused. If you look in the CArc on page 34, it gives and example of a Warmage/Elem savant. The spells with a "sonic" descriptor are being energy substituted to fire. Energy Substitution only makes reference to the four main ones that I had listed. However, in Tome and Blood of the 3.0, it did list sonic as a descriptor in the Energy Substitution feat. Could this be some kind of hangover from 3.0 that wasn't corrected in this prestige class? CArc is supposed to be 3.5, right?
Garrett_Longbottle
04-16-08, 05:55 PM Yeah, it's not a good PrC for casters, especially WarMages whose sole strength is having every energy type you might want at your beck and call. I'd advise against taking it, unless you really really only want to deal electricity damage for some reason.

Good point, kind of along the lines that I was thinking. Any suggestions? I've already got the Energy Substitution Feat - Electricity and Spell Focus along with Empower. How about the Argent Savant?
Arniha
04-19-08, 09:20 PM I'm actually building a warmage right now, although mine is level 11. If you have access to it I would strongly advise taking a look at the Fiend-Blooded PrC out of Heroes of Horror. If he's already sixth level go ahead and get to seventh so that you get sudden empower, then go for the Fiend-Blooded. The increase of stats will boost your casting power, and the Fiendish-Sorcery ability will gain you access to a lot of spells normally out of your grasp.
teshen
04-20-08, 02:55 AM . . . Any suggestions? I've already got the Energy Substitution Feat - Electricity and Spell Focus along with Empower. How about the Argent Savant?
Argent savant is alright if you like force, but it's a little far in the future considering that it requires at least 12 ranks in a skill.

If your dm allows you to retrain a little, some levels in sand shaper from Sandstorm could look pretty cool on a warmage. Add levels in earth dreamer from Races of Stone for some more earthy action and you can still throw around your electricity...

Four levels in fatespinner could be good to play with your spell DCs a little but a warmage would normally have to be at least level eight to meet the spellcasting requirements. If you have your heart set on electricity, Stormwrack has a prc called stormcaster that could suite you... but the trick would be getting gust of wind (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/gustOfWind.htm) on the warmage's spell list... see if your dm will let you trade out another evocation spell for it.
Ander Spectacular
04-20-08, 08:05 AM If you have your heart set on electricity, Stormwrack has a prc called stormcaster that could suite you... but the trick would be getting gust of wind (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/gustOfWind.htm) on the warmage's spell list... see if your dm will let you trade out another evocation spell for it.

Gust of Wind is already on there.

As has been said, Elemental Savant is bad for a warmage. Sandshaper loses a CL at 1st, but greatly expands the warmage's spell list and is worth the CL loss.
-AS-
teshen
04-20-08, 10:56 AM Gust of Wind is already on there. . . :doh: I was looking under second level spells, but it's there in the third level... yeah, he's almost ready once he gets the touchstone feat.
StevenO
04-20-08, 01:55 PM Right. In both the Minis Handbook (3.5) and Tome and Blood (3.0) Energy Substitution allows you to pick Sonic damage. They changed this in CArc, but got rid of the +1 spell slot adjustment.
I don't believe the Tome and Blood version of Energy Substitution had any level modifiers although you could select "Sonic" as your energy type. Changing that to the big four in CAc was probably a good idea as Sonic type damage is so powerful.

As written I dislike the 3.5 Elemental Savant because it automatically convers ALL your energy spells into the chosen type. I'd personally houserule (and ask for this houserule) that the Savant is now forbidden from using the opposing element but can still use the other two normally; this is how it was done in the 3.0 version. That way you are giving up one element to power another but aren't giving up all your power for one type.
Prime32
04-27-08, 12:59 PM What if an elemental savant takes archmage levels and picks up Mastery of Elements?
StevenO
04-27-08, 02:12 PM What if an elemental savant takes archmage levels and picks up Mastery of Elements?
Then the cosmos spontaneously colapses as you violate the principle of one class with another.

