Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Khatoblepas 08-29-07, 09:37 PM	Blaster mages seem to need a boost, particularily at levels 9-15. Hopefully, this patches them just enough ;). Hope it's not overpowered, though it does lose TWO spellcaster levels and is spontaineous only, meaning those that take it get 9th level spells at 20th level. Ouch. It does, however: - Help the mage overcome spell resistance and elemental resistance, one of the banes of blasting. - Mitigate some metamagic, without the cheese of Persistant spells. Well, there's Persistant Divine Power, but when you learn it as a 6th level spell, and the mitigation is only -1... you're in the same position as before. This helps the blaster keep up with pew pew pew. - Increased crit range on spells, without wasting feats! WoO! Well, it's just 19-20 instead of 20. Not too bad, I suppose. Come on, P.E.A.C.H time! Make blaster mages worth it! Paroxysmal Evoker Hit Dice: D4 Requirements Spells: Able to spontaineously cast 4th level arcane spells, and at least 5 spells of the evocation school. Skill: Spellcraft 9 ranks, Concentration 12 ranks Feats: Greater Spell Penetration, any metamagic feat. Special: Must have defeated another spellcaster in battle using only evocation spells. Skills The Paroxysmal Evoker's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), and Spellcraft (Int). Skill Points Per Level: 2 + Int BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1. +0 +0 +0 +2 Pierce Resistance, -- 2. +1 +0 +0 +3 Spellburst +1d6 +1 level of arcane casting class 3. +1 +1 +1 +3 -- +1 level of arcane casting class 4. +2 +1 +1 +4 Keen Spell, Spellburst +2d6 +1 level of arcane casting class 5. +2 +2 +2 +4 Paraoxysmal Metamagic -- Class Features: All of the following are Class Features of the Paraoxysmal Evoker prestige class. Spells: At each level apart from 1st and 5th, a Paraoxysmal Evoker gains spells per day and spells known as if they went up a level in their previous arcane spellcasting class. However, they add their class level to determine their caster level for evocation spells and spell resistance checks. Pierce Resistance (Ex): A Paraoxysmal Evoker's worst enemy is anything that can hinder their effectiveness, and so gain training to overcome this - they add their class level + their Charisma modifier to checks to overcome spell resistance when casting evocation spells, and they ignore the first 2*class level points of elemental resistance. Focused Casting: At 1st level, a Paraoxysmal Evoker must choose a single school of magic to give up in order to focus their talents on the manipulation of energy. This school cannot be Evocation, or Conjuration. Spellburst: When casting a direct damage spell, a Paraoxysmal Evoker can sacrifice a 0 level spell slot as an immediate action to add the specified damage to a single target spell. The type of damage is the same as the spell cast at the time. This damage only applies to the first damage roll from that spell. Extra Spells: Paraoxysmal Evokers are experimental and often quite inventive - practicing spells that others of their level would never dream of using. At each level, Paraoxysmal Evokers add a single evocation spell to their spells known. It does not have to be on their spell list, but spells taken from a divine casting class are taken as spells of one level higher (for example, a Paraoxysmal Evoker taking Flame Strike would learn it as a fifth level spell, not a fourth level spell) Keen Spell: At 4th level, a Paraoxysmal Evoker's Orb, Ray and damage dealing Touch spells have their critical threat range doubled. (This doesn't stack with any other effects that increase threat range) Paraoxysmal Metamagic: At 5th level, a Paraoxysmal Evoker reduces the spell level cost of any metamagic feat they apply to evocation spells by 1, to a minimum of +1. This never leads to a negative spell level adjustment.
CactusPOP 08-30-07, 09:03 AM	That's quite a interesting PrC, man! Awesome work! There just some points that I would like to discuss with you. Skills The Paroxysmal Evoker's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), and Spellcraft (Int). Skill Points Per Level: 2 + Int (...) Extra Spells: Paraoxysmal Evokers are experimental and often quite inventive - practicing spells that others of their level would never dream of using. At each level, Paraoxysmal Evokers add a single evocation spell to their spells known. It does not have to be on their spell list, but spells taken from a divine casting class are taken as spells of one level higher (for example, a Paraoxysmal Evoker taking Flame Strike would learn it as a fifth level spell, not a fourth level spell) You say that somebody with this class can choose evocation spell even of divine magic lists. So, it would be necessary some acknowledge about divine things. That way, I suppose it would be nice to add Knowledge (Divine) and Knowledge (planes) to the class skills.
