Mimic (PEACH) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Mimic (PEACH) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Zovc
10-24-07, 09:15 PM This is my first serious attempt at a prestige class, tell me what you think, guys!

This is still a work in progress, by the way. I'm really just wondering if this sort of thing is fair.

[picture]

Level; Special
1st; Mimic
2nd; Improved Counterspell (Su?)
3rd; -
4th; Improved Dodge
5th; Mind Games
6th; Improved Mimic
7th; Greater Dodge
8th-10th;Still in the works

Mimic
Similar to the creatures they share their name with, mimics aim to copy others. Mimics are truly amazing when it comes to reading others, something they do with relative ease.
Hit die: d6
BAB: Weak (0, 1, 1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5)
Good Saves: Refl, Will
Bad Saves: Fort
Requirements
Base Attack Bonus: +3.
Skills: Diplomacy 8 ranks, Sense Motive 8 ranks, Perform 8 ranks, Bluff 8 ranks, Spellcraft 8 ranks.
Feats: Dodge.

Class Skills
More on that later.

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the Mimic.
Mimic: You now have the option to ready an action called mimic. When you ready a mimic, you designate one target (your dodge bonus now applies to this character), the next time that target acts; you do the exact reflection of their actions at the same time. You may not mimic a creature who performs actions you are unable to do yourself (this includes moving faster than you are able to). Whenever it is the mimicked creature’s turn, you may--in the middle of their action, if you wish--stop mimicking them. When you stop mimicking a character, you place yourself immediately above them in the order of initiative. A creature that does not wish to be mimicked may perform a feint as a free action, if successful, you stop mimicking and place yourself immediately above them in the order of initiative and remain flat footed until your turn; if they fail, you may react with a feint; if you succeed, you may end the mimicked creature’s turn and take yours immediately after. If a creature you are mimicking attempts an action you are incapable of, you stop mimicking that creature and place yourself immediately before them in the order of initiative; you are flat-footed until your next turn. When you and the creature you are mimicking clash, perhaps in the form of an attack, perhaps in the form of a charge, you decide who succeeds by having the mimicked creature make a bluff check and the mimic make a sense motive check, whoever wins is able to perform their take on the action in question first.
Improvised Counterspell (Su): Whenever a spell is cast, if you are able to successfully identify the spell via a spellcraft check, you may attempt to counter the spell by making another spellcraft check (DC = 15 + spell’s level + caster’s level).
Improved Dodge: You now receive a +2 dodge bonus to AC against the creature you have designated for your dodge feat.
Mind Games: On your third round of mimicking a creature, you may attempt to frustrate the mimicked creature, the creature may try to attempt a will save to resist this effect, if they attempt to resist, you make a charisma check plus you mimic levels. If the creature succeeds, they may immediately try to end your mimic with a feint, receiving a +4 bonus to the check, if they fail their bluff check, the mimicry continues as normal. If the subject fails their will save, the creature is infuriated by the fact that you are mimicking them, the creature’s only concern is to stop your mimicry. If either subject sustains any damage, the mind games end.
Improved Mimic: Your ability to mimic creatures is improved, you receive a +2 bonus to all checks you make related to mimicry. You also may mimic creatures who move faster than you are capable of. If you have the appropriate number of appendages, you may also mimic a creature's method of movement. You may now designate how you copy your target's movement, you may move opposite them, or in the same manner. For example, you may decide to move left when they move right, or the vice, the same applies for forward and backward movement.
Greater Dodge: Once per round, you may optionally replace your (total) Armor Class with the result of a Sense Motive check, you must treat the result of this roll as your armor class regardless of whether or not it is higher than your current armor class. When using Greater Dodge, you do not recieve any bonuses to AC other than from this feat. You now receive a +4 bonus to AC against the creature you designate to have a dodge bonus against.
vorpo
10-24-07, 09:34 PM Improvised Counterspell: If you successfully identify a spell via a spellcraft check, you may use an attack of opportunity to lead a caster to believe you will counterspell their spell. Upon the identification of the spell, you must emulate the casting of this spell with a Use Magic Device check (or if you’re able to cast a spell of that level, a bluff check can be made instead). The DC for this skill check is equal to 10 + the level of the spell + the caster’s charisma modifier. If you succeed your check, you may attempt to convince the spellcaster (with a bluff check, opposed by a spellcraft check) that their spell has failed, if the caster fails their sense motive check, the spell fails and is lost.