In actuallity I'd imagine the Archmage ability should override the Savants restriction but I'd also strongly discourage it to begin with.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Garrett_Longbottle 04-16-08, 03:26 PM	Hi All, I'm thinking about turning my 6th level Warmage into an Elemental Savant and had a couple questions. In the description of the Elemental Savant's "Elemental Speciality", it states that "When the savant casts a spell that normally deals energy damage, its energy descriptor changes to the savant's chosen energy type , and it deals damage of that energy type instead of its normal energy type." First question, does this apply to all energies or just the four main elemental ones which are fire, acid, electricity and cold. It's a tough call whether or not to turn him into an Elemental Savant as you're really pigeon-holed for the type of damage you can now do. Another thing is that the warmage gets all the 4th level "Orb" spells. Does this mean that all these spells will now just be "Orb of Electricity" spells?:confused:
Sinfire Titan 04-16-08, 03:54 PM	1: Only to the primary energy types you can choose from. 2: If the Orb deals Force or Sonic damage, then no. All of the others have their damage changed to the chosen type, but still have the same secondary effects.
Mercurius 04-16-08, 03:59 PM	Yeah, it's not a good PrC for casters, especially WarMages whose sole strength is having every energy type you might want at your beck and call. I'd advise against taking it, unless you really really only want to deal electricity damage for some reason.
Garrett_Longbottle 04-16-08, 04:11 PM	1: Only to the primary energy types you can choose from. 2: If the Orb deals Force or Sonic damage, then no. All of the others have their damage changed to the chosen type, but still have the same secondary effects. Thanks for the reply. I'm still kind of confused. If you look in the CArc on page 34, it gives and example of a Warmage/Elem savant. The spells with a "sonic" descriptor are being energy substituted to fire. Energy Substitution only makes reference to the four main ones that I had listed. However, in Tome and Blood of the 3.0, it did list sonic as a descriptor in the Energy Substitution feat. Could this be some kind of hangover from 3.0 that wasn't corrected in this prestige class? CArc is supposed to be 3.5, right?
Sinfire Titan 04-16-08, 05:10 PM	Thanks for the reply. I'm still kind of confused. If you look in the CArc on page 34, it gives and example of a Warmage/Elem savant. The spells with a "sonic" descriptor are being energy substituted to fire. Energy Substitution only makes reference to the four main ones that I had listed. However, in Tome and Blood of the 3.0, it did list sonic as a descriptor in the Energy Substitution feat. Could this be some kind of hangover from 3.0 that wasn't corrected in this prestige class? CArc is supposed to be 3.5, right? Right. In both the Minis Handbook (3.5) and Tome and Blood (3.0) Energy Substitution allows you to pick Sonic damage. They changed this in CArc, but got rid of the +1 spell slot adjustment.
Garrett_Longbottle 04-16-08, 05:42 PM	1: Only to the primary energy types you can choose from. 2: If the Orb deals Force or Sonic damage, then no. All of the others have their damage changed to the chosen type, but still have the same secondary effects. Thanks for the reply. I'm still kind of confused. If you look in the CArc on page 34, it gives and example of a Warmage/Elem savant. The spells with a "sonic" descriptor are being energy substituted to fire. Energy Substitution only makes reference to the four main ones that I had listed. However, in Tome and Blood of the 3.0, it did list sonic as a descriptor in the Energy Substitution feat. Could this be some kind of hangover from 3.0 that wasn't corrected in this prestige class? CArc is supposed to be 3.5, right?
Garrett_Longbottle 04-16-08, 05:55 PM	Yeah, it's not a good PrC for casters, especially WarMages whose sole strength is having every energy type you might want at your beck and call. I'd advise against taking it, unless you really really only want to deal electricity damage for some reason. Good point, kind of along the lines that I was thinking. Any suggestions? I've already got the Energy Substitution Feat - Electricity and Spell Focus along with Empower. How about the Argent Savant?
Arniha 04-19-08, 09:20 PM	I'm actually building a warmage right now, although mine is level 11. If you have access to it I would strongly advise taking a look at the Fiend-Blooded PrC out of Heroes of Horror. If he's already sixth level go ahead and get to seventh so that you get sudden empower, then go for the Fiend-Blooded. The increase of stats will boost your casting power, and the Fiendish-Sorcery ability will gain you access to a lot of spells normally out of your grasp.
teshen 04-20-08, 02:55 AM	. . . Any suggestions? I've already got the Energy Substitution Feat - Electricity and Spell Focus along with Empower. How about the Argent Savant? Argent savant is alright if you like force, but it's a little far in the future considering that it requires at least 12 ranks in a skill. If your dm allows you to retrain a little, some levels in sand shaper from Sandstorm could look pretty cool on a warmage. Add levels in earth dreamer from Races of Stone for some more earthy action and you can still throw around your electricity... Four levels in fatespinner could be good to play with your spell DCs a little but a warmage would normally have to be at least level eight to meet the spellcasting requirements. If you have your heart set on electricity, Stormwrack has a prc called stormcaster that could suite you... but the trick would be getting gust of wind (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/gustOfWind.htm) on the warmage's spell list... see if your dm will let you trade out another evocation spell for it.
Ander Spectacular 04-20-08, 08:05 AM	If you have your heart set on electricity, Stormwrack has a prc called stormcaster that could suite you... but the trick would be getting gust of wind (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/gustOfWind.htm) on the warmage's spell list... see if your dm will let you trade out another evocation spell for it. Gust of Wind is already on there. As has been said, Elemental Savant is bad for a warmage. Sandshaper loses a CL at 1st, but greatly expands the warmage's spell list and is worth the CL loss. -AS-
teshen 04-20-08, 10:56 AM	Gust of Wind is already on there. . . :doh: I was looking under second level spells, but it's there in the third level... yeah, he's almost ready once he gets the touchstone feat.
StevenO 04-20-08, 01:55 PM	Right. In both the Minis Handbook (3.5) and Tome and Blood (3.0) Energy Substitution allows you to pick Sonic damage. They changed this in CArc, but got rid of the +1 spell slot adjustment. I don't believe the Tome and Blood version of Energy Substitution had any level modifiers although you could select "Sonic" as your energy type. Changing that to the big four in CAc was probably a good idea as Sonic type damage is so powerful. As written I dislike the 3.5 Elemental Savant because it automatically convers ALL your energy spells into the chosen type. I'd personally houserule (and ask for this houserule) that the Savant is now forbidden from using the opposing element but can still use the other two normally; this is how it was done in the 3.0 version. That way you are giving up one element to power another but aren't giving up all your power for one type.
Prime32 04-27-08, 12:59 PM	What if an elemental savant takes archmage levels and picks up Mastery of Elements?
StevenO 04-27-08, 02:12 PM	What if an elemental savant takes archmage levels and picks up Mastery of Elements? Then the cosmos spontaneously colapses as you violate the principle of one class with another. In actuallity I'd imagine the Archmage ability should override the Savants restriction but I'd also strongly discourage it to begin with.