ZeronHitaro 08-30-07, 09:23 AM	Let's see.... -Bypasses 5+ Cha mod (assuming 22-26 with average magic items) so about 6-8 for 13 points of spell resistance bypass. -Burn all your piddly spells for an even bigger one -Extra spells -Extended spell cap damage -Permanent Arcane Thesis effect All for the cost of two caster levels with no dead levels in the PrC all while virtually nullifying one of only three caster weaknesses. I'd say...it's not getting near my game. It's only weakness is the lack of two CL, which is more than made up for by a single feat. Caster style PrCs are supposed to exchange power for versatility or staying power for nova power. This one gives you all the hot dogs and even the relish cart.
Khatoblepas 08-30-07, 09:51 AM	Let's see.... -Bypasses 5+ Cha mod (assuming 22-26 with average magic items) so about 6-8 for 13 points of spell resistance bypass. I admit, a little strong - I think I might have to put a "Evocation Only" bonus on piercing SR. -Burn all your piddly spells for an even bigger one Whoop de do, average 7 extra damage against a single target. It's like skirmish/sneak attack you have to pay for. -Extra spells Extra EVOCATION spells. Blasty blasty? Not any other school? -Extended spell cap damage Which is unaffected by Metamagic, thus is effectively bonus damage. -Permanent Arcane Thesis effect On evocation spells only? Heck, it don't even work on Orb of Force. All for the cost of two caster levels with no dead levels in the PrC all while virtually nullifying one of only three caster weaknesses. I'd say...it's not getting near my game. It's only weakness is the lack of two CL, which is more than made up for by a single feat. I'd like to see the feat that gives you two spellcaster levels. And for spontaineous casters, this is quite a sacrifice, as it means if they give up one more level of spells, they lose 9th level spells. They also don't get (if they are sorcerers) more than one 9th level spell. Besides which, this prestige class is still not as effective as the many save-or-dies wizards get. Blaster mages tail off in power at levels 9+... they are quite possibly the worst type of mage you can play. Caster style PrCs are supposed to exchange power for versatility or staying power for nova power. This one gives you all the hot dogs and even the relish cart. And a prestige class focused entirely around blasting the hell out of people isn't exchanging versatility for power? And for -2SCL? Maybe it is a little too powerful ATM.. needs some kind of mitigation... and clarification. UPDATE: - Paraoxysmal Evoker must give up a school of magic. - Pierce Resistance's SR bonus only applies to evocation spells.
IdleAltruism 08-30-07, 10:24 AM	Blaster mages seem to need a boost, particularily at levels 9-15. Hopefully, this patches them just enough ;). Hope it's not overpowered, though it does lose TWO spellcaster levels and is spontaineous only, meaning those that take it get 9th level spells at 20th level. Evocationists don't really need a buff. Its only when you compare them to more powerful combinations/spells themselves that it looks weak. Even then theres nothing stopping an evocationist from using those spells and combinations. Requirements Spells: Able to spontaineously cast 4th level arcane spells, and at least 5 spells of the evocation school. Skill: Spellcraft 9 ranks, Concentration 12 ranks Feats: Greater Spell Penetration, any metamagic feat. Special: Must have defeated another spellcaster in battle using only evocation spells. Ok to start, sorcerers specializing in evocation isn't the brightest idea. Sorcerers need a broad range of spells because of their limited selection. I'm guessing this is a warmage class then? So two feats and skills they would have anyways. Spell penetration isn't bad so this class isn't giving anything up to enter it. Requirements are kind of weak. Spells: At each level apart from 1st and 5th, a Paraoxysmal Evoker gains spells per day and spells known as if they went up a level in their previous arcane spellcasting class. However, they add their class level to determine their caster level for evocation spells and spell resistance checks. I would put caster level checks to overcome spell with evocation spells. Pierce