Won't work. Counterspell works because the counterspell's energy cancels out the target spell. Without having any actual energy coming out of the Mimic, the spell will be cast regardless of what mimic is doing. That is to say, unless you somehow interrupt the spellcasting (forced the arcanist to make a concentration check and fails), the spell will not be stopped. If you want this class to have countering ability, do so just by having a SU counterspell feature instead of various UMD, sense motive blah blah checks.
vorpo
10-24-07, 09:36 PM Another thing, the way you presented this class, you didn't have to make this a 10 lvl PrC. In fact, you presented this class to be a 1 lvl PrC (yes, ONE level).
Zovc
10-24-07, 10:22 PM Okay, how do I go about making a supernatural ability to counterspell?

I tried to make note that the class is not complete. It is, in fact, far from being complete. I'm not sure If the class will be 5 levels or ten, but I actually did hint at it being ten levels by listing it's base attack bonus with ten entries.

I intend for the class to be 10 levels, more than likely.

When posting this class, I was more concerned with how people felt about the idea, and how I went about the mimic action.

I'll try to make a basic table for the class, okay?
vorpo
10-25-07, 12:54 AM From the looks of it as of now, this class doesn't have a lot to offer for 10 levels. 5 maybe. The thing is, the key ability is Mimic, which is basically a one time deal as of now. You have to have it at lvl 1, but after that, none of the other abilities look interesting enough to warrant further investment into class levels. Maybe if you break down the mimic ability to spread out over 5 or 10 lvls.

As for the counterspelling goes, just simply allow him to counterspell at a higher DC than normal and make some fluff to fit the flavor (should be harder to counterspell than a regular spellcaster).
Zovc
10-25-07, 02:32 PM Well, I know that the class doesn't have a lot to offer, I was planning on having "Improved Mimic" which would allow you to copy a creature that would normally be physically. For example, you would move on all fours and bark if mimicking a wolf. And then I also planned to have another Mimic feat at the final level (10, I was thinking) which allowed you to copy creature's abilities, such as spell-like abilities, breath weapons, etc.

I'm going to try and jot down some more stuff. I'll edit my first post.
vorpo
10-25-07, 02:40 PM Maybe make mimic into progressive abilities. Like, first tier you can only mimic EX abilities, then next tier you can mimic SP and next SU something like that. Tho SU abilities aren't necessarily stronger than SP.
Zovc
10-25-07, 02:58 PM I like that idea, how do you feel about at 10th level allowing the mimic to attempt to convince their target of what they are going to do?

In other words, the creature is so convinced that the mimic is one step ahead of them, they are actually copying the mimic.
vorpo
10-25-07, 03:26 PM Can you mimic spells or only EX/SP/SU abilities?
Zovc
10-25-07, 03:44 PM Well, as of now you can only mimic spells for the sake of counterspelling.

I was hoping to have an ability that you could use to memorize something you mimic, though.

As far as Mimicing EX/SP/SU abilities, I was going to do Ex at 8, SP/SU at 9, and memorization at 10.
Peregrine_Wolf
10-26-07, 07:15 PM I think this is a pretty fun idea. I think the memorization bit should have a DC, otherwise you could jsut have the mimic soak up a few spells and go around casting finger of death on people etc. Maybe opponents caster lvl + 10? Your check would then be Charisma+class lvl. If this gets completed I think I'll toss one into one of my campaigns =)
vorpo
10-26-07, 08:36 PM Well, the custom-made blue mage class (see peach orchard) has that ability pretty much. Anyway, I'd think if you limit your memorization to a limited time (a day or a week or whatever), it'd be ok. Personally though, having a permanent memorization takes off the "mimic" flavor.
Zovc
10-27-07, 01:55 PM I was going to limit the memorization ability, of course I would! I was thinking that once memorized, they can use the ability freely as long as they can see the (still animate [not dead/destroyed]) creature.

