Red Wizard - Need some input.. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Red Wizard - Need some input.. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
sootar
04-16-08, 09:30 AM When it comes to the Red Wizard prestigclass you have to scarefice a 3rd school of magic to gain the bonuses from the class. For me, being a Necromancer, I saw the best bonus as "Spell Power". However, things seem to have changed a bit.

Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting:

"Spell Power: For spells involving the Red Wizard's specialist school, add this value to the DC to saving throws and caster level checks to overcome spell resistance. The value starts at +1 and goes up to +2 at 4th level, +3 at 6th level, +4 at 8th level and +5 at 10th level. This ability stacks with other spell power effects that affects spells from the Red Wizards specialist school."

DMG:

"At 2nd level, the Red Wizard gains a bonus that increases his effective caster level for purposes of determening level-dependent spell variables and for caster level checks. The bonus starts at +1 and increases at higher levels as shown on Table 6-15. This effect stacks with other spell power benefits that affects spells from the Red Wizards specialist school."

Now, where the hell did the increase to Save DC go? Increase caster lvl? Thats all you get? Sure, being a Necromancer this means I can animate more HD in undeads, but thats not what im focusing on. I was looking forward to my Necro spells getting a +5 save DC at 10th level, not getting a bigger undead walking next to me. The spell power described in "Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting" was my reason for choosing that pretige class. Circle leader and such aint that good for a PC at all. Spell Defense? It can come in handy. But more for specialists in other schools than Necromancy.

But there comes the reason for my post. Perhaps tyhere is something I've missed here. Or perhaps missed in the rest of the Red Wizard text that either explains this or makes it all right to loose it.

Input anyone?
1 ton ghost
04-16-08, 01:11 PM Kudos for going Thayan.
I would poke through CompArcane (or is it Mage) to find the feats that help unlock the barred schools for specialty classes. Giving up 3 is a big committment and I'm of the opinion that it pays to be well rounded.

Don't forget the campaign setting book is 3.0 edition, not 3.5. Remember Spell Focus and Spellcasting Prodigy? They kicked ass in 3rd ed, not in 3.5, eh...

For feats and all, I would just recommend not putting all your eggs in 1 basket. You get super good at necro magic, you might wind up facing a considerable amount of undead that are immune and beyond control.

Also, push for one of your friends to go for Thayan Knight (MagofFaerun). A nice dynamic and smart match. Helps maintain group cohesion too.
Sinfire Titan
04-16-08, 01:19 PM If it is set in Thay, then why not play an Incanatrix from Player's Guide to Faerun?
The_Shaman
04-16-08, 04:53 PM Considering that almost all Thayan mages are specialists, the Incantatrix may narrow it a bit too much... especially if you go for Red Wizard on top of it. Losing 2 schools, hurts, but losing 3 or 4... ouch.

@Sootar: yes, the Red Wizard lost a LOT during the 3.5 conversion. As did the Archmage, who could get 3 abilities for a total of +6 to DC. I think the Shadow adept had something similar as well. In 3.5, getting an ability that improves your spells' DC is very, very hard.
sootar
04-19-08, 02:52 PM Cheers for the updates guys.. I'll be sure to look more into this.
runestar
04-20-08, 12:06 AM Technically, a literal reading of the 3.5 red wizard's spell power suggests that the caster lv increase applies to any spell he casts, not just spells from his specialist school...;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
sootar 04-16-08, 09:30 AM	When it comes to the Red Wizard prestigclass you have to scarefice a 3rd school of magic to gain the bonuses from the class. For me, being a Necromancer, I saw the best bonus as "Spell Power". However, things seem to have changed a bit. Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting: "Spell Power: For spells involving the Red Wizard's specialist school, add this value to the DC to saving throws and caster level checks to overcome spell resistance. The value starts at +1 and goes up to +2 at 4th level, +3 at 6th level, +4 at 8th level and +5 at 10th level. This ability stacks with other spell power effects that affects spells from the Red Wizards specialist school." DMG: "At 2nd level, the Red Wizard gains a bonus that increases his effective caster level for purposes of determening level-dependent spell variables and for caster level checks. The bonus starts at +1 and increases at higher levels as shown on Table 6-15. This effect stacks with other spell power benefits that affects spells from the Red Wizards specialist school." Now, where the hell did the increase to Save DC go? Increase caster lvl? Thats all you get? Sure, being a Necromancer this means I can animate more HD in undeads, but thats not what im focusing on. I was looking forward to my Necro spells getting a +5 save DC at 10th level, not getting a bigger undead walking next to me. The spell power described in "Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting" was my reason for choosing that pretige class. Circle leader and such aint that good for a PC at all. Spell Defense? It can come in handy. But more for specialists in other schools than Necromancy. But there comes the reason for my post. Perhaps tyhere is something I've missed here. Or perhaps missed in the rest of the Red Wizard text that either explains this or makes it all right to loose it. Input anyone?
1 ton ghost 04-16-08, 01:11 PM	Kudos for going Thayan. I would poke through CompArcane (or is it Mage) to find the feats that help unlock the barred schools for specialty classes. Giving up 3 is a big committment and I'm of the opinion that it pays to be well rounded. Don't forget the campaign setting book is 3.0 edition, not 3.5. Remember Spell Focus and Spellcasting Prodigy? They kicked ass in 3rd ed, not in 3.5, eh... For feats and all, I would just recommend not putting all your eggs in 1 basket. You get super good at necro magic, you might wind up facing a considerable amount of undead that are immune and beyond control. Also, push for one of your friends to go for Thayan Knight (MagofFaerun). A nice dynamic and smart match. Helps maintain group cohesion too.
Sinfire Titan 04-16-08, 01:19 PM	If it is set in Thay, then why not play an Incanatrix from Player's Guide to Faerun?
The_Shaman 04-16-08, 04:53 PM	Considering that almost all Thayan mages are specialists, the Incantatrix may narrow it a bit too much... especially if you go for Red Wizard on top of it. Losing 2 schools, hurts, but losing 3 or 4... ouch. @Sootar: yes, the Red Wizard lost a LOT during the 3.5 conversion. As did the Archmage, who could get 3 abilities for a total of +6 to DC. I think the Shadow adept had something similar as well. In 3.5, getting an ability that improves your spells' DC is very, very hard.
sootar 04-19-08, 02:52 PM	Cheers for the updates guys.. I'll be sure to look more into this.
runestar 04-20-08, 12:06 AM	Technically, a literal reading of the 3.5 red wizard's spell power suggests that the caster lv increase applies to any spell he casts, not just spells from his specialist school...;)