I'll kill myself ... or the duskblade [Archive] - Wizards Community

I'll kill myself ... or the duskblade [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Crimson7
03-01-07, 05:10 PM Hi everyone...

perhaps i'm going to said a big ****...but...why not ?!

I don't like the Duskblade, and the Duskblade don't like me...so

here my2cent

2° Monk
6° Warmage
7° Enlighted Fist (Hold Ray & Arcane Strike)
5° Abjurator Champion

Weapon with the ability Ki (DMG) (it'll be treated like unarmed attack for the special ability of the monk class)

now with the ability of the EF you can treat your weapon as unarmed attack to channel touch and ranged touch spells.

Caster 18° (9th spells level)

Some Feats to spot : Ascetic Mage, Extra Edge, Extra spell x3 (Brillant Blade[BoED]: like the energy ability of the DMG)(Shield)(Greater Armor)

...
if i didn't wrong, i'll make a nice build for a combat/caster (lawful...but nice)

...so ?
:rolleyes:
Crimson7
03-02-07, 02:15 AM At least...any suggest ?
it can be done ? :)
Encard
03-02-07, 01:34 PM Eh... What are you asking? I don't see a coherent question. Are you just trying to recreate the Duskblade using other classes?

That said, this doesn't work. The Ki Focus weapon ability only functions for a monk's ki abilities, not for Arcane Fist - just because you power Arcane Fist with Stunning Fist doesn't mean they're the same ability. Even if you could, it would only work a few times per day, not ever round.

Aside from that, I don't like the build very much. You have CL18, but only for Warmage spells, which is not the best list for a gish, and also loses out on a lot of the better touch/ranged touch spells. Your BAB is bad - +14, unless I miscount, which is very unimpressive if you want to engage in melee. Your HP will be mediocre. Your feats got used up mostly in grabbing a few basic buffs... and don't forget to meet the PrC requirement of Combat Casting for Abjurant Champion and Enlightened Fist. All in all, it just seems rather weak.
Crimson7
03-02-07, 04:29 PM That said, this doesn't work. The Ki Focus weapon ability only functions for a monk's ki abilities, not for Arcane Fist - just because you power Arcane Fist with Stunning Fist doesn't mean they're the same ability. Even if you could, it would only work a few times per day, not ever round.

...aside the build, have you any suggest for channeling arcane spell (up to 3°level spell, as the magic weapon ability) in a weapon, with the warmage class ?

but not...
the sorcerer has less versatile kind of damage (and elemental) spell.
the duskblade is slow in progression of caster level.
and...not the PrC Spellsword...the warmage can already cast in armor(light or medium) without penality.

any suggest ?!:rolleyes:
The_Shaman
03-02-07, 04:36 PM For channeling via a weapon, consider the Raumathari Battlemage from Unapproachable East. The d4 is a pain, but they can do a lot of damage with their sword channeling. Aside from that, you could put in several spellsword levels, but I don't think you'd want that.
3DJutsu
03-02-07, 06:41 PM uhh, with 2 levels in Monk and 7 in EF, how do you have a CL of 18th? It should be 16th CL And a few other things:

Extra Spell does not work with a Warmage or beguiler, they already know all the spells on their list, look it up in Sage (I think)

Extra Edge is only useful for warmage build that are more warmage (IMO)

You don't have Combat Casting (preq for at least ONE of the PrC)
3DJutsu
03-02-07, 06:45 PM Also, going into Warmage, your monk is now pretty much reliant on good ability scores across the board. Not good unless you roll really well or use a fairly substaintial point buy.
The_Shaman
03-02-07, 06:46 PM Wait, monk means 2 lost sp-levels, EF lost afaik only 1... Shouldn't it be 17, or does EF lose another caster level afterwards?