As far as memorizing the ability, I was thinking either it was automatic, you simply had to mimic the ability, or it would be some sort of intelligence check (as is memorizing a map or something of that nature). For the number of uses of a memorized ability, it could be based on intelligence, either a number of times equal to your int modifier, or an increasingly difficult intelligence check. (DC = 10 + memorized ability's origin's HD + 2 per use)

Also, the descriptions of my abilities are extremely lengthy, does anyone thing they can reword them to be shorter and/or clearer?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Zovc 10-24-07, 09:15 PM	This is my first serious attempt at a prestige class, tell me what you think, guys! This is still a work in progress, by the way. I'm really just wondering if this sort of thing is fair. [picture] Level; Special 1st; Mimic 2nd; Improved Counterspell (Su?) 3rd; - 4th; Improved Dodge 5th; Mind Games 6th; Improved Mimic 7th; Greater Dodge 8th-10th;Still in the works Mimic Similar to the creatures they share their name with, mimics aim to copy others. Mimics are truly amazing when it comes to reading others, something they do with relative ease. Hit die: d6 BAB: Weak (0, 1, 1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5) Good Saves: Refl, Will Bad Saves: Fort Requirements Base Attack Bonus: +3. Skills: Diplomacy 8 ranks, Sense Motive 8 ranks, Perform 8 ranks, Bluff 8 ranks, Spellcraft 8 ranks. Feats: Dodge. Class Skills More on that later. Class Features All of the following are class features of the Mimic. Mimic: You now have the option to ready an action called mimic. When you ready a mimic, you designate one target (your dodge bonus now applies to this character), the next time that target acts; you do the exact reflection of their actions at the same time. You may not mimic a creature who performs actions you are unable to do yourself (this includes moving faster than you are able to). Whenever it is the mimicked creature’s turn, you may--in the middle of their action, if you wish--stop mimicking them. When you stop mimicking a character, you place yourself immediately above them in the order of initiative. A creature that does not wish to be mimicked may perform a feint as a free action, if successful, you stop mimicking and place yourself immediately above them in the order of initiative and remain flat footed until your turn; if they fail, you may react with a feint; if you succeed, you may end the mimicked creature’s turn and take yours immediately after. If a creature you are mimicking attempts an action you are incapable of, you stop mimicking that creature and place yourself immediately before them in the order of initiative; you are flat-footed until your next turn. When you and the creature you are mimicking clash, perhaps in the form of an attack, perhaps in the form of a charge, you decide who succeeds by having the mimicked creature make a bluff check and the mimic make a sense motive check, whoever wins is able to perform their take on the action in question first. Improvised Counterspell (Su): Whenever a spell is cast, if you are able to successfully identify the spell via a spellcraft check, you may attempt to counter the spell by making another spellcraft check (DC = 15 + spell’s level + caster’s level). Improved Dodge: You now receive a +2 dodge bonus to AC against the creature you have designated for your dodge feat. Mind Games: On your third round of mimicking a creature, you may attempt to frustrate the mimicked creature, the creature may try to attempt a will save to resist this effect, if they attempt to resist, you make a charisma check plus you mimic levels. If the creature succeeds, they may immediately try to end your mimic with a feint, receiving a +4 bonus to the check, if they fail their bluff check, the mimicry continues as normal. If the subject fails their will save, the creature is infuriated by the fact that you are mimicking them, the creature’s only concern is to stop your mimicry. If either subject sustains any damage, the mind games end. Improved Mimic: Your ability to mimic creatures is improved, you receive a +2 bonus to all checks you make related to mimicry. You also may mimic creatures who move faster than you are capable of. If you have the appropriate number of appendages, you may also mimic a creature's method of movement. You may now designate how you copy your target's movement, you may move opposite them, or in the same manner. For example, you may decide to move left when they move right, or the vice, the same applies for forward and backward movement. Greater Dodge: Once per round, you may optionally replace your (total) Armor Class with the result of a Sense Motive check, you must treat the result of this roll as your armor class regardless of whether or not it is higher than your current armor class. When using Greater Dodge, you do not recieve any bonuses to AC other than from this feat. You now receive a +4 bonus to AC against the creature you designate to have a dodge bonus against.
