Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Syrkres 05-22-07, 09:59 AM	Ok, this may be asking alot, but I am wondering if anyone can point me to a PrC that grants (without requiring) Sneak Attack and Two Weapon Fighting within 3 levels. I am not asking to have it by level 3. It would be around level 10 or so, but when I enter into the class, within 3 levels I would have those abilities. Or maybe just even Sneak Attack? Or TWF? I am trying to build a new character, and my alternative is to take 1 level of Rogue and 2 levels of Ranger. I can't take TWF because I don't have the Dex, thus I need it granted as a class ability. Though if I think about it, I could get close to it by the time it comes around to taking the class I need, which may eliminate the need for the 2 levels of Ranger, thus reduce me to just needing a level of Rogue, but I figured I would ask here.
The_Shaman 05-22-07, 10:14 AM	I've been looking for ranger/rogue PrCs myself, but there aren't many... I can point you towards looking for SA and feats, but the two aren't too common together anyway. Pious templar gets feats, good BAB, and a couple more tricks, but you might need the rogue level. OTOH, Nightsong enforcer gives sneak attack (diluted, though - at 1-4-7-10) and full BAB, but no feats. It's good for multiclass rogues though, as it can net you a few rogue special abilities. How about you get a PrC for feats and a PrC for SA, each for a few levels? Say, divine champion 2 (WFocus required) / NSenforcer 1 (Improved initiative and evasion required)?
Montravont 05-22-07, 04:52 PM	granted.. you may have your reasons.. but why are you taking a rogue build with a low DEX?
Syrkres 05-22-07, 07:26 PM	granted.. you may have your reasons.. but why are you taking a rogue build with a low DEX? Perfectly good question! I am actually playing a Druid, well actually a Monk(2)/Druid(5) and would like to take the Daggerspell Shaper (PrC). The character was pre-made for me, thus I really can't change much of him as he is, thus he has a low Dex and his current class make up, but I can direct where he goes from here on out. Thus it would be nice if I could get to DsS. The current path I see right now, is Rogue(1), Ranger(2). With Druid(5) with Druid as favored class that should be "ok" for the classes. But I also wanted to throw in there Nature's Warriors (from CWar) which is a nice add, and only a 5 level PrC. Plus it adds to the Druid's levels and the things he can change into where as the DsS does not (HD wise). So with his current levels (7), NW(5), I was hoping to try and get into DsS without having to take those three extra base class (Rogue/Ranger). Thus the question, whats the quickest way to get Sneak Attack and Two Weapon Fighting?
Garonak 05-23-07, 04:16 AM	Dread Pirate grants twf, not sure about sneak attack though...
The_Shaman 05-23-07, 04:29 AM	Hmm, not many classes grant sneak attack if you didn't already have it - especially if you want to keep your casting progression. I'm sorry for not reading your post fully, btw - if you don't want to meet the prerequisites, Ranger (or anything that specifically gives TWF, I don't have the books with me at the moment) is your main bet, as classes with unspecified free feats usually want you to be eligible.
Syrkres 05-23-07, 09:58 AM	Yeah, thats the hard part, I have other feats and I can get close to the Dex (but only up to 13). A magic item could possibly do it, but some GMs are iffy on that for qualifying for Feats, I remember an official ruling somewhere on that. I think it was on these boards, or maybe in the FAQ, will have to check (unless someone can point me to it). It's not like we get hit with Disjunction all the time. ;) I can get other feats, which is why I was hoping for another rout, I will take a look at the Dread Pirate, see what that requries, anyone know when it grants the TWF? at what level? or requirements, don't have my books with me at the momement. That would just mean 1 level of rogue if the Dread pirate grants it at a 1 or 2 levels? If it's any higher, then Ranger is the better route. Again thanks all for input, why I love the boards.
Garonak 05-23-07, 05:01 PM	You get twf at lvl 1 Dread Pirate, but it requires Weapon Finesse and Quick Draw. By taking a lvl in Swashbuckler you get the weapon finesse feat. For sneak attack... I would just take a lvl rogue. On the other hand you might take a lvl Scout instead, fits more with the druid concept. And skirmish lets you into daggerspell shifter.
The_Shaman 05-23-07, 05:50 PM	You get twf at lvl 1 Dread Pirate, but it requires Weapon Finesse and Quick Draw. By taking a lvl in Swashbuckler you get the weapon finesse feat. For sneak attack... I would just take a lvl rogue. On the other hand you might take a lvl Scout instead, fits more with the druid concept. And skirmish lets you into daggerspell shifter. Franly, I think ranger 2/rogue 2 is not so bad. I include the second rogue level for evasion, which imo is quite nice with 2 levels in 2 good-reflex save classes (read: +6 to your reflex save), while iirc the shaper also had good reflex save.