I would try with a standard-issue Battle Sorcerer gish: at lvl 6 you go into AChampion, then (presuming AC gives you proficiency with all martial weapons) into EK. Caster lvl 19, BAB 18. If I'm wrong about EC, you could just try to squeeze in 1 level of Dragonslayer from the Draconomicon. By the way, I'm choosing battle sorcerer for the 3/4 BAB, light-armor casting and proficiency with a martial weapon. It has a tremendous problem with spells known, so you may want to ask for a bloodline feat (look at Dragon 310 iirc - there are some nice sorcerer feats there) or admitting knowstones to the game. Technically, this trick could be pulled with a bard/AC/Sublime chord EK build, but it wouldn't be much better.
3DJutsu
03-02-07, 06:50 PM Wait, monk means 2 lost sp-levels, EF lost afaik only 1... Shouldn't it be 17, or does EF lose another caster level afterwards?

EF loses a CL at 1st and 6th level, hes 7 levels in
Crimson7
03-02-07, 10:00 PM By the way, I'm choosing battle sorcerer for the 3/4 BAB, light-armor casting and proficiency with a martial weapon. It has a tremendous problem with spells known,

...a tremendous problem...yes...
In fact with the ability of th AChampion to "upgrade" the bonus from "shield" and "mage armor" (or "Greater Mage Armor"), the option of the Battle Sorcerer to acquire the proficiency of the armor it's useless...so it could be restore the normal number of spell known and casted per day, and remove the proficiency for light armor casting... isn't ?

but, actually i revisited the bladesinger (yes...i've said the opposite before:rolleyes: )

6 Warmage
2 EKnight
5 AChampion
7 Bladesinger

BAB 17° that, with the "master ability" of the 5° AChampion our CL will raise to 17° (from 15)

Bonus to CA from Intelligence (From Bladesinger style combat) that make sinergy with the Edge of the Warmage.

And the "Extra Spell" feat it could be used to include spells from different arcane school, in the Warmage's list spell (unlike the "Advanced Learning" in the Warmage progression)

For channel spell...i think that the best choice is the magic ability +1 for the weapon...each PrC with channelling ability it could be used just a few times per day ...bleah...

any advice for this build ?! or "news" for a different channelling ? :D
3DJutsu
03-02-07, 10:52 PM Extra Spell does not work for Warmages, look it up in the D&D FAQ on Pg. 18
Can the warmage (Complete Arcane) benefit from the
Extra Spell feat?
No. Extra Spell lets you add one spell to your list of spells
known, but the spell must be taken from your class spell list.
Since the warmage already knows all the spells on his class
spell list, this feat has no effect,
Crimson7
03-02-07, 10:55 PM OOOOOk ;)

but the other questions remains
3DJutsu
03-03-07, 02:51 AM Not to be rude, but what other question? All I can see are a bunch of poorly spelled paragraphs with no real coherency behind them... sorry, but....yea...
Rulebook
03-03-07, 07:23 AM i think his question is "how can i re-create the duskblade with other classes, only more munchkin-y?"

seriously, if you're looking for a gish, the duskblade is NOT it. if you're looking for a decent front-liner with a whole mess of utility spells to make him -really- versatile, the duskblade is your class.

but given the brokenness of the originating post... im assuming he wants "M4d K3wL p0w3Rz!!!!111oneone"
CantripN
03-03-07, 08:56 AM Perhaps the CharOP would be of more use, here?

All I can say is not very good, since I've never played a monk nor a gish...
The_Shaman
03-03-07, 09:26 AM Some observations:

1st point: Abjurant Champion does NOT upgrade Mage Armor. Second, you get better BAB and a martial weapon proficiency, which qualifies you for Abjurant champion without spending a feat (as I don't think other arcane spellcasters except for bards and 1 sorcerer variant in CMage get martial weapon proficiencies from the get-go). This can be a moot point if you're an elf, though. Anyway, what spell level do you reach, 7th?