vorpo 10-24-07, 09:34 PM	Improvised Counterspell: If you successfully identify a spell via a spellcraft check, you may use an attack of opportunity to lead a caster to believe you will counterspell their spell. Upon the identification of the spell, you must emulate the casting of this spell with a Use Magic Device check (or if you’re able to cast a spell of that level, a bluff check can be made instead). The DC for this skill check is equal to 10 + the level of the spell + the caster’s charisma modifier. If you succeed your check, you may attempt to convince the spellcaster (with a bluff check, opposed by a spellcraft check) that their spell has failed, if the caster fails their sense motive check, the spell fails and is lost. Won't work. Counterspell works because the counterspell's energy cancels out the target spell. Without having any actual energy coming out of the Mimic, the spell will be cast regardless of what mimic is doing. That is to say, unless you somehow interrupt the spellcasting (forced the arcanist to make a concentration check and fails), the spell will not be stopped. If you want this class to have countering ability, do so just by having a SU counterspell feature instead of various UMD, sense motive blah blah checks.
vorpo 10-24-07, 09:36 PM	Another thing, the way you presented this class, you didn't have to make this a 10 lvl PrC. In fact, you presented this class to be a 1 lvl PrC (yes, ONE level).
Zovc 10-24-07, 10:22 PM	Okay, how do I go about making a supernatural ability to counterspell? I tried to make note that the class is not complete. It is, in fact, far from being complete. I'm not sure If the class will be 5 levels or ten, but I actually did hint at it being ten levels by listing it's base attack bonus with ten entries. I intend for the class to be 10 levels, more than likely. When posting this class, I was more concerned with how people felt about the idea, and how I went about the mimic action. I'll try to make a basic table for the class, okay?
vorpo 10-25-07, 12:54 AM	From the looks of it as of now, this class doesn't have a lot to offer for 10 levels. 5 maybe. The thing is, the key ability is Mimic, which is basically a one time deal as of now. You have to have it at lvl 1, but after that, none of the other abilities look interesting enough to warrant further investment into class levels. Maybe if you break down the mimic ability to spread out over 5 or 10 lvls. As for the counterspelling goes, just simply allow him to counterspell at a higher DC than normal and make some fluff to fit the flavor (should be harder to counterspell than a regular spellcaster).
Zovc 10-25-07, 02:32 PM	Well, I know that the class doesn't have a lot to offer, I was planning on having "Improved Mimic" which would allow you to copy a creature that would normally be physically. For example, you would move on all fours and bark if mimicking a wolf. And then I also planned to have another Mimic feat at the final level (10, I was thinking) which allowed you to copy creature's abilities, such as spell-like abilities, breath weapons, etc. I'm going to try and jot down some more stuff. I'll edit my first post.
vorpo 10-25-07, 02:40 PM	Maybe make mimic into progressive abilities. Like, first tier you can only mimic EX abilities, then next tier you can mimic SP and next SU something like that. Tho SU abilities aren't necessarily stronger than SP.
Zovc 10-25-07, 02:58 PM	I like that idea, how do you feel about at 10th level allowing the mimic to attempt to convince their target of what they are going to do? In other words, the creature is so convinced that the mimic is one step ahead of them, they are actually copying the mimic.
vorpo 10-25-07, 03:26 PM	Can you mimic spells or only EX/SP/SU abilities?
Zovc 10-25-07, 03:44 PM	Well, as of now you can only mimic spells for the sake of counterspelling. I was hoping to have an ability that you could use to memorize something you mimic, though. As far as Mimicing EX/SP/SU abilities, I was going to do Ex at 8, SP/SU at 9, and memorization at 10.
Peregrine_Wolf 10-26-07, 07:15 PM	I think this is a pretty fun idea. I think the memorization bit should have a DC, otherwise you could jsut have the mimic soak up a few spells and go around casting finger of death on people etc. Maybe opponents caster lvl + 10? Your check would then be Charisma+class lvl. If this gets completed I think I'll toss one into one of my campaigns =)
vorpo 10-26-07, 08:36 PM	Well, the custom-made blue mage class (see peach orchard) has that ability pretty much. Anyway, I'd think if you limit your memorization to a limited time (a day or a week or whatever), it'd be ok. Personally though, having a permanent memorization takes off the "mimic" flavor.
Zovc 10-27-07, 01:55 PM	I was going to limit the memorization ability, of course I would! I was thinking that once memorized, they can use the ability freely as long as they can see the (still animate [not dead/destroyed]) creature. As far as memorizing the ability, I was thinking either it was automatic, you simply had to mimic the ability, or it would be some sort of intelligence check (as is memorizing a map or something of that nature). For the number of uses of a memorized ability, it could be based on intelligence, either a number of times equal to your int modifier, or an increasingly difficult intelligence check. (DC = 10 + memorized ability's origin's HD + 2 per use) Also, the descriptions of my abilities are extremely lengthy, does anyone thing they can reword them to be shorter and/or clearer?