sandshaper worth lost caster level? [Archive] - Wizards Community

sandshaper worth lost caster level? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Criz918
10-06-07, 07:45 PM So im trying to find an interesting prc for my sorcerer and i was looking at sand shaper in the sandstorm book. Ive never really done a spellcaster and my friend says that very few classes are worth losing caster levels. Are the abilities the sand shaper gain worth losing a caster level? Is going more than 8 levels worth losing the second caster level? Right now I think Im willing to lose 1 caster level for the abilities but the second lost level doesnt seem worth it. Are there any other good prc that dont lose much in the way of caster levels?
The_Shaman
10-06-07, 08:17 PM I'd say yes, at least the first 8 levels are worth it. Normally, a caster level is one of the best things a sorcerer can get, but practically doubling your list of spells known... Well, that is that good. The second lost CL is not such a good idea imo.

As for other PrCs, what do you want to do and what books are available? I can say "go incantatrix" but that might not be what you wanted.
Criz918
10-06-07, 08:38 PM I have access to pretty much every book either through myself or (mostly) my friend. Luckily for me Im my gamer guilds librarian so I have a lot of dnd books at my apartment even if they arent mine and I havent read them all.

As for what I can use, pretty much anything that isnt campaign specific, which i think inchantrix is, and also no initiate of the sevenfold veil- he wont allow it.

Other than that, the only thing I know I want for sure for my sorcerer is rp based (hes a merchant) so Im open to suggestions
Grod_The_Giant
10-06-07, 11:38 PM I've always though that Mage of the Arcane Order is a good Prc- ESPECIALLY for sorcerer. You need to waste another feat (Arcane Preparation) and pray your DM doesn't realive how powerful it is, but its legal.

You get full access to the Spellpool, potentially allowing you to cast ANY spell on the sorcerer/wizard list, as well as feats, skills and connections. All for the cost of two feats (more then made up for by bonus metamagic feats granted by the class) and a few gold here-and-there.
Jaxgaret
10-07-07, 03:55 AM The first 8 levels of Sand Shaper can definitely be worth it for a Sorcerer, though it generally is a 1-level dip class.

Keep in mind that due to Dust Magic's +1 CL boost, your caster level remains the same as if you had not lost the single spellcasting level.

The last two levels are not really worth it at all.
The_Shaman
10-07-07, 06:13 AM Basically, CL is good for 3 things: numerics on a spell, extra spells known and new spell levels. The second is not much of a problem due to dust magic, in the second Sandshaper is much better than 1 more sorc level, so we're left with the third. If you lose no more caster levels, I'd say it's a nice trade it even for sorcerers.
Darth Sephiroth
10-09-07, 01:31 AM If you play a Kobold you can eliminate another of those penalties with rituals, though with the two rituals you end up losing 4 HP.
Umbral
10-09-07, 06:18 AM For a Wizard -no it is not worth it.

For a caster with a limiter on spells known, such as a Sorcerer, Beguiler, Warmage, Duskblade...yes. Yes, it is very much worth it!
ninjarabbit
10-09-07, 08:12 AM I've always though that Mage of the Arcane Order is a good Prc- ESPECIALLY for sorcerer. You need to waste another feat (Arcane Preparation) and pray your DM doesn't realive how powerful it is, but its legal.

You get full access to the Spellpool, potentially allowing you to cast ANY spell on the sorcerer/wizard list, as well as feats, skills and connections. All for the cost of two feats (more then made up for by bonus metamagic feats granted by the class) and a few gold here-and-there.

Actually you only get access to the PHB wizard/sorcerer spells, which still isn't bad because 90% of the good and broken spells are from the PHB.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Criz918 10-06-07, 07:45 PM	So im trying to find an interesting prc for my sorcerer and i was looking at sand shaper in the sandstorm book. Ive never really done a spellcaster and my friend says that very few classes are worth losing caster levels. Are the abilities the sand shaper gain worth losing a caster level? Is going more than 8 levels worth losing the second caster level? Right now I think Im willing to lose 1 caster level for the abilities but the second lost level doesnt seem worth it. Are there any other good prc that dont lose much in the way of caster levels?
The_Shaman 10-06-07, 08:17 PM	I'd say yes, at least the first 8 levels are worth it. Normally, a caster level is one of the best things a sorcerer can get, but practically doubling your list of spells known... Well, that is that good. The second lost CL is not such a good idea imo. As for other PrCs, what do you want to do and what books are available? I can say "go incantatrix" but that might not be what you wanted.
Criz918 10-06-07, 08:38 PM	I have access to pretty much every book either through myself or (mostly) my friend. Luckily for me Im my gamer guilds librarian so I have a lot of dnd books at my apartment even if they arent mine and I havent read them all. As for what I can use, pretty much anything that isnt campaign specific, which i think inchantrix is, and also no initiate of the sevenfold veil- he wont allow it. Other than that, the only thing I know I want for sure for my sorcerer is rp based (hes a merchant) so Im open to suggestions
Grod_The_Giant 10-06-07, 11:38 PM	I've always though that Mage of the Arcane Order is a good Prc- ESPECIALLY for sorcerer. You need to waste another feat (Arcane Preparation) and pray your DM doesn't realive how powerful it is, but its legal. You get full access to the Spellpool, potentially allowing you to cast ANY spell on the sorcerer/wizard list, as well as feats, skills and connections. All for the cost of two feats (more then made up for by bonus metamagic feats granted by the class) and a few gold here-and-there.
Jaxgaret 10-07-07, 03:55 AM	The first 8 levels of Sand Shaper can definitely be worth it for a Sorcerer, though it generally is a 1-level dip class. Keep in mind that due to Dust Magic's +1 CL boost, your caster level remains the same as if you had not lost the single spellcasting level. The last two levels are not really worth it at all.
The_Shaman 10-07-07, 06:13 AM	Basically, CL is good for 3 things: numerics on a spell, extra spells known and new spell levels. The second is not much of a problem due to dust magic, in the second Sandshaper is much better than 1 more sorc level, so we're left with the third. If you lose no more caster levels, I'd say it's a nice trade it even for sorcerers.
Darth Sephiroth 10-09-07, 01:31 AM	If you play a Kobold you can eliminate another of those penalties with rituals, though with the two rituals you end up losing 4 HP.
Umbral 10-09-07, 06:18 AM	For a Wizard -no it is not worth it. For a caster with a limiter on spells known, such as a Sorcerer, Beguiler, Warmage, Duskblade...yes. Yes, it is very much worth it!
ninjarabbit 10-09-07, 08:12 AM	I've always though that Mage of the Arcane Order is a good Prc- ESPECIALLY for sorcerer. You need to waste another feat (Arcane Preparation) and pray your DM doesn't realive how powerful it is, but its legal. You get full access to the Spellpool, potentially allowing you to cast ANY spell on the sorcerer/wizard list, as well as feats, skills and connections. All for the cost of two feats (more then made up for by bonus metamagic feats granted by the class) and a few gold here-and-there. Actually you only get access to the PHB wizard/sorcerer spells, which still isn't bad because 90% of the good and broken spells are from the PHB.