I'd just go with a normal sorcerer or wizard, perhaps - the battle sorcerer is if you want to emulate the DB's armored casting; although you could probably do it with a psion, too. Warmage lets you know a lot of spells, but it's still going to be a lot less versatile than any of the others.
Rulebook
03-03-07, 06:53 PM yeah, mage armor is Conjuration!

although your Protection from X spells still get the boost, so its not a wash.
3DJutsu
03-03-07, 10:35 PM Can I get a list of spells affected by that ability that aren't Shield, anyone?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Crimson7 03-01-07, 05:10 PM	Hi everyone... perhaps i'm going to said a big ****...but...why not ?! I don't like the Duskblade, and the Duskblade don't like me...so here my2cent 2° Monk 6° Warmage 7° Enlighted Fist (Hold Ray & Arcane Strike) 5° Abjurator Champion Weapon with the ability Ki (DMG) (it'll be treated like unarmed attack for the special ability of the monk class) now with the ability of the EF you can treat your weapon as unarmed attack to channel touch and ranged touch spells. Caster 18° (9th spells level) Some Feats to spot : Ascetic Mage, Extra Edge, Extra spell x3 (Brillant Blade[BoED]: like the energy ability of the DMG)(Shield)(Greater Armor) ... if i didn't wrong, i'll make a nice build for a combat/caster (lawful...but nice) ...so ? :rolleyes:
Crimson7 03-02-07, 02:15 AM	At least...any suggest ? it can be done ? :)
Encard 03-02-07, 01:34 PM	Eh... What are you asking? I don't see a coherent question. Are you just trying to recreate the Duskblade using other classes? That said, this doesn't work. The Ki Focus weapon ability only functions for a monk's ki abilities, not for Arcane Fist - just because you power Arcane Fist with Stunning Fist doesn't mean they're the same ability. Even if you could, it would only work a few times per day, not ever round. Aside from that, I don't like the build very much. You have CL18, but only for Warmage spells, which is not the best list for a gish, and also loses out on a lot of the better touch/ranged touch spells. Your BAB is bad - +14, unless I miscount, which is very unimpressive if you want to engage in melee. Your HP will be mediocre. Your feats got used up mostly in grabbing a few basic buffs... and don't forget to meet the PrC requirement of Combat Casting for Abjurant Champion and Enlightened Fist. All in all, it just seems rather weak.
Crimson7 03-02-07, 04:29 PM	That said, this doesn't work. The Ki Focus weapon ability only functions for a monk's ki abilities, not for Arcane Fist - just because you power Arcane Fist with Stunning Fist doesn't mean they're the same ability. Even if you could, it would only work a few times per day, not ever round. ...aside the build, have you any suggest for channeling arcane spell (up to 3°level spell, as the magic weapon ability) in a weapon, with the warmage class ? but not... the sorcerer has less versatile kind of damage (and elemental) spell. the duskblade is slow in progression of caster level. and...not the PrC Spellsword...the warmage can already cast in armor(light or medium) without penality. any suggest ?!:rolleyes:
The_Shaman 03-02-07, 04:36 PM	For channeling via a weapon, consider the Raumathari Battlemage from Unapproachable East. The d4 is a pain, but they can do a lot of damage with their sword channeling. Aside from that, you could put in several spellsword levels, but I don't think you'd want that.
3DJutsu 03-02-07, 06:41 PM	uhh, with 2 levels in Monk and 7 in EF, how do you have a CL of 18th? It should be 16th CL And a few other things: Extra Spell does not work with a Warmage or beguiler, they already know all the spells on their list, look it up in Sage (I think) Extra Edge is only useful for warmage build that are more warmage (IMO) You don't have Combat Casting (preq for at least ONE of the PrC)
3DJutsu 03-02-07, 06:45 PM	Also, going into Warmage, your monk is now pretty much reliant on good ability scores across the board. Not good unless you roll really well or use a fairly substaintial point buy.