Resistance (Ex): A Paraoxysmal Evoker's worst enemy is anything that can hinder their effectiveness, and so gain training to overcome this - they add their class level + their Charisma modifier to checks to overcome spell resistance when casting evocation spells, and they ignore the first 2*class level points of elemental resistance. Ok way to powerful. Why give monsters spell resistance? Might as well say they don't have it while using evocation spells. I wouldn't recommend doing that but its basically what you have here. The second part of the ability is 2xparoxysmal level? So to a maximum of 10 ignoring damage? This ability is somewhat powerful to. I know theres a feat that does something similar. I believe its a metamagic feat +1. Spellburst: When casting a direct damage spell, a Paraoxysmal Evoker can sacrifice a 0 level spell slot as an immediate action to add the specified damage to a single target spell. The type of damage is the same as the spell cast at the time. This damage only applies to the first damage roll from that spell. This is meh. I'd just remove this, it doesn't serve a purpose. 9x a day do an additional 2d6 at max just doesn't look right. Extra Spells: Paraoxysmal Evokers are experimental and often quite inventive - practicing spells that others of their level would never dream of using. At each level, Paraoxysmal Evokers add a single evocation spell to their spells known. It does not have to be on their spell list, but spells taken from a divine casting class are taken as spells of one level higher (for example, a Paraoxysmal Evoker taking Flame Strike would learn it as a fifth level spell, not a fourth level spell) 5 additional spells is alot for spontaneous casters. I think maybe one or two would be appropriate. Keen Spell:At 4th level, a Paraoxysmal Evoker's Orb, Ray and damage dealing Touch spells have their critical threat range doubled. (This doesn't stack with any other effects that increase threat range) Improved critical ray. I don't think this fits with the flavor. I'd drop this in favor of a metamagic feat or something. Unlocked Potential: A Paraoxysmal Evoker's love of blasting spells leads them to unlock hidden potential within their spells. Evokers add their class level to the maximum dice cap of evocation spells. However, this extra damage is ignored when applying metamagic (for example, a 15th level Paraoxysmal Evoker's maximised Fireball deals 60 damage + 5d6 damage.) This seems a little to powerful. 9d4 magic missles! Does this mean they automatically have an additional 5d6? Or do they still have to meat the CL requirements? For example, a cone of cold would have a maximum 20d6, would you need a CL of 20 to get it or would you just need to be 15 with 5 levels into this class? Paraoxysmal Metamagic: At 3rd level, a Paraoxysmal Evoker reduces the spell level cost of any metamagic feat they apply to evocation spells by 1, to a minimum of +1. This never leads to a negative spell level adjustment. I don't like encouraging spontaneous metamagic. Thats just me, it just seems it can be abused early on if this sort of stuff is allowed. I would make this the last level ability. Paraoxysmal Shield: At 5th level, a Paraoxysmal Evoker can conjure a shield that protects them whilst casting. As a standard action, an Evoker can sacrifice a spell slot (max 5th level) to gain the following effects: - The spell slot's level as a deflection modifier to AC against attacks made as an attack of opportunity, or attacks made whilst the Evoker is casting a spell. - The Evoker can, as an immediate action, dispel the barrier and deal damage equal to spell level * 1d6 to all creatures threatening him. The energy damage is chosen at the time of spell slot sacrifice, and can be Cold, Fire, or Electricity. Wait since when does evocation have defensive abilities :D . I don't like this ability personally. It looks really weak. You should have a +3 ring of protection by mid game and eventually a +5 which makes this ability worthless. The AC is to condition, the damage is also pretty pathetic, and you have to use a spell slot in order to use it. Really this class isn't needed. I think the Archmage fulfills this role already(or incantatrix, actually alot of classes do).
