Post/Author/DateTime	Post
war_m0nger 04-17-07, 01:29 PM	Got a guy in my group who wants to play a sneaky, roguish cleric (but doesn't want to take any levels in Rogue if he can help it). Any ideas for a good PrC/overall build? He's currently 8th level and human (plays with studded leather and a quarterstaff - so you can tell he's no powergamer).
NobodyRemembersThis 04-17-07, 01:46 PM	There was the temple raider of Olidammara - it sucked, but it is an option. Last I saw it was in Defenders of the Faith (3.0)
CantripN 04-17-07, 01:58 PM	It's also in Complete Divine (3.5e), pg. 67. It has it's own spell list and spellcasting progression, though. You might consider trading it in for a partial cleric spellcasting progression... 7/10 spellcasting seems fitting, in my opinion. In which case there's nothing bad about Cleric 5/Temple Raider 10/Divine Oracle 3/Contemplative 2. Yeah, that looks okay.
The_Shaman 04-17-07, 02:03 PM	It's a skill-heavy class, though. It's for the rogues or bards who want a bit of divine magic, not vice versa. However, there are quite few roguish PrCs that don't require some sneak attack or similar goodies. Sneakiness itself is skill-dependent, so I'm not sure how you could approach that... 1-2 levels of rogue or a similar class seem like the best idea (followed by, say, an adaptation of the shadowbane stalker to allow for non-LGs. I admit I don't know of that many cleric-based roguish PrCs.
Ainamacar 04-17-07, 02:05 PM	The main problem with the Temple Raider is that it has its own spellcasting (as noted above), rather than extending an existing cleric's abilities. My off-the-cuff inclination would be to let things stand as written but replace the spellcasting with advancement every other level. Or, to drop sneak attack (or some other things) and replace the spellcasting with an 8/10 progression or so. That certainly isn't overpowering, especially compared to the other PrCs that are available to clerics.
The_Shaman 04-17-07, 02:24 PM	I think that as it is, you could substitute the Temple Raider's casting for something along the lines of 5/10 or 6/10 casting. The divine casting PrCs get (2/2/2/1) is - level for level - better than the one paladins and rangers get (since the base classes get that many spells around lvl 17 or so). Therefore, 5/10 or 6/10 sounds about right.
Rjovik 04-17-07, 10:38 PM	I am "the guy" in question. That is, it is my character which is looking for good viable options for PrC for my Cleric of Olidamarra. I will post some information below on Conleth (PC's Name) in hopes that this will generate more information/discussions. Conleth cleric of Olidamarra Chaotic / Neutral "Unhealthy" fascination with Blades (spells that call blades into existence) Desires to know all there is about dragons and how to kill them with as little a risk as possible. Ever searching for was to call two spells per round. This is a very interesting character. He has chosen the evil side of the alignment issue that neutral characters must choose. That is he can only "instant convert" spell to harm NOT to heal. He is also restricted from GOOD spells. And he REBUKES undead, not TURN. It is very fun playing as "shady hero" in a party of most goodie-goodie types. I am OK with playing him as a straight Cleric, but really wish there were more PrC options for this type of PC. I know that this is somewhat of a unique way of playing a PC Hero. Any and all help in finding and/or developing some good options will be GREATLY appreciated.
CantripN 04-18-07, 01:02 AM	Adapting the Swiftblade for an Divine caster might be fun: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327
war_m0nger 04-18-07, 09:29 AM	I am "the guy" in question. That is, it is my character which is looking for good viable options for PrC for my Cleric of Olidamarra. I will post some information below on Conleth (PC's Name) in hopes that this will generate more information/discussions. Conleth cleric of Olidamarra Chaotic / Neutral "Unhealthy" fascination with Blades (spells that call blades into existence) Desires to know all there is about dragons and how to kill them with as little a risk as possible. Ever searching for was to call two spells per round. This is a very interesting character. He has chosen the evil side of the alignment issue that neutral characters must choose. That is he can only "instant convert" spell to harm NOT to heal. He is also restricted from GOOD spells. And he REBUKES undead, not TURN. It is very fun playing as "shady hero" in a party of most goodie-goodie types. I am OK with playing him as a straight Cleric, but really wish there were more PrC options for this type of PC. I know that this is somewhat of a unique way of playing a PC Hero. Any and all help in finding and/or developing some good options will be GREATLY appreciated. Hey R.D! Welcome! (Player's my best friend)
NobodyRemembersThis 04-18-07, 12:33 PM	You could also possibly build a 5 level PrC designed to give you some skills and sneak oriented rogue abilities. I'll have more on this idea later. :)
CantripN 04-18-07, 01:35 PM	Aye, I recall seeing a Divine Trickster somewhere, but after browsing through all the books I have access to, couldn't find it... EDIT: Oh, Rich Burlew rocks! http://www.giantitp.com/Func0015.html
The_Shaman 04-18-07, 04:59 PM	Well, there's a gnomish PrC - specialty priests of Garl Glittergold, but imo it's completely absurd. You're a jester, not a thief.
Gadren 04-19-07, 08:17 PM	I'm at work right now and don't have my books on me, but I'm pretty sure there is a class in the complete adventurer that improves divine casting, sneak attack, and roguish skills. I think it was "shadowbane" something?
Marcus Majarra 04-20-07, 01:26 AM	The class you're thinking of is the Shadowbane Stalker, from the Complete Adventurer. It's the quintessential rogue/cleric PrC, although it has a strong anti-evil bent. Otherwise, there's always the Black Flame Zealot.
Krusk 04-20-07, 01:34 AM	You could easily modify fatespinner into a divine class. Just exchange the word arcane with divine and it is pretty much workable. It would go great with a cleric of olidammara. based off altering your luck, which is a pretty "tricky" thing to do.
The_Shaman 04-20-07, 02:15 PM	I've been looking through some FR stuff again... Does Olidammara cover shadows in his portfolio? If yes, an adaptation of the Darkmask from Lords of Darkness (Vhaeroun cleric/rogue PrC) might be useful as well.
RadicalTaoist 04-20-07, 03:49 PM	The archetype of the Cleric of Olidammara was the exact reason my dissatisfaction with the cleric class lead to this.
DSCrankshaw 04-21-07, 04:34 AM	Well, if you want something really random, you could try Fortune's Friend from Complete Scoundrel. It requires a luck feat, and its built around the luck mechanic, but it also has 6 skill ranks per level, what's essentially the rogue skill list, and partial spellcasting (arcane or divine).