The_Shaman 03-02-07, 06:46 PM	Wait, monk means 2 lost sp-levels, EF lost afaik only 1... Shouldn't it be 17, or does EF lose another caster level afterwards? I would try with a standard-issue Battle Sorcerer gish: at lvl 6 you go into AChampion, then (presuming AC gives you proficiency with all martial weapons) into EK. Caster lvl 19, BAB 18. If I'm wrong about EC, you could just try to squeeze in 1 level of Dragonslayer from the Draconomicon. By the way, I'm choosing battle sorcerer for the 3/4 BAB, light-armor casting and proficiency with a martial weapon. It has a tremendous problem with spells known, so you may want to ask for a bloodline feat (look at Dragon 310 iirc - there are some nice sorcerer feats there) or admitting knowstones to the game. Technically, this trick could be pulled with a bard/AC/Sublime chord EK build, but it wouldn't be much better.
3DJutsu 03-02-07, 06:50 PM	Wait, monk means 2 lost sp-levels, EF lost afaik only 1... Shouldn't it be 17, or does EF lose another caster level afterwards? EF loses a CL at 1st and 6th level, hes 7 levels in
Crimson7 03-02-07, 10:00 PM	By the way, I'm choosing battle sorcerer for the 3/4 BAB, light-armor casting and proficiency with a martial weapon. It has a tremendous problem with spells known, ...a tremendous problem...yes... In fact with the ability of th AChampion to "upgrade" the bonus from "shield" and "mage armor" (or "Greater Mage Armor"), the option of the Battle Sorcerer to acquire the proficiency of the armor it's useless...so it could be restore the normal number of spell known and casted per day, and remove the proficiency for light armor casting... isn't ? but, actually i revisited the bladesinger (yes...i've said the opposite before:rolleyes: ) 6 Warmage 2 EKnight 5 AChampion 7 Bladesinger BAB 17° that, with the "master ability" of the 5° AChampion our CL will raise to 17° (from 15) Bonus to CA from Intelligence (From Bladesinger style combat) that make sinergy with the Edge of the Warmage. And the "Extra Spell" feat it could be used to include spells from different arcane school, in the Warmage's list spell (unlike the "Advanced Learning" in the Warmage progression) For channel spell...i think that the best choice is the magic ability +1 for the weapon...each PrC with channelling ability it could be used just a few times per day ...bleah... any advice for this build ?! or "news" for a different channelling ? :D
3DJutsu 03-02-07, 10:52 PM	Extra Spell does not work for Warmages, look it up in the D&D FAQ on Pg. 18 Can the warmage (Complete Arcane) benefit from the Extra Spell feat? No. Extra Spell lets you add one spell to your list of spells known, but the spell must be taken from your class spell list. Since the warmage already knows all the spells on his class spell list, this feat has no effect,
Crimson7 03-02-07, 10:55 PM	OOOOOk ;) but the other questions remains
3DJutsu 03-03-07, 02:51 AM	Not to be rude, but what other question? All I can see are a bunch of poorly spelled paragraphs with no real coherency behind them... sorry, but....yea...
Rulebook 03-03-07, 07:23 AM	i think his question is "how can i re-create the duskblade with other classes, only more munchkin-y?" seriously, if you're looking for a gish, the duskblade is NOT it. if you're looking for a decent front-liner with a whole mess of utility spells to make him -really- versatile, the duskblade is your class. but given the brokenness of the originating post... im assuming he wants "M4d K3wL p0w3Rz!!!!111oneone"
CantripN 03-03-07, 08:56 AM	Perhaps the CharOP would be of more use, here? All I can say is not very good, since I've never played a monk nor a gish...
The_Shaman 03-03-07, 09:26 AM	Some observations: 1st point: Abjurant Champion does NOT upgrade Mage Armor. Second, you get better BAB and a martial weapon proficiency, which qualifies you for Abjurant champion without spending a feat (as I don't think other arcane spellcasters except for bards and 1 sorcerer variant in CMage get martial weapon proficiencies from the get-go). This can be a moot point if you're an elf, though. Anyway, what spell level do you reach, 7th? I'd just go with a normal sorcerer or wizard, perhaps - the battle sorcerer is if you want to emulate the DB's armored casting; although you could probably do it with a psion, too. Warmage lets you know a lot of spells, but it's still going to be a lot less versatile than any of the others.
Rulebook 03-03-07, 06:53 PM	yeah, mage armor is Conjuration! although your Protection from X spells still get the boost, so its not a wash.
3DJutsu 03-03-07, 10:35 PM	Can I get a list of spells affected by that ability that aren't Shield, anyone?