Khatoblepas 08-30-07, 10:57 AM	Evocationists don't really need a buff. Its only when you compare them to more powerful combinations/spells themselves that it looks weak. Even then theres nothing stopping an evocationist from using those spells and combinations. Even though it's usually a waste of time focusing on evocation if you're just going to use the other tricks anyway? Ok to start, sorcerers specializing in evocation isn't the brightest idea. Sorcerers need a broad range of spells because of their limited selection. I'm guessing this is a warmage class then? So two feats and skills they would have anyways. Spell penetration isn't bad so this class isn't giving anything up to enter it. Requirements are kind of weak. Any suggestions on the requirements? Ok way to powerful. Why give monsters spell resistance? Might as well say they don't have it while using evocation spells. I wouldn't recommend doing that but its basically what you have here. The second part of the ability is 2xparoxysmal level? So to a maximum of 10 ignoring damage? This ability is somewhat powerful to. I know theres a feat that does something similar. I believe its a metamagic feat +1. SR at higher levels becomes rather annoying for evokers. 5+Cha isn't that much (max around +13), when you compare it to the high SR of some monsters. Heck, when you reach epic things have SR90 or something stupid. Besides which, most evocation spells are Ref half anyway - so any creature with high enough SR isn't going to worry about saving anyway, because they're all outsiders / creatures with loads of HD. SR scales faster than CL. But if it's still too powerful, I can just reduce it to +Cha on SR rolls. This is meh. I'd just remove this, it doesn't serve a purpose. 9x a day do an additional 2d6 at max just doesn't look right. Really? It's a small boost... if it's that redundant I can just remove it. 5 additional spells is alot for spontaneous casters. I think maybe one or two would be appropriate. They're all evocation spells, and they lose 2CL for it. Sand Shaper gives a heck of a lot more for 1CL. This seems a little to powerful. 9d4 magic missles! Does this mean they automatically have an additional 5d6? Or do they still have to meat the CL requirements? For example, a cone of cold would have a maximum 20d6, would you need a CL of 20 to get it or would you just need to be 15 with 5 levels into this class? o_O 9d4 magic missiles? Magic Missile's damage is fixed, you can't increase the cap. And yes, you need to meet the CL requirements. It's a special damage cap increase, not bonus dice. I don't like encouraging spontaneous metamagic. Thats just me, it just seems it can be abused early on if this sort of stuff is allowed. I would make this the last level ability. Good point. Wait since when does evocation have defensive abilities :D . I don't like this ability personally. It looks really weak. You should have a +3 ring of protection by mid game and eventually a +5 which makes this ability worthless. The AC is to condition, the damage is also pretty pathetic, and you have to use a spell slot in order to use it. Indeed. Removing it and replacing it with Metamagic ability. Really this class isn't needed. I think the Archmage fulfills this role already(or incantatrix, actually alot of classes do). Incantatrix is applying metamagic to everything, Archmage is changing the way spells work. This is a blaster buff :P Possibly Warmage 10/Paraoxysmal Evoker 5/Archmage 5 should be possible, since neither's class abilities overlap. UPDATE: Bah, nerfed it.
peteyrock 08-30-07, 11:04 AM	Personally, I agree that Evokers don't really need extra power. However, I think your idea with Spell Burst is pretty freakin' sweet.
ZeronHitaro 08-30-07, 03:20 PM	I'd like to see the feat that gives you two spellcaster levels. Practiced Spellcaster feat. Complete Arcane. Give you an increase in caster level of +4 for purpose of filling in caster levels lost via PrCs. So it not only fills in the 2 lost by this PrC but gives me 2 more to spare should I decide to go into another PrC as PS caster levels cannot be used to boost the base caster level past the total character level.
Khatoblepas 08-30-07, 03:49 PM	Practiced Spellcaster feat. Complete Arcane. Give you an increase in caster level of +4 for purpose of filling in caster levels lost via PrCs. So it not only fills in the 2 lost by this PrC but gives me 2 more to spare should I decide to go into another PrC as PS caster levels cannot be used to boost the base caster level past the total character level. SPELLcaster levels, not caster levels. Spellcaster levels determine your Spells per Day/Spells Known. Caster level determines your effectiveness. Practiced Spellcaster does not give you more spells per day.
ZeronHitaro 08-30-07, 04:05 PM	SPELLcaster levels, not caster levels. Spellcaster levels determine your Spells per Day/Spells Known. Caster level determines your effectiveness. Practiced Spellcaster does not give you more spells per day. I know that. I was referring to caster levels in the first place since even with no +spells from leveling caster level determines power and piercing, which this class originally added to at first glance.
IdleAltruism 08-30-07, 04:56 PM	SR at higher levels becomes rather annoying for evokers. 5+Cha isn't that much (max around +13), when you compare it to the high SR of some monsters. Heck, when you reach epic things have SR90 or something stupid. Besides which, most evocation spells are Ref half anyway - so any creature with high enough SR isn't going to worry about saving anyway, because they're all outsiders / creatures with loads of HD. SR scales faster than CL. But if it's still too powerful, I can just reduce it to +Cha on SR rolls. SR is generally based on CR. You blow that out of the water with this. What might have been a 50/50 becomes 100%. Max is around 16 at 20th level with just core standard races. Thats a 16+ bonus from one ability! Even if it was a +4 bonus it would be over powered. An addition +1 and then maybe another +1 to punching SR would be balanced. Two feats gives +4, when maxed this is an automatic +5. If you made it +CHA it would pretty much start out as a +5 then end up as a +10-11, still way to powerful. Spell resistance is supposed to be annoying! Epic is a whole different ball game and epic mages have ways to up their CL(including epic spells). They don't need this. Actually lets look at this. The balor has a +19 ref. The average DC for a ninth level spell, lets assume the caster has an 19 attribute + greater spell focus. Thats a 25 DC save for half. So the balor has a 25% chance of failure against a caster with very low DC saves. Those are good odds for this crappy mage, if you get around 45-50% success rate against an opposed save your high level mage is pretty well off. Sure you wont get it every time, but the odds aren't really against you. Incantatrix is applying metamagic to everything, Archmage is changing the way spells work. This is a blaster buff :P Possibly Warmage 10/Paraoxysmal Evoker 5/Archmage 5 should be possible, since neither's class abilities overlap. I don't think a warmage could become an archmage. Can they learn spells from at least 5 different schools? As I've said before there are already blaster classes, or classes blasters can benefit from. What does this class have that makes it an appealing option to warmages and sorcerers? As a spontaneous caster your spell level progression is already delayed compared to your preparing counterparts. With this you lose 2 CL, gain the ability to ignore SR with evocation spells,and gain a buff to metamagic your spells. There isn't much flavor to it and the abilities really aren't worth it especially at that level. I can see this getting abused at epic levels tho. Uber SR punching + a semi-free epic feat in their 5th level ability. We already have general blasters, theres even a base class for them. If you want to make a PrC for them you want to try to bring something new to the table. Heres some ideas just to throw around, an explosion mage. Make reflex save spells turn into fortitude saves that only target individuals. A destruction mage. The supreme blow it up mage, with destructive abilities(I'm thinking new uses for different spells, maybe add new spells only accessible through the class). Spell fire type blaster mage, using raw arcane energy, maybe with mechanics similar to the archmage ability. Lord of elements, we have classes for each element but not one for all of them. A backlash mage, takes damage to do bad things to the bad guys.
Khatoblepas 08-30-07, 04:59 PM	Eh, alright. This PrC is discontinued due to it being impossible to balance, or even quantify it's existance. Let that be a lesson to all that read this thread! SR-punching is not worth the hassle. It did bring illumination to the table, though. Thank you, everyone :) Next time, I'll build a PrC with a flavor reason too. I'm already cooking one up. Heh :P
forsaken1111 08-31-07, 01:15 PM	TBH this prc's SR-punching abilities are tame compared to some other tricks you can pull. I managed to have a ML 30 at level 14 by using some dragon magazine material. ML 30, even with the -10 for magic-psionics similar but different rule, will punch SR 20 without a roll, and up to SR 40. Can punch SR 30 without a roll if you take Psionics Mastery allowing you to take 10 on the check. It seems like a cool class really, just lose the SR punching and focus on what the class is about, doing damage. IMO The bypassing 10 points of energy resistance is not that strong, thats only 10 more